Is Guns (both OLD and NEW) a niche thing, a thing of the past?

[bran]

Plenty of new bands list the Stones, Led Zeppelin, Nirvana, Metallica as one of their influences or even their among main influences...How many have listed GN'R?

None that i know, but GNR didn't create something new, they we're just the perfect mix of influences.

I believe they created something new.

And even if some of you deny that, you have to admit that they're creating something new with their latest music. Chinese Democracy is only the beginning.

i agree

[sweetness]

Plenty of new bands list the Stones, Led Zeppelin, Nirvana, Metallica as one of their influences or even their among main influences...How many have listed GN'R?

None that i know, but GNR didn't create something new, they we're just the perfect mix of influences.

I believe they created something new.

And even if some of you deny that, you have to admit that they're creating something new with their latest music. Chinese Democracy is only the beginning.

Not even. its the exact same style of music with extra dubbed layers and production, whoopty doo. That doesn't mean its bad or anything, just stop talking about it like its breaking new ground, you sound ridiculous

[SoulMonster]

If they decide to release music regularly and keep it up to date then they become a current band that matters in today's music scene. If not they end up as so many bands from the 80's that still tour: a nostalgia act.

[Guest siliconmessiah]

Chinese Democracy is only the beginning.

It has been "the beginning" for over 10 years...=/

It´s the lack of using momentum and the silence that kills this band.

The headline news on their homepage is nearly 2 years old!

Horrible!

They should do something. Release music, maybe a double album.

Just something...

Edited February 8, 2011 by siliconmessiah

[STARABOSTES]

GNR is a classic rock band. I hear their songs on the radio all the time. Nobody really caught on to "NuGNR" aside from the fervent believers on certain forums. I think most people see it as a nostalgia act with one original member singing the classics. No matter how many people want it to happen the new band will never catch on in terms of popularity. In fairness, though, I don't think the original lineup could produce an album now that would be a hit. The kids don't want to listen to music made by a bunch of guys nearing fifty. They want their Bieber and Swift.

That didn't stop AC/DC and Metallica from releasing commercially successful albums. There are different markets. Of course GNR will never sell to teens again but there's a bunch of 30-50 year olds that would LOVE an original classic rock album from the original band.

I agree the original lineup could put out a solid-selling album along the lines of Death Magnetic. Bands like that do sell reasonably well to the older market, but it's the kids that buy albums. I think that AC/DC and Metallica also benefit from consistently touring and releasing music so that they have a very large and loyal fanbase. I think that a lot of GNR's old fans have probably moved on due to lack of activity by the original lineup.

what?

Death Magnetic is crap man, it's the recognition of artists that they didn't have what it takes to move forward!

and Black Ice it in the same place.

oh, if you're into no-progress no-nothing but - my granny used to like when she was your age kind of thing, maybe.

not going to catch teens? look again man, here or in any other forum,

and you'll see people around 20 years of age, even younger,

who weren't around when GNR ruled the world in '90s.

so thing again.

are you in anyway, that self indulgent that you believe that if you don't like something that applies to everyone else?

from were I stand, Chinese Democracy is way over the albums mentioned before,

and from the no monumental promotion thing to the albums sells and successful world tour, I say

GNR are every bit a present rock band! and get of your high horses of some forum users crap,

that applies to some of us who still pray for Slash to return to GNR as his making an ass of himself since he's on his own. not me.

[STARABOSTES]

Rock music in general is pretty much dead in the US....

Like that's never been said before.

And GN'R (both old and new) only occupied a very short time in popular music history. Even while the old band was together they were beginning to be washed aside with Grunge and Rap on the rise in the mid 1990s.

New pop flavors come and go all the time, some more than you probably change your underwear. Where are all those bands now, and if they are still playing or have reunited, how well do their efforts (album quality, music sales, ticket sales) compare to Guns?

Each album as well showcased diminishing returns: AFD had sold over 12 million by 1991; In 1991, the UYI's sold seven million each;

So by your estimates, AFD sold 12 million in 5 years and UYI I/II sold 14 million combined in only its first year. Hello?

In 1993, TSI sold just over a million copies. An article I read from 1997 also stated that their 1993 tour sales were less than those of 1992.

It was also a covers album with a lot of obscure tracks, there were quite a few without the main vocalist which can hurt any similar effort, they didn't write much anything on it, and it was pretty clear by this point the band members had creative problems. As much as I like Guns new and old and think they do covers amazingly, I don't care for TSI personally, it has its moments, but I don't consider it a true Guns album or part of the GnR canon. It just feels too forced and maybe even contract filler, and I think part of it's negative feedback is what led to Axl wanting to make things right by doing a truly great original album. It's like Highlander 2 or similar efforts- just pretend it didn't happen.

Now, we're way beyond the mid 1990s. Hip Hop, Electro-Pop and the like is huge now. GN'R only really held mainstream interest from around 1988 (when SCOM took off) to 1993.

I don't think I've ever seen such a continued interest/buzz on any other unreleased album in my life other than The Beach Boys/Brian Wilson's Smile Album.

That's just a five year run, with only 4 full albums in that period.

Most bands never manage to get even a fraction of that level of success.

Compare that to the Stones, who were founded in 1962 and were still as popular in 1977 as they were in 1967. By 1967, five years into their history, the Stones had released 8 albums. Led Zeppelin who remained relevant and popular even through radically different and rapidly changing musical landscapes from 1969 to 1980. By 1974, five years into Zep's history, they had released 5 albums and were working on a massive double album. Even a shorter lived act like The Doors released 6 albums in 4 years.

All great classic bands that had their run well before the internet hit the masses and the music industry as we know it began to change. Zeppelin and The Doors had key members die which, love it or hate it, contributes to album sales and the whole myth thing. Stones lost Brian Jones, although he was fired before he died and maybe he was not quite as key member (I think he was), but their sound definitely changed without him.

An interesting point of reference: The Rolling Stones' last album A Bigger Bang sold a little over half a million in the US.

Guns' run was short in comparison to the world renowned greats, and they were not nearly as prolific in their span.

Guns are still running, there's still enough interest for them to keep doing it, and considering the lineup changes, all the hurdles and obstacles faced and other issues, they're not doing all that bad. Despite all the hype, mystery, edits, and years of wait, I truly like Chi-Dem. I don't need multiplatinum album sales to tell me an album's great.

The thing is, how does the rest of the world look back on Guns? Do we just overinflate their greatness/popularity since we're die hard fans? Would your average music listener know what Guns N' Roses was/is, and if they did, what would they think? I've talked to people who like (modern) rock, and even some of them just view GN'R as nothing more than '80s Hair Metal--Not much differently than how they view Motley Crue. A remnant of a cheesy era. Sort of like how the character Randy the Ram is viewed in the movie The Wrestler--A shadow remaining from a brighter, more neon colored era of make up, big hair and wild clothes.

There's always going to be some new band on the block. VERY few of them reach the same almost mythological level or have the same shelf life.

A great band that's managed to shift musical direction and has survived a lot of problems/changes including lineup changes despite terrible odds, with some of the shittiest fans I've ever come across. And some of the best, as well.

cool post!

i had to take out the last quote so that I could post this.

Edited February 8, 2011 by STARABOSTES

[Use Your Delusion 1]

being 17 many of my class mates and people at school love Guns and see them as the best classic rock band, they are much more popular than the stones or aerosmith or even ACDC. I would even go so far as to say they are among the most popular bands full stop along with the likes of the Black Eyed Pea's.

[Guest NewGNRnOldGNR]

Of course GNR will never sell to teens again but there's a bunch of 30-50 year olds that would LOVE an original classic rock album from the original band.

I don't believe that's a legitimate statement at all. The “original” line-up is still very relevant to the modern day. I find that most adolescents love the likes of “Sweet Child”, “Jungle”, “Paradise City” etc. and would be very enthusiastic about the prospects of another “old” Guns record. In fact I found that most young people's (not affiliated to the fan base) reasoning for not attending one of “Chinese Democracy” gigs was that “it wasn't the real Guns N' Roses”. If the old Guns were to (at some point) release a rebellious/in your face/”I don't give a fuck” album (which pays homage to the “Appetite” sound) I personally believe a very frustrated era of youth would relate almost immediately.

[moreblack]

from were I stand, Chinese Democracy is way over the albums mentioned before,

might wanna stand somewhere else.

[Zint]

What is Guns' legacy? And were they really still as popular in 1993 as they were in 1991 or 1988 as some think?

Guns' legacy..

Well,to me that were a gift from the Gods.

They rescued everything that was cool about rock.

In an era where everything was about looking like Poison,Trixter and sounding like shit,Guns tapped into the essence of their influences (a diverse range from Elton John to the Sex Pistols) and reminded people what some good straight-the-fuck-up rock could (and should) sound like.

Live,they were a fucking phenomenon to be reckoned with.I've seen many a concert in my day,but Guns live...man...whew...there was nothing like it.

If tickets to a reunion tour went on sale tomorrow,you'd fuckin see what kind of flash in the pan they were.

[sergiodefenders]

Guns n' Roses is a nostalgic act nowdays, a consolation, people are attending the show to hear classic song, most of the them don't care new music and of course forums of the web neither. Unless we got a GNR reunion, we will never see again a band as colossal as Guns used to be.

Edited February 8, 2011 by sergiodefenders

[star]

Difficult question to anwser. AFD is a thing of the past, a timeless classic

As for the present, well GN'R don't exist. There is no other way at looking at it.

The band, Guns N'Roses, split and went their own ways. One member remains, and attempts to fool the world

[GeorgeGlass]

First things first, Live Era sucks shit....In '99, GNR had been dead for 5 solid years, with a breakup to boot. During the same time, Metallica were actively touring Load and Reload so they were still very on the scene of music. In addition, metalheads are perhaps the most loyal fans out there...in other words, its easier for a rock fan to jump ship to grunge than it is for a metalhead. As a side note, though they took a tremendous amount of heat for Load and Reload, I absolutely love what they bring to the entire Metallica catalogue. They are brilliant albums and you need not have to headbang to enjoy music from Met.

Since '90, there have been exactly ZERO years where Metallica didn't play at least one show. That is why its laughable to compare Metallica to Guns. Metallica were able to battle through, even adapt their music style/experiment and stay largely together while Axl wandered off to LA LA land never to be heard from again. James had many problems of his own but in the SKOM documentary, you could see how much Metallica meant to him, and that he'd do whatever it took to keep the Metallica machine running, including the dismissal of Jason, arguably the second most important member of that band. Axl went off the deep end and hasn't been the same since.

Edited February 8, 2011 by GeorgeGlass

[Guest siliconmessiah]

most of the them don't care new music and of course forums of the web neither.

??!?!?!?!

Excuse me. But this is the lamest thing ever said.

The only fucking thing people has been talking and discussing about on GnR-forums, gossip-pages on the internet and other shitty press for about 10 years, is wanting new music from Guns N´ Roses.

A lot of people is still waiting for new music (leaks?) to come. It has been a pretty hot subject for the past month too. Impressive that you might have missed this.

Edited February 8, 2011 by siliconmessiah

[bran]

most of the them don't care new music and of course forums of the web neither.

??!?!?!?!

Excuse me. But this is the lamest thing ever said.

The only fucking thing people has been talking and discussing about on GnR-forums, gossip-pages on the internet and other shitty press for about 10 years, is wanting new music from Guns N´ Roses.

A lot of people is still waiting for new music (leaks?) to come. It has been a pretty hot subject for the past month too. Impressive that you might have missed this.

exactly people want to make believe the new version of guns n roses doesnt sell and it is utter bullshit, CD sold over 3 million copies world wide, holds the record for most plays on myspace in history, went #3 on the charts in the USA and #1 in a shitload of places around the world, had a very successful tour and crashed these forums with possible leak info, some people are so desperate for the reunion they ignore things. since 2006 this band has been pretty active 2006-2007 they tour 2008 chinese democracy is released and 2009-2010 they tour yeah i want a new album and hopefully one lands this year

[Guest siliconmessiah]

most of the them don't care new music and of course forums of the web neither.

??!?!?!?!

Excuse me. But this is the lamest thing ever said.

The only fucking thing people has been talking and discussing about on GnR-forums, gossip-pages on the internet and other shitty press for about 10 years, is wanting new music from Guns N´ Roses.

A lot of people is still waiting for new music (leaks?) to come. It has been a pretty hot subject for the past month too. Impressive that you might have missed this.

exactly people want to make believe the new version of guns n roses doesnt sell and it is utter bullshit, CD sold over 3 million copies world wide, holds the record for most plays on myspace in history, went #3 on the charts in the USA and #1 in a shitload of places around the world, had a very successful tour and crashed these forums with possible leak info, some people are so desperate for the reunion they ignore things. since 2006 this band has been pretty active 2006-2007 they tour 2008 chinese democracy is released and 2009-2010 they tour yeah i want a new album and hopefully one lands this year

Yes.

I think everyone should be aware that there are a lot of people that simply want Axl Rose and Guns N Roses to fail. And I love how Axl keeps on doing what he loves the most, without letting anyone break his visions down!

Axl´s way of bringing Guns N Roses into the future with a lot of energy is the right thing to do! I just wish we could get some more music/releases that could put the reunion-bullshit to rest. Because. It. Will. Never. Ever. Happen.

[sergiodefenders]

most of the them don't care new music and of course forums of the web neither.

??!?!?!?!

Excuse me. But this is the lamest thing ever said.

The only fucking thing people has been talking and discussing about on GnR-forums, gossip-pages on the internet and other shitty press for about 10 years, is wanting new music from Guns N´ Roses.

A lot of people is still waiting for new music (leaks?) to come. It has been a pretty hot subject for the past month too. Impressive that you might have missed this.

I'm talking about of people who attend to the shows, and people what you are talking are a very tiny part of that or do you think that venues are crowded with "forums's users"?.

[Nick83]

Guns n Roses popularity does not equal the album sales. Their popularity is way beyond album sales, which is kind of strange.

GNR is a piece of history. They had some sort of cultural/worldwide impact which made them imprinted into the minds of everyone, and this still exists. It's really unexplainable. I guess it was a touch of magic. It just was what it was.

Perhaps it was because people either loved them or hated them. But what's funny is that those who "hated" them, secretly listened with enjoyment. I suppose in a way we could theoretically double the album sales to more accurately reflect those that were "fans".

[GnR Chris]

Guns n' Roses is a nostalgic act nowdays, a consolation, people are attending the show to hear classic song, most of the them don't care new music and of course forums of the web neither. Unless we got a GNR reunion, we will never see again a band as colossal as Guns used to be.

I disagree with this. If you watch a lot of the live videos, you hear a ton of people singing along to the Chinese Democracy stuff.

Edited February 8, 2011 by GnR Chris

[moreblack]

Guns n' Roses is a nostalgic act nowdays, a consolation, people are attending the show to hear classic song, most of the them don't care new music and of course forums of the web neither. Unless we got a GNR reunion, we will never see again a band as colossal as Guns used to be.

I disagree with this. If you watch a lot of the live videos, you hear a ton of people singing along to the Chinese Democracy stuff.

never seen that

[Martin Riggs]

I don't think the legendary Guns N Roses (1987-93) will ever be a "niche" thing, Millions of people and countless other young people that are just getting into that version of GNR will always hold it in VERY high regard. That becomes more and more the case as time goes on. Hence the constant talk/desire of most people concerning a reunion.

As for them losing a little luster in the early 90's to some people was partly the slight expansion of musical styles on UYI and frankly a lot of people became a little sick and tired of Axl's antics. If most of the original band came back though they would be just as big worldwide as Metallica and AC/DC and probably even more so because GNR is just more exciting than those bands.

[Todo Poderoso Timão]

New GNR is, no doubt, a niche thing.

The old one, at least here in Brazil, is not at all.

[STARABOSTES]

Guns n' Roses is a nostalgic act nowdays, a consolation, people are attending the show to hear classic song, most of the them don't care new music and of course forums of the web neither. Unless we got a GNR reunion, we will never see again a band as colossal as Guns used to be.

I disagree with this. If you watch a lot of the live videos, you hear a ton of people singing along to the Chinese Democracy stuff.

never seen that

well behind a cat it is kinda hard...

hey dude, have you ever been to a GNR concert lately?

I've been to 2, in two different countries in 2010, and the crowd was into Chinese Democracy songs!

there were teens around man, as much as I could have seen at AC/DC concert which I attended or at Rammstein, also in 2010.

so... how about attending one, whenever you'll get the chance if ever GNR will start a new tour.

[moreblack]

hey dude, have you ever been to a GNR concert lately?

so... how about attending one, whenever you'll get the chance if ever GNR will start a new tour.

already have, what of it?

[STARABOSTES]

hey dude, have you ever been to a GNR concert lately?

so... how about attending one, whenever you'll get the chance if ever GNR will start a new tour.

already have, what of it?

look man, I'd written it already,

so, go be pretentious and a man of few words somewhere else,

here, I'm inside me, your're not fulling anyone.

from my perspective, you are a good forum poster but have no perspective on the whole picture.

chating is fine but it's waste of time.

here it is, my full and last answer to you:

GNR is a living beast, the band members come and go,

and there's nothing we can do about it.

yes there are incarnations better than others, for me the actual band is the one, at this moment,

but this would be way to philosophical for you, if I'll try and explain it to you, that in 1990-1993 the band that was then, was the best one for me, then. just then. it could never re-be, because that's how it is: they don't have the same age, same attitude (well at least Slash and Matt lost theirs), haven't played together for so long. Slash was good but just inside GNR, that's exactly why he or you or anyone else go on an on about him returning to GNR. if he was good on his own, he'd prove it by now, and never look back. I mean com'on, do you have the stupidity to put him, for real (don't care about magazine or polls) second after Jimi Hendrix man?! that guy done all his parts, composed all of his music, this guy, well he did got some parts right but that's as far as he could go. all of his albums after leaving GNR lack something, and that is - the spirit of GNR.

and if you or anyone else are so found of Slash being in GNR again, just take a big breath, hold it to infinity, and maybe then, he'll be welcomed back in GNR. that's the trick right? why should he be welcomed back and not ask for?

because Axl has the power, because these guys, who play now in GNR are better than him.

and even if they weren't Axl would not, and could not ask Slash to come back,

that would be like why all the struggle to reform GNR in the first place?!

would you, after ten's of years of work at something you believe in, when your supposed best friend left you to do it on your own, would you call him back after to get the thing running without him?

but this creature is going forward and it's not gonna go back

and become an nostalgia act.

the reasons GNR is still alive n' kicking is because the band it is at it is,

and not as you, are any nostalgic would want it to be.

yes I know you won't understand much of this, and you'll come back with some empty 2 lines answer,

but this is not intended. what it is, for you to remind me if I'll ever forget and reply to one of your posts,

that I wrote here today I wouldn't no more.

peace man.

God bless your soul!

bye now, and for ever.