finck6 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Total guess but going off previous band member comments (it took Axl a VERY long time to do vocals, working on instrumental 34) I'd guess less than half, maybe even one third or less, of those "songs" have vocals. Even less have complete vocals. For some reason Axl doesn't participate with the band in creating music. He brings in some songs and the band works on them, bust mostly the band is left to create without him. He just doesn't get the recording process and how to be in a band ever since he had the power to not need to "get" it. It's my opinion he will never touch up these remaining songs because he doesn't want to or he feels something is preventing him. Of course, NOTHING is preventing him from getting in the studio and finishing them. Definitely sucks from a fan perspective... Also the argument of "they just released one four years ago" doesn't carry weight. Before CD these same people would be saying "this lengthy recording process is justified because we will get multiple albums and have a lot of songs from it". I actually remember people saying that he could just tour for years and years after he was done recording and just release a pre-recorded album every couple years. That was the trade off the fans felt. Now that only 14 songs came of it people are left feeling empty. Maybe that's hard to understand for people who came in late in the game.the argument they just released one four years ago doesn't carry weight anymore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Total guess but going off previous band member comments (it took Axl a VERY long time to do vocals, working on instrumental 34) I'd guess less than half, maybe even one third or less, of those "songs" have vocals. Even less have complete vocals. For some reason Axl doesn't participate with the band in creating music. He brings in some songs and the band works on them, bust mostly the band is left to create without him. He just doesn't get the recording process and how to be in a band ever since he had the power to not need to "get" it. It's my opinion he will never touch up these remaining songs because he doesn't want to or he feels something is preventing him. Of course, NOTHING is preventing him from getting in the studio and finishing them. Definitely sucks from a fan perspective... Also the argument of "they just released one four years ago" doesn't carry weight. Before CD these same people would be saying "this lengthy recording process is justified because we will get multiple albums and have a lot of songs from it". I actually remember people saying that he could just tour for years and years after he was done recording and just release a pre-recorded album every couple years. That was the trade off the fans felt. Now that only 14 songs came of it people are left feeling empty. Maybe that's hard to understand for people who came in late in the game.the argument they just released one four years ago doesn't carry weight anymoreCare to explain? If you look at most major bands these days, there's generally a 3-5 year range between releases (a much bigger window with particular artists like AC/DC, Stevie Wonder, Billy Joel and at times Elton John). Sure, if you want to justify the weight for Chinese Democracy by claiming that they should have had another album out by now, but that's your own perception on how things should run. Consider that Robin left the band just as CD was being released. Why would Axl release subsequent material that's based on the efforts of two guitarists who are no longer in the band? How motivated would you be to publish and promote material that's based on the efforts of those who you feel abandoned you? This isn't to excuse Axl of the circumstances he finds himself in. No one can encounter that much bad luck without some personal involvement. But I would argue that Axl is an old-school business model kind of guy and under that mindset, you don't release subsequent releases so soon after the initial release, especially considering a change in the band's roster. Assuming Axl developed a distaste for the unreleased material he has in his musical vault, it's not to be unexpected that it would be awhile before we heard another Guns N' Roses album from the band we see before us. Cheers,Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finck6 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Total guess but going off previous band member comments (it took Axl a VERY long time to do vocals, working on instrumental 34) I'd guess less than half, maybe even one third or less, of those "songs" have vocals. Even less have complete vocals. For some reason Axl doesn't participate with the band in creating music. He brings in some songs and the band works on them, bust mostly the band is left to create without him. He just doesn't get the recording process and how to be in a band ever since he had the power to not need to "get" it. It's my opinion he will never touch up these remaining songs because he doesn't want to or he feels something is preventing him. Of course, NOTHING is preventing him from getting in the studio and finishing them. Definitely sucks from a fan perspective... Also the argument of "they just released one four years ago" doesn't carry weight. Before CD these same people would be saying "this lengthy recording process is justified because we will get multiple albums and have a lot of songs from it". I actually remember people saying that he could just tour for years and years after he was done recording and just release a pre-recorded album every couple years. That was the trade off the fans felt. Now that only 14 songs came of it people are left feeling empty. Maybe that's hard to understand for people who came in late in the game.the argument they just released one four years ago doesn't carry weight anymoreCare to explain? If you look at most major bands these days, there's generally a 3-5 year range between releases (a much bigger window with particular artists like AC/DC, Stevie Wonder, Billy Joel and at times Elton John). Sure, if you want to justify the weight for Chinese Democracy by claiming that they should have had another album out by now, but that's your own perception on how things should run. Consider that Robin left the band just as CD was being released. Why would Axl release subsequent material that's based on the efforts of two guitarists who are no longer in the band? How motivated would you be to publish and promote material that's based on the efforts of those who you feel abandoned you? This isn't to excuse Axl of the circumstances he finds himself in. No one can encounter that much bad luck without some personal involvement. But I would argue that Axl is an old-school business model kind of guy and under that mindset, you don't release subsequent releases so soon after the initial release, especially considering a change in the band's roster. Assuming Axl developed a distaste for the unreleased material he has in his musical vault, it's not to be unexpected that it would be awhile before we heard another Guns N' Roses album from the band we see before us. Cheers,Andrewcare 2 explain? guns n roses isn't an indie band. chinese demoracy isn't guns n roses first record either. it's time for a new one this yearrobin and bucket did the work on the unreleased songs like soulmonster, jackie chan, the general, and blood in the water. their work is chinese democracy. multiple albums. you don't piss on this work just because dj ashba and ron thal currently play on stage with axl rose at rock concertseither team brazil (guns n roses management) or someone in axl's circle needs 2 press axl for the next album now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo Posted July 9, 2012 Author Share Posted July 9, 2012 Total guess but going off previous band member comments (it took Axl a VERY long time to do vocals, working on instrumental 34) I'd guess less than half, maybe even one third or less, of those "songs" have vocals. Even less have complete vocals. For some reason Axl doesn't participate with the band in creating music. He brings in some songs and the band works on them, bust mostly the band is left to create without him. He just doesn't get the recording process and how to be in a band ever since he had the power to not need to "get" it. It's my opinion he will never touch up these remaining songs because he doesn't want to or he feels something is preventing him. Of course, NOTHING is preventing him from getting in the studio and finishing them. Definitely sucks from a fan perspective... Also the argument of "they just released one four years ago" doesn't carry weight. Before CD these same people would be saying "this lengthy recording process is justified because we will get multiple albums and have a lot of songs from it". I actually remember people saying that he could just tour for years and years after he was done recording and just release a pre-recorded album every couple years. That was the trade off the fans felt. Now that only 14 songs came of it people are left feeling empty. Maybe that's hard to understand for people who came in late in the game.the argument they just released one four years ago doesn't carry weight anymoreCare to explain? If you look at most major bands these days, there's generally a 3-5 year range between releases (a much bigger window with particular artists like AC/DC, Stevie Wonder, Billy Joel and at times Elton John). Sure, if you want to justify the weight for Chinese Democracy by claiming that they should have had another album out by now, but that's your own perception on how things should run. Consider that Robin left the band just as CD was being released. Why would Axl release subsequent material that's based on the efforts of two guitarists who are no longer in the band? How motivated would you be to publish and promote material that's based on the efforts of those who you feel abandoned you? This isn't to excuse Axl of the circumstances he finds himself in. No one can encounter that much bad luck without some personal involvement. But I would argue that Axl is an old-school business model kind of guy and under that mindset, you don't release subsequent releases so soon after the initial release, especially considering a change in the band's roster. Assuming Axl developed a distaste for the unreleased material he has in his musical vault, it's not to be unexpected that it would be awhile before we heard another Guns N' Roses album from the band we see before us. Cheers,AndrewThere are also bands that put out new albums every 2-3 years.And those songs aren't just Robin songs are they? Because Robin and Bucket got tired of waiting around (notice a theme there?), then you theorize that Axl doesn't want to release them? What about all the work that Axl and the rest of the band contributed? Just throw all that aside because he is mad that 2 people out of 8 left? What about the work the other 6 people (including himself) put into the songs? Kind of like cutting off your nose to spite your face.Usually I agree with your posts, but I think you are missing the boat on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 (edited) Total guess but going off previous band member comments (it took Axl a VERY long time to do vocals, working on instrumental 34) I'd guess less than half, maybe even one third or less, of those "songs" have vocals. Even less have complete vocals. For some reason Axl doesn't participate with the band in creating music. He brings in some songs and the band works on them, bust mostly the band is left to create without him. He just doesn't get the recording process and how to be in a band ever since he had the power to not need to "get" it. It's my opinion he will never touch up these remaining songs because he doesn't want to or he feels something is preventing him. Of course, NOTHING is preventing him from getting in the studio and finishing them. Definitely sucks from a fan perspective... Also the argument of "they just released one four years ago" doesn't carry weight. Before CD these same people would be saying "this lengthy recording process is justified because we will get multiple albums and have a lot of songs from it". I actually remember people saying that he could just tour for years and years after he was done recording and just release a pre-recorded album every couple years. That was the trade off the fans felt. Now that only 14 songs came of it people are left feeling empty. Maybe that's hard to understand for people who came in late in the game.the argument they just released one four years ago doesn't carry weight anymoreCare to explain? If you look at most major bands these days, there's generally a 3-5 year range between releases (a much bigger window with particular artists like AC/DC, Stevie Wonder, Billy Joel and at times Elton John). Sure, if you want to justify the weight for Chinese Democracy by claiming that they should have had another album out by now, but that's your own perception on how things should run. Consider that Robin left the band just as CD was being released. Why would Axl release subsequent material that's based on the efforts of two guitarists who are no longer in the band? How motivated would you be to publish and promote material that's based on the efforts of those who you feel abandoned you? This isn't to excuse Axl of the circumstances he finds himself in. No one can encounter that much bad luck without some personal involvement. But I would argue that Axl is an old-school business model kind of guy and under that mindset, you don't release subsequent releases so soon after the initial release, especially considering a change in the band's roster. Assuming Axl developed a distaste for the unreleased material he has in his musical vault, it's not to be unexpected that it would be awhile before we heard another Guns N' Roses album from the band we see before us. Cheers,AndrewThere are also bands that put out new albums every 2-3 years.And those songs aren't just Robin songs are they? Because Robin and Bucket got tired of waiting around (notice a theme there?), then you theorize that Axl doesn't want to release them? What about all the work that Axl and the rest of the band contributed? Just throw all that aside because he is mad that 2 people out of 8 left? What about the work the other 6 people (including himself) put into the songs? Kind of like cutting off your nose to spite your face.Usually I agree with your posts, but I think you are missing the boat on this one.Well, that's the power you're afforded when you own the machine. I'm not here to justify any of Axl's actions, but I think simply stating that "it's been four years, where's the music?" misses the reality which many other bands operate on. Agreed, there should be more music ready to go based on the eons it took to write, record and produce the Chinese Democracy material, but one has to wonder if the motivation is still there to finish it. I don't necessarily disagree with you Groghan, but you're ascribing the emotion of anger towards Axl's motives that may not be accurate. Perhaps he's "moved on" from that phase as it reminds him of a very frustrating time in his life and just wants to concentrate on creating new music with the guys he has working with him. Anger, frustration, ambivalence, who knows what it is. But it's got to be something (and I haven't even brought up the potential business/label issues that they may be facing). If Axl categorizes material in terms of who the major contributor was ("this is Robin song, this is a Buckethead song"), I can see why he might not be as motivated to help line the pockets of guys who left him (regardless of whether it was justified or not by the fans) or at the very least further associate the Guns N' Roses brand with former members. I think the problem that you may be having is that you're applying your own rationality into Axl's world, who clearly operates on a different level of thought process (or a different world) altogether. Being rich enough to do nothing while owning the rights to the GNR has certain luxuries that permits Axl to do (or not do) whatever he likes. I simply point out that a lot of big bands do not operate on the 2-3 year album cycle. GNR has never been that kind of a band (so long as you don't consider Lies and The Spaghetti Incident as actual albums - I don't since one's an EP and the other is a cover album). Coupled this with the ever changing dynamic of the band's composition and the relative emotions that come with it and who knows how it's going to affect a guy like Axl (who doesn't act and behave in a way that most would consider prudent). As a fan, it is frustrating for sure. But as someone who waited from 1991 to 2008 for new material, I feel like my head has hardly been under water for that long with waiting for new material. I always counted on Chinese Democracy being released some day purely out of economic reasons (it would have bankrupted Axl had it not). Yet I do not see those same factors playing a role in pushing a new release. The man can make his millions on tour playing the same old songs (along with a few new ones) and never feel compelled to release anything new. Who knows if he's even that confident he can write with DJ and Ron (remember Ron was added at the last minute based on his playing ability). We'll see how things come, but I'm not holding out for new material for another few years as I've been through this game before.Cheers,Andrew Edited July 9, 2012 by downzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilgotchi Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 It's sh$% like this that makes me glad the Sex Pistols split after one record.Imagine the aces this band would be holding if they had done the same.......Oh well, hindsight and all that.Life is a caberet old chum..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsh327 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 No one's in a place to press Axl on new music. He has to decide it's time for it. Billy Joel hasn't put anything out since 1993. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmo Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 IMO,1- Axl realized anything he releases is likely to receive poor reception from major fan base and critics and that he's better off with these constant tours.2- He just doesn't think it's time yet, Axl takes time. Every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wicked Hand Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Simple: all acts today make their money on the road. Releasing music is a hobvious headache for ax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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