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1 minute ago, SoulMonster said:

I agree with right wing politicians on specific cases and left wing politicians on other cases. It's all about issues and not about any blind allegiance to any political sides. Brexit is a moronic idea. So is Trump. 

Proves my point really. You are incapable of understanding their point of view, or respecting their point of view. A political spectrum which consists of samey centre-left stuff would not equip you with a knowledge or acquaintance with the reasoning behind espousing conservatism. 

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2 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Proves my point really. You are incapable of understanding their point of view, or respecting their point of view. A political spectrum which consists of samey centre-left stuff would not equip you with a knowledge or acquaintance with the reasoning behind espousing conservatism. 

The fact that I think Brexit is a moronic idea and so is Trump, "proves your point" that I am not familiar with right wing politics? Okay :lol:

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Just now, SoulMonster said:

The fact that I think Brexit is a moronic idea and so is Trump, "proves your point" that I am not familiar with right wing politics? Okay :lol:

I would neither describe 'moronic' as a particular knowledgeable nor empathetic attempt to describe a political position you oppose, although I have heard worse! 

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3 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

I would neither describe 'moronic' as a particular knowledgeable nor empathetic attempt to describe a political position you oppose, although I have heard worse! 

Neither would I, but I wasn't aware you wanted me to summarize why I am opposed to Brexit and Trump, something I have done numerous times in other discussions. Where you have replied. So you should be familiar with it. Alcohol-induced amnesia?

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6 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Neither would I, but I wasn't aware you wanted me to summarize why I am opposed to Brexit and Trump, something I have done numerous times in other discussions. Where you have replied. So you should be familiar with it. Alcohol-induced amnesia?

So Norway's two main parties are a Conservative Party who are ''liberal'' and ''pro-European'', and a Labour party who bases its policies on Tony Blair. These are identikit parties. Basically your entire political spectrum consists of gigantic servings of Blairism. This will not equip you with the tools to understanding and emphasising with most other countries who have a broader political spectrum.

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4 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

So Norway's two main parties are a Conservative Party who are ''liberal'' and ''pro-European'', and a Labour party who bases its policies on Tony Blair. These are identikit parties. Basically your entire political spectrum consists of gigantic servings of Blairism. This will not equip you with the tools to understanding and emphasising with most other countries who have a broader political spectrum.

Heh. What makes you think I don't emphatize with other countries? I disagree with people who think Brexit is the best option for Britain, and people who think Trump is the best option for USA. It almost seems like you are arguing that you have to be steeped in a right-wing environment to get the brilliance of all their policies, like the only way to agree with Brexit and Trump is through brainwashing :lol:

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According to Washington Post Reporter Bob Woodward (the guy helped break the Watergate Scandal), Trump was fully aware of how serious and deadly COVID-19 is back in January, but chose to downplay the seriousness of it publicly so as to not create a panic:

“You just breathe the air and that’s how it’s passed,” Trump said in a Feb. 7 call. “And so that’s a very tricky one. That’s a very delicate one. It’s also more deadly than even your strenuous flu.”

“This is deadly stuff,” the president repeated for emphasis.

At that time, Trump was telling the nation that the virus was no worse than a seasonal flu, predicting it would soon disappear, and insisting that the U.S. government had it totally under control. It would be several weeks before he would publicly acknowledge that the virus was no ordinary flu and that it could be transmitted through the air.

Trump admitted to Woodward on March 19 that he deliberately minimized the danger. “I wanted to always play it down,” the president said.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/bob-woodward-rage-book-trump/2020/09/09/0368fe3c-efd2-11ea-b4bc-3a2098fc73d4_story.html

 

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Just now, SoulMonster said:

Heh. What makes you think I don't emphatize with other countries? I disagree with people who think Brexit is the best option for Britain, and people who think Trump is the best option for USA. It almost seems like you are arguing that you have to be steeped in a right-wing environment to get the brilliance of all their policies, like the only way to agree with Brexit and Trump is through brainwashing :lol:

More than a passing acquaintance of Conservatism and the type of voters who'd vote for it would equip you with greater understanding and sympathy whilst not necessarily agreeing with it. Heck, I could equally argue about a left-wing also - Britain had Corbyn in charge of our shadow cabinet a few months ago!! In contrast, your Labour sounds as if Blair, Macron and Trudeau have had a threesome and spawned a metrosexual lefty-centrist love child.

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19 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Proves my point really. You are incapable of understanding their point of view, or respecting their point of view. A political spectrum which consists of samey centre-left stuff would not equip you with a knowledge or acquaintance with the reasoning behind espousing conservatism. 

Totally anecdotal to me specifically, but I feel that even in the US, people don't try to come to reason with what others' positions come from. My friends and family all have their own differing beliefs (obviously), but always seem to ascribe intention to those they don't agree with. I try to (though don't always) look at things from the differing perspective, or at least think back on a conversation I've had with someone about to see where they were coming from. I find it very tiring talking with some people because they don't ever try to see the "other sides'" perspective. Not pointing fingers at anyone here, just wanted to agree with the thought that it's often difficult for some people to put themselves in others positions, if only to come to a better realization of where their specific beliefs may stem from.

I think abortion is a good example of this:

From a "pro-life" person's perspective, they're trying to push for personal responsibility and preservation of what they believe is a human life. They also tend to think that a "pro-choice" person doesn't care at all (though sometimes probably true) about the life of a fetus, and are making a completely selfish decision and end their evaluation there.

From a "pro-choice" person's perspective, they're about body autonomy for the mother  and want women to have the option available to choose for themselves. I think they also tend to think it's "pro-life" people (often men) trying to control women's bodies and decisions, and end their evaluation there.

Abortion, of course is a very heated issue, with many potential nuances beyond these admittedly very simple explanations, but i'm just using the example to shed light on the previous point.

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2 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

More than a passing acquaintance of Conservatism and the type of voters who'd vote for it would equip you with greater understanding and sympathy whilst not necessarily agreeing with it. Heck, I could equally argue about a left-wing also - Britain had Corbyn in charge of our shadow cabinet a few months ago!! In contrast, your Labour sounds as if Blair, Macron and Trudeau have had a threesome and spawned a metrosexual lefty-centrist love child.

Since your posts are becoming less and less sensible, let's end the discussion of SM's political views here and return to the topic at hand.

Thanks.

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13 hours ago, Ace Nova said:

No idea...just popped up on my Twitter feed earlier. 

Perhaps the location (the White House) of where the formal treating signing is news.

I do agree that the deal is a serious foreign policy win for the Trump administration.  This will have reverberations for the region for decades to come and helps to undermine Iran's efforts.  

Trump is still a shit President, but he gets credit for this.  

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Just now, DieselDaisy said:

More than a passing acquaintance of Conservatism and the type of voters who'd vote for it would equip you with greater understanding and sympathy whilst not necessarily agreeing with it. 

I already understand fully well that Brexit and Trump are moronic ideas. And I have already, on at least two occasions, expressed sympathy for the people who were misled and lied to re: Brexit. As for sympathy for Trump voters...that's harder! But USA is fucked and it is a systemic collapse in education, equality, trust in the democratic system, etc., which results in people don't giving a fuck who they vote or actually thinking Trump is the right answer. It is not their fault they are victims to decades-long distortion of society and attrition of the relationship between citizens and politicians. So yeah, I feel some sympathy for them, too. Except all those who think Trump is a good man.

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2 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

I already understand fully well that Brexit and Trump are moronic ideas. And I have already, on at least two occasions, expressed sympathy for the people who were misled and lied to re: Brexit. As for sympathy for Trump voters...that's harder! But USA is fucked and it is a systemic collapse in education, equality, trust in the democratic system, etc., which results in people don't giving a fuck who they vote or actually thinking Trump is the right answer. It is not their fault they are victims to decades-long distortion of society and attrition of the relationship between citizens and politicians. So yeah, I feel some sympathy for them, too. Except all those who think Trump is a good man.

You have just proven my point. ''Misled and lied to'', not ''giving a fuck...victims to...distortion''. Can you not entertain the theory, even slightly, that perhaps they just have a different political view from you? 

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8 minutes ago, Swampfox said:

I agree.  Let's get back to Trump being the front runner for the Nobel Peace Prize.  Is anyone else even close?

You actually made me laugh here.  Congrats!

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This I can’t make sense of:

Why is the Trump campaign spending money in Georgia and North Carolina this week but not in Arizona, Ohio, or Pennsylvania?  Do they think those three states are in the bag or is it a money issue? 

Really strange. 

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2 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

We have one political party, Fremskrittspartiet (FRP), where politicians leaning to the far right tend to aggregate. That being said, what we consider far-right is probably still a bit left of the GOP ;)

Maybe being a member/part of the Norwegian model of government could hamper his abilities to pass conservative laws, etc....but in terms of ideology, having a populist, "anti-immigration" ideology is about as far-right as you can go...it's akin to "Trump's base" imo.

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34 minutes ago, Ace Nova said:

Maybe being a member/part of the Norwegian model of government could hamper his abilities to pass conservative laws, etc....but in terms of ideology, having a populist, "anti-immigration" ideology is about as far-right as you can go...it's akin to "Trump's base" imo.

What hampers his from passing conservative laws isn't our "model of government", but lack of sufficient support in the population. People just don't vote for his party enough, or for him personally. 

Anti-immigration sure is a common right-wing position these days, but there is much more to traditional right wing politics than being against immigration.

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2 hours ago, downzy said:

According to Washington Post Reporter Bob Woodward (the guy helped break the Watergate Scandal), Trump was fully aware of how serious and deadly COVID-19 is back in January, but chose to downplay the seriousness of it publicly so as to not create a panic:

“You just breathe the air and that’s how it’s passed,” Trump said in a Feb. 7 call. “And so that’s a very tricky one. That’s a very delicate one. It’s also more deadly than even your strenuous flu.”

“This is deadly stuff,” the president repeated for emphasis.

At that time, Trump was telling the nation that the virus was no worse than a seasonal flu, predicting it would soon disappear, and insisting that the U.S. government had it totally under control. It would be several weeks before he would publicly acknowledge that the virus was no ordinary flu and that it could be transmitted through the air.

Trump admitted to Woodward on March 19 that he deliberately minimized the danger. “I wanted to always play it down,” the president said.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/bob-woodward-rage-book-trump/2020/09/09/0368fe3c-efd2-11ea-b4bc-3a2098fc73d4_story.html

 

Yeah I saw that as well. Sure Trump knew. You bet Dr. Fauci told him 100 times that COVID-19 was a very serious issue. But he kept downplaying the pandemic because of the economy. In fact he did worst than just downplaying it. He came up with bullshit like drinking bleach. And he was/is strongly against wearing the mask and social distance.

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25 minutes ago, Padme said:

Yeah I saw that as well. Sure Trump knew. You bet Dr. Fauci told him 100 times that COVID-19 was a very serious issue. But he kept downplaying the pandemic because of the economy. In fact he did worst than just downplaying it. He came up with bullshit like drinking bleach. And he was/is strongly against wearing the mask and social distance.

Really?  Fauci was saying wearing a mask wasn't necessary back in January then changed his tune.

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5 minutes ago, Swampfox said:

Really?  Fauci was saying wearing a mask wasn't necessary back in January then changed his tune.

Because masks at the time weren't confirmed to be a suitable or viable method to lessen the spread of the virus.  Also, there was a shortage of them, and Fauci's priority was to ensure medical professionals and first responders had first access to them.  

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