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Why Did Axl Fight So Hard For The GNR Name...


Nick85

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Axl fought so hard for the band name for one reason. Money.

Nothing could give him more money than to let it go and reunite. If it was the money, he'd be touring with Slash, Duff & Co. Believe it. :shrugs:

Yeah, you're not wrong there.

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Axl fought so hard for the band name for one reason. Money.

Nothing could give him more money than to let it go and reunite. If it was the money, he'd be touring with Slash, Duff & Co. Believe it. :shrugs:

Don't try using common sense in these forums dammit.

Fact 1: Axl does everything for the love of money

Fact 2: Slash does everything for the love of music.

Any and all other arguments will be completely dismissed. The end.

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money.

I guess that's some of that "superior" conversational brilliance you were referring to on that other gnr messageboard. Of course, looking through your posts, it would seem that one word snarky responses is about all you're really capable of. As the kids say: lol.

although looking at it objectively, if he grew accustomed to a certain lifestyle, and with x amount of people depending on him for jobs. It's pretty much the only choice. He wasn't gonna generate that amount of revenue in any other way, certainly not solo.

Axl has Ozzy status...he could have easily toured and released music under "Axl Rose" and do just as well.

Ozzy status? Dont get me wrong i love Axl , but i dont think we can compare the fame Axl has to Ozzy ,i mean from what i know him along with Black Sabbath are one of the major "faces" for a whole music genre.

We are talking about a band that many see as the pioners of heavy metal , wich is very different from the value Guns and roses have for the general public . Guns and roses are famous , and they are part of rock history yes , but in a different way from a band like Black Sabbath from wich Ozzy was part . Just my opinion

Edited by love&hates
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IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the first album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have more music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

  • KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  • Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  • Motörhead only has Lemmy
  • Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  • Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  • Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  • the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  • Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  • The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  • the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

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IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the first album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have more music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

  • KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  • Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  • Motörhead only has Lemmy
  • Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  • Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  • Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  • the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  • Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  • The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  • the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

I agree with literally everything you've said here. Great post. :thumbsup:

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IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the first album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have more music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

  • KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  • Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  • Motörhead only has Lemmy
  • Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  • Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  • Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  • the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  • Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  • The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  • the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

Great post!

Fuck me I didn't know Foo's changed band memebers :shrugs:

I didn't even notice at all. All I know is Dave Grohl is there lol

I wonder if casual GNR fans are like that also? Like as long as Axl is there all is good....

Most 'casual' fans of Guns N' Roses I have talked to don't like Chinese Democracy and wish Slash was in the band. I have only met one who likes CD. Believe it or not from my experiences the hard core fans are more open minded even though at first glace it doesn't seem like it here lol

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IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the first album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have tmore music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

  • KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  • Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  • Motörhead only has Lemmy
  • Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  • Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  • Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  • the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  • Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  • The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  • the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

o

Excellent synopsis!

The contract was signed by all members,not only Axl.

The name came from traciis name and Axls name,although AIDS and heads of amazon were suggested and dismissed.

Sssaul was in road crew along along with Steven,he also had an audition with poison .He was in a band nemesis black sheep for a bit as well. Izzy was in and out of numerous bands since leaving lafayette. diff came from Seattle to answer a ad for bass player wanted.

I'm sure the guys ran into each other,If you hang out in LA you always seem to run into an aquaintance whether you want to or not. So,yeah Axl brought in the band name,brought in Dizwald,and was watching his band deteriotrate to self abuse.Axl was always seen as the leader.Did he. Fire David Nivven? Yes,for trying to get Axl removed from the band.Fact.

Compare any of the alumnis albums to ChiDem,and its no contest-a no brainer,unless your lips are crazy glued to Saul's ass :rolleyes: Loved Saul when he replaced tracking. as lead guitarist,although Izzy wasn't wanted in the band by Saul,he wanted to be the only guitar player.Sure Izzy had his addiction problems but so did saul.

So hell yes I will be a GNR fan until I'm in my roll around wheelchair.After 20 years of being into a band,it is set and nothing else will measure up to GNR past,present or future. ;)

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IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the first album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have tmore music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

  • KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  • Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  • Motörhead only has Lemmy
  • Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  • Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  • Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  • the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  • Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  • The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  • the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

o

Excellent synopsis!

The contract was signed by all members,not only Axl.

The name came from traciis name and Axls name,although AIDS and heads of amazon were suggested and dismissed.

Sssaul was in road crew along along with Steven,he also had an audition with poison .He was in a band nemesis black sheep for a bit as well. Izzy was in and out of numerous bands since leaving lafayette. diff came from Seattle to answer a ad for bass player wanted.

I'm sure the guys ran into each other,If you hang out in LA you always seem to run into an aquaintance whether you want to or not. So,yeah Axl brought in the band name,brought in Dizwald,and was watching his band deteriotrate to self abuse.Axl was always seen as the leader.Did he. Fire David Nivven? Yes,for trying to get Axl removed from the band.Fact.

Compare any of the alumnis albums to ChiDem,and its no contest-a no brainer,unless your lips are crazy glued to Saul's ass :rolleyes: Loved Saul when he replaced tracking. as lead guitarist,although Izzy wasn't wanted in the band by Saul,he wanted to be the only guitar player.Sure Izzy had his addiction problems but so did saul.

So hell yes I will be a GNR fan until I'm in my roll around wheelchair.After 20 years of being into a band,it is set and nothing else will measure up to GNR past,present or future. ;)

No contest? I don't know about that, everyone has different music tastes and just because someone might prefer Slash's new material to Chinese Democracy it doesn't mean that they are "glued to his ass" it just means they listen to the music they want to listen to. After all, music is subjective, there is no fun in saying "he sucks, end of story", music is all about emotion and personal tastes. That is the beauty of being a musician, the ability to connect with people :)

Edited by WhazUp
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IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the first album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighuting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have tmore music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

  • KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  • Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  • Motörhead only has Lemmy
  • Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  • Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  • Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  • the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  • Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  • The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  • the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

o

Excellent synopsis!

The contract was signed by all members,not only Axl.

The name came from traciis name and Axls name,although AIDS and heads of amazon were suggested and dismissed.

Sssaul was in road crew along along with Steven,he also had an audition with poison .He was in a band nemesis black sheep for a bit as well. Izzy was in and out of numerous bands since leaving lafayette. diff came from Seattle to answer a ad for bass player wanted.

I'm sure the guys ran into each other,If you hang out in LA you always seem to run into an aquaintance whether you want to or not. So,yeah Axl brought in the band name,yybrought in Dizwald,and was watching his band deteriotrate to self abuse.Axl was always seen as the leader.Did he. Fire David Nivven? Yes,for trying to get Axl removed from the band.Fact.

Compare any of the alumnis albums to ChiDem,and its no contest-a no brainer,unless your lips are crazy glued to Saul's ass :rolleyes: Loved Saul when he replaced tracking. as lead guitarist,although Izzy wasn't wanted in the band by Saul,he wanted to be the only guitar player.Sure Izzy had his addiction problems but so did saul.

So hell yes I will be a GNR fan until I'm in my roll around wheelchair.After 20 years of being into a band,it is set and nothing else will measure up to GNR past,present or future. ;)

No contest? I don't know about that, everyone has different music tastes and just because someone might prefer Slash's new material to Chinese Democracy it doesn't mean that they are "glued to his ass" it just means they listen to the music they want to listen to. After all, music is subjective, there is no fun in saying "he sucks, end of story", music is all about emotion and personal tastes. That is the beauty of being a musician, the ability to connect with people :)

Sure,no problem to sashay the malevolent hatred back to whence they came. IMO I stopped having any respect for saul,when he brought "the snakepit album in saying it would be the next GNR album,duff n Axl were both against this,but offered to work on a few songs.

Saul immediately took his music and went off on the snakepit album.

The best lyricists on GNRs were Izzy,Axl,and West,who contributed a lot. Like it or not,Axl owns the GNR name.I'm glad of that.

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IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the first album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighuting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have tmore music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

  • KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  • Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  • Motörhead only has Lemmy
  • Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  • Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  • Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  • the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  • Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  • The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  • the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

o

Excellent synopsis!

The contract was signed by all members,not only Axl.

The name came from traciis name and Axls name,although AIDS and heads of amazon were suggested and dismissed.

Sssaul was in road crew along along with Steven,he also had an audition with poison .He was in a band nemesis black sheep for a bit as well. Izzy was in and out of numerous bands since leaving lafayette. diff came from Seattle to answer a ad for bass player wanted.

I'm sure the guys ran into each other,If you hang out in LA you always seem to run into an aquaintance whether you want to or not. So,yeah Axl brought in the band name,yybrought in Dizwald,and was watching his band deteriotrate to self abuse.Axl was always seen as the leader.Did he. Fire David Nivven? Yes,for trying to get Axl removed from the band.Fact.

Compare any of the alumnis albums to ChiDem,and its no contest-a no brainer,unless your lips are crazy glued to Saul's ass :rolleyes: Loved Saul when he replaced tracking. as lead guitarist,although Izzy wasn't wanted in the band by Saul,he wanted to be the only guitar player.Sure Izzy had his addiction problems but so did saul.

So hell yes I will be a GNR fan until I'm in my roll around wheelchair.After 20 years of being into a band,it is set and nothing else will measure up to GNR past,present or future. ;)

No contest? I don't know about that, everyone has different music tastes and just because someone might prefer Slash's new material to Chinese Democracy it doesn't mean that they are "glued to his ass" it just means they listen to the music they want to listen to. After all, music is subjective, there is no fun in saying "he sucks, end of story", music is all about emotion and personal tastes. That is the beauty of being a musician, the ability to connect with people :)

Sure,no problem to sashay the malevolent hatred back to whence they came. IMO I stopped having any respect for saul,when he brought "the snakepit album in saying it would be the next GNR album,duff n Axl were both against this,but offered to work on a few songs.

Saul immediately took his music and went off on the snakepit album.

The best lyricists on GNRs were Izzy,Axl,and West,who contributed a lot. Like it or not,Axl owns the GNR name.I'm glad of that.

I honestly do not get why you hate him because of that. IMO both Axl and Slash could have handled the whole rift better than they did/are. It is not one hundred percent Axl's fault or Slash's fault, it takes two to tango. Same goes for this place, you have every right not to like Slash, or not to like his work post-guns. But I have just seen very one-sided posts coming from you

And this is coming from a dude who enjoys Chinese Democracy and can't wait to hear what the next album will sound like :thumbsup:

Edited by WhazUp
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IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the fuirst album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighuting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have tmore music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

  • KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  • Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  • Motörhead only has Lemmy
  • Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  • Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  • Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  • the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  • Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  • The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  • the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

o

Excellent synopsis!

The contract was signed by all members,not only Axl.

The name came from traciis name and Axls name,although AIDS and heads of amazon were suggested and dismissed.

Sssaul was in road crew along along with Steven,he also had an audition with poison .He was in a band nemesis black sheep for a bit as well. Izzy was in and out of numerous bands since leaving lafayette. diff came from Seattle to answer a ad for bass player wanted.

I'm sure the guys ran into each other,If you hang out in LA you always seem to run into an aquaintance whether you want to or not. So,yeah Axl brought in the band name,yybrought in Dizwald,and was watching his band deteriotrate to self abuse.Axl was always seen as the leader.Did he. Fire David Nivven? Yes,for trying to get Axl removed from the band.Fact.

Compare any of the alumnis albums to ChiDem,and its no contest-a no brainer,unless your lips are crazy glued to Saul's ass :rolleyes: Loved Saul when he replaced tracking. as lead guitarist,although Izzy wasn't wanted in the band by Saul,he wanted to be the only guitar player.Sure Izzy had his addiction problems but so did saul.

So hell yes I will be a GNR fan until I'm in my roll around wheelchair.After 20 years of being into a band,it is set and nothing else will measure up to GNR past,present or future. ;)

No contest? I don't know about that, everyone has different music tastes and just because someone might prefer Slash's new material to Chinese Democracy it doesn't mean that they are "glued to his ass" it just means they listen to the music they want to listen to. After all, music is subjective, there is no fun in saying "he sucks, end of story", music is all about emotion and personal tastes. That is the beauty of being a musician, the ability to connect with people :)

Sure,no problem to sashay the malevolent hatred back to whence they came. IMO I stopped having any respect for saul,when he brought "the snakepit album in saying it would be the next GNR album,duff n Axl were both against this,but offered to work on a few songs.

Saul immediately took his music and went off on the snakepit album.

The best lyricists on GNRs were Izzy,Axl,and West,who contributed a lot. Like it or not,Axl owns the GNR name.I'm glad of that.

I honestly do not get why you hate him because of that. IMO both Axl and Slash could have handled the whole rift better than they did/are. It is not one hundred percent Axl's fault or Slash's fault, it takes two to tango. Same goes for this place, you have every right not to like Slash, or not to like his work post-guns. But I have just seen very one-sided posts coming from you and another poster.

And this is coming from a dude who enjoys Chinese Democracy and can't wait to hear what the next album will sound like :thumbsup:

I hear u loud n clear bro,point taken.I don't hate slash but the choices he has made make me cringe,such as the superbowl sideshow,his monotonous riffs,and the guy doesn't have a knack for writing lyrics. I don't agree with some of his actions such as VR dressing up like GNR for Halloween.

I don't think he has the chops of Satriani or vai,or Ashba and Ron. Maybe he did,but it all sounds repetitive now.

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IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the fuirst album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighuting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have tmore music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

  • KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  • Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  • Motörhead only has Lemmy
  • Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  • Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  • Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  • the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  • Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  • The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  • the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

o

Excellent synopsis!

The contract was signed by all members,not only Axl.

The name came from traciis name and Axls name,although AIDS and heads of amazon were suggested and dismissed.

Sssaul was in road crew along along with Steven,he also had an audition with poison .He was in a band nemesis black sheep for a bit as well. Izzy was in and out of numerous bands since leaving lafayette. diff came from Seattle to answer a ad for bass player wanted.

I'm sure the guys ran into each other,If you hang out in LA you always seem to run into an aquaintance whether you want to or not. So,yeah Axl brought in the band name,yybrought in Dizwald,and was watching his band deteriotrate to self abuse.Axl was always seen as the leader.Did he. Fire David Nivven? Yes,for trying to get Axl removed from the band.Fact.

Compare any of the alumnis albums to ChiDem,and its no contest-a no brainer,unless your lips are crazy glued to Saul's ass :rolleyes: Loved Saul when he replaced tracking. as lead guitarist,although Izzy wasn't wanted in the band by Saul,he wanted to be the only guitar player.Sure Izzy had his addiction problems but so did saul.

So hell yes I will be a GNR fan until I'm in my roll around wheelchair.After 20 years of being into a band,it is set and nothing else will measure up to GNR past,present or future. ;)

No contest? I don't know about that, everyone has different music tastes and just because someone might prefer Slash's new material to Chinese Democracy it doesn't mean that they are "glued to his ass" it just means they listen to the music they want to listen to. After all, music is subjective, there is no fun in saying "he sucks, end of story", music is all about emotion and personal tastes. That is the beauty of being a musician, the ability to connect with people :)

Sure,no problem to sashay the malevolent hatred back to whence they came. IMO I stopped having any respect for saul,when he brought "the snakepit album in saying it would be the next GNR album,duff n Axl were both against this,but offered to work on a few songs.

Saul immediately took his music and went off on the snakepit album.

The best lyricists on GNRs were Izzy,Axl,and West,who contributed a lot. Like it or not,Axl owns the GNR name.I'm glad of that.

I honestly do not get why you hate him because of that. IMO both Axl and Slash could have handled the whole rift better than they did/are. It is not one hundred percent Axl's fault or Slash's fault, it takes two to tango. Same goes for this place, you have every right not to like Slash, or not to like his work post-guns. But I have just seen very one-sided posts coming from you and another poster.

And this is coming from a dude who enjoys Chinese Democracy and can't wait to hear what the next album will sound like :thumbsup:

I hear u loud n clear bro,point taken.I don't hate slash but the choices he has made make me cringe,such as the superbowl sideshow,his monotonous riffs,and the guy doesn't have a knack for writing lyrics. I don't agree with some of his actions such as VR dressing up like GNR for Halloween.

I don't think he has the chops of Satriani or vai,or Ashba and Ron. Maybe he did,but it all sounds repetitive now.

And I respect that man you have every right not to like Slash, hell I can't say I like everything he has done post-guns as well. I personally like a lot of stuff he has done, but even I admit that not everything he has done is on the same caliber of what he has done before. He may not have the technical chops, but I personally still love hearing him just going and playing with other musicians cause IMO he has a lot of feel for blues and in this instance simplicity isn't a bad thing from my perspective.

And when it comes to the whole GNR debate, Slash definitely could have handled it better. But then again, Axl could have handled things better too IMO. I like both of them, but that doesn't mean I agree with 100% of things they both have done

I think the most important thing is just to give respect to other forum members' opinions on the band situation, and to give credit where credit is due both with Axl and Slash. If everyone here did that there would be a lot less aggressive arguments and even though we may disagree on things we can respect each other's viewpoints and have a nice productive conversation :)

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...Only to release just 1 album in the almost 20 years since he retained the rights to the Guns N' Roses name?

Before I inevitibly get labeled a "hater" by some, I'd like to make it clear that when all is said and done I'm glad Axl continued the GNR legacy after Slash & Duff's departure, and I really dug the music on Chinese Democracy. So there's that.

Anyway, Axl maintains that he took control of the Guns N' Roses name to "salvage" and continue Guns N' Roses, not to end it...But the last time Axl did any real recording was from 1999 through maybe 2002, not counting the rerecording & tinkering that went on through early 2007.

We saw that the majority of Axl's vocals were laid down early on, many from the initial demos (See the TWAT, IRS, & Catcher 1999 demos, as they're the same vocals that are on the album.) That's a long time ago, more than ten years in some cases!

I recently said in another thread that I'd have no problem whatsoever with Axl calling his band Guns N' Roses, as long as they were releasing more new music & earning the name. But they're not doing that.

So here's a question: If Axl won't or can't (we don't know) release the other album that he already has recorded from the Chinese Democracy sessions, does anyone who's actually been around for a while honestly see Axl ever stepping into the studio again with the intention of writing/recording/releasing a new Guns N' Roses album with the current lineup? Keep in mind how difficult it was for him to complete and release CD back when he had a great deal of backing & financial support from the label. After what went down with CD's release, we have no idea where he currently stands with them.

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if whatever else has been recorded during the CD sessions becomes the last official recordings from Guns N' Roses, that is, if they can find a way to get that out, gulp, soon.

Of course not. Axl earns a great big revenue/income monthly only by owning the name. Period.

Edited by Todo Poderoso Timão
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IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the fuirst album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighuting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have tmore music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

  • KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  • Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  • Motörhead only has Lemmy
  • Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  • Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  • Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  • the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  • Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  • The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  • the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

o

Excellent synopsis!

The contract was signed by all members,not only Axl.

The name came from traciis name and Axls name,although AIDS and heads of amazon were suggested and dismissed.

Sssaul was in road crew along along with Steven,he also had an audition with poison .He was in a band nemesis black sheep for a bit as well. Izzy was in and out of numerous bands since leaving lafayette. diff came from Seattle to answer a ad for bass player wanted.

I'm sure the guys ran into each other,If you hang out in LA you always seem to run into an aquaintance whether you want to or not. So,yeah Axl brought in the band name,yybrought in Dizwald,and was watching his band deteriotrate to self abuse.Axl was always seen as the leader.Did he. Fire David Nivven? Yes,for trying to get Axl removed from the band.Fact.

Compare any of the alumnis albums to ChiDem,and its no contest-a no brainer,unless your lips are crazy glued to Saul's ass :rolleyes: Loved Saul when he replaced tracking. as lead guitarist,although Izzy wasn't wanted in the band by Saul,he wanted to be the only guitar player.Sure Izzy had his addiction problems but so did saul.

So hell yes I will be a GNR fan until I'm in my roll around wheelchair.After 20 years of being into a band,it is set and nothing else will measure up to GNR past,present or future. ;)

No contest? I don't know about that, everyone has different music tastes and just because someone might prefer Slash's new material to Chinese Democracy it doesn't mean that they are "glued to his ass" it just means they listen to the music they want to listen to. After all, music is subjective, there is no fun in saying "he sucks, end of story", music is all about emotion and personal tastes. That is the beauty of being a musician, the ability to connect with people :)

Sure,no problem to sashay the malevolent hatred back to whence they came. IMO I stopped having any respect for saul,when he brought "the snakepit album in saying it would be the next GNR album,duff n Axl were both against this,but offered to work on a few songs.

Saul immediately took his music and went off on the snakepit album.

The best lyricists on GNRs were Izzy,Axl,and West,who contributed a lot. Like it or not,Axl owns the GNR name.I'm glad of that.

I honestly do not get why you hate him because of that. IMO both Axl and Slash could have handled the whole rift better than they did/are. It is not one hundred percent Axl's fault or Slash's fault, it takes two to tango. Same goes for this place, you have every right not to like Slash, or not to like his work post-guns. But I have just seen very one-sided posts coming from you and another poster.

And this is coming from a dude who enjoys Chinese Democracy and can't wait to hear what the next album will sound like :thumbsup:

I hear u loud n clear bro,point taken.I don't hate slash but the choices he has made make me cringe,such as the superbowl sideshow,his monotonous riffs,and the guy doesn't have a knack for writing lyrics. I don't agree with some of his actions such as VR dressing up like GNR for Halloween.

I don't think he has the chops of Satriani or vai,or Ashba and Ron. Maybe he did,but it all sounds repetitive now.

And I respect that man you have every right not to like Slash, hell I can't say I like everything he has done post-guns as well. I personally like a lot of stuff he has done, but even I admit that not everything he has done is on the same caliber of what he has done before. He may not have the technical chops, but I personally still love hearing him just going and playing with other musicians cause IMO he has a lot of feel for blues and in this instance simplicity isn't a bad thing from my perspective.

And when it comes to the whole GNR debate, Slash definitely could have handled it better. But then again, Axl could have handled things better too IMO. I like both of them, but that doesn't mean I agree with 100% of things they both have done

I think the most important thing is just to give respect to other forum members' opinions on the band situation, and to give credit where credit is due both with Axl and Slash. If everyone here did that there would be a lot less aggressive arguments and even though we may disagree on things we can respect each other's viewpoints and have a nice productive conversation :)

That would be idyllic,but there are a few people here that bash incessantly,I think they derive some sort of pleasure in it.I can deal with discussion very politely.When the clown forum sends people over here to start shit,or some idiot rumor that gets spread all over the internet,it pushes my buttons.

I personally think they ought to make your above post as sticky!

Well said!! Very impartial,not that I agree with you,but we can express our differences in a civilized matter,and so can everyone else!!

:thumbsup:

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I've always been surprised how gung Ho the rest of the guys were about just quitting this band. it's like they didn't realize they were dating a hot supermodel who makes all your dreams come true.

Like David Caruso leaving NYPD Blue cos he thought he was bigger than the show?

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I've always been surprised how gung Ho the rest of the guys were about just quitting this band. it's like they didn't realize they were dating a hot supermodel who makes all your dreams come true.

It wasn't an overnight snap decision, this was a slow build pretty much since the AFD days.

Eventually the final straw had to come, and the foundation had been eroding away for years.

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Ibguess they had fuck you money. So they could just walk away knowing that really they were the shit and whatever axl was doing was very unlikely to come close. but what career were they embarking on. I'd have stayed until they fired me for making the tea wrong.

I've always been surprised how gung Ho the rest of the guys were about just quitting this band. it's like they didn't realize they were dating a hot supermodel who makes all your dreams come true.

Like David Caruso leaving NYPD Blue cos he thought he was bigger than the show?

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Stop trying to make Slash out as the bad guy as Axl rejected the songs...............Slash, Gilby and Matt all stated that Axl flately rejected the Snakepit songs initially.....did not want to work on any of them..by the time he decided he was willing to work on 3- 4 of them Slash had already commited to the Snakepit project........

Stop trying to rewrite history mate....

And really, it's no different than what Axl did. He got new people to help him complete his project when his current group was unwilling. :shrugs:

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