The Breaking Bad Finale Discussion Thread [SPOILERS WITHIN - UP TO FINALE]

[Ace Nova]

Umm, IMO, .....one of the "comical elements" of the gunfight..

And hell..anyone who has written anything, knows you don't just change "Chapters" in the middle of a "gunfight."

I have a feeling they're not really changing chapters. Probably just throwing a wrench in their case. Hank and Gomie had enough evidence to implicate just about everyone on the show. This leaves the possibility for a spin off show featuring Saul and maybe for someone to actually survive without being imprisoned. Marie still knows the facts about the case and I'm sure Hank has left some evidence behind....just not all of it.

Edited September 9, 2013 by Kasanova King

[Ace Nova]

Gomie basically just verified that all the major (adult) characters on the show have indeed "Broken Bad" except for his character. He also points out that he may not be necessarily 'dead' when people on the show were saying he didn't have a good chance to survive. He said something along the lines of, "That's what you think but people are always wrong"...

[Powerage5]

Gomie basically just verified that all the major (adult) characters on the show have indeed "Broken Bad" except for his character. He also points out that he may not be necessarily 'dead' when people on the show were saying he didn't have a good chance to survive. He said something along the lines of, "That's what you think but people are always wrong"...

Yeah...I think he was a terrible guest for tonight given the cliffhanger.

[luciusfunk]

Holy shit! What an ending! Fuck!

[Powerage5]

Great prediction: Hank dies in the shootout. Marie blames Walt, and goes to the press about it, and the DEA with his identity. Walt has to get the fuck out of dodge and get a new identity.

We know his identity is made public, and that he has to get a new identity, could Marie be that puzzle piece?

[Estranged Reality]

Talking Bad is just terrible.

Talking Dead was implemented fairly early in the show's run. I'm still not a fan, but given the fact that it inherently courts a very 'geeky' fanbase (being a zombie show and all), it made sense. Having guys like Kevin Smith on there and stuff...I never watched a single episode and I was never a fan of the idea, but I understood the appeal to the fanatics.

But for Breaking Bad? This is just a whole other type of show, and to bring in a 'Talking Bad' program in the second half of the final season just seems so fucking crass.

[luciusfunk]

Tonight's "leaked spoiler":

Tohajille:

This is perhaps the biggest episode of the series. It is crazy from start to finish. The episode opens with Jesse and Hank having a mock conversation about Hank would defend himself if Walt were to accuse him of being involved with the drug operation. Hank struggle with the fact that he wants to finish Walt by himself but Jesse encourages him to take the case to the DEA now that they have built a solid foundation. Jesse is worried they wouldn't be able to deal with Walt on their own. Hank is skeptical but knows it is probably the right thing to do.

Skyler is struggling to keep her secrets from Marie as the IRS continues to investigate the car wash. It is being very clear to the IRS that something is wrong. Marie snoops through some of Skylers papers, which lead to Skyler admitting to Marie that they have been laundering Walts gambling winning through the car wash.

After Walt believes he is being followed, we see him meet Lydia for coffee. He again brings the ricin to poison Lydia but does not. Lydia tells him that the Nazis wont let Todds death go lightly.

Skyler visits Beneke but he denies talking to the IRS. His company is not under investigation, which leads Skyler to believe he sold her out for immunity. Skyler seems to accept Benekes reasoning and walks away.

Jesse visits Saul and discusses their next move.

Marie hints to Hank about the money laundering and this seems to give Hank the push he needs to take the Walt case to the DEA. He calls Gomie.

Walt meets Declan in the desert for their meeting. Walt makes it clear he with not return but Declan doesnt like it. I wont ruin this next part because you have to see it to believe it, but Walt manages to take out declan in his two men in a way reminiscent of how he killed Tuco and Gus (Yeah Mr White! Yeah science!)

Walt returns to ABQ to discover that his identity as Heisenberg has been compromised and a massive man hunt is underway.

We get a montage of Walt preparing his escape by contacting the disappearing dude meanwhile the Nazi guys busting into Walts house, trashing it and murdering Skyler out by the pool while baby holly sits helpless. It is truly the greatest and most horrifying scene in the entire series.

Again, way off.

[Estranged Reality]

Great prediction: Hank dies in the shootout. Marie blames Walt, and goes to the press about it, and the DEA with his identity. Walt has to get the fuck out of dodge and get a new identity.

We know his identity is made public, and that he has to get a new identity, could Marie be that puzzle piece?

Yeah, honestly? That's exactly what I was thinking during the whole scene. It just seemed obvious that the phone call to Marie would tie back in to the plot somehow. It was also a great 'exit' for Hank since it shows him in his last moments expressing love for his wife, etc.: all the stuff you usually want to see a character do before he dies.

[luciusfunk]

I think Hank and Gomie have to die in order for Walt to get out of the SUV. That or one is lying helpless and dying before being saved.

[bacardimayne]

Prediction:

-Nazis kill Gomie and Hank, Jesse escapes

-Nazis demand Walt cooks for them, Walt agrees

-Cooks up that poisonous shit and kills one or two of them, escapes

-Walt and Jesse end up teaming up again since, for some reason, they both have the Nazis after them

-This all leads to Jesse getting killed by the Nazis and Walt going full Scarface on them with the M60

I know there are holes, but I think this is a general outline of what will go down.

[arnold layne]

I don't think Walt can forgive after Jesse teamed up with Hank.

Fairly sure that relationship has ended.

[bacardimayne]

I don't think Walt can forgive after Jesse teamed up with Hank.

Fairly sure that relationship has ended.

Walt-Jesse is the ongoing motif of the series, I wouldn't be surprised at all if they teamed up one final time.

[downzy]

Probably one of the best episodes of the series so far.

All this talk that "they're all breaking bad" is nonsense. This isn't a show about anybody else but Walt. I read this in a recently posted review over at Daily Beast and think it's spot on:

With three episodes left I think the carnage is just beginning to rev up.

They clearly have all "Broken Bad"...but it's all a result of Walter White breaking bad. Walter White is the antagonist and the show is demonstrating how he is sort of a "black hole" in a sense, taking everyone down with him - both mentally (That's why they all broke bad) and physically. (When they all end up dead or in jail). It's as clear as day.

I think this prediction is a pretty good one:

"What I think now is that there won’t be any winners when Breaking Bad is over. Just one loser: Walter White—alone, dying of cancer, with seven barrels of money all to himself. And no family left to give it any meaning."

That has been clear to me since the beginning of this season. There are no 'winners' here...when Walter White broke bad it was the beginning of the end. Although I wouldn't doubt there will be at least one or two 'survivors'.

The show is called Breaking Bad, not Broke Bad. There's no one given point where Walt actually broke. It's an ongoing process where he continually falls down the rabbit hole. That's why I question this theory that other characters also became nefarious or less moral. Though a case could be made for Skylar (though I'd argue that she was always someone who defined herself by how she controlled those around her, hence her browbeating of Walt in the first couple season and the situation she got herself in with Ted), I don't think any of the other characters every truly lost who they were, even if they found themselves pushing their scruples a bit. I suppose if they spent more time in the world directly dealing with Heisenberg perhaps the process would have overtaken them as well.

Those who argue that there's a definitive point where Walt broke bad is missing the point of the show.

Edited September 9, 2013 by downzy

[Ace Nova]

Prediction:

-Nazis kill Gomie and Hank, Jesse escapes

-Nazis demand Walt cooks for them, Walt agrees

-Cooks up that poisonous shit and kills one or two of them, escapes

-Walt and Jesse end up teaming up again since, for some reason, they both have the Nazis after them

-This all leads to Jesse getting killed by the Nazis and Walt going full Scarface on them with the M60

I know there are holes, but I think this is a general outline of what will go down.

Pretty good...it all could happen.

I have a feeling that Todd gets killed in the shootout, along with Hank and Gomie. This sets up a division between the nazis and Walt. Walt is angry that the Nazis killed Hank and the Nazis are angry that Todd is dead...plus about the fact they no longer have a cook. Walt tells the nazis to take Jesse, since he can cook just as good as he can. The nazis take Jesse.

Marie, like you said, flips out when Hank goes missing, and breaks the story to the DEA, the media, etc. At this point, Walt has no choice but to skip town.

Jesse plays along and starts cooking for the nazis...in order to escape, he intentionally blows up the cook, killing himself (maybe by accident) along with some of the nazis.

The nazis go crazy, and try to get Walt out of hiding by kidnapping Junior (who stayed behind with Marie). Walt tells Skylar that he needs to go back and cook, because they kidnapped junior. Skylar flips out, attacks Walt and Walt ends up killing her. (Possibly in self defense) We then go to the flash-forward scene, with Walt basically coming back to town to save Junior.

The show is called Breaking Bad, not Broke Bad. There's no one given point where Walt actually broke. It's an ongoing process where he continually falls down the rabbit hole. That's why I question this theory that other characters also became nefarious or less moral. Though a case could be made for Skylar (though I'd argue that she was always someone who defined herself by how she controlled those around her, hence her browbeating of Walt in the first couple season and the situation she got herself in with Ted), I don't think any of the other characters every truly lost who they were, even if they found themselves pushing their scruples a bit. I suppose if they spent more time in the world directly dealing with Heisenberg perhaps the process would have overtaken them as well.

Those who argue that there's a definitive point where Walt broke bad is missing the point of the show.

I respectfully disagree. The entire premise of the show is about Walter White breaking bad (and yes, he did that when he agreed to cook meth and sell it for a profit). And how Walter White breaking bad causes everyone around him to break bad as well...leading to most of their demises. It's painfully obvious that all the main adult characters "broke bad". About a year ago they were all having family picnics and barbeques together. Now, they have all (at the very least) contemplated or plotted murder. That's breaking bad. Gomie, just verified that all the adult characters "broke bad" except for his on Talking Bad tonight.

Edited September 9, 2013 by Kasanova King

[downzy]

Prediction:

-Nazis kill Gomie and Hank, Jesse escapes

-Nazis demand Walt cooks for them, Walt agrees

-Cooks up that poisonous shit and kills one or two of them, escapes

-Walt and Jesse end up teaming up again since, for some reason, they both have the Nazis after them

-This all leads to Jesse getting killed by the Nazis and Walt going full Scarface on them with the M60

I know there are holes, but I think this is a general outline of what will go down.

Pretty good...it all could happen.

I have a feeling that Todd gets killed in the shootout, along with Hank and Gomie. This sets up a division between the nazis and Walt. Walt is angry that the Nazis killed Hank and the Nazis are angry that Todd is dead...plus about the fact they no longer have a cook. Walt tells the nazis to take Jesse, since he can cook just as good as he can. The nazis take Jesse.

Marie, like you said, flips out when Hank goes missing, and breaks the story to the DEA, the media, etc. At this point, Walt has no choice but to skip town.

Jesse plays along and starts cooking for the nazis...in order to escape, he intentionally blows up the cook, killing himself (maybe by accident) along with some of the nazis.

The nazis go crazy, and try to get Walt out of hiding by kidnapping Junior (who stayed behind with Marie). Walt tells Skylar that he needs to go back and cook, because they kidnapped junior. Skylar flips out, attacks Walt and Walt ends up killing her. (Possibly in self defense) We then go to the flash-forward scene, with Walt basically coming back to town to save Junior.

The show is called Breaking Bad, not Broke Bad. There's no one given point where Walt actually broke. It's an ongoing process where he continually falls down the rabbit hole. That's why I question this theory that other characters also became nefarious or less moral. Though a case could be made for Skylar (though I'd argue that she was always someone who defined herself by how she controlled those around her, hence her browbeating of Walt in the first couple season and the situation she got herself in with Ted), I don't think any of the other characters every truly lost who they were, even if they found themselves pushing their scruples a bit. I suppose if they spent more time in the world directly dealing with Heisenberg perhaps the process would have overtaken them as well.

Those who argue that there's a definitive point where Walt broke bad is missing the point of the show.

I respectfully disagree. The entire premise of the show is about Walter White breaking bad (and yes, he did that when he agreed to cook meth and sell it for a profit). And how Walter White breaking bad causes everyone around him to break bad as well...leading to most of their demises. It's painfully obvious that all the main adult characters "broke bad". About a year ago they were all having family picnics and barbeques together. Now, they have all (at the very least) contemplated or plotted murder. That's breaking bad. Gomie, just verified that all the adult characters "broke bad" except for his on Talking Bad tonight.

So by your logic then none of the characters who have "broke bad" are good. That they are just bad people, or a far worse iteration of who they were before. But as this episode clearly indicates, there's still a lot of good in Walt; there are moral lines even he will still not cross. He couldn't bring himself to continue the hit on Jesse once he knew his brother-in law was part of the group. Hence why we see him tearing up when he's on the phone with Todd. He just can't bring himself to do. He still has some sort of baseline that at this point he can't break. His character is still transforming, but that doesn't mean it's a binary equation: you're either good or you're bad. But your notion of "breaking bad" doesn't leave much room for this understanding.

The other problem with your notion of "breaking bad" is that it equalizes all malignant behavior. You're arguing that Hank has "broken bad," but so has Walt. By that logic they're in the same moral space. Which I utterly reject. Hank may have spit out a few questionable lines about his concern for Jesse's life (who Dean Norris, the actor who plays Hank, argues that Hank never really meant it, that it was a front for Gomez), but that's a far stretch from the many sins Walt has committed. The only questionable thing Marie has done of late has investigated poisons, which she admits she wouldn't act on. Again, that's a very different kind of "bad" than actually poisoning a child to manipulate someone else.

Finally, the term "broke bad" doesn't leave a lot of room for redemption. It's apparent that Jesse is trying to find a way to atone for his sins. While Walt is doubling down on his badness, Jesse seems to want reprieve. But your concept leaves little room for Jesse.

Welcome to disagree, but I think this black and white notion of character development limits one's understanding and enjoyment that Gilligan has weaved into the show. As for the actor who plays Gomez, not necessarily the go to authority figure on all things Breaking Bad is he? I'd rather base my understanding on my own reading, along with what the guy who created the show and writes the scripts thinks.

Edited September 9, 2013 by downzy

[Gia]

Prediction:

-Nazis kill Gomie and Hank, Jesse escapes

-Nazis demand Walt cooks for them, Walt agrees

-Cooks up that poisonous shit and kills one or two of them, escapes

-Walt and Jesse end up teaming up again since, for some reason, they both have the Nazis after them

-This all leads to Jesse getting killed by the Nazis and Walt going full Scarface on them with the M60

I know there are holes, but I think this is a general outline of what will go down.

Pretty good...it all could happen.

I have a feeling that Todd gets killed in the shootout, along with Hank and Gomie. This sets up a division between the nazis and Walt. Walt is angry that the Nazis killed Hank and the Nazis are angry that Todd is dead...plus about the fact they no longer have a cook. Walt tells the nazis to take Jesse, since he can cook just as good as he can. The nazis take Jesse.

Marie, like you said, flips out when Hank goes missing, and breaks the story to the DEA, the media, etc. At this point, Walt has no choice but to skip town.

Jesse plays along and starts cooking for the nazis...in order to escape, he intentionally blows up the cook, killing himself (maybe by accident) along with some of the nazis.

The nazis go crazy, and try to get Walt out of hiding by kidnapping Junior (who stayed behind with Marie). Walt tells Skylar that he needs to go back and cook, because they kidnapped junior. Skylar flips out, attacks Walt and Walt ends up killing her. (Possibly in self defense) We then go to the flash-forward scene, with Walt basically coming back to town to save Junior.

The show is called Breaking Bad, not Broke Bad. There's no one given point where Walt actually broke. It's an ongoing process where he continually falls down the rabbit hole. That's why I question this theory that other characters also became nefarious or less moral. Though a case could be made for Skylar (though I'd argue that she was always someone who defined herself by how she controlled those around her, hence her browbeating of Walt in the first couple season and the situation she got herself in with Ted), I don't think any of the other characters every truly lost who they were, even if they found themselves pushing their scruples a bit. I suppose if they spent more time in the world directly dealing with Heisenberg perhaps the process would have overtaken them as well.

Those who argue that there's a definitive point where Walt broke bad is missing the point of the show.

I respectfully disagree. The entire premise of the show is about Walter White breaking bad (and yes, he did that when he agreed to cook meth and sell it for a profit). And how Walter White breaking bad causes everyone around him to break bad as well...leading to most of their demises. It's painfully obvious that all the main adult characters "broke bad". About a year ago they were all having family picnics and barbeques together. Now, they have all (at the very least) contemplated or plotted murder. That's breaking bad. Gomie, just verified that all the adult characters "broke bad" except for his on Talking Bad tonight.

So by your logic then none of the characters who have "broke bad" are good. That they are just bad people, or a far worse iteration of who they were before. But as this episode clearly indicates, there's still a lot of good in Walt; there are moral lines even he will still not cross. He couldn't bring himself to continue the hit on Jesse once he knew his brother-in law was part of the group. Hence why we see him tearing up when he's on the phone with Todd. He just can't bring himself to do. He still has some sort of baseline that at this point he can't break. His character is still transforming, but that doesn't mean it's a binary equation: you're either good or you're bad. But your notion of "breaking bad" doesn't leave much room for this understanding.

The other problem with your notion of "breaking bad" is that it equalizes all malignant behavior. You're arguing that Hank has "broken bad," but so has Walt. By that logic they're in the same moral space. Which I utterly reject. Hank may have spit out a few questionable lines about his concern for Jesse's life (who Dean Norris, the actor who plays Hank, argues that Hank never really meant it, that it was a front for Gomez), but that's a far stretch from the many sins Walt has committed. The only questionable thing Marie has done of late has investigated poisons, which she admits she wouldn't act on. Again, that's a very different kind of "bad" than actually poisoning a child to manipulate someone else.

Finally, the term "broke bad" doesn't leave a lot of room for redemption. It's apparent that Jesse is trying to find a way to atone for his sins. While Walt is doubling down on his badness, Jesse seems to want reprieve. But your concept leaves little room for Jesse.

Welcome to disagree, but I think this black and white notion of character development limits one's understanding and enjoyment that Gilligan has weaved into the show. As for the actor who plays Gomez, not necessarily the go to authority figure on all things Breaking Bad is he? I'd rather base my understanding on my own reading, along with what the guy who created the show and writes the scripts thinks.

Can you relax for once?

It's a fucking show

[Ace Nova]

So by your logic then none of the characters who have "broke bad" are good. That they are just bad people, or a far worse iteration of who they were before. But as this episode clearly indicates, there's still a lot of good in Walt; there are moral lines even he will still not cross. He couldn't bring himself to continue the hit on Jesse once he knew his brother-in law was part of the group. Hence why we see him tearing up when he's on the phone with Todd. He just can't bring himself to do. He still has some sort of baseline that at this point he can't break. His character is still transforming, but that doesn't mean it's a binary equation: you're either good or you're bad. But your notion of "breaking bad" doesn't leave much room for this understanding.

The other problem with your notion of "breaking bad" is that it equalizes all malignant behavior. You're arguing that Hank has "broken bad," but so has Walt. By that logic they're in the same moral space. Which I utterly reject. Hank may have spit out a few questionable lines about his concern for Jesse's life (who Dean Norris, the actor who plays Hank, argues that Hank never really meant it, that it was a front for Gomez), but that's a far stretch from the many sins Walt has committed. The only questionable thing Marie has done of late has investigated poisons, which she admits she wouldn't act on. Again, that's a very different kind of "bad" than actually poisoning a child to manipulate someone else.

Finally, the term "broke bad" doesn't leave a lot of room for redemption. It's apparent that Jesse is trying to find a way to atone for his sins. While Walt is doubling down on his badness, Jesse seems to want reprieve. But your concept leaves little room for Jesse.

Welcome to disagree, but I think this black and white notion of character development limits one's understanding and enjoyment that Gilligan has weaved into the show. As for the actor who plays Gomez, not necessarily the go to authority figure on all things Breaking Bad is he? I'd rather base my understanding on my own reading, along with what the guy who created the show and writes the scripts thinks.

I'd like to read where Vince Gilligan has stated that the characters don't break bad. I don't think you have a full understanding of the meaning of the phrase "breaking bad". Lead actor Bryan Cranston stated in an interview that "the term 'breaking bad' is a southern colloquialism and it means when someone who has taken a turn off the path of the straight and narrow, when they've gone wrong. And that could be for that day or for a lifetime." It doesn't mean they are permanently "bad" as you're insinuating.

So yes, by definition, all the (adult) characters have broken bad. (Other than Gomie) It's really that simple. As for the show having deeper plot lines, themes and character developments, of course it does...no one is disagreeing with that.

Edited September 9, 2013 by Kasanova King

[downzy]

So by your logic then none of the characters who have "broke bad" are good. That they are just bad people, or a far worse iteration of who they were before. But as this episode clearly indicates, there's still a lot of good in Walt; there are moral lines even he will still not cross. He couldn't bring himself to continue the hit on Jesse once he knew his brother-in law was part of the group. Hence why we see him tearing up when he's on the phone with Todd. He just can't bring himself to do. He still has some sort of baseline that at this point he can't break. His character is still transforming, but that doesn't mean it's a binary equation: you're either good or you're bad. But your notion of "breaking bad" doesn't leave much room for this understanding.

The other problem with your notion of "breaking bad" is that it equalizes all malignant behavior. You're arguing that Hank has "broken bad," but so has Walt. By that logic they're in the same moral space. Which I utterly reject. Hank may have spit out a few questionable lines about his concern for Jesse's life (who Dean Norris, the actor who plays Hank, argues that Hank never really meant it, that it was a front for Gomez), but that's a far stretch from the many sins Walt has committed. The only questionable thing Marie has done of late has investigated poisons, which she admits she wouldn't act on. Again, that's a very different kind of "bad" than actually poisoning a child to manipulate someone else.

Finally, the term "broke bad" doesn't leave a lot of room for redemption. It's apparent that Jesse is trying to find a way to atone for his sins. While Walt is doubling down on his badness, Jesse seems to want reprieve. But your concept leaves little room for Jesse.

Welcome to disagree, but I think this black and white notion of character development limits one's understanding and enjoyment that Gilligan has weaved into the show. As for the actor who plays Gomez, not necessarily the go to authority figure on all things Breaking Bad is he? I'd rather base my understanding on my own reading, along with what the guy who created the show and writes the scripts thinks.

I'd like to read where Vince Gilligan has stated that the characters don't break bad. I don't think you have a full understanding of the meaning of the phrase "breaking bad". Lead actor Bryan Cranston stated in an interview that "the term 'breaking bad' is a southern colloquialism and it means when someone who has taken a turn off the path of the straight and narrow, when they've gone wrong. And that could be for that day or for a lifetime." It doesn't mean they are permanently "bad" as you're insinuating.

So yes, by definition, all the (adult) characters have broken bad. (Other than Gomie) It's really that simple. As for the show having deeper plot lines, themes and character developments, of course it does...no one is disagreeing with that.

The way I understand the term is someone who has turned away from their previous lawful or moral lifestyle. I don't see how certain characters, such as Hank and Marie, fall into that category. Moreover, my problem is how the term has been used by many who equate all actions as morally equivalent. To say, "they've all broken bad," and hence all within the same moral space is not something that makes sense. It's too simplistic. It's a process, not a particular action, by which one's moral boundaries are loosened without regard or conscience. Otherwise, if "breaking bad" isn't qualified, it's just a blanket statement devoid of severity or weight. You claim that Walt "broke bad" when he started cooking meth in season one. But then what about when he ran over the guys coming to kill Jesse in season two? Or what about poisoning Brock in season four? If he had already "broken bad," that doesn't leave much room for further character development. It's with each act that he furthers his transformation. Again, it's not one particular action, but the culmination of them all that defines, at least for me, the process of "breaking bad." Walt in this season, is a very different person than who he was when he initially started cooking meth. By saying he "broke bad" in season one, what room does that leave for all the far worse destruction he brought later in the show?

Edited September 9, 2013 by downzy

[Ace Nova]

The way I understand the term is someone who has turned away from their previous lawful or moral lifestyle. I don't see how certain characters, such as Hank and Marie, fall into that category. Moreover, my problem is how the term has been used by many who equate all actions as morally equivalent. To say, "they've all broken bad," and hence all within the same moral space is not something that makes sense. It's too simplistic. It's a process, not a particular action, by which one's moral boundaries are loosened without regard or conscience. Otherwise, if "breaking bad" isn't qualified, it's just a blanket statement devoid of severity or weight. You claim that Walt "broke bad" when he started cooking meth. But then what about when he ran over the guys coming to kill Jesse? Even he had already "broken bad," that doesn't leave much room for further character development. It's with each act that he furthers his transformation. Again, it's not one particular action, but the culmination of them all that defines, at least for me, the process of "breaking bad." Walt in this season, is a very different person than who he was when he initially started cooking meth. By saying he "broke bad" in season one, what room does that leave for all the far worse destruction he brought later in the show?

It can be both, like Brian Cranston explains - you can 'break bad' for a day or a lifetime...and that's clearly the definition in which is applied in the show. Walt broke bad when he started to cook meth and (although has had some minor returns to morality) he has been "broken bad" the entire series. I think as the series comes to conclusion, we will see that in fact, even the few times Walt seemed to "come back to morality", in reality, he was doing it all for himself (and using his family as justification/excuse).

And yes, Hank has been bordering 'breaking bad' in his absolute obsession in catching Hesienberg - to the point of almost losing his job over it. Then he clearly breaks bad by A.) Doing this all behind the DEA's back B.) Not caring if Jesse got killed in the sting (That's almost the same level as conspiring to murder someone).

Marie breaks bad by A.) Wanting Walt dead. B.) Contemplating ways she could murder Walt. Both Hank and Marie were good, rational, law abiding citizens in the beginning of the series. If this doesn't show you that they broke bad, then you are missing the entire point of the show. Different people, break bad in different ways, for different reasons, for different periods of time.

At the end of tonight's episode, you can see that since Hank's obsession has been pacified by finally catching Heisenberg, he has finally come back to 'morality' by his loving phone call to his wife. He broke bad but now he has come back. Unfortunately for him, it's too late...and I think you will see that as a reoccurring theme in the show...that the characters broke bad and unfortunately, by the time some of them came back, it was too late, the damage (or death, etc) is already done.

Edited September 9, 2013 by Kasanova King

[downzy]

Marie wasn't a law abiding citizen in the beginning of the series. She was a klepto who also liked to pass herself off as different people at open houses. In fact, she has become a more centered person as the show wore on. Hank often did his investigations outside the force. Look how he caught Fring. And again, I seriously doubt he would truly let Jesse die if push came to shove. As Norris himself stated, it was like a front for Gomez. It was one line that ultimately didn't mean anything. I've yelled and said shit at people all the time I didn't really mean. Doesn't necessarily mean I was "breaking bad" when I said it.

The point I'm trying to make here is that Walt's transformation is not just a matter of unconnected actions. They're connected, one sin allowing for greater sin later. It's the compounding of immoral behavior that is, for me at least, the driving force of the show. We're nearly at the end of the line here, and we'll see how far Walt has come in this process of becoming someone who he wouldn't recognize at the beginning of the series. He's still breaking; we haven't seen yet where this trip is finally going to take him as a person. That's why I don't accept the notion that he "broke bad" because he hasn't arrived at his final destination yet.

Edited September 9, 2013 by downzy

[Tater Totts]

That ending cliffhanger had me shaking by the end of it.

[Powerage5]

That ending cliffhanger had me shaking by the end of it.

Me too. I felt like I was on a caffeine high.

[Tater Totts]

That ending cliffhanger had me shaking by the end of it.

Me too. I felt like I was on a caffeine high.

The last time I reacted like this was the season 3 ending with Jesse shooting Gale.

[Powerage5]

That ending cliffhanger had me shaking by the end of it.

Me too. I felt like I was on a caffeine high.

The last time I reacted like this was the season 3 ending with Jesse shooting Gale.

Mike's death did it for me too. I got Gus' death spoiled for me, so I'll never know how I should have reacted

[Tater Totts]

That ending cliffhanger had me shaking by the end of it.

Me too. I felt like I was on a caffeine high.

The last time I reacted like this was the season 3 ending with Jesse shooting Gale.

Mike's death did it for me too. I got Gus' death spoiled for me, so I'll never know how I should have reacted

Same as, I read a spoiler for the last episode by accident as someone posted it as a "theory" but everything he said was right. Even after that I thought it would be a little outlandish for that to happen so when it did I was a little disappointed.