Petition for ITW to replace Live and Let Die

[Cosmo]

ITW is perfect right there as it is... Great song. I really, really don't get the hate it gets (even though it's cheesy and very unusual for Guns N' Roses, it's a good song) and I'd be glad if it replaced LALD. Even though Guns N' Roses has adopted the song as it's own, and it's a good live song, it's been played in every concert since UYI and like it or not it's a cover song.

[wasted]

I thought ITW, TWAT, Bond Theme, Live n Let Die worked pretty well live.

I'd drop Easy and Brownstone for Shackler's and IRS.

[Johnny Drama]

Why does everyone hate ITW? Seriously it's been one of my favourites since Day Dot and I'd love to see it replace LALD but I don't think that's the opinion of the majority though.

[Towelie]

Why does everyone hate ITW? Seriously it's been one of my favourites since Day Dot and I'd love to see it replace LALD but I don't think that's the opinion of the majority though.

Why does everyone hate ITW? Well, I can't speak for everyone else, but to me, the song is the very definition of a filler. I'm all for Axl experimenting with new sounds and stepping outside of his comfort zone, but ITW is just an experiment gone wrong. His whiney, grovelly vocals on the verses really grate on me, the chorus has no hook, the overall production and musical arrangement sounds contrived and lacking in inspiration. Not even a solo from Buckethead redeems this hot mess of a track.

[Lies They Tell]

Yeah, I can't speak for anyone else either, but I dislike the song because I absolutely hate the cheesy vocals and especially the chorus. It doesn't help that the chorus is repeated over and over again until I just can't take it anymore. It's the same thing with for example Back Of Bitch.

Besides I never liked the music of 70's porno movies and that's what If The World sounds like. I like the spanish guitars though and I like the fact that Axl's gone out of his comfort zone and trying something different. But just like Towelie said ITW sounds like an experiment gone wrong.

And I know that the song is supposed to sound like a bad James Bond tune. But just because it's supposed to sound bad doesn't change the fact that it still sounds bad. I don't like bad James Bond tunes and I don't like this one either.

[magisme]

I never knew the way that you look at meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
Would ever mean so much to meeeeeeeeeeeeeee
But in my heart I found the feelings that I've never shown
And now they've got the best of meeeeeeeeeeeee

Pretty much the dictionary definition of bad lyrics, capped off by emphasizing that you're rhyming the same fucking one syllable word twice in a row. Truly awful. 14 years in the making, folks.

[GivenToFly]

I never knew the way that you look at meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Would ever mean so much to meeeeeeeeeeeeeee

But in my heart I found the feelings that I've never shown

And now they've got the best of meeeeeeeeeeeee

Pretty much the dictionary definition of bad lyrics, capped off by emphasizing that you're rhyming the same fucking one syllable word twice in a row. Truly awful. 14 years in the making, folks.

Yeah, the lyrics are pretty bad. In fact the album is full of lyrics that strike me as amateurish and rushed. It's ironic, given how carefully Axl tinkered with the music. I wonder why he paid so little attention to the lyrics.

[magisme]

I never knew the way that you look at meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Would ever mean so much to meeeeeeeeeeeeeee

But in my heart I found the feelings that I've never shown

And now they've got the best of meeeeeeeeeeeee

Pretty much the dictionary definition of bad lyrics, capped off by emphasizing that you're rhyming the same fucking one syllable word twice in a row. Truly awful. 14 years in the making, folks.

Yeah, the lyrics are pretty bad. In fact the album is full of lyrics that strike me as amateurish and rushed. It's ironic, given how carefully Axl tinkered with the music. I wonder why he paid so little attention to the lyrics.

It's one of the great mysteries of the album to me. I mean, I'm one of the people who think that Axl sounds bad on the record too. That I can kind of explain away by thinking about how impossible it is to get Axl in the studio and all that. But lyrics like this? He should be laying in bed thinking these over, realizing, "WTF did I write? That's terrible. Gonna have to revise that." We're talking a damn decade and a half he had to make these changes. Jesus.

[GivenToFly]

I never knew the way that you look at meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Would ever mean so much to meeeeeeeeeeeeeee

But in my heart I found the feelings that I've never shown

And now they've got the best of meeeeeeeeeeeee

Pretty much the dictionary definition of bad lyrics, capped off by emphasizing that you're rhyming the same fucking one syllable word twice in a row. Truly awful. 14 years in the making, folks.

Yeah, the lyrics are pretty bad. In fact the album is full of lyrics that strike me as amateurish and rushed. It's ironic, given how carefully Axl tinkered with the music. I wonder why he paid so little attention to the lyrics.

It's one of the great mysteries of the album to me. I mean, I'm one of the people who think that Axl sounds bad on the record too. That I can kind of explain away by thinking about how impossible it is to get Axl in the studio and all that. But lyrics like this? He should be laying in bed thinking these over, realizing, "WTF did I write? That's terrible. Gonna have to revise that." We're talking a damn decade and a half he had to make these changes. Jesus.

We know from different sources that he procrastinated a lot and had trouble getting into the frame of mind and spirit to do any work. I think he completely ignored the creative work for the album while he wasn't actually recording, so when he did get into the studio he had to quickly come up with something to sing. Or maybe in the car on the way to the studio.

This is me speculating on how long it took him to write the lyrics on Chinese Democracy:

CD: 5 minutes

Shakler's: 4 minutes

Better: 1-1.5 hours spread over two years

The blues: see Better

ITW: 3 minutes

TWAT: 5 minutes

Catcher: 20 minutes

Scraped: improvised during the first take

Riad: 4 minutes

Sorry: 20 minutes over two days

IRS: 30 minutes

Madagascar: see Better

TIL: written in the early 90s, doesn't count

Prostitute: proper effort, rewrites and all: 1 hour

[Black Sabbath]

You can't drop LALD

[Powerage5]

I am all for dropping the covers and replacing them with more original material, though it'd be a huge shame to lose Axl's ridic screams in LALD.

And I'm really surprised at the hate given to If The World. Except for the way-too-corny second verse, I really dig it, esp. Bucket's flamenco playing.

Not to derail, but I completely agree with your first point; If I got my wish, they'd stop adding stuff like Whole Lotta Rosie, The Seeler, etc etc and just add more Guns N' Roses tunes.

Ah, The Seeler. My all-time favorite song by The Why.

[Coma16]

I can't speak for everyone else but I love ITW. I think it sounds great in the record and even better live.

[Powerage5]

I can't speak for everyone else but I love ITW. I think it sounds great in the record and even better live.

Same. I remember after they dropped it in 2010 everyone was crying about how it's such a great live song and they never play it. Now everyone is talking about how it's such a terrible song. I don't get GN'R fans sometimes

[Young_Gun]

The solo is the best part of ITW. It is an only slightly above average song to me.

[Riddick Bowe]

Live And Let Die is a great live number. Cool pyro aswell. Keep it!

[Lies They Tell]

Same. I remember after they dropped it in 2010 everyone was crying about how it's such a great live song and they never play it. Now everyone is talking about how it's such a terrible song. I don't get GN'R fans sometimes

Dude, the people who loved the song were different people than the people who are criticizing it now. I remember that I praised the lord when they finally dropped the song from the setlist and replaced it with TIL. But that was on a different forum.

[Cosmo]

Same. I remember after they dropped it in 2010 everyone was crying about how it's such a great live song and they never play it. Now everyone is talking about how it's such a terrible song. I don't get GN'R fans sometimes

Dude, the people who loved the song were different people than the people who are criticizing it now. I remember that I praised the lord when they finally dropped the song from the setlist and replaced it with TIL. But that was on a different forum.

TIL is such a downer live without the rasp...

[Lies They Tell]

Same. I remember after they dropped it in 2010 everyone was crying about how it's such a great live song and they never play it. Now everyone is talking about how it's such a terrible song. I don't get GN'R fans sometimes

Dude, the people who loved the song were different people than the people who are criticizing it now. I remember that I praised the lord when they finally dropped the song from the setlist and replaced it with TIL. But that was on a different forum.

TIL is such a downer live without the rasp...

Well, back then he was still using the rasp

I never knew the way that you look at meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Would ever mean so much to meeeeeeeeeeeeeee

But in my heart I found the feelings that I've never shown

And now they've got the best of meeeeeeeeeeeee

Pretty much the dictionary definition of bad lyrics, capped off by emphasizing that you're rhyming the same fucking one syllable word twice in a row. Truly awful. 14 years in the making, folks.

I really wanted to like your post, cause you pretty much summed up what's wrong with the lyrics.

But honestly I doubt Axl's been tinkering the lyrics of ITW for 14 years. I believe (and hope) that ITW is just a filler song they wrote pretty quickly and put on the album cause they wanted to save many of the big guns for later.

[Apollo]

I've always hated LALD, live and album version. Way too much of a pop song. And I don't go to shows to see fireworks, I go to listen to the band.

Used to love KOHD. But now it is a complete energy suck. No emotion and takes way too long.

I'd much rather see Axl drop those two songs and replace them with 3 songs from CD.

Why not throw ITW and IRS back into the set!

Edited December 20, 2013 by Groghan

[Mr. Dude]

I've always hated LALD, live and album version. Way too much of a pop song. And I don't go to shows to see fireworks, I go to listen to the band.

Used to love KOHD. But now it is a complete energy suck. No emotion and takes way too long.

I'd much rather see Axl drop those two songs and replace them with 3 songs from CD.

Why not throw ITW and IRS back into the set!

I definitely would like them to bring IRS back. IRS and TWAT are my favorites from CD (and I think the lyrics are brilliant and amongst the most authentic Axl has ever written, but then I feel that way about the album as a whole). I think IRS is probably a pretty taxing song for Axl to sing night in and night out. I still think he should throw it in the setlist every now and then though.

[Cosmo]

I've always hated LALD, live and album version. Way too much of a pop song. And I don't go to shows to see fireworks, I go to listen to the band.

Used to love KOHD. But now it is a complete energy suck. No emotion and takes way too long.

I'd much rather see Axl drop those two songs and replace them with 3 songs from CD.

Why not throw ITW and IRS back into the set!

I don't think Axl can handle IRS nowadays... And I'm really fine with KOHD as long as it's not over 10min long.

[Powerage5]

Same. I remember after they dropped it in 2010 everyone was crying about how it's such a great live song and they never play it. Now everyone is talking about how it's such a terrible song. I don't get GN'R fans sometimes

Dude, the people who loved the song were different people than the people who are criticizing it now. I remember that I praised the lord when they finally dropped the song from the setlist and replaced it with TIL. But that was on a different forum.

I wasn't saying specific members changed their minds, I was just saying as a whole, the community seems to have shifted from really liking the song to absolutely hating it. There was almost nothing but positive comments about ITW live on here while they were still playing it. It's just...odd.

[IncitingChaos]

On the topic of lyrical strength on the album I have to say There Was A Time is very well put together lyrically. The way the song transitions is great.

I do understand seeing weaker lyrics on the album but ITW seemed like a quick fun song for Axl to write. I actually believe him when he said he wanted his own Bond sounding song, I think he thought it would be fun. So I hate to knock those lyrics, and the truth is if you want deeper lyrics then go read poetry.

Axl has written his fair share of lyrically strong songs, so if he comes up with a few quick songs using cheesy lyrics then just let it be. It's more about the delivery of the lyrics. I don't think This I Love is top notch lyrically but he delivers the song with a great amount of emotion so it works. I think he puts a lot into If the World also. I wouldn't mind seeing it show up every once in a while.

Sorry I haven't read most of the thread just some stuff about lyrics, so if I touched on something someone else already did then I apologize.