Why Did Axl Fight So Hard For The GNR Name...

[Cosmo]

Saul and William?

I've seen a lot of heated arguments on this forum but these new characters take it to another level

It's all Michael Andrew's fault...

[sailaway]

IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the fuirst album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighuting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have tmore music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

• KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  
• Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  
• Motörhead only has Lemmy
  
• Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  
• Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  
• Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  
• the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  
• Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  
• The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  
• the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis
  

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

o

Excellent synopsis!

The contract was signed by all members,not only Axl.

The name came from traciis name and Axls name,although AIDS and heads of amazon were suggested and dismissed.

Sssaul was in road crew along along with Steven,he also had an audition with poison .He was in a band nemesis black sheep for a bit as well. Izzy was in and out of numerous bands since leaving lafayette. diff came from Seattle to answer a ad for bass player wanted.

I'm sure the guys ran into each other,If you hang out in LA you always seem to run into an aquaintance whether you want to or not. So,yeah Axl brought in the band name,yybrought in Dizwald,and was watching his band deteriotrate to self abuse.Axl was always seen as the leader.Did he. Fire David Nivven? Yes,for trying to get Axl removed from the band.Fact.

Compare any of the alumnis albums to ChiDem,and its no contest-a no brainer,unless your lips are crazy glued to Saul's ass Loved Saul when he replaced tracking. as lead guitarist,although Izzy wasn't wanted in the band by Saul,he wanted to be the only guitar player.Sure Izzy had his addiction problems but so did saul.

So hell yes I will be a GNR fan until I'm in my roll around wheelchair.After 20 years of being into a band,it is set and nothing else will measure up to GNR past,present or future.

No contest? I don't know about that, everyone has different music tastes and just because someone might prefer Slash's new material to Chinese Democracy it doesn't mean that they are "glued to his ass" it just means they listen to the music they want to listen to. After all, music is subjective, there is no fun in saying "he sucks, end of story", music is all about emotion and personal tastes. That is the beauty of being a musician, the ability to connect with people

Sure,no problem to sashay the malevolent hatred back to whence they came. IMO I stopped having any respect for saul,when he brought "the snakepit album in saying it would be the next GNR album,duff n Axl were both against this,but offered to work on a few songs.

Saul immediately took his music and went off on the snakepit album.

The best lyricists on GNRs were Izzy,Axl,and West,who contributed a lot. Like it or not,Axl owns the GNR name.I'm glad of that.

I honestly do not get why you hate him because of that. IMO both Axl and Slash could have handled the whole rift better than they did/are. It is not one hundred percent Axl's fault or Slash's fault, it takes two to tango. Same goes for this place, you have every right not to like Slash, or not to like his work post-guns. But I have just seen very one-sided posts coming from you and another poster.

And this is coming from a dude who enjoys Chinese Democracy and can't wait to hear what the next album will sound like

I hear u loud n clear bro,point taken.I don't hate slash but the choices he has made make me cringe,such as the superbowl sideshow,his monotonous riffs,and the guy doesn't have a knack for writing lyrics. I don't agree with some of his actions such as VR dressing up like GNR for Halloween.

I don't think he has the chops of Satriani or vai,or Ashba and Ron. Maybe he did,but it all sounds repetitive now.

And I respect that man you have every right not to like Slash, hell I can't say I like everything he has done post-guns as well. I personally like a lot of stuff he has done, but even I admit that not everything he has done is on the same caliber of what he has done before. He may not have the technical chops, but I personally still love hearing him just going and playing with other musicians cause IMO he has a lot of feel for blues and in this instance simplicity isn't a bad thing from my perspective.

And when it comes to the whole GNR debate, Slash definitely could have handled it better. But then again, Axl could have handled things better too IMO. I like both of them, but that doesn't mean I agree with 100% of things they both have done

I think the most important thing is just to give respect to other forum members' opinions on the band situation, and to give credit where credit is due both with Axl and Slash. If everyone here did that there would be a lot less aggressive arguments and even though we may disagree on things we can respect each other's viewpoints and have a nice productive conversation

That would be idyllic,but there are a few people here that bash incessantly,I think they derive some sort of pleasure in it.I can deal with discussion very politely.When the clown forum sends people over here to start shit,or some idiot rumor that gets spread all over the internet,it pushes my buttons.

I personally think they ought to make your above post as sticky!

Well said!! Very impartial,not that I agree with you,but we can express our differences in a civilized matter,and so can everyone else!!

Uhh, you're like the second worst person here for not respecting people and their opinions. Until you can stop calling Slash Saul, stop strictly posting about the type of posters you don't like, talking about some clown forum most people don't even know about but apparently you regular just to catch people you don't like, quoting and laughing at every post that's against Slash or old members, etc etc, please stay out of the "let's respect each other" side of this forum; you're not invited in that conversation and you look stupid when you try and promote civility because everyone knows what you're like.

You don't dictate to me,do yourself a favor and go grill them burgers at your career choice.

This was a civilized Exchange by Whazup and myself until you stuck your ass into the convo.

[Midnight Rambler]

Spite?

[sailaway]

Spite?

No thanks,but if you have coffee on hand,ill take a cup

[The Wicked Hand]

Victory or death!

[dalsh327]

IMHO it was not about Axl making as much money as possible as he certainly is not milking the sacred cow anywhere near its potential but the Guns N Roses is a very valuable brand name and Axl realized that...It offered him financial security allowing him to do whatever he wants with a guaranteed revenue stream to finance his lifestyle and any music he choses to release...

It also gave his nuband and numusic instant credibility and helps him sell tickets...Anyone who thinks Axl sells as many albums and concert tickets without using the GnR name is kidding themselves I think...........

I also have no doubt that he was under pressure form the label to release music under the GnR banner as they realize the value of the brand...Slash wanted to tour as just Snakepit to support the first album but the label insisted on adding his name to band name for fan recognition....Brand names help sell products...........

I don't blame Axl for fighting for the name as it was a smart business decision............

You're right about the label pressuring Axl to keep the GnR. But you see, if Axl were to release Chinese Democracy as a solo album, it would most probably have been released a lot earlier, gotten much better reviews, people wouldn't be as harsh as they were on CD for it being released in the GnR catalog. We'd probably have more music, Axl's general media image would be much, much better, he would be able to play the classic GnR catalog still without the name, and his current situation with former GnR member would be much, much healthier, making a reunion much more possible. Ultimately, it would've been the right choice for him, I think. However, I think the fact he kept the name was not due to money interest or anything like that. I think in his head, keeping the GnR name and possibly making the new GnR formation successful would be as if "he won", in his head Slash, Duff, Matt, Izzy, and co would be pissed and regretful. He'd in some way prove "he didn't need them".

I don't think what he did was out of normality:

• KISS's only got Paul Stanley and Gene Simmons
  
• Iron Maiden technically only has two original members, which are Steve Harris and Dave Murray
  
• Motörhead only has Lemmy
  
• Wolfmother only has Andrew Stockdale
  
• Black Sabbath only has one stable member, which is Tommy Iommi
  
• Sepultura doesn't even have the Cavalera brothers anymore
  
• the Foo Fighters only kept stable original members Dave Grohl and Nate Mendel
  
• Lynyrd Skynyrd's only got original member Gary Rossington
  
• The Ramones only kept stable Joey and Johnny Ramone
  
• the Red Hot Chili Peppers only have original members Flea and Anthony Kleidis
  

and those are the ones I can think of right now... I don't think any fan base was half as harsh as the GnR fan base.

Paul and Gene had already been working together for a couple of years when they put KISS together. Supposedly Gene contacted Ace and Peter to be on "Family Jewels", but if you heard about this season, he's been working a lot of stuff out with his family. I'm pretty sure we might see another Metallica-like therapy session with the band next season, and it prob. ties in to the Rock Hall induction, if they happen to be nominated.

Black Sabbath is no longer Iommi's band. She sued Iommi over merchandising so the band could split it 4 ways (but it sounds like they settled that issue), she managed Black Sabbath once they reunited and when they did the remasters/box set, she was the exec producer. Iommi can't call the band Black Sabbath without Ozzy.

Skynyrd's pretty much a tribute band.

The Ramones - Tommy, the original drummer, went on to become a producer, but he continued to work with The Ramones behind the scenes.

The Foo Fighters wasn't a real band from the beginning. it was a bunch of songs Dave Grohl had demoed.

[moreblack]

Black Sabbath is no longer Iommi's band. She sued Iommi over merchandising so the band could split it 4 ways (but it sounds like they settled that issue), she managed Black Sabbath once they reunited and when they did the remasters/box set, she was the exec producer. Iommi can't call the band Black Sabbath without Ozzy.

The cancer needed to claim that bitch's life in the worst way...

[love&hates]

Black Sabbath is no longer Iommi's band. She sued Iommi over merchandising so the band could split it 4 ways (but it sounds like they settled that issue), she managed Black Sabbath once they reunited and when they did the remasters/box set, she was the exec producer. Iommi can't call the band Black Sabbath without Ozzy.

The cancer needed to claim that bitch's life in the worst way...

Thats a bit strong ... i wouldn´t want to be on your bad side , for sure

[Cosmo]

Paul and Gene had already been working together for a couple of years when they put KISS together.

Sure, same thing with GnR.

Black Sabbath is no longer Iommi's band. She sued Iommi over merchandising so the band could split it 4 ways (but it sounds like they settled that issue), she managed Black Sabbath once they reunited and when they did the remasters/box set, she was the exec producer. Iommi can't call the band Black Sabbath without Ozzy.

Yes but that doesn't change the fact he's the only stable member in Black Sabbath history and even without the other founding members it was still called Black Sabbath. Back then, people were much more open minded than GnR fans.

Skynyrd's pretty much a tribute band.

That's kinda that the nuGnR haters say about GnR 'cept they release more albums.

The Ramones - Tommy, the original drummer, went on to become a producer, but he continued to work with The Ramones behind the scenes.

You're right but we still we had 'The Ramones' with Joey, Johnny, CJ and Marky on albums he wasn't involved with.

The Foo Fighters wasn't a real band from the beginning. it was a bunch of songs Dave Grohl had demoed.

You're right about this one. But still, at least 9 big bands serve as very good examples.

[Apollo]

Paul and Gene had already been working together for a couple of years when they put KISS together.

Sure, same thing with GnR.

Black Sabbath is no longer Iommi's band. She sued Iommi over merchandising so the band could split it 4 ways (but it sounds like they settled that issue), she managed Black Sabbath once they reunited and when they did the remasters/box set, she was the exec producer. Iommi can't call the band Black Sabbath without Ozzy.

Yes but that doesn't change the fact he's the only stable member in Black Sabbath history and even without the other founding members it was still called Black Sabbath. Back then, people were much more open minded than GnR fans.

Skynyrd's pretty much a tribute band.

That's kinda that the nuGnR haters say about GnR 'cept they release more albums.

The Ramones - Tommy, the original drummer, went on to become a producer, but he continued to work with The Ramones behind the scenes.

You're right but we still we had 'The Ramones' with Joey, Johnny, CJ and Marky on albums he wasn't involved with.

The Foo Fighters wasn't a real band from the beginning. it was a bunch of songs Dave Grohl had demoed.

You're right about this one. But still, at least 9 big bands serve as very good examples.

Everybody is making great points.

But at the end of the day the name of a band is still just a NAME. Letters on a piece of paper. Nothing more, nothing less.

The name of a band has no relationship to past, present or future music. The name of a band has nothing to do with the quality level of music.

Axl using the name that he legal owns has no meaning to me in life. He owns it......done. Axl using the GnR name has no effect on ANY past GnR songs. It doesn't make scom a bad song now. And calling himself GnR isn't going to make any difference to what the next album sounds like.

I will never understand why fans get so tied up in a bands name. Or legacy. Or respect for former players. I care about the songs. None of that other drama has any bearing to me.

[hbkhbk]

Cancer Is Fashion