Fernando's answer *UK SUBS post PG19*

[magisme]

Good point. We're not at all in the same boat. I've spent thousands of dollars on GNR. Fernando and his family have made hundreds of thousands, if not millions, "working" for GNR, driving it into the ground and making it a laughing stock in the music world. Pretty different.

[DieselDaisy]

He is a prickly sensitive character, Fernando, isn't he? What is with the accusation of racism? I have never seen much racism and I imagine the mods would delete any straight away.

[Axl_morris]

Good point. We're not at all in the same boat. I've spent thousands of dollars on GNR. Fernando and his family have made hundreds of thousands, if not millions, "working" for GNR, driving it into the ground and making it a laughing stock in the music world. Pretty different.

You get what you pay for. It's not as if you spent thousands of dollars and got nothing in return...

[magisme]

Good point. We're not at all in the same boat. I've spent thousands of dollars on GNR. Fernando and his family have made hundreds of thousands, if not millions, "working" for GNR, driving it into the ground and making it a laughing stock in the music world. Pretty different.

You get what you pay for. It's not as if you spent thousands of dollars and got nothing in return...

Did I say that? You're missing the point entirely.

And no, with this band you do not get what you pay for. Unless you're good paying for expensive turds.

[stumbleine]

Good point. We're not at all in the same boat. I've spent thousands of dollars on GNR. Fernando and his family have made hundreds of thousands, if not millions, "working" for GNR, driving it into the ground and making it a laughing stock in the music world. Pretty different.

You get what you pay for. It's not as if you spent thousands of dollars and got nothing in return...

CD,jungle,easy etc

[Estranged Reality]

So he still didn't answer that letter. Extremely pointless answer.

If he really spent 2 hours on "other more active forums" (which I'm assuming would include MyGNR) he'd realize there's not as much hate as he thinks.

I outlined this in another really long post, but I'll briefly restate it: that's the problem with those of you (and there are only a few) who just bash Fernando or Beta for the easy reasons: deriding them for being house maids, Brazilian, whatever. You guys make it way too easy for them to ignore VALID criticisms (their handling and apparent mismanagement of the band, for example) and just lump it all together as "hate."

I truly wish people didn't ever troll them and make fun of them in racist or sexist ways or even just bash them for their history, because it reduces the level of discourse and if I were in their shoes I'd probably have the same reaction and just lump it all together. No one wants to be reading stuff about themselves like that.

However I do think there are valid questions, criticisms and concerns that they could take an opportunity to address, and I think it's kind of ignorant of Fernando to imply that ALL of our members are spewing hate. You can't write off a whole fanbase like that, and the truth is that we moderate D&N to the extent that those kinds of hateful posts aren't allowed, so unless he spent 2 hours in the Attitude subforum I'm not sure where he's getting this idea from.

[ManetsBR]

Good point on the same boat thing.

[RussTCB]

Sad thing is we are a great bunch...I'd say there is just maybe 5 assholes here that ruined it for all of us.

I really don't think it's time to throw in the towel and say everything is ruined. I really believe there's still a way for this to all work out. I think there can be a happy medium where people post their opinions, negative and positive, without crossing lines that people respect everyday out in the real world.

Thank you for trying to be the amending bridge here. I hope HV and Subsy understand what a great asset to this place you are.

I appreciate you saying that, I'm just trying to help out

I understand a lot of the ill will people feel towards any management team and everyone is obviously more than welcome to express that, but there has got to be a middle ground where things don't get so nasty.

Nope. Not when all they can do is insult the fanbase and talk about hate and racism. Fuck them. Now go ahead and overstep and delete this post. Gotta keep up appearances while absolutely nothing continues to happen with this "band."

So you feel that there's absolutely no way to find a middle ground?

[Estranged Reality]

mypjforum.com

Really, NuGNR is probably the most hostile band when it comes to their online community, which ironically (as I've also detailed lengthily in the past) is comprised of their only remaining true fans, since most other casual fans of GN'R probably don't even know who Ron Thal or DJ Ashba are. The people who go to those shows are mostly going to hear the hits, not because they give a shit about the band in its current state. This is easily evidenced by the fact that outside the forums, you'll rarely find any press or articles about the band or its current members, let alone find people talking about them. I know someone who went to see a GN'R show in Vegas and they didn't even know who the guitarists were anymore, they just wanted to see the hits played. That's pretty much where we're at with the band.

And yet the online fans who actually dedicate time and interest to the individual members (and don't focus solely on Axl) are the ones who receive the brunt of snarky comments and missives. It's just kind of sad.

[wasted]

I wouldnt be surprised if theres a GNR song about the internet forums on the next record called Butthurt.

Edited August 26, 2013 by wasted

[stumbleine]

mypjforum.com

what do you think of PJ's ever changing setlists?

this band makes it exciting for their fans.

still a supporter of this idea.

it would start a revolution.

[Gia]

I wouldnt be surprised if theres a GNR song about the internet forums on the next record called Butthurt.

[magisme]

Sad thing is we are a great bunch...I'd say there is just maybe 5 assholes here that ruined it for all of us.

I really don't think it's time to throw in the towel and say everything is ruined. I really believe there's still a way for this to all work out. I think there can be a happy medium where people post their opinions, negative and positive, without crossing lines that people respect everyday out in the real world.

Thank you for trying to be the amending bridge here. I hope HV and Subsy understand what a great asset to this place you are.

I appreciate you saying that, I'm just trying to help out

I understand a lot of the ill will people feel towards any management team and everyone is obviously more than welcome to express that, but there has got to be a middle ground where things don't get so nasty.

Nope. Not when all they can do is insult the fanbase and talk about hate and racism. Fuck them. Now go ahead and overstep and delete this post. Gotta keep up appearances while absolutely nothing continues to happen with this "band."

So you feel that there's absolutely no way to find a middle ground?

In all honesty, no. Not without MAJOR changes to the band and its management.

Middle ground on what? Them telling us nothing and us doing what? Them telling us they have nothing planned and us doing what? Them calling us racists and haters and us doing what? Them putting out a subpar product show after show and us doing what? Beta telling us we complain too much if we want new music and us doing what? It is not our job to make Axl and Team Brazil feel warm and fuzzy about themselves, especially when they've turned GNR into what it is now: a complete and utter joke.

[Randy Lahey]

Axl has always been one to focus on negativity. I imagine mygnr is probably his favorite GNR forum.

I wouldnt be surprised if theres a GNR song about the internet forums on the next record called Butthurt.

Get in the Ring Part 2. I wouldn't be all that surprised if Axl cut a song calling out posters by name.

[ManetsBR]

But whenever he types mygnr on the browser the computer shuts down and a siren comes up. Then he's put in a empty room for two hours with Dexter, Dijon and Whiskey (the cats) to relax.

Edited August 26, 2013 by ManetsBR

[Gia]

But whenever he types mygnr on the browser the computer shuts down and a siren comes up. Then he's put in a empty room for two hours with Dexter, Dijon and Whiskey (the cats) to relax.

What's got into you Manets!

[RussTCB]

I appreciate you saying that, I'm just trying to help out

In all honesty, no. Not without MAJOR changes to the band and its management.

Middle ground on what? Them telling us nothing and us doing what? Them telling us they have nothing planned and us doing what? Them calling us racists and haters and us doing what? Them putting out a subpar product show after show and us doing what? Beta telling us we complain too much if we want new music and us doing what? It is not our job to make Axl and Team Brazil feel warm and fuzzy about themselves, especially when they've turned GNR into what it is now: a complete and utter joke.

I'm saying a middle ground between fans expressing their opinions without resorting to personal attacks, hate and racism.

[DieselDaisy]

You get the fan base you deserve. At the end of the day, the reason people bash the hell out of Team Brazil is because, Team Brazil damn well deserve a good bashing. Since they took over GN'R, it has been one-unmitigated-disaster after another. From the laughable excuse for a fanclub, to the collapse of Axl's North American attendances (bowling alleys!) through overbooking multiple nostalgia tours; from the DVD which simply refuses to come out, to a total lack of activity on the ‘new material front’ - Team Brazil have been disastrous for Guns N' Roses.

So then, the fans have a justifiable excuse to bash Beta and Fernando. Fernando, if you cannot stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.

[Randy Lahey]

I appreciate you saying that, I'm just trying to help out

In all honesty, no. Not without MAJOR changes to the band and its management.

Middle ground on what? Them telling us nothing and us doing what? Them telling us they have nothing planned and us doing what? Them calling us racists and haters and us doing what? Them putting out a subpar product show after show and us doing what? Beta telling us we complain too much if we want new music and us doing what? It is not our job to make Axl and Team Brazil feel warm and fuzzy about themselves, especially when they've turned GNR into what it is now: a complete and utter joke.

I'm saying a middle ground between fans expressing their opinions without resorting to personal attacks, hate and racism.

I take it you never read Axl's letter to Madison? Volatile band and volatile fans. It's at the point where only a new album or a reunion is going to make any of the forum fans happy.

Edited August 26, 2013 by Randy Lahey

[RussTCB]

You get the fan base you deserve. At the end of the day, the reason people bash the hell out of Team Brazil is because, Team Brazil damn well deserve a good bashing. Since they took over GN'R, it has been one-unmitigated-disaster after another. From the laughable excuse for a fanclub, to the collapse of Axl's North American attendances (bowling alleys!) through overbooking multiple nostalgia tours; from the DVD which simply refuses to come out, to a total lack of activity on the ‘new material front’ - Team Brazil have been disastrous for Guns N' Roses.

So then, the fans have a justifiable excuse to bash Beta and Fernando. Fernando, if you cannot stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.

A lot of valid points and to be honest, this is a good example of the type of criticism that should be encouraged. Stating things you're unhappy with in an intelligent, we'll thought out fashion is a ton more constructive than just posted some personal insults.

[magisme]

I appreciate you saying that, I'm just trying to help out

In all honesty, no. Not without MAJOR changes to the band and its management.

Middle ground on what? Them telling us nothing and us doing what? Them telling us they have nothing planned and us doing what? Them calling us racists and haters and us doing what? Them putting out a subpar product show after show and us doing what? Beta telling us we complain too much if we want new music and us doing what? It is not our job to make Axl and Team Brazil feel warm and fuzzy about themselves, especially when they've turned GNR into what it is now: a complete and utter joke.

I'm saying a middle ground between fans expressing their opinions without resorting to personal attacks, hate and racism.

Based on my observations, with the exception of ER, not one of you can be trusted to adequately identify "personal attacks," "hate" or "racism," so no, I don't think there's middle ground to be had there either.

[Gia]

Seriously though why couldn't he just answer the questions instead of trying to make us feel bad for a few comments?

[RussTCB]

I appreciate you saying that, I'm just trying to help out

In all honesty, no. Not without MAJOR changes to the band and its management.

Middle ground on what? Them telling us nothing and us doing what? Them telling us they have nothing planned and us doing what? Them calling us racists and haters and us doing what? Them putting out a subpar product show after show and us doing what? Beta telling us we complain too much if we want new music and us doing what? It is not our job to make Axl and Team Brazil feel warm and fuzzy about themselves, especially when they've turned GNR into what it is now: a complete and utter joke.

I'm saying a middle ground between fans expressing their opinions without resorting to personal attacks, hate and racism.

I take it you never read Axl's letter to Madison? Volatile band and volatile fans. It's at the point where only a new album or a reunion is going to make any of the forum fans happy.

Oh I'm very aware of the Axl/Madison issue but you're not suggesting that to be the reason for personal attacks and insults right?

[bacardimayne]

lolwhiskey

[ManetsBR]

Awwwww