One reason CD wasn't the success it should have been

[finck6]

Axl waited too long. That's it. It went from being mysterious into being an industry punch line. if he put out the album in 99, who knows what could have happened. Besides, the label would have been much more inclined to promote properly back then.

finally someone else who holds axl accountable. thank you.

Well in all honesty, the album not coming out in 99 was not axl's fault, from what I remember the label wasn't thrilled about it. But those demos from 99 were killer especially twat. It wasn't so over done, but buckets solo was needed.

who's fault is it for cd not being a success in 2008?

[finck6]

CD's commercial failure:

- lacks mainstream hits, except for This I Love which oddly enough never was released as a single...

- Doesn't sound like GNR on most songs

- lack of promotion and videos

axl rose is behind the lack of promotion and chinese democracy videos

and

this i love would have been the next november rain single. robin finck's EPIC TIL solo tops slash solo on the november rain single

Is/was the world ready for a song like This i love because when was the last time a ballad got succesfull on the radio?

um november rain. TIL was the next November Rain. was until Axl let Robin go back 2 NIN again

The difference between those songs is that a lot of fans had heard November Rain years before the release of Use Your Illusion. First time i've heard it was in 1989.

but i give you the answer. you still try to put me down. that's the difference

Euhm? No, i'm not trying to put you down. Imo This i love could never be the next November Rain because it would never have the same succes. This i love was a 1993 song released in 2008.

TIL started as a rough demo in 1993 but ended as EPIC from axl and robin in 2008

[Patience 4 Axl]

patience 4 axl -

can you think of many examples of band's that release an album 21 years after their most successful album and produce long lasting and enduring classic hits?

do any of you people ever consider the fact that pop culture is a young man's game and that later in your career, no matter how good your music is, you will still be relegated to "legacy act" territory?

???

Other bands have either: 1. known when it was time to call it quits or 2. have consistently released music over that time.

And as usual, you're bringing in an argument that isn't relevant to the topic. This isn't a comparison thread. We're talking about Guns here. Axl 1. kept the band name going, in theory anyway and 2. only released one album in all that time. These were his choices, has nothing to do with other bands.

I also disagree about the legacy act. But if you want to do the comparison thing ill humor you now. Bands such as U2, Bon Jovi and Aerosmith for example have continued to make music over the years that sell records, are played on the radio, and most importantly, know what their fans enjoy. People go to their shows for both their old AND newer stuff. Axl may be caught in legacy status because his new songs didn't have the same appeal to both his hardcore fans or the casual ones. He's remembered for his classics now because they were damn good tunes, and he hasn't been able to outdo his own best work while other artists of his same generation and genre have.

[droezle]

CD's commercial failure:

- lacks mainstream hits, except for This I Love which oddly enough never was released as a single...

- Doesn't sound like GNR on most songs

- lack of promotion and videos

axl rose is behind the lack of promotion and chinese democracy videos

and

this i love would have been the next november rain single. robin finck's EPIC TIL solo tops slash solo on the november rain single

Is/was the world ready for a song like This i love because when was the last time a ballad got succesfull on the radio?

um november rain. TIL was the next November Rain. was until Axl let Robin go back 2 NIN again

The difference between those songs is that a lot of fans had heard November Rain years before the release of Use Your Illusion. First time i've heard it was in 1989.

but i give you the answer. you still try to put me down. that's the difference

Euhm? No, i'm not trying to put you down. Imo This i love could never be the next November Rain because it would never have the same succes. This i love was a 1993 song released in 2008.

TIL started as a rough demo in 1993 but ended as EPIC from axl and robin in 2008

If the song is epic or not is just a matter of personal opinion. To me it's just another ballad.

[finck6]

CD's commercial failure:

- lacks mainstream hits, except for This I Love which oddly enough never was released as a single...

- Doesn't sound like GNR on most songs

- lack of promotion and videos

axl rose is behind the lack of promotion and chinese democracy videos

and

this i love would have been the next november rain single. robin finck's EPIC TIL solo tops slash solo on the november rain single

Is/was the world ready for a song like This i love because when was the last time a ballad got succesfull on the radio?

um november rain. TIL was the next November Rain. was until Axl let Robin go back 2 NIN again

The difference between those songs is that a lot of fans had heard November Rain years before the release of Use Your Illusion. First time i've heard it was in 1989.

but i give you the answer. you still try to put me down. that's the difference

Euhm? No, i'm not trying to put you down. Imo This i love could never be the next November Rain because it would never have the same succes. This i love was a 1993 song released in 2008.

TIL started as a rough demo in 1993 but ended as EPIC from axl and robin in 2008

If the song is epic or not is just a matter of personal opinion. To me it's just another ballad.

we'll never know if TIL 2 the general public in u.s. was just another ballad cause axl never gave it a shot 2 b more as a released single

[Bobbo]

patience 4 axl -

can you think of many examples of band's that release an album 21 years after their most successful album and produce long lasting and enduring classic hits?

do any of you people ever consider the fact that pop culture is a young man's game and that later in your career, no matter how good your music is, you will still be relegated to "legacy act" territory?

???

Other bands have either: 1. known when it was time to call it quits or 2. have consistently released music over that time.

And as usual, you're bringing in an argument that isn't relevant to the topic. This isn't a comparison thread. We're talking about Guns here. Axl 1. kept the band name going, in theory anyway and 2. only released one album in all that time. These were his choices, has nothing to do with other bands.

I also disagree about the legacy act. But if you want to do the comparison thing ill humor you now. Bands such as U2, Bon Jovi and Aerosmith for example have continued to make music over the years that sell records, are played on the radio, and most importantly, know what their fans enjoy. People go to their shows for both their old AND newer stuff. Axl may be caught in legacy status because his new songs didn't have the same appeal to both his hardcore fans or the casual ones. He's remembered for his classics now because they were damn good tunes, and he hasn't been able to outdo his own best work while other artists of his same generation and genre have.

Brilliant post.

[SoulMonster]

patience 4 axl -

can you think of many examples of band's that release an album 21 years after their most successful album and produce long lasting and enduring classic hits?

do any of you people ever consider the fact that pop culture is a young man's game and that later in your career, no matter how good your music is, you will still be relegated to "legacy act" territory?

???

Other bands have either: 1. known when it was time to call it quits or 2. have consistently released music over that time.

Are you saying Axl should have quit when the UYI lineup broke up? We wouldn't have had CD then. Are you saying you would have preferred to NOT have CD? Does CD hurt you in any way? I can understand you might not like the album, but why would you prefer it to never have come out?

[Hiipu]

^ I guess he could've released it under a new name...

[dalsh327]

patience 4 axl -

can you think of many examples of band's that release an album 21 years after their most successful album and produce long lasting and enduring classic hits?

do any of you people ever consider the fact that pop culture is a young man's game and that later in your career, no matter how good your music is, you will still be relegated to "legacy act" territory?

???

Other bands have either: 1. known when it was time to call it quits or 2. have consistently released music over that time.

Are you saying Axl should have quit when the UYI lineup broke up? We wouldn't have had CD then. Are you saying you would have preferred to NOT have CD? Does CD hurt you in any way? I can understand you might not like the album, but why would you prefer it to never have come out?

GNR needed to sit the rest of the 90s out after "TSI?" was out and still put 86-93 out. I think they all needed to work their personal issues out and then regroup, ready to take the world on again. U2 put the documentary out about how rough "Achtung Baby" had gone in the beginning, but something snapped in place for them.

Axl turned into a boss. Telling Slash and Duff that Paul was officially in a "whether you like it or not" way, isn't a band anymore. Slash was out of the band by the time Chris joined, but one can only imagine what Slash would've thought when he would've seen an extra set of keyboards in the studio one day.

And when artists lose the creative drive, they start focusing on other things. Like litigation. Sometimes it's forced on them, and in that case, it can unhinge creative types.

If GNR consistently released music, they wouldn't have put the Illusions out the way they did.

[wasted]

^ I guess he could've released it under a new name...

He couldn't as he was under contract and given money to make a GNR record?

He'd prob have buy his way out of the contract and pay the production costs?

^ I guess he could've released it under a new name...

He couldn't as he was under contract and given money to make a GNR record?

He'd prob have buy his way out of the contract and pay the production costs?

[Hiipu]

^ Sometimes artists release "Best of" albums or Live albums to get off the contract. I'm sure he could've done the same, instead opting to use the name as a moneygrabber. Then when the moneystream was cut off, he did cashgrab tours to further fund the record.

Not saying touring is a bad thing, I loved the show I saw 2006 But I'm sure I would've loved it if he was under different name... Obviously the reason to keep the name was monetary (and no doubt managers had their spoons in the pot...)

CD wasn't sales success not because of the lack of promotion (there was more than enought of that) but mainly the long waiting period which made everyone wanting Axl to fail (especially the fans of the old band who loved music the old band made together) 'cause he kept the name and well, the material just didn't resonate to people in the world that time. I'm loving most of CD but the truth is that most people who hear it, even fans of the band, react to it like I react to, say, new Metallica records: Listen to it once, and it's done.

Edited July 5, 2012 by Hiipu

[wasted]

He got advance money for a studio album I don't know what would happen if he refused to let them put the material to recoup the 14 mil.

I thought it sold pretty well. Not crazy but compared to peers did about the same.

[Hiipu]

^ But with everyone leaving the project (and he didn't get 14 mil right away, but in smaller amounts I'm sure...) he could've easily changed the album to, say, "Axl Rose - Chinese Democracy" and still carry on getting money.

[Kill Devil Hill]

Wouldn't Axl have been dropped by the label if he went "solo?" They dropped Slash and co. after the Interscope merge.

[Hiipu]

Highly doubtful Axl would've got canned as frontmen are more easily marketable anyways.

[dalsh327]

^ Sometimes artists release "Best of" albums or Live albums to get off the contract. I'm sure he could've done the same, instead opting to use the name as a moneygrabber. Then when the moneystream was cut off, he did cashgrab tours to further fund the record.

Not saying touring is a bad thing, I loved the show I saw 2006 But I'm sure I would've loved it if he was under different name... Obviously the reason to keep the name was monetary (and no doubt managers had their spoons in the pot...)

CD wasn't sales success not because of the lack of promotion (there was more than enought of that) but mainly the long waiting period which made everyone wanting Axl to fail (especially the fans of the old band who loved music the old band made together) 'cause he kept the name and well, the material just didn't resonate to people in the world that time. I'm loving most of CD but the truth is that most people who hear it, even fans of the band, react to it like I react to, say, new Metallica records: Listen to it once, and it's done.

I think the original reason he wanted the name is to avoid a Yoko or Courtney situation if any of them died. Now it's so he plays arenas and gets the lion's share at the swag booths. Some people feel he should have just retired the name and left it in the past.

[Damn_Smooth]

Wouldn't Axl have been dropped by the label if he went "solo?" They dropped Slash and co. after the Interscope merge.

Axl owned Guns when they dropped Slash. They drop Axl, they lose Guns. Axl probably would've went solo by now if it meant he could lose the label. He obviously hates it.

[Kill Devil Hill]

But that's what I'm saying. If Axl said, "GN'R's dead. I'd like to go solo," Interscope probably would've said goodbye.

[Damn_Smooth]

But that's what I'm saying. If Axl said, "GN'R's dead. I'd like to go solo," Interscope probably would've said goodbye.

I don't work in the industry and I don't know jack shit about it, but my spider-sense tells me that the label had first rights on an Axl Rose solo career. Would the label give up the chance at a GN'R reunion to let Axl go?

[wasted]

Axl said in chats without the name he'd be bankrupt. He'd never get back to the level he is now.

[Hiipu]

^ The constant touring is also what makes most money for Axl right now. Albums don't make money like they used to so... I wouldn't hold my breath for a new one anytime soon

[vaida]

The simple anwser (CD wasn't the success it should have been) because its not Guns N'Roses, only Axl Rose

Not true.

CD was made by 3 of the 6 guys that made the classic era's last recording.

So how is it "only Axl Rose" if half the band stuck around to make CD?

I havn't studied the CD credits so much. I'm pretty sure Slash, Duff, Izzy, Adler arm't among them.

[finck6]

The simple anwser (CD wasn't the success it should have been) because its not Guns N'Roses, only Axl Rose

Not true.

CD was made by 3 of the 6 guys that made the classic era's last recording.

So how is it "only Axl Rose" if half the band stuck around to make CD?

I havn't studied the CD credits so much. I'm pretty sure Slash, Duff, Izzy, Adler arm't among them.

i don't know what mister saint laurent's talking about. but. the CD credits r not slash, duff, izzy, and adler. the CD credits r like buckethead, robin finck, stinson, fortus, and brain.

[maynard]

I miss Paul. He was great on RIR3.

[finck6]

I miss Paul. He was great on RIR3.

paul isn't coming back 2 guns n roses