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The sound of the "Illusions" albums

GeetarMikey

By GeetarMikey
in 2013

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GeetarMikey Junior

GeetarMikey

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I was listening to UYI1 in the car the other day and does anyone else think that Izzy sounds like he's really not bothered? He's hardly playing in most stuff, or drowned out by piano/horns/etc... most of the time. The interplay between Slash and Izzy on AFD is so important to its sound and it's almost not there on the UYI's. Still love the albums though, don't get me wrong!

Then I thought that no wonder we love Locomotive and Coma so much - it's Slash doing all the guitar tracks and they sound all the meatier for it.

What do you guys think of the sound/production overall on those albums, I'd be interested to hear!

Thanks!

Mike

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Bansidhe GOD

Bansidhe

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They tuned Izzy's guitar down. He complained about it when he heard the albums.

They used the excuse of him being too messed up on smack and his playing being all over the place.

Edited by Bansidhe
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Chris 55 FRONTMAN

Chris 55

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They tuned Izzy's guitar down. He complained about it when he heard the albums.

They used the excuse of him being too messed up on smack and his playing being all over the place.

Weird. He was sober then. At least that's what I remember hearing.

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T.wa.T GOD

T.wa.T

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They tuned Izzy's guitar down. He complained about it when he heard the albums.

They used the excuse of him being too messed up on smack and his playing being all over the place.

Weird. He was sober then. At least that's what I remember hearing.

I'm pretty sure he was clean then to.

I think there was some resentment towards Izzy because they felt that he wasn't putting enough energy into his performances and studio work.

They lowered his guitar in the mix of the albums and that's one of the reasons why he began to call it quits.

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niceguy DEMI-GOD

niceguy

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Izzy wasn't around for the recording sessions for UYI, unlike when they recorded AFD. He wasn't physically there.

Slash has said that Izzy recorded his guitar parts on his own and just handed the producer some DAT tapes of his parts. That's like trying to splice smartphone video into a major motion picture---it won't gel together.

So, Slash pretty much played all the guitar on UYI. Honestly, for such a highly-anticipated release, it makes sense to want to produce something really high-quality, rather than something crappily recorded, and hence you don't hear Izzy much.

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WhazUp LEGEND

WhazUp

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Slash had decided to do most of the guitars and have as little Izzy as possible.

This. Slash is an extremely jealous person.

And Izzy was an extemely distant person in regards to the band at that time so let's not try and assume it's all Slash's fault that his guitar parts are low in the mix.

What do you guys think of the sound/production overall on those albums, I'd be interested to hear!

I like the sound overall but it could have been better. The two issues I have are indeed the lack of the one-two punch that the guitars had on Appetite but most importantly Matt's drum sound is just bland to me. It works well on Estranged, NR, and a few select tracks but overall I perfer Adler's punch to Matt's heaviness

Edited by WhazUp
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iftheworld GOD

iftheworld

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Slash had decided to do most of the guitars and have as little Izzy as possible.

This. Slash is an extremely jealous person.

And Izzy was an extemely distant person in regards to the band at that time so let's not try and assume it's all Slash's fault that his guitar parts are low in the mix.

>What do you guys think of the sound/production overall on those albums, I'd be interested to hear!

I like the sound overall but it could have been better. The two issues I have are indeed the lack of the one-two punch that the guitars had on Appetite but most importantly Matt's drum sound is just bland to me. It works well on Estranged, NR, and a few select tracks but overall I perfer Adler's punch to Matt's heaviness

Oh I get it. Because he didn't like to socialise with drunks and junkies he deserved his guitar parts toned down. Thanks for sharing your logic. By the way I never stated it was Slash's fault.

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WhazUp LEGEND

WhazUp

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Oh I get it. Because he didn't like to socialise with drunks and junkies he deserved his guitar parts toned down.

Never said that, distant could very well mean musical ventures in the studio on a professional level. Not that we as fans know the innerworkings of the band in the studio during that time anyways although quotes from Zutaut reference impersonal sending in of DAT tapes all around

By the way I never stated it was Slash's fault.

The post you agreed with certaintly did place the blame on him

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wasted LEGEND

wasted

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Axl said something about Izzy handing in 4 track demos which he thought were kind of done. I think Axl and Slash jacked Izzy's songs up and he didn't really like it that much.

I thought the piano and doing more Izzy songs like Dust n Bones and 14 Years was a way to keep Izzy interested. It's like Izzy wrote the songs and Slash played them, Axl did vocals.

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IndiannaRose LEGEND

IndiannaRose

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I dislike how the production team mixed and mastered both records. They sound dated to me (as opposed to Appetite, which I feel has a crisper/fresher sound). In addition to that, Matt's drums are missing that swagger that helped give GN'R a more distinctive sound. The drums just sound muddy to me. Furthermore (as previously stated in this thread), Izzy's lack of involvement is evident in the lack of interplay between Slash's and Izzy's guitar work. To me, this was an integral component of the GN'R "sound" that is largely missing from these two records.

Overall, I think these are fantastic records that are undoubtedly flawed. They could have definitely been taken to another level had the mentioned issues been addressed more attentively.



Edited by IndiannaRose
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SweetRose Senior

SweetRose

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Also in an interview with Del James in RIP magazine,Axl said getting Izzy to work on the album(s) was like pulling teeth. And no I'm not going to go search for the interview and post it. But it was in the 3 part interview that spanned 3 issues of RIP titled I,Axl.

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GnRDuff1 DEMI-GOD

GnRDuff1

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I dislike how the production team mixed and mastered both records. They sound dated to me (as opposed to Appetite, which I feel has a crisper/fresher sound). In addition to that, Matt's drums are missing that swagger that helped give GN'R a more distinctive sound. The drums just sound muddy to me. Furthermore (as previously stated in this thread), Izzy's lack of involvement is evident in the lack of interplay between Slash's and Izzy's guitar work. To me, this was an integral component of the GN'R "sound" that is largely missing from these two records.

Overall, I think these are fantastic records that are undoubtedly flawed. They could have definitely been taken to another level had the mentioned issues been addressed more attentively.

I think the actual mixing and tone of Matt's drums was more of the problem with the record than his actual playing. and as for the drowning out of Izzy,s guitar, they're almost totally different albums when you pan the volume towards the left side . I've listened to them this way probably 6 times, and on the songs where he actually played it changes the whole feel Edited by GnRDuff1
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rockerman GOD

rockerman

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Oh I get it. Because he didn't like to socialise with drunks and junkies he deserved his guitar parts toned down.

Never said that, distant could very well mean musical ventures in the studio on a professional level. Not that we as fans know the innerworkings of the band in the studio during that time anyways although quotes from Zutaut reference impersonal sending in of DAT tapes all around

>By the way I never stated it was Slash's fault.

The post you agreed with certaintly did place the blame on him

Oh I get it. Because he didn't like to socialise with drunks and junkies he deserved his guitar parts toned down.

Never said that, distant could very well mean musical ventures in the studio on a professional level. Not that we as fans know the innerworkings of the band in the studio during that time anyways although quotes from Zutaut reference impersonal sending in of DAT tapes all around

>By the way I never stated it was Slash's fault.

The post you agreed with certaintly did place the blame on him

Izzy liked the atmosphere of the clubs...low key... back in the day you hang out with guys ..you jam together you write some songs together.. go to the club and perform together.. hang out afterwards and shoot up...no expectations or hassles. Then in a few short years your THE biggest band on the earth with everybody trying to get into your space. Egos get inflated..everybody wants to kiss your ass and suddenly your best friend tells you.. your getting a pay cut because your not putting enough OOMPH into your gigs.

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Iron MikeyJ FRONTMAN

Iron MikeyJ

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Slash has stated before that he never really liked playing with izzy, he actually prefered gilby. I'm not trying to start a slash bash fest, but I do think slash was threatened by izzy. I've heard many "insiders" say time and time again that izzy was the most important member. He brought the soul to all of those songs. Axl and slash were the frosting on the cake. Maybe slash wanted to be "heard" more on the illusions in order to get more credit. Because honestly slash didn't become a house hold name untill the illusion records were released. Axl was the main star up untill that point.

Despite that "theory" you can hear izzy all over those records. Dust n bones, 14 years, you ain't the first, double talkin jive, don't cry, etc. I think izzys influence is very well represented, maybe not in every song, but still very prominate throughout both records.

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DieselDaisy LEGEND

DieselDaisy

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The problem with UYI...

- Too little Izzy in the mix: Slash's guitar is too high.

- Too many horrible Axl overdubs (''cool ranch dressing'')

- Sorum lacks Adler's groove.

- Dizzy Reed adds all of this piano stuff over eveything.

That is it in a nutshell.

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SweetRose Senior

SweetRose

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Why is what Dizzy added to UYIs and different to what he added to CD?

I sometimes wonder if Axl with this line up,actually took a shit on stage,how many NuGNR fans would think its so cool?

Old GNR did not suck. Current fans just hate the fact that this line up is currently not going anywhere.

Edited by SweetRose
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