Guns N Roses Are At A Crossroad

[GN'R Fan]

The way some of you worship Axl is funny.

So by your statements this really is just a nostalgic act. He doesn't care about success, putting out new music once every 15 years is MORE than enough, and the members of this band are happy just being a cover band. Wow.

Length of time being a fan does matter. I've been here 25 years. I was supporting Axl through it all. But he is losing me. That should matter.

Not releasing new music is a slap in the face to every current member of the band. Like it or not, if you tour for 15 years and play music that another band created......you are a cover band. End of story.

This band sounds amazing live. Unfortunately, and history has shown this, the longer it takes to release new music the more band members that are going to quit.

I'm baffled how GnR and music fans can say that Axl is handling the GnR name properly. So what you guys want, and think is awesome, is a revolving door of musicians, one album every decade at most, GnR to not be relevant in the music world, and for the band to just continually tour and play its so easy every night?

I'm different than you guys. I think this band could put out amazing music and would love to see them operate like EVERY other band in the world. Some of you are content with it being a cover band.

Oh , and CD was a success. Any label in the world will take a band that can produce albums that sell

4-5 million copies. Axl doesn't have to be the biggest band in the world. Keeping putting out albums that sell 4-5 million copies every 2-3 years and GnR will be relevant and successful. All GnR fans will be happy, the band will be a real band, they will make tons of money, Axl will show he can be a success without slash/Duff/Izzy. Everybody wins.

Or, just continue touring and living off the songs the old band created.

To quote an often overused Internet Forum phrase - this!

As another long term fan I have to agree.

[avahland]

... Now I'm just tired of it. If he gave a crap about his fans and the GnR name, he would be putting out new music. Like every other band in the world does.

Don't be tired....just be patient. Sooner or later there will be new music.

Unfortunately it's gonna be later...

meanwhile....lower your expectations....forget about defending....GNR doesn't need to be defended

Enjoy the shows !

[SoulMonster]

He doesn't care about success, putting out new music once every 15 years is MORE than enough, and the members of this band are happy just being a cover band. Wow.

Who exactly says that Axl doesn't care about success, that it is okay with putting out music every 15 years, or says that the members of the band are happy just covering others' material?

I'm baffled how GnR and music fans can say that Axl is handling the GnR name properly.

Who says that?

It seems to me many people here are so passionate and antagonistic that they would rather conjure up other's opinions so they can fiercely respond to ideal fantasies than actually react to what they ARE saying.

Are you serious?

I admire your Passion for defending Axl. I've been doing it for the last 15 years.

But come on. Go back and reread all of these posts. You and a few others keep defending what this band is doing in every topic.

One album in 3.5 years is not bad.

People love this band touring.

Axl only has to please himself, not his fans.

And on and on and on.

We could go ten more years with no new album, four new band members, and years of touring and making money off of the old band, and GnR playing at clubs.......and you and Ali and a couple others will be on here saying it was the All Good.

No. Why are you still dreaming up my opinions? Is it really so hard for you to just cope with what I am writing??

I am not defending Axl, I think he is an asshole that is awfully bad at getting music out to his audience. The only nice things I have to say about him is that he is a good frontman and an excellent musician. That being said, I think it is FANTASTIC that Guns N' Roses released a record in late 2008, because I never expected that back in 1997, and I think it is fantastic that they keep on touring a FANTASTIC set list to audiences all over the world, because for most of my time of being a GN'R fan (since 1988) they haven't done much at all, and as an artist I think Axl's primary goal should always be to try to realize artistic goals rather than please the dirty plebs. I PREFER musicians that are driven by the art more than anything else. It might mean that music comes sporadically and rarely, but I tend to enjoy that music so much more. But I am NOT defending Axl or how he works GN'R, I would have done things differently. Then you would have had a frontman that promoted music, was very available to the fanbase, answered all questions, played new music all the time...but you wouldn't have enjoyed it much .

I was right there with you guys. Ten years ago. Defending Axl with a Passion. Now I'm just tired of it. If he gave a crap about his fans and the GnR name, he would be putting out new music. Like every other band in the world does.

This all means you are...uhm, not thinking clearly. First for "defending an artist". How fanboid is that? He doesn't need your defence and I don't think he deserves it, either. And changing opinions, that is another way of saying that you at one time was wrong. And your idea that he doesn't release music mere 3,5 years after he actually did it, seals the deal. You are...uhm, not thinking clearly.

Edited February 11, 2012 by SoulMonster

[axlsalinger]

Great topic - I was thinking of starting something similar last night. Excellent post by the OP. I do agree that the band is at a crossroads now. 3.5 years since CD was released is long enough. If you put your car in neutral, it doesn't matter how long or hard you rev the engine ... you still ain't going nowhere.

Couple of comments I made in another thread:

It has nothing to do with "staying home" or "going out" to see the band live. Even the people doing the most complaining (well, most of them) understand that most bands don't do radically different setlists every night. (If this is all you're interested in, go see Phish or Pearl Jam).

It has to do with the fact that Axl fought so hard to keep GNR going, then refuses to actually progress this band and move it forward. GNR circa 2012 has so much talent, it's a damn shame that they don't release new music. We know the names of many unreleased songs. They have been mentioned by Axl himself, with enthusiasm. Anyone who has actually heard them says they are great, so I don't really buy the theory that they just don't have any good songs in the bank.

If they all suck, then get into the studio and record some new ones. If you're not ready for a new album, release a single. If you're not ready for a single, leak a couple of old tracks. If you don't want to do that either, at least TALK TO THE FANS and let us know what we CAN reasonably expect.

As the OP said, WHY FIGHT SO HARD to re-create Guns n' Roses with all-new guys if all you want to do is tour Appetite and UYI songs?

I don't think Axl is interested in returning to being the biggest rock star on the planet. But I do think he would like for people to accept the current incarnation of GNR as a good band, and as GNR. Most of us do - most of the general public do not, or are indifferent. Regarding the lost Chinese Democracy years, what happened, happened. It cannot be undone. But Axl can definitely write a new chapter of Guns history by releasing something new and moving on. All it really takes is a hit song or two, suddenly people say hey, now I get it. New Guns is cool! Rather than sitting on their hands through CD songs they don't really know waiting to hear songs they do know, suddenly the majority of the audience (and not just the die-hards) is actually looking forward to hearing the NEW Guns single. They're just as excited about hearing Monstrosity (or whatever the single is called) as they are about hearing Paradise City. Isn't this the very reason Axl has kept this thing going?

However you want to phrase the question, a perpetual never-ending Chinese Democracy World Tour is not the answer.

This ain't rocket science, folks.

[EhEh]

Great, another year of touring the same old, same old......can't wait.

[spunko12345]

He doesn't care about success, putting out new music once every 15 years is MORE than enough, and the members of this band are happy just being a cover band. Wow.

Who exactly says that Axl doesn't care about success, that it is okay with putting out music every 15 years, or says that the members of the band are happy just covering others' material?

I'm baffled how GnR and music fans can say that Axl is handling the GnR name properly.

Who says that?

It seems to me many people here are so passionate and antagonistic that they would rather conjure up other's opinions so they can fiercely respond to ideal fantasies than actually react to what they ARE saying.

Dont kid yourself. People say on a daily basis that they love Axl because he does things his way, eg releasing one album in 20 years and handling GNR the way he does. When people dare to critisize the way he's handled the GNR name solo they are accused of being anti Axl when in reality they are a better fan because they want music and productivity.

You are deliberately avoiding Groghans points which I think are very accurate.

Edited February 11, 2012 by spunko12345

[Flayer]

No, no one enjoys the delays. Some people just choose to accept it as the way Axl operates and others are still complaining about it after all these years.

[SoulMonster]

Dont kid yourself. People say on a daily basis that they love Axl because he does things his way, eg releasing one album in 20 years and handling GNR the way he does.

Since it happens on a "daily basis" I assume it would be easy for you to quote a few members from today who have said that "they love Axl because he" "releases one album in 20 years".

You are deliberately avoiding Groghans points which I think are very accurate.

No, I am deliberately avoiding addressing parts of Groghans posts which I don't disagree with because I see no reason to discuss when I agree, and instead I focus on those parts which in my opinion are wrong. Like when he makes lots of silly claims about what people, me included, thinks, just so he can toss out his irrelevant rebuttals and responses to fictional arguments. Do you seriously expect me to defend the imaginary viewpoints he says comes from people here when my whole point is that he just makes them up? Like, do you expect me to defend imaginary people who says "Axl is handling the GNR name properly" when it is all just figments of Groghans fantasy?

Edited February 11, 2012 by SoulMonster

[jmapelian]

Actually, they were at the crossroads a long time ago, and they made some bad decisions, as a result they are now a mid tier band averaging 6,000 fans per show, Instead of selling out arena's like AC/DC, Metallica, Van Halen, Aerosmith and on and on. I believe there formula for success Is to stick to what got them here, which Is just straight up Rock N Roll.I would have to say, most of the worlds opinion Is that(judging by the sales numbers) Chinese Democracy wasn't a good Guns N Roses album and wasn't worth 14 years of silence. They need to go back to basics, release a new album ,with at least one or two hit singles, something along the lines of Sweet Child, Paradise City, November Rain and keep there faces plastered everywhere they possibly can, because as of right now America still doesn't accept this version of Guns N Roses, as a matter of fact I would be willing to bet, that the average American couldn't name one other member of the band, other then Axl Rose.

Axl Rose does not care about that definition of success. He does not care if the average person knows his new band members or songs, if he's matching up to Metallica or not, or if America "accepts" him. He doesn't care to do the same thing and stick to any formula. The path he's chosen is for his own definition of success, which I'd say is making the music he wants to and playing with the people he wants to.

That's bullshit - he sure as hell cared when he said he wanted AFD to be the biggest selling rock debut album and he sure as hell cared when he said he wanted the Illusion albums to bury AFD - now that he's set for life financially, he doesn't care - right

[Tom1447]

I wouldnt be supprised if a re-release/ new album is coming out in the next few months.

Theres only a small chance, but its still a chance.

[spunko12345]

Dont kid yourself. People say on a daily basis that they love Axl because he does things his way, eg releasing one album in 20 years and handling GNR the way he does.

Since it happens on a "daily basis" I assume it would be easy for you to quote a few members from today who have said that "they love Axl because he" "releases one album in 20 years".

You are deliberately avoiding Groghans points which I think are very accurate.

No, I am deliberately avoiding addressing parts of Groghans posts which I don't disagree with because I see no reason to discuss when I agree, and instead I focus on those parts which in my opinion are wrong. Like when he makes lots of silly claims about what people, me included, thinks, just so he can toss out his irrelevant rebuttals and responses to fictional arguments. Do you seriously expect me to defend the imaginary viewpoints he says comes from people here when my whole point is that he just makes them up? Like, do you expect me to defend imaginary people who says "Axl is handling the GNR name properly" when it is all just figments of Groghans fantasy?

Again you are avoiding the issue. Clearly no one actually states "I love GNR and the fact that they only have one album in 20 years". But I definately could point you in the direction of plenty of "Axl is cool because he doesnt want to be like Metallica/AC/DC etc" in response to someone naming a functional band of similar age, or "I am more happy with GNR now than ever before".

OK, just to simplify it for you I will ask you the questions directly.

Do you think Axl has handled GNR in the best way possible since taking over the name?

Are you happy with the amount of albums released since 1993?

As an extra challenge try to answer the questions by blaming the fewest other parties as you possibly can.

Edited February 11, 2012 by spunko12345

[SoulMonster]

Again you are avoiding the issue. Clearly no one actually states "I love GNR and the fact that they only have one album in 20 years".

Then why on earth are you deliberately claiming they do this daily? Are you training the forum to ignore everything you write? Why?

But I definately could point you in the direction of plenty of "Axl is cool because he doesnt want to be like Metallica/AC/DC etc" in response to someone naming a functional band of similar age, or "I am more happy with GNR now than ever before".

Sure, and those are fair enough opinions -- although not opinions I necessarily agree with.

OK, just to simplify it for you I will ask you the questions directly.

Do you think Axl has handled GNR in the best way possible since taking over the name?

Absolutely not and I have explicitly stated that earlier tonight.

Are you happy with the amount of albums released since 1993?

Of course I am. I would of course have been even happier with more records with equal quality but anything is better than zero which is default.

Is THIS the issues you claim I have avoided answering??

As an extra challenge try to answer the questions by blaming the fewest other parties as you possibly can.

Only Axl is to blame for how he handles Guns N' Roses. Jeezes, I wish people would start reading what I write rather than just assume I have certain opinions and then attack me for them. It is so tiring to always have to shoot down strawmen rather than actually discuss differences in real opinions.

[Flayer]

Why don't we start taking pissing matches to the chat instead of these threads?

[jmapelian]

Why don't we start taking pissing matches to the chat instead of these threads?

that's all GnR's been about since around 1996/97 dude

[AGS]

GnR were at the crossroads in

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want me to go on

the band doesnt stop no matter what fans, forum members, press, managers etc says...

[Flayer]

And I'm waiting, at the crossroads

Waiting for yooooooooooooooooooou

Where are you?

[Saphyra]

I think Axl creates primarily for himself.

Exactly!

[Chimera]

I think the 'real' Axl Rose is a dude who's now content being an average guy. He's made his fame, released some great music, and partied his ass off. I honestly think he's been 'over' Guns N Roses since Use Your Illusion. Everything since then has been posturing indecision. "We'll release music." - "We won't release music." - "I want Chinese to bury Appetite." - "We will tour next year with new songs." - "We're releasing another record." - "The Better video will be soon."

Now, it's like we have a balance between hermit Axl, and productive Axl. I think the tour schedule is manageable, and I think it accents his personality better than doing what he used to do. Besides, he's an old dude. People age, and priorities change. A large percentage of GNR fans believed the release of Chinese Democracy would usher in a new era of GNR in the media. Many even expected videos, Superbowl performances, multiple albums, band photos, press kits, merchandising - the works.

What we received was a mish-mash compilation of new songs extracted from different eras that lacked cohesion.

[Chris 55]

I think the 'real' Axl Rose is a dude who's now content being an average guy. He's made his fame, released some great music, and partied his ass off. I honestly think he's been 'over' Guns N Roses since Use Your Illusion. Everything since then has been posturing indecision. "We'll release music." - "We won't release music." - "I want Chinese to bury Appetite." - "We will tour next year with new songs." - "We're releasing another record." - "The Better video will be soon."

Nah, if that were true, he wouldn't have done CD and would have not got the GNR as his own etc.

[axlsalinger]

GnR were at the crossroads in

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want me to go on

the band doesnt stop no matter what fans, forum members, press, managers etc says...

Why weren't they at a crossroad in 1998, lol?

[Chimera]

I think the 'real' Axl Rose is a dude who's now content being an average guy. He's made his fame, released some great music, and partied his ass off. I honestly think he's been 'over' Guns N Roses since Use Your Illusion. Everything since then has been posturing indecision. "We'll release music." - "We won't release music." - "I want Chinese to bury Appetite." - "We will tour next year with new songs." - "We're releasing another record." - "The Better video will be soon."

Nah, if that were true, he wouldn't have done CD and would have not got the GNR as his own etc.

Had the record label not intervened - would it have ever been released? Axl's in coasting mode. For years, Chinese Democracy was his 'ship in a bottle' that he promised to finish one day. He made little blips of activity followed by long periods of hibernation. I honestly deduce he's content in this groove of his career. It doesn't require too much effort, he doesn't have to push himself outside of his comfort zone, and he gets to have a little fun, and make a little money.

I can't say I blame him.

[Zint]

I'll be completely honest...I don't understand this next round of tour dates.

They saved the States for the last leg of the Chi-Dem world tour.

End of...you know?

Get the fuck back in the studio..forward momentum.

Get something new going.

The fans salivated at the news of small venue shows,it's gotta mean one thing right??

It's gotta mean something.

Even one new song would have reinflated the fan enthusiasm balloon.

And yet...by the end of the night,nothing new,nada...in fact...even less Chi Dem songs.

I just really don't understand it.

They should be in the studio or,at least,be locked in a rehearsal studio somewhere working on new material.

Or editing material for a world tour blu-ray or something (maybe they are I dunno...sure doesn't feel like it though).

Stayed up late last night,intrigued,secretly hoping for a nugget,something.

Ultimately...just another round of another round.

I don't get it.

[Apollo]

I'll be completely honest...I don't understand this next round of tour dates.

They saved the States for the last leg of the Chi-Dem world tour.

End of...you know?

Get the fuck back in the studio..forward momentum.

Get something new going.

The fans salivated at the news of small venue shows,it's gotta mean one thing right??

It's gotta mean something.

Even one new song would have reinflated the fan enthusiasm balloon.

And yet...by the end of the night,nothing new,nada...in fact...even less Chi Dem songs.

I just really don't understand it.

They should be in the studio or,at least,be locked in a rehearsal studio somewhere working on new material.

Or editing material for a world tour blu-ray or something (maybe they are I dunno...sure doesn't feel like it though).

Stayed up late last night,intrigued,secretly hoping for a nugget,something.

Ultimately...just another round of another round.

I don't get it.

Great post. Hit the nail on the head.

[WhazUp]

I'll be completely honest...I don't understand this next round of tour dates.

They saved the States for the last leg of the Chi-Dem world tour.

End of...you know?

Get the fuck back in the studio..forward momentum.

Get something new going.

The fans salivated at the news of small venue shows,it's gotta mean one thing right??

It's gotta mean something.

Even one new song would have reinflated the fan enthusiasm balloon.

And yet...by the end of the night,nothing new,nada...in fact...even less Chi Dem songs.

I just really don't understand it.

They should be in the studio or,at least,be locked in a rehearsal studio somewhere working on new material.

Or editing material for a world tour blu-ray or something (maybe they are I dunno...sure doesn't feel like it though).

Stayed up late last night,intrigued,secretly hoping for a nugget,something.

Ultimately...just another round of another round.

I don't get it.

Great post. Hit the nail on the head.

+1, I agree 100%

[ThinkAboutYou]

I'll be completely honest...I don't understand this next round of tour dates.

They saved the States for the last leg of the Chi-Dem world tour.

End of...you know?

Get the fuck back in the studio..forward momentum.

Get something new going.

The fans salivated at the news of small venue shows,it's gotta mean one thing right??

It's gotta mean something.

Even one new song would have reinflated the fan enthusiasm balloon.

And yet...by the end of the night,nothing new,nada...in fact...even less Chi Dem songs.

I just really don't understand it.

They should be in the studio or,at least,be locked in a rehearsal studio somewhere working on new material.

Or editing material for a world tour blu-ray or something (maybe they are I dunno...sure doesn't feel like it though).

Stayed up late last night,intrigued,secretly hoping for a nugget,something.

Ultimately...just another round of another round.

I don't get it.

Great post. Hit the nail on the head.

+1, I agree 100%

The casual fans wont care but anyone been around ten years needs some new songs. I would still goto any GNR show but the excitement level would be higher with new songs played.

Edited February 12, 2012 by ThinkAboutYou