The Boxing Thread

[Snake-Pit]

I had no respect for Floyd Mayweather JNR because for the longest time ever, I thought he was dodging the fight like a pussy afraid of a ass whooping...

Then he put his money where his mouth is, made it so anticipated that eventually, he commanded the biggest purse/pay out in Boxing history, then he won it.

[RandallFlagg]

I would say with respect to the significance and magnitude of the event Pacman got schooled but as an individual fight it was just a simple fight for Floyd with some rocky patches I think at absolute best it's 8-4 to Floyd, 10-2 at worst. Pacquiao got countered hard twice in the first round and that became the pattern of the fight, if he'd never got obliterated by Dinamita's counter would he have thrown caution to the wind and relied on his primal strengths more, who knows. Maidana didn't give two shits what was coming back, sure he got stunned a couple times but he never stopped backing Floyd up and bringing the best out of him, he got Floyd throwing and out of his groove.

Mayweather has always been respectful (the last ten years, except dumb Ortiz and Merchant lol) to his opponents after the hysteria and whatever bullshit he plays in the build up, I liked the respect he gave to manny but jesus what the hell was wrong with Pacquiao? Talk about sour grapes, 'I thought I won the fight, he ran, he never hurt me' well duh that's what you've been aware of for five years and said you had three plans for. Now I hear about this non existent shoulder injury and he still can't bring himself to admit he didn't turn up whilst Floyd did and as a result he got swept aside like a crash test dummy. He wasn't exactly a deer in headlights like Canelo but he wasn't any better, completely negated and had no back up plan that Roach claimed.

[RandallFlagg]

Let's say Manny did have a slight shoulder problem, this is fighting if you're 75% fit you are good to go and stepped into the ring, I don't doubt Floyd has fought with issues, his rotator cuff in the first Castillo fight, which I thought he lost and he gets no end of shit for saying he injured his shoulder, so let's not have double standards here. He definitely did not look markedly affected by an injury, it wasn't exactly Martinez 'no knees' Maravilla territory. I just did not see any detriment in Pacquiao that gives credence to an injury is why he lost even though he thought he 'won the fight because he ran'. Imagine if Floyd did that, showed no class after the bell, didn't thank god like he always does (who would deliver him into his hands) and then constantly goes on about a shoulder injury with Bob Arum/Koncz whispering answers at the press conference.

Edited May 3, 2015 by RandallFlagg

[ZoSoRose]

Dont care about boxing but too bad some bum woman beater won

[Len Cnut]

In a nutshell a bunch of non-fans tuned in to watch what they thought was the rich arrogant black geezer get hammered by the goodly Christian kind hearted Manny Pacquiao from the rice paddies of the Phillipines, a symbol of all that is good and just in the human condition against all that is considered excessive, vulgar and puerile about the modern world...and the latter won...with ease. And now a bunch of panties are twisted, awwwww

[Bono]

Mayweather is NOT a fighter. End of story. He's a point grubber. Nobody will ever view him as the greatest or even close to it because he does not FIGHT. He's all about points and every fucking fight he wins his opponents look like they haven't even stepped in the ring. That's why most people don't like Mayweather. Now if he demolished guys while outscoring them fine but he doesn't. Anyone who thinsk he does is delusional. I mean to say he won with ease is so misleading. Yes he outscored Manny easily but to say he won the FIGHT is pretty funny. Manny wasn't hurt ever. In fact the fighter who was in the most trouble at any one point in the fight was Mayweather so....... Yippie! Big fucking deal. NONE of the greats ever shouted from the roof tops about how amazing they were because they out pointed a guy. The greats shouted it because they beat down their opponents convincingly. Mayweather not so much.

[Len Cnut]

Mayweather is NOT a fighter. End of story.

No, he's a boxer.

Nobody will ever view him as the greatest or even close to it because he does not FIGHT.

5 division world champion, defeated every world champion they put in front of him, dominating the sport since 1997, 48-0 undefeated, yeah, i think he's close to the greats. Fuck 'i think', he just is, sorry if that troubles you but you can't argue against facts.

He's all about points and every fucking fight he wins his opponents look like they haven't even stepped in the ring.

What you mean like Emmanuel Burton didn't have a mark on him? Or Arturo Gatti? Or Diego Corrales? Or Ricky Hatton?

Now if he demolished guys while outscoring them fine but he doesn't. Anyone who thinsk he does is delusional. I mean to say he won with ease is so misleading. Yes he outscored Manny easily but to say he won the FIGHT is pretty funny.

How is it do you think fights are won? What, all by knockout? No, you win either by knockout, or by points or by disqualification. If you outscore a person easily then you win the fight...easily. Would you like perhaps a manual to Marquis of Queensberry rules and what is expected of a boxer to win a fight because i think you're having trouble with some of the principles therein.

Manny wasn't hurt ever

Any number of fighters that lost fights weren't hurt in the sense of being troubled to the point of approaching knockout, whats your point?

NONE of the greats ever shouted from the roof tops about how amazing they were because they out pointed a guy.

Sorry, was someone shouting from rooftops?

The greats shouted it because they beat down their opponents convincingly.

Name me the boxer that consistently beat people down convincingly in his late 30s. Most people Mayweathers age are retired, having suffered losses and diminishing skill set...and yet there's Mayweather easily defeating the greatest other fighter of his generation...and what, you're peeved because he didn't or couldn't beat his brains out for you?

He just won the biggest fight in 20 years and he's not supposed to celebrate cuz he done it on points...says who? D'ya think Manny would've not celebrated if he had won by points, do you think people like you would not having been waiting there with baited breath to cane the shit out of a spirited Mayweather who turned up to go toe to toe but ultimately lost? Bullshit, you would've given him the verbal shagging on his life and he would've NEVER been allowed to forget it, no one would've gone 'oh good ol' Mayweather, least he turned up to fight', it would've been 'so whoose TBE now, dickhead?'...so why should he not celebrate?

For 5 years now people have been dangling this Manny thing in front of him, saying his legacy could not be mentioned among the greats if he didn't deal with Manny...and now he has, with ease...pissed all over him quite frankly and he still doesn't get the respect.

Nevermind though eh? I hear here done alright out of it, all told.

Edited May 3, 2015 by Len B'stard

[DieselDaisy]

Memories of Liston/Clay I although, If the Nevada state had checked out the shoulder two weeks prior, I suppose there must be some truth in it.

[Len Cnut]

Shoulder my fuckin' arse he just got done, like anyone that was blagging themselves could see a mile off.

The guy wins and he wins with ease, within the rules of boxing, puts on a masterclass really. I mean i dunno what it is about peoples perception that it isn't registering what an immense thing it is to handle an opponent the calibre of Manny the way he did. Like i said before the fight, domination, controlled, perfectly executed fight.

[DieselDaisy]

To me honest I was more impressed with that Ukraine kid with the 3-1 record and a belt: super fast accurate combos. Mayweather would have been destroyed if he lived in any other era but this one.

[Bono]

haha the desperate breakdown of my post is hilarious. It's liek watching Axl Rose fans freak out when someone says something negative about the almighty. It's painfully obvious what i said is true. Mayweather is NOT exciting, he never tries to go for a finish, he plays defence and counters with fluff. That's why nobody likes him, that's why he will never be considerd one of the greatest despite his titles. All his fights are hype and he fails to deliver every time other than a nice looking scorecard. Other boxers have been fighters. Skilled guys who can also finish. Mayweather? Meh. Most boring and uninteresting champ of all time.

As for him dealing with Manny he fucking ducked him for years until Manny was clearly out of his prime. The only reason Mayweather took the fight was because he knew if he didn't it would taint his legacy. Still his legacy sucks compared to the all time greats. I'm not arguing he isn't a great technical boxer because he is but the fact is he's the least interesting, least exciting, most underwheling champ ever. His fans have a hard time accepting that.

Also caling his style of fighting dominating is laughable. If you seriously think he "dominated" Manny I don't know what to say.

[Len Cnut]

To me honest I was more impressed with that Ukraine kid with the 3-1 record and a belt: super fast accurate combos. Mayweather would have been destroyed if he lived in any other era but this one.

And this people is the only way that we'll see Mayweather lose, by way of these fights that happen in our imaginations between Money and Tommy Hearns or Ray Leonard etc

BTW, it might be worth your while to have a looksee at the sort of successes that they were having when they were 38. If i recall Ray wasn't far from that age when Hector Camacho dealt with him in a fight that everyone agreed should be stricken from the record cuz Ray was too old and it shouldn't be counted cuz he wasn't in his prime.

And Tommy Hearns, who got beat in his career by the likes of Iran Barkley, an ex Nigel Benn victim.

[DieselDaisy]

I suppose Mayweather's problem is, it is an unappealing style. It looks cagey and tentative to the viewer - a bit sneaky also. People prefer aggressive punchers or artistic boxers. Those two styles are what people desire from their boxers. The Archie Moore defensive stuff is not really that appealing.

[Len Cnut]

haha the desperate breakdown of my post is hilarious. It's liek watching Axl Rose fans freak out when someone says something negative about the almighty. It's painfully obvious what i said is true.

No, it's absolutely obvious that you know exactly nothing about boxing and make wild inaccurate statements of which, when i question you on them and bring up instances where it's not true you just don't address them and just make wild broad sweeping general comments, feeding off your emotions and making very little sense at all. This is nothing like watching an Axl Rose fan freak out because i think Mayweather is a massive cunt...but that does not change his record and it does not change the fact you don't know what you are talking about...at all.

You made a point about Mayweather opponents not getting hurt and Mayweather not dominating, i cited specific instances where he did. SPECIFIC instances. Gatti, Corrales, Ricky Hatton, i can name you more too. What you gonna say, they were shit, Gatti was shit was he? You say you like a brawl, go check out Gatti vs Ward. You know what he did to Gatti don't you? He beat Gatti to where his corner wouldn't let him off the stool. He was crying onto Buddy McGirts shoulder cuz he'd been embarassed.

Corrales was an undefeated knockout artist when he fought Floyd, people wondered how he'd deal with his power, Floyd knocked him down like 3 times and beat him to where his corner threw in the towel.

So why is it when you say shit that is false and i point out specifically and categorically where you're wrong you liken it some blind fan of a rock band defending the undefendable? This is just your MO though, make broad sweeping statements that are total bullshit, get checked on em and then go 'HAHAHAHAHAHA, look at you talking out of your arse', it just doesn't work that way fella, if you know what you are talking about you are welcome to dispute any comment I've made. But you can't and won't cuz you're wrong and you take it upon yourself to comment about things you have zero knowledge of and then act all pointlessly smug when you've been proved wrong.

Mayweather is NOT exciting, he never tries to go for a finish, he plays defence and counters with fluff.

Again, would you like me to run through all the the fighters he knocked out? All of the fighters he pitched a shut out against? Or are you just gonna keep talking out of your arse?

he never tries to go for a finish, he plays defence and counters with fluff.

You don't have to go for a finish, you have to win. Defence is a key aspect of a successful boxer and as far as countering with fluff, well if it must be some pretty hardcore fluff to hold off someone like Manny Pacquiao. Or Diego Corrales. Or Juan Manuel Marquez. Or Ricky Hatton. Or Shane Moseley. Or Oscar De La Hoya. Or Gennaro Hernandez. Or Emmanuel Burton.

See this? This is called facts, real instances, real actual fights that happened...that you know nothing about because you don't know shit about the topic of which you speak (i sound like Roger Mayweather ).

All his fights are hype and he fails to deliver every time other than a nice looking scorecard.

Thats all it really needs really, a nice looking scorecard.

As for him dealing with Manny he fucking ducked him for years until Manny was clearly out of his prime.

Manny Pacquiao refused a 50 50 split with Mayweather on the basis of random drug testing...then agrees 5 years later to random drug testing after having been planked by Dinamita Marquez and ends up taking a shitload less than a 50 50 split...5 years later. Now if Manny Pacquiao is not very intelligent thats not Floyd Mayweathers fault but it does beg the question why someone would refuse random drug testing.

And if Manny is out of his prime and he's 2 years younger than Mayweather then what does that make Mayweather?

The only reason Mayweather took the fight was because he knew if he didn't it would taint his legacy.

And dominated him. Handily. The guy everyone said had his number. The guy everyone said he couldn't run from cuz he had rapid fire combinations. Good weren't they, them combinations? Really had Mayweather in the deep end eh? To paraphrase my man Roy Jones Floyd beat Manny so easy he could've been playing checkers on the other side

Still his legacy sucks compared to the all time greats.

48-0, 5 division world champion....legacy sucks. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

I'm not arguing he isn't a great technical boxer because he is

Cuz you can't argue it cuz it's the reason why he's great.

Also caling his style of fighting dominating is laughable. If you seriously think he "dominated" Manny I don't know what to say.

Again, learn something about boxing and then get back to me, when you shut a guy out on points 9 rounds to 3 that is domination. If you think dominating in the boxing vernacular meant he sat on his chest for 12 rounds repetitively tapping his forehead or that it meant the fight was a massacre then I kinda understand why you spend so much time in a room on your own laughing at a computer screen.

I suppose Mayweather's problem is, it is an unappealing style. It looks cagey and tentative to the viewer - a bit sneaky also. People prefer aggressive punchers or artistic boxers. Those two styles are what people desire from their boxers. The Archie Moore defensive stuff is not really that appealing.

Archie was still an all time great though, although probably a fluff punching bum according to Bonzo Jim Duggan up there

Edited May 3, 2015 by Len B'stard

[Bono]

This is the fight in a nutshell. Enjoy.

[DieselDaisy]

Do you still want boxing to appeal to more laymen Len haha? As I said, Johnny come latelies. Same thing happened with cricket in England during the 2005 Ashes.

[Len Cnut]

This is the fight in a nutshell. Enjoy.

Meanwhile, back on planet earth, 9 rounds to 3, domination

Do you still want boxing to appeal to more laymen Len haha? As I said, Johnny come latelies. Same thing happened with cricket in England during the 2005 Ashes.

Definitely, its just Bono being Bono, bless him

[DieselDaisy]

I thought he was just genuinely slipping rather than hugging. Yes he knows how to tie a man up but it was hardly Evander Holyfield. He was slipping and moving out of the way and using his ring work - and a bit of holding but not what that video game suggests.

[Bono]

I'd have more respect for the guy if he fucking pushed the pace. He doesn't,. For fuck sakes unless Manny or anyone goes after him he won't engage. It's fucking hilarious that you think he dominated. he simply won on the scorecard. And yeah yeah blah blah blah tha's what it's all about I know you think it's a patty cake contest or soemthing. I've seen guys win on the score card but actualy dominate. there's a big fucking difference. Clearly you don't know the difference.

I love that just because you don't post in this thread day and night people think you're just a johnny come lately. I don't post in the MMA thread often either but still watch the sport all the time. I don't post in the work out thread either so I guess if I started posting in there people would tell me to learn something about working out haha. I guess unless you love Mayweather and think he's the greatest you don't know anything about boxing haha. Ok fellas keep defending your boy and scratching your head why millions of others, boxing fans included don't like the guy's style and think he's a bitch fighter.

Edited May 3, 2015 by Bono

[DieselDaisy]

There is no doubt that Mayweather completely dominated the match. Pacquiao could not fight his fight. Floyd used his jab, slipped everything and finished strongly in every round. It was almost like watching Olympic boxing where everything is point based and about finishing well. Where I differ with Len is I think Manny's work rate could have been higher. The fact he won three rounds employing a more aggressive tactic suggests he hypothetically could have beaten Floyd if he employed that for the duration of the match. He looked tentative. There were about five chances during the match when he seemed to hold back - this was very obvious to me. I am not sure what his corner were saying to him either?

[Iron MikeyJ]

Len, I agree with you as well as the nay sayers. Is Floyd an all time great? Yes, I think he had earned that right. Is he boring as Hell to watch fight? Yes he is. He is great at what he does, but the problem is what he is great at isn't all that impressive. I'm not saying it isn't impressive to be a great defensive fighter, because that is impressive imo. But he uses the rules of boxing in order to do just enough to win. As I said last night, he doesn't want to beat the other fighter, he just wants to win the fight. That's a major difference. All the old greats wanted to actually beat the man they were fighting, that's why people are disappointed with him. Just doing enough to win, is all he wants to do. Which at the end of the day, he still wins, so you have to respect that about him.

I read an absolutely spot on article today that compared Floyd to a basketball team that shoots 95% from the free throw line and always finds ways to get to the line. So basically they are winning by shooting to free throws a game and playing defense. Yes they still won, so you have to give them credit, but they also played the most boring game ever to watch. I know basketball isn't very popular over there, so let me say it's like a soccer team that scores 1 quick goal every game, then just plays keep away the rest of the game and is always winning 1-0. Yea they won, but if they would have tried more than perhaps they could have scored more goals, but instead were happy with their 1-0 victory. That has been Floyd's entire career in a nutshell. He could have done more, he has the ability to be a good if not great offensive fighter, but he chooses not to. He is happy to do just enough to win. That's not the Tyson way, or Ali way, or Sugar Ray way. Its effective yes, and within the rules, but not what I like in fighters.

Having said all of that, Floyd has to be in the conversation for greatest welterweight of all time. Is he #1? No. But I do think last night ensured he is top 5. Just like Marciano isn't considered the greatest, but most do out him in the top 5.

[Len Cnut]

I'd have more respect for the guy if he fucking pushed the pace. He doesn't,. For fuck sakes unless Manny or anyone goes after him he won't engage. It's fucking hilarious that you think he dominated. he simply won on the scorecard. And yeah yeah blah blah blah tha's what it's all about I know you think it's a patty cake contest or soemthing. I've seen guys win on the score card but actualy dominate. there's a big fucking difference. Clearly you don't know the difference.

*sigh*

This is just getting tedious, again, i don't know how many ways i can say this til it gets through to you, 9 rounds to 3 IS domination. Now if in your mind domination means its got to 9 rounds to 3 or more with some serious pounding going on in those 9 rounds or more then I'm sorry but i am not responsible for that presumption. This isn't rock band criticism, it isn't about interpretation, it isn't subjective, there are factual rules to this shit and when you beat someone 9 rounds to 3, that is referred to as domination and it has been for as far back as you wanna go in the sport. The fact that you can't reconcile yourself to this fact is not really my problem.

I love that just because you don't post in this thread day and night people think you're just a johnny come lately.

Y'don't reckon the avalanche of bullshit you posted in the last hour or so on this thread had anything to do with it, do you? Or the fact that you immediately evasive every time someone brings you up on the specifics of your claims?

I guess unless you love Mayweather and think he's the greatest you don't know anything about boxing haha. Ok fellas keep defending your boy

Again, more presumption on your part, you can scroll through this thread and find me, NUMEROUS occasions, absolutely tearing Mayweather to shreds. Even in regards to this fight I'm on record here saying that i would LOVE Manny Pacqiauo to stretch him out and i think that he's an uneducated and profoundly ignorant moron.

HOWEVER, the difference between me and you is not liking someone doesn't make me throw a girlie fit and start making shit up and saying wild random bullshit that makes absolutely no sense. I will not and do not allow my emotions to cloud my judgements about an obvious reality. I was supporting no one in this fight in the sense of being a fan because neither of them provoke the kind of emotion in me that an Ali or a Ray Robinson or a Henry Armstrong or a Ray Leonard does, something I'm again on record saying a few pages earlier when ChristmasFanatic asked me who i was rooting for.

This idea that I'm making the points I'm making out of some kind of attachment to Mayweather is absolutely false and kinda defines the difference between my approach and your approach, my approach is a sober and rationale assessment of the reality of a boxing contest, your approach is a 'this is my side and thats your side and I'm having a bitch fit because my side didn't make it' kinda thing.

I don't have no interest in 'supporting' Manny Pacquiao OR Floyd Mayweather, neither of them pay my bills or mean shit to me other than 2 people that i enjoy watching participate in 12 round boxing contests, i have absolutely no emotional attachment to either of them. Perhaps thats why i can assess these things soberly and rationally and you can't.

Len, I agree with you as well as the nay sayers. Is Floyd an all time great? Yes, I think he had earned that right. Is he boring as Hell to watch fight? Yes he is. He is great at what he does, but the problem is what he is great at isn't all that impressive. I'm not saying it isn't impressive to be a great defensive fighter, because that is impressive imo. But he uses the rules of boxing in order to do just enough to win. As I said last night, he doesn't want to beat the other fighter, he just wants to win the fight. That's a major difference. All the old greats wanted to actually beat the man they were fighting, that's why people are disappointed with him. Just doing enough to win, is all he wants to do. Which at the end of the day, he still wins, so you have to respect that about him.

I read an absolutely spot on article today that compared Floyd to a basketball team that shoots 95% from the free throw line and always finds ways to get to the line. So basically they are winning by shooting to free throws a game and playing defense. Yes they still won, so you have to give them credit, but they also played the most boring game ever to watch. I know basketball isn't very popular over there, so let me say it's like a soccer team that scores 1 quick goal every game, then just plays keep away the rest of the game and is always winning 1-0. Yea they won, but if they would have tried more than perhaps they could have scored more goals, but instead were happy with their 1-0 victory. That has been Floyd's entire career in a nutshell. He could have done more, he has the ability to be a good if not great offensive fighter, but he chooses not to. He is happy to do just enough to win. That's not the Tyson way, or Ali way, or Sugar Ray way. Its effective yes, and within the rules, but not what I like in fighters.

Having said all of that, Floyd has to be in the conversation for greatest welterweight of all time. Is he #1? No. But I do think last night ensured he is top 5. Just like Marciano isn't considered the greatest, but most do out him in the top 5.

I agree with EVERY word of this post, thank you. I agree that thats the reason people are disappointed with him and I'd be lying through my teeth if i said i wouldn't've loved to've seen a finish to that fight in the way you described, to beat the man. But there's a huge leap from there to what Bono is saying.

If you were to ask my opinion i don't even think of him in a top ten of all time greats. But that doesn't make him any less a great fighter.

[J Dog]

As bad as I hate to say it since I don't like the guy or his style of boxing, Floyd is catching too much shit from everywhere. I don't mean here really, I haven't read all the comments, but from everywhere in general. Yeah he did his dancing and hugging like always, but he tagged Manny pretty good in damn near every round. Besides those few times when Manny got him in the corner and let loose, he really couldn't do much else. I was actually surprised at how aggressive(if you call it that) Floyd was in those first few rounds.

[Lithium]

I don't post in the work out thread either so I guess if I started posting in there people would tell me to learn something about working out haha.

What do you squat, brah?

[Len Cnut]

As bad as I hate to say it since I don't like the guy or his style of boxing, Floyd is catching too much shit from everywhere. I don't mean here really, I haven't read all the comments, but from everywhere in general. Yeah he did his dancing and hugging like always, but he tagged Manny pretty good in damn near every round. Besides those few times when Manny got him in the corner and let loose, he really couldn't do much else. I was actually surprised at how aggressive(if you call it that) Floyd was in those first few rounds.

Thing is though, in his recent fights, he hasn't been moving a lot. Roach was saying his legs were shot and he couldn't move as well as he used to. Proved that wrong, didn't he?

Floyd is so crafty and so talented that he does things that are cheating that he does in a way that makes them not cheating. For example, Floyd ALWAYS uses his elbow to push fighters off but the ref can never say anything because the way he does it is so slick and that way basically is that he can tell when a fighter is coming in for a clinch so he raised his arms in that Ken Norton style right at the point when the guy locks him in a clinch, thus positioning his elbows right by the guys chest so he can push him off from there...but the ref can't say shit because the only reason his elbow is touching the other guy cuz the other guy clinched him.

If you fighter in a strict rhythm (which all but the very very very elite fighters do) Floyd will suss it out and he will pick you apart and thats the thing with Manny. Everyone talked about his lateral movement, his feinting, all that shit but the fact is he ALWAYS does that shit from out of range so it's not effective, he'll then either leap in from out of range having seen an angle (won't work with Floyd cuz you'll just leap into a counter) or he'll have to get in front of him and get set and once again, same result, Floyd sees it coming.

Along with gameplans come patterns, patterns in footwork, in your lateral movement, in angles you throw from....a top top top level fighter will work these out and pick you apart. THAT is what seperates Floyd from just about everyone else in this generation of fighters.

The genius of Floyd Mayweather is that he doesn't fight in one set pattern, sometimes he circles away...then he'll go centre of the ring, then'll he'll put the shoulder out and try and walk you down...and he'll keep switching these patterns throughout the fight, based on his judgement of what is required at any given moment...it's genius because it makes him impossible to figure out....Ali was like that.

Fighters like Manny have to plant their feet for power punches...so how do you avoid that? keep stepping and hitting, make him follow you, when he's following you he's constantly walking after you so you set up, pop pop...and then move again. This isn't the first time this has happened to Manny, Tim Bradley (though that fight was a crock of shit) did a similar thing and similarly frustrated him, trouble was Bradley didn't have the reflexes of a Floyd to evade his punches for the full 12.

I mean everyone had to've known, watching Pacquiao struggle to put away the likes of Chris Algieri that if he can't catch that big lumbering idiot he's not gonna have much joy with a Floyd Mayweather.

It's just dominant genius boxing and if you're someone who has an interest in the technical aspects of boxing i just can't fathom how you can find it not seriously impressive.

Edited May 3, 2015 by Len B'stard