Daniel Tosh rape joke

[Dan H.]

How do you feel about this?

Are rape jokes okay?

Is anything off limits when it comes to comedy? Were his remarks really jokes?

What are your thoughts?

[Guest Len B'stard]

All jokes are always OK by virtue of what they are i.e. jokes, meaning not serious and to be understood in the context of comedy. comedy is an art form, it's above things like politics and political correctness, a joke is non-serious and to understood as a concept. There can be bad jokes, those are the ones you don't find funny but there is no right or wrong or off-limits, morality simply doesn't factor into it.

Rapes, racism, child molestation, animal buggery, religion, EVERYTHING should be fair game for jokes. Jokes do not hurt people, a joke has never stabbed or robbed or murdered someone. Those that would control the way you think and express yourself have though...and still do, frequently.

[Guest Satanisk_Slakt]

I agree with Len. I would say that it can be really bad in the wrong context. You must have some sort of tact to it as well. You don't go and say out rape jokes to someone that was raped the week before. But in the right context, it's all fine in my book!

Edited July 14, 2012 by Satanisk_Slakt

[Dan H.]

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/07/11/why-daniel-tosh-s-rape-joke-at-the-laugh-factory-wasn-t-funny.html

Best link I could find

[Dan H.]

Also Lenny, where's the line between a joke and verbal abuse?

[The Linguini Occurrence]

How do you feel about this?

Are rape jokes okay?

Is anything off limits when it comes to comedy? Were his remarks really jokes?

What are your thoughts?

Simple, anything the comedian wouldn't joke about if the same thing impacted their world should be off limits.

For example - if the comedian's child had Down Syndrome and the comedian refused to make fun of the child, then they shouldn't make fun of anyone else with Down Syndrome.

If the comedian was sexually abused as a child and refuses to joke about it, they shouldn't joke about other kids that were sexually abused.

If the comedian's brother was decapitated in a car accident and the comedian refuses to include it in their act, they shouldn't include other people's accidental decapitations in their act.

If Tosh's wife, sister, daughter or mother had been recently raped - would he still find it funny to joke about rape?

Would any female comedian joke about rape if they them self had been raped?

I don't have any tolerance for people who don't give a crap about other people's misfortune, and then demand sympathy when the same misfortune affects their own little world.

[The Sandman]

To me, the joke just didn't seem funny. I'm not against taboo topics, but if it had made people properly laugh, then there probably wouldn't be half the furore.

[Guest Len B'stard]

Also Lenny, where's the line between a joke and verbal abuse?

For example?

[Dan H.]

Also Lenny, where's the line between a joke and verbal abuse?

For example?

In this case, Tosh made a rape joke and a female heckler shouted 'That isn't funny!'

He responded by saying 'Rape jokes are always funny, wouldn't it be funny if she got raped by five guys right now?'

Is that a joke, or a threat/verbal abuse?

[wasted]

I agree with Len. I would say that it can be really bad in the wrong context. You must have some sort of tact to it as well. You don't go and say out rape jokes to someone that was raped the week before. But in the right context, it's all fine in my book!

But surely they are perfect test audience. If they don't get it no one will.

[The Sandman]

Also Lenny, where's the line between a joke and verbal abuse?

For example?

In this case, Tosh made a rape joke and a female heckler shouted 'That isn't funny!'

He responded by saying 'Rape jokes are always funny, wouldn't it be funny if she got raped by five guys right now?'

Is that a joke, or a threat/verbal abuse?

Just isn't funny.

[Guest Len B'stard]

Also Lenny, where's the line between a joke and verbal abuse?

For example?

In this case, Tosh made a rape joke and a female heckler shouted 'That isn't funny!'

He responded by saying 'Rape jokes are always funny, wouldn't it be funny if she got raped by five guys right now?'

Is that a joke, or a threat/verbal abuse?

Thats a joke...how do you percieve a threat there? Also, it's in the context of a comedy show, the people there paid money to hear this persons jokes, this is why they were there in the first place. And if you're gonna conduct a running review of the show by way of heckling, thats inviting becoming part of the show. i don't even see why it's that offensive, one of the most iconic comedy performances of all time, Richard Pryor Live & Smokin' contains the line:

"i hate when people be leavin' during my shows, i hope y'all get raped by black folks with the clap...and there's nothing like the black clap"

that was to peoples leaving the show...ain't no worse than that

[The Linguini Occurrence]

Also Lenny, where's the line between a joke and verbal abuse?

For example?

In this case, Tosh made a rape joke and a female heckler shouted 'That isn't funny!'

He responded by saying 'Rape jokes are always funny, wouldn't it be funny if she got raped by five guys right now?'

Is that a joke, or a threat/verbal abuse?

Thats a joke...how do you percieve a threat there?

What if Tosh said to an audience half-filled with African Americans "Lynching jokes are always funny, wouldn't it be funny if he got lynched right now". Yeah, run that one by a mixed test audience Mister Five-Point-Oh.

That shit ain't right. Real comedy is supposed to make the entire audience laugh and feel good, if it hurts or offends any part of the audience then that shit ain't right.

[Guest Len B'stard]

Also Lenny, where's the line between a joke and verbal abuse?

For example?

In this case, Tosh made a rape joke and a female heckler shouted 'That isn't funny!'

He responded by saying 'Rape jokes are always funny, wouldn't it be funny if she got raped by five guys right now?'

Is that a joke, or a threat/verbal abuse?

Thats a joke...how do you percieve a threat there?

What if Tosh said to an audience half-filled with African Americans "Lynching jokes are always funny, wouldn't it be funny if he got lynched right now". Yeah, run that one by a mixed test audience Mister Five-Point-Oh.

That shit ain't right. Real comedy is supposed to make the entire audience laugh and feel good, if it hurts or offends any part of the audience then that shit ain't right.

Well that wouldn't mean the joke isn't funny that would just mean he's a bad comedian that didn't pick his fuckin' shot very well, thats about as much of an indictment as you can level on this Tosh lad, that he's not a very good comedian but i don't think it qualifies as a threat or verbal abuse, both the real issue and your african american hypothetical example.

And as far as "real comedy is supposed to make the entire audience laugh"...where on earth does it say that, how'd you work that out?

[GET OFF AXLS BACK]

Nothing is taboo in comedy. People just like to be outraged.

[Dan H.]

I agree with you len, I'm just promoting discussion.

I think Tosh is fine. I think the people who pay to be in his audience should know what they're getting into.

[The Linguini Occurrence]

And as far as "real comedy is supposed to make the entire audience laugh"...where on earth does it say that, how'd you work that out?

Why does the audience pay to see the comedian? Do they pay to laugh and enjoy the show, or do they pay to get offended and pissed off by the show?

Hard to imagine any audience member forking over money to see a show if they know ahead of time that they won't find the show to be funny.

[spunko12345]

Offence is taken not given. By that I mean a comedian can't pander to the audience and tread carefully around certain subjects because everything is offensive to some people.

Ricky gervai said nobody has the right to never be offended.

That was after a woman complained and walked out of his show due to a joke about down syndrome , as she had a down syndrome kid. Gervais rightly pointed out that she was happy to sit there enjoying the show while he was riffing on topics like AIDS. It was just when he touched on her particular subject near her heart that she became outraged.

That said I don't think the joke the OP refers to is funny, not because it is about rape but because it has no element of truth to it. No it wouldn't be funny If 5 guys raped her. Not in the slightest. A good comedian should say what people are thinking but their inner voice won't let them.

Like when Gervais says Susan Boyle looks like a Mong. He took A LOT of flak for that. But you know what, she does look like a fucking mong. The only people who would take offence is Susan Boyle or mongs. By definition Susan can't be offended because that means she would prefer not to look like a mong, which surely must be hurtful to mongs everywhere.

[Guest Len B'stard]

And as far as "real comedy is supposed to make the entire audience laugh"...where on earth does it say that, how'd you work that out?

Why does the audience pay to see the comedian? Do they pay to laugh and enjoy the show, or do they pay to get offended and pissed off by the show?

Hard to imagine any audience member forking over money to see a show if they know ahead of time that they won't find the show to be funny.

Well thats an unprescedented take on the subject, you pay to see a comedian who is there to make you laugh, you don't get guarantees y'know. There is no rule of comedy that says if the entire audience don't laugh then you've failed. Watch some of the seminal performances of comedy on tape that exist, the aforementioned Richard Pryor, Live and Smokin', it's fuckin hilairious but hardly no ones laughing, in fact some sound disgusted...look at Lenny Bruce, he didn't make EVERYBODY laugh.

A comedian doesn't succeed when the whole audience laughs...a comedian has succeeded the moment one person laughs at his jokes, some comedy is contentious, some comedy isn't designed for everybody. I've never heard anybody say that before y'know, that comedy should make everybody laugh or it ain't right, thats a tremendous burden on any comedian, i don't think i've ever heard of anybody that always made everybody laugh.

Like when Gervais says Susan Boyle looks like a Mong. He took A LOT of flak for that. But you know what, she does look like a fucking mong. The only people who would take offence is Susan Boyle or mongs.

Edited July 14, 2012 by sugaraylen

[dalsh327]

People were paying to see Dane Cook headline, not Daniel Tosh.

As far as what she did, she heckled. Once you get someone's attention, whether it's wearing a Slash t-shirt flipping Axl off, or disrupting a show with a comment and now on their radar, it's in the opinion of the audience how far the entertainer should go. Axl has the audience on his side when he gets heckled. Same thing with Tosh.

Did Dane Cook apologize for Tosh? Didn't seem like it. "Easily offended people should kill themselves", so Cook is standing by Tosh's routine.

There's standup comics that will empty a room by going way over the line. Patrice O'Neal could be mean on and off stage. He put Lisa Lamp in tears. He would've crossed the line and not cared about losing the TV gig. Someone like Louis CK could get away with it, b/c FX already pushes the envelope with their own shows. Kurt Sutter says a lot of fucked up stuff on Twitter (even though he's not a standup) but SOA is a fucking cash cow and can get away with it. Radio personalities like Imus calling a sports team "nappy headed hos" and being made to apologize, he needs advertiser money, so Jesse Jackson was called in.

The more power you have with the channel, the less you have to apologize for what you have to say.

But when a standup comic has a TV show, he's going to be held accountable what he says in his standup routine. And to me, a standup comic has to tone it down or choose between TV or performing live if he wants to be free on stage to say what he wants. A lot of standup comics are in Tosh's corner, but at the same time, when you have a TV or film career, have to realize you're bringing in an audience that might not be prepared for what you're going to say on stage. Howard Stern's case is the opposite, people weren't sure coming out of satellite radio if he was going to work clean, but he's become politically correct in recent years. Sharon swears way more than Howard does anyway.

But if you see a show and notice the first few rows have empty seats, you're prob. going to get owned by the comedian, because they're empty for a reason. If you don't want to be on a comedian's radar: don't heckle, and don't sit up front. But you're more likely to get photos with them and stuff signed if you do, because you were a good sport about it.

If you want to own a comedian, you do two things: keep heckling to the point more people start joining in, or don't react and have the room go cold silent and talk with your friends.

If you're at a comedy club, you're opening yourself to becoming part of the show if you draw attention. And the guy with the mic usually wins.

King Dick.

[The Linguini Occurrence]

I've never heard anybody say that before y'know, that comedy should make everybody laugh or it ain't right, thats a tremendous burden on any comedian, i don't think i've ever heard of anybody that always made everybody laugh.

No no no ... I never said comedy should make everybody laugh or it ain't right. I said if a comedian makes jokes that would offend or hurt audience members, and if he would never make those jokes if the subjects have impacted him, then that ain't right. Like if his wife had been raped, there's no fuckin' way he would be cracking jokes about rape ... unless he fuckin' hated his wife

[Guest Len B'stard]

I've never heard anybody say that before y'know, that comedy should make everybody laugh or it ain't right, thats a tremendous burden on any comedian, i don't think i've ever heard of anybody that always made everybody laugh.

No no no ... I never said comedy should make everybody laugh or it ain't right. I said if a comedian makes jokes that would offend or hurt audience members, and if he would never make those jokes if the subjects have impacted him, then that ain't right. Like if his wife had been raped, there's no fuckin' way he would be cracking jokes about rape ... unless he fuckin' hated his wife

Like my man Spunko said (dunno why but that boy reminds me of Shane McGowan, weird mental association, dunno why) offence ain't given, it's taken.

[Nobodys_Fault]

When you heckle a comedian you become part of the performance and lose any right to be offended. The performer will do their utmost to make you feel like such an asshole that you'll leave. If you don't like it, don't fucking heckle simple as that.

[TeeJay410]

I've never been a comedian, but being heckled must be an extremely stressful situation. Going on stage in front of people and trying to make them laugh is hard. Have you ever told a joke and no one laughed? Uncomfortable awkward feeling. Now make everyone in the room have access to alcohol and increase the number of people to 200-1,000. Hicks, Carlin, Pryor, all have blown up at people in insane ways after being heckled. Anyone remember the guy who played Kramer and screamed about "black persons" when he was heckled? Daniel Tosh is just the latest. I'm sure he'd take back what he said if he could and there's no question it was wrong, but he apologized and it should be accepted. I doubt comedy central made him do it either, they want him to be outrageous and unapologetic. But point blank the guy just flipped, and said some very unfunny hurtful things while being heckled in a high stress situation. There are two sides to it.

[Ghostie]

The comedians that are strongest at their craft don't need to be like that. See Carlin, Bruce, etc.

Dude's probably a date rapist anyway...