CD > AFD

[Dazey]

With CD, Axl has fulfilled his promise to outdo AFD.

This is the conclusion I have come to.

Clearly, CD and AFD are different beasts created in different eras.

But musically, CD is much better than AFD. From a musician point of view, CD blows AFD away. Anybody could cover the songs on AFD with ease. CD is not so easy to cover.

The lyrics on CD are also much more matured than on AFD. Obviously, a more grown up, wiser, and mature Axl will give your more mature lyrics.

Of course CD is not going to outsell AFD. But that's because of timing and a different era. When AFD was released, it was simply the right album for the generation of young people at the time.

CD lyrically is not going to speak to the mass population of young people today, simply because Axl is from a different era.

More fans may be able to sing along to the songs on AFD than on CD. But musically, musicians will find CD to be much more influential.

For these reasons, I truly honestly believe that CD is much better than AFD.

What do you think and why?

[Guest Len B'stard]

this person is clearly taking the piss but OK, so basically, an album is better the more musically complex it is? Nooooooooo, sorry, wrong. First of all Chi Dem ain't musically more complex than AFD, i fail to see how that is the case. It's a lot more augmented than AFD but layers and layers and layers of simple shit on top of each other does not make one complex tapestry of complexity unless the way in which the parts compliment each other are in some way complex which they're not in Chi Dem, they're just layers of flashy shit on top of an album that, structurally, is no more complex than AFD. It's just AFD with a lot of shit on top.

And where the fuck did this idea that complex means better come from? So what, Emerson Lake and Palmer are better than The Beatles by that rationale?

[gnrfan2007]

It is more than just the layers of sounds. If that is all you can take away from CD, then your mind is obviously not at the same level as where Axl has envisioned for GnR.

The songs on AFD is like what a typical garage band could pull off. They are cheap rock songs.

The songs on CD is like what you would get from Mozart.

CD is better musically. The talent on CD is 100x better than the old band. The complexity of the songs are thus 100x more musically beautiful.

It's time to get real. Slash and Duff have a limited music range and knowledge: 3-4 chord pop rock songs and cheap hammer-on/pull-off riffs.

The material on CD could not have been put together by the old band.

If you listen to UYIs, you will notice that Axl was clearly on a different level that what Slash, Duff, Izzy, and Matt were able to do.

CD is GnR's "Sgt. Pepper" album.

"Sgt. Pepper" was the album that gave The Beatles musical artist credibility.

Same thing. CD and the subsequent albums will solidify GnR's legacy as MUSICAL ARTISTS and not some '80s wannabe punk-rock/hard-rock band that died out after the Nirvana changed everything.

this person is clearly taking the piss but OK, so basically, an album is better the more musically complex it is? Nooooooooo, sorry, wrong. First of all Chi Dem ain't musically more complex than AFD, i fail to see how that is the case. It's a lot more augmented than AFD but layers and layers and layers of simple shit on top of each other does not make one complex tapestry of complexity unless the way in which the parts compliment each other are in some way complex which they're not in Chi Dem, they're just layers of flashy shit on top of an album that, structurally, is no more complex than AFD. It's just AFD with a lot of shit on top.

And where the fuck did this idea that complex means better come from? So what, Emerson Lake and Palmer are better than The Beatles by that rationale?

Edited September 4, 2011 by gnrfan2007

[D..]

The songs on AFD is like what a typical garage band could pull off. They are cheap rock songs.

No way. AFD may appear "simple" compared to CD but the arrangement by Izzy on songs like say, Nightrain, is genius. The genius of this album is that it can talk to anyone, it appears to be "basic hard rock" but it's a lot more than that and people haven't been mistaken when they hailed it as one of the best rock album ever made.

AFD in its genre is the best. CD is something else and probably also the best in its genre.

[GivenToFly]

The lyrics on CD are also much more matured than on AFD. Obviously, a more grown up, wiser, and mature Axl will give your more mature lyrics.

Look, I like CD very very much, it's one of my favorite albums, and yes, I do prefer it to Appetite For Destruction, but come on, the lyrics? The last thing the lyrics on this album are is mature. It's all drama queen, self-important, whiny stuff. Prostitute and Madagascar, I guess, show him at his most mature and even there he still barely comes across as an adult and he still has moments when he lapses into self-entitlement and self-victimization. Some of the lyrics on AFD (probably on account of having a more down to earth writing partner in Izzy and being - then painfully - in touch with reality) are actually more mature. Paradise City alone owns most of CD together in this sense.

It is more than just the layers of sounds. If that is all you can take away from CD, then your mind is obviously not at the same level as where Axl has envisioned for GnR.

The songs on AFD is like what a typical garage band could pull off. They are cheap rock songs.

The songs on CD is like what you would get from Mozart.

CD is better musically. The talent on CD is 100x better than the old band. The complexity of the songs are thus 100x more musically beautiful.

It's time to get real. Slash and Duff have a limited music range and knowledge: 3-4 chord pop rock songs and cheap hammer-on/pull-off riffs.

The material on CD could not have been put together by the old band.

If you listen to UYIs, you will notice that Axl was clearly on a different level that what Slash, Duff, Izzy, and Matt were able to do.

CD is GnR's "Dr. Pepper" album.

"Dr. Pepper" was the album that gave The Beatles musical artist credibility.

Same thing. CD and the subsequent albums will solidify GnR's legacy as MUSICAL ARTISTS and not some '80s wannabe punk-rock/hard-rock band that died out after the Nirvana changed everything.

this person is clearly taking the piss but OK, so basically, an album is better the more musically complex it is? Nooooooooo, sorry, wrong. First of all Chi Dem ain't musically more complex than AFD, i fail to see how that is the case. It's a lot more augmented than AFD but layers and layers and layers of simple shit on top of each other does not make one complex tapestry of complexity unless the way in which the parts compliment each other are in some way complex which they're not in Chi Dem, they're just layers of flashy shit on top of an album that, structurally, is no more complex than AFD. It's just AFD with a lot of shit on top.

And where the fuck did this idea that complex means better come from? So what, Emerson Lake and Palmer are better than The Beatles by that rationale?

Oh nevermind, I thought this was a serious thread.

[moreblack]

LOL no. AFD is one of a kind almost perfect hard rock album. But thanks for the cupcake thread.

[Guest siliconmessiah]

Honestly.

I haven´t listened to AFD in a couple of years. I guess I have just got tired of that album.

I am starting to get tired of CD too.

There are other bands with good albums out there. Avenged Sevenfold has quickly become a favourite of mine. They have good, complex and progressive music. For starters, I recommend the songs "Buried alive" and "Afterlife".

Edited September 3, 2011 by siliconmessiah

[Georgy Zhukov]

I love both albums.

[AbominableHoman]

LOL no. AFD is one of a kind almost perfect hard rock album. But thanks for the cupcake thread.

What he said.

[WhazUp]

It is more than just the layers of sounds. If that is all you can take away from CD, then your mind is obviously not at the same level as where Axl has envisioned for GnR.

The songs on AFD is like what a typical garage band could pull off. They are cheap rock songs.

The songs on CD is like what you would get from Mozart.

CD is better musically. The talent on CD is 100x better than the old band. The complexity of the songs are thus 100x more musically beautiful.

It's time to get real. Slash and Duff have a limited music range and knowledge: 3-4 chord pop rock songs and cheap hammer-on/pull-off riffs.

The material on CD could not have been put together by the old band.

If you listen to UYIs, you will notice that Axl was clearly on a different level that what Slash, Duff, Izzy, and Matt were able to do.

CD is GnR's "Dr. Pepper" album.

"Dr. Pepper" was the album that gave The Beatles musical artist credibility.

Same thing. CD and the subsequent albums will solidify GnR's legacy as MUSICAL ARTISTS and not some '80s wannabe punk-rock/hard-rock band that died out after the Nirvana changed everything.

this person is clearly taking the piss but OK, so basically, an album is better the more musically complex it is? Nooooooooo, sorry, wrong. First of all Chi Dem ain't musically more complex than AFD, i fail to see how that is the case. It's a lot more augmented than AFD but layers and layers and layers of simple shit on top of each other does not make one complex tapestry of complexity unless the way in which the parts compliment each other are in some way complex which they're not in Chi Dem, they're just layers of flashy shit on top of an album that, structurally, is no more complex than AFD. It's just AFD with a lot of shit on top.

And where the fuck did this idea that complex means better come from? So what, Emerson Lake and Palmer are better than The Beatles by that rationale?

Slash is just "pop chords"? Please listen to the song Obsession Confession where Slash plays a flamenco style solo. You are wrong on that count. And even IF you are right, that doesn't make you right about CD being the album to give them credibility amongst musicians. Cause musicians know that you don't need to be technically good to write good music. Musicians (myself being one too) respect artists who create unique music that means something to them. I love Chinese Democracy but the highly respectable musicians I know only know it by "oh that is the album that axl took 14 years to make". Appetite may be technically easier to play, but that doesn't mean the sounds created are inferior. In fact, popular opinion shows the opposite in regards to GNR

Edited September 3, 2011 by WhazUp

[Guest Len B'stard]

It is more than just the layers of sounds. If that is all you can take away from CD, then your mind is obviously not at the same level as where Axl has envisioned for GnR.

OK, well explain how it's not.

The songs on AFD is like what a typical garage band could pull off. They are cheap rock songs.

Right but the miracle isn't the fact that they can play Appetite, the miracle is them coming up with Appetite, there's a difference. Gimme a guitar and i'll play Hide Your Love Away by The Beatles for you right now but ask me to come up with a song with such melody and i'm fucked.

The songs on CD is like what you would get from Mozart.

OHHHHH!!! So THATS why it set the world on fire like it did...what a dickhead

CD is better musically. The talent on CD is 100x better than the old band. The complexity of the songs are thus 100x more musically beautiful.

Well if thats all your mind can take from Appetite i think you can't see what the rest of the world is talking about when they big that album up and essentially ignore Chi Dem. Also, what does better musically mean? Explain to me, explicitly what that means, better musically, i'd like to know. So if i make a song and it's got a G an A and a D chord if i add a F# then it's better musically, what does that mean, better musically?

It's time to get real. Slash and Duff have a limited music range and knowledge: 3-4 chord pop rock songs and cheap hammer-on/pull-off riffs.

Whats cheap about hammer on's and pull offs? What techniques in terms of guitar playing would you say are of greater value...and why?

The material on CD could not have been put together by the old band.

Yes it could have, there is absolutely nothing of substance on Chi Dem that the old band couldn't do. You can take any song in the world, as simple as you like and if you dig deep enough in hog heaven you can get all your synthesisers and pro tools and crap and all this space nintendo shit and cake the songs with it to give the illusion that you're creating something grand or epic but it's pretty much like those little bodysuits Paris Hilton gives her mutts. And put together is a very accurate way of describing it, there's is clearly not a stick of organic music on Chi Dem and it shows.

If you listen to UYIs, you will notice that Axl was clearly on a different level that what Slash, Duff, Izzy, and Matt were able to do.

Yeah, i'll hang with you on that, if nothing else Axl Rose has proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that he's on a different level to everyone else.

CD is GnR's "Dr. Pepper" album.

"Dr. Pepper" was the album that gave The Beatles musical artist credibility.

Beatles were lauded as credible artists from their earliest songwriting work released, make no mistake about that. I remember an early interview with John Lennon where some high end muso was going on about his early albums and use of the mixolydian scale and John was like, oh, thats wonderful but i don't know what it is. Beatles had credibility from the jump.

Same thing. CD and the subsequent albums will solidify GnR's legacy as MUSICAL ARTISTS and not some '80s wannabe punk-rock/hard-rock band that died out after the Nirvana changed everything.

GnR have not released anything that gave them the artistic credibility that Appetite did, fact. None of the Illusions or Spag or CD have even approached getting the kind of claim AFD did.

But bottom line, the fans, the music press, journalists, musicians, across the board ALL rate the original band, the day new GnR approach anything like that sort of recognition, then we'll talk.

[Thelonious]

CD is GnR's "Dr. Pepper" album.

"Dr. Pepper" was the album that gave The Beatles musical artist credibility.

Dr. Pepper?? one of the funniest things I think I have read on this forum in a long time...The Beatles wrote Dr. Pepper..........

LULZ-- Poor kid. He's heard of Sgt. Pepper's significance, but doesn't have a clue why.

OP--

Edited September 3, 2011 by Thelonious

[Kill Devil Hill]

The songs on CD is like what you would get from Mozart.

Lolwut?

[moreblack]

CD outdoes nothing, not even the rock of the current times.

[Damn_Smooth]

CD outdoes nothing, not even the rock of the current times.

So go visit a Beiber forum. Or better yet, start your own Fergie/Slash fan page. If you have that opinion (Yes, I realize that you're too stupid to grasp that opinion does not equal fact.) you really don't belong here, because it's not going to get any better for you.

[dalsh327]

With CD, Axl has fulfilled his promise to outdo AFD.

This is the conclusion I have come to.

Clearly, CD and AFD are different beasts created in different eras.

But musically, CD is much better than AFD. From a musician point of view, CD blows AFD away. Anybody could cover the songs on AFD with ease. CD is not so easy to cover.

The lyrics on CD are also much more matured than on AFD. Obviously, a more grown up, wiser, and mature Axl will give your more mature lyrics.

Of course CD is not going to outsell AFD. But that's because of timing and a different era. When AFD was released, it was simply the right album for the generation of young people at the time.

CD lyrically is not going to speak to the mass population of young people today, simply because Axl is from a different era.

More fans may be able to sing along to the songs on AFD than on CD. But musically, musicians will find CD to be much more influential.

For these reasons, I truly honestly believe that CD is much better than AFD.

What do you think and why?

It's like comparing Dylan's Highway 61 Revisited & Blonde on Blonde against Blood on the Tracks.

Or putting Lennon's work on Sgt Pepper and White Album up against Double Fantasy.

Musicians aren't going to find CD influential, because most of the sounds used on there can be found elsewhere. Something influential either means you've never heard it before, or heard it done before in a specific way.

I think it's underrated as a rock album, but it's only because you can't help but compare it to their past albums. Best thing to do is compare it to what other bands are putting out right now, not what GNR put out 20 years ago.

I don't know if the new Janes or Chili Peppers CDs are going to live up to their past recordings, either. There's major elements missing out of both bands right now. I don't know if the McKagan songs are anything Janes will be putting out, or had to go back to the drawing board.

It's like talking about Van Halen 3. Ed still stands by the album as something people in time will eventually come around to liking. It's been 12 years since that one was out, and it still gets put on "worst of all time" lists. And the funny thing is the reviews for CD were mostly positive, even though it wound up on "worst of the year" lists.

Axl's put the bulk of CD and AFD side by side at the live shows... either the audience is into it or they're not.

[Cosmo]

CD is GnR's "Dr. Pepper" album.

"Dr. Pepper" was the album that gave The Beatles musical artist credibility.

Sorry, dude. Dr. Pepper?! Is this serious?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! You should've at least googled that one.

[Chris 55]

CD outdoes nothing, not even the rock of the current times.

So go visit a Beiber forum. Or better yet, start your own Fergie/Slash fan page. If you have that opinion (Yes, I realize that you're too stupid to grasp that opinion does not equal fact.) you really don't belong here, because it's not going to get any better for you.

Yeah, that's it. Get upset over someone's opinion.

[Apollo]

CD outdoes nothing, not even the rock of the current times.

So go visit a Beiber forum. Or better yet, start your own Fergie/Slash fan page. If you have that opinion (Yes, I realize that you're too stupid to grasp that opinion does not equal fact.) you really don't belong here, because it's not going to get any better for you.

Yeah, that's it. Get upset over someone's opinion.

He is not upset over somebody's opinion. Moreblack is one of the posters who make negative comments about Axl, Cd and the new band all the time, for years. It just makes no sense to most normal people.

I could not care less if u or anybody doesnt like Axl, GnR, or CD. It is music and we all have different tastes.

What is Mindboggling is that people who dislike Axl, GnR or CD would choose to continually post in a GnR forum. It is idiotic.

I don't like Bieber, I can't stand the Red Sox, I hate mustard..........so u will NOT find me spending one second of my life posting in a bieber, mustard or red sox forum. I post in forums that are related to things that bring me joy.

I think the concept of a reality show following the lives of the kardashians is stupid. If I was like you and Moreblack and a few others on here, I would watch every show and spend an hour a day on their forum.....badmouthing and saying how terrible the show was. OR I would be like a normal person and NOT ever go to their forum.

This isn't about different opinions and free speech. People that spend time in forums of bands they don't like.....or that go to a forum specifically to bash that band......yes, something is wrong with them. Maybe their lives are so boring and sad that their only form of entertainment is to constantly be negative and whine and cry all the time.

Moreblack.....let me give u the same advice YOU gave somebody when they were bashing VR."plenty of other good bands out there, go find one you enjoy."

[moreblack]

CD outdoes nothing, not even the rock of the current times.

So go visit a Beiber forum. Or better yet, start your own Fergie/Slash fan page. If you have that opinion (Yes, I realize that you're too stupid to grasp that opinion does not equal fact.) you really don't belong here, because it's not going to get any better for you.

Yeah, that's it. Get upset over someone's opinion.

apparently it don't take much these days

and Gro, get over yourself. You post here, I post here. Live with it.

this is clearly not a serious thread, therefore should not be taken discussion seriously.

Edited September 3, 2011 by moreblack

[Damn_Smooth]

CD outdoes nothing, not even the rock of the current times.

So go visit a Beiber forum. Or better yet, start your own Fergie/Slash fan page. If you have that opinion (Yes, I realize that you're too stupid to grasp that opinion does not equal fact.) you really don't belong here, because it's not going to get any better for you.

Yeah, that's it. Get upset over someone's opinion.

It's rather obvious that your reading comprehension is somewhat lacking so I'll explain to you that that "opinion" was stated as fact. I find it sweet that you stick up for your ???, but what I said stands true. Why waste the time to post in a forum of a band that you think is worse than any other band out there? What kind of life does one lead where their only goal is to whine about something that isn't going to change, daily? Since you obviously know the answer, I'll patiently await your response.

[Chris 55]

CD outdoes nothing, not even the rock of the current times.

So go visit a Beiber forum. Or better yet, start your own Fergie/Slash fan page. If you have that opinion (Yes, I realize that you're too stupid to grasp that opinion does not equal fact.) you really don't belong here, because it's not going to get any better for you.

Yeah, that's it. Get upset over someone's opinion.

It's rather obvious that your reading comprehension is somewhat lacking so I'll explain to you that that "opinion" was stated as fact. I find it sweet that you stick up for your ???, but what I said stands true. Why waste the time to post in a forum of a band that you think is worse than any other band out there? What kind of life does one lead where their only goal is to whine about something that isn't going to change, daily? Since you obviously know the answer, I'll patiently await your response.

Ok...here it is. Ready?

Of course it's his opinion. Do you normally get so bent out of shape over stupid shit? Does he HAVE to type "in my opinion" just so you don't get all worked up and think that his statement is a "fact" and it's the end all, be all decision about which album is better? Is your sense of reality so far gone that you insult someone on a message board over their musical taste? I can be more understanding if you're a little kid but if you're a teenager or an adult and this is your behavior to someone's opinion about an album on a message board, you've got some pretty bad mental problems.

Edited September 3, 2011 by Chris 55

[Damn_Smooth]

CD outdoes nothing, not even the rock of the current times.

So go visit a Beiber forum. Or better yet, start your own Fergie/Slash fan page. If you have that opinion (Yes, I realize that you're too stupid to grasp that opinion does not equal fact.) you really don't belong here, because it's not going to get any better for you.

Yeah, that's it. Get upset over someone's opinion.

It's rather obvious that your reading comprehension is somewhat lacking so I'll explain to you that that "opinion" was stated as fact. I find it sweet that you stick up for your ???, but what I said stands true. Why waste the time to post in a forum of a band that you think is worse than any other band out there? What kind of life does one lead where their only goal is to whine about something that isn't going to change, daily? Since you obviously know the answer, I'll patiently await your response.

Ok...here it is. Ready?

Thanks. It's all so clear now.

[st0n3r]

There we go again: someone claims he doesn't like CD and he's 'stupid'. I really don't understand you guys. Moreblack always seemed an ok poster to me, not a cupcake. He just prefers the Slash-era over the current one. Does that make him less of a fan or something? I guess every Metallica-fan who dislikes St. Anger is also a 'hater'?

You guys need to realize that disliking CD does not equal trolling. Do you guys actually visit a DISCUSSION forum, only to have people agree ith you?

Edited September 3, 2011 by st0n3r

[Nintari]

CD outdoes nothing, not even the rock of the current times.

So go visit a Beiber forum. Or better yet, start your own Fergie/Slash fan page. If you have that opinion (Yes, I realize that you're too stupid to grasp that opinion does not equal fact.) you really don't belong here, because it's not going to get any better for you.

Yeah, that's it. Get upset over someone's opinion.

In order for an opinion to be taken seriously, one's reputation needs to be at a certain credible level. Moreblack's been trolling this forum forever. Everything he says is just cupcake after cupcake after cupcake.

That's why you see the anger. People get tired of the trolling.

There we go again: someone claims he doesn't like CD and he's 'stupid'. I really don't understand you guys. Moreblack always seemed an ok poster to me, not a cupcake. He just prefers the Slash-era over the current one. Does that make him less of a fan or something? I guess every Metallica-fan who dislikes St. Anger is also a 'hater'?

Think about it. If moreblack was a decent guy and just preferred the Slash era to the Axl era, than why wouldn't he stay in the correct forum discussing what he loves the most? The answer is, he's not HERE for that. He's here to take shots at people and what they like and to get under their skin...period.

Edited September 3, 2011 by Nintari