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Donald Trump just grabbed America by the pussy

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1 hour ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

I would like to hear people defend this WITHOUT mentioning Trump's name, because he has NOTHING to do with these blatant lies. But of course Trump is the "big bad lier."

 

This would be a bizarre and pointless exercise because we have to weigh Biden in comparison to Trump given that they're the two candidates...

we are supposed to place Biden in a vacuum without Trump while this was posted by the Trump campaign, lol.

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8 minutes ago, Jakey Styley said:

This would be a bizarre and pointless exercise because we have to weigh Biden in comparison to Trump given that they're the two candidates...

we are supposed to place Biden in a vacuum without Trump while this was posted by the Trump campaign, lol.

Because it doesn't matter who posted the video. Its the content that should be the focus, anything else is a distraction from the point. 

I bring this up for the following reasons, first and foremost, it CLEARLY shows that Biden will say and do anything to get elected. It was true then, and I'm sure it is true now. It also gives a glimpse into the quality of his character. Finally, it is interesting that none of the liberal news media has asked him about any of this. Im not saying it should be used to beat him over the head with, but it deserves to be brought up at least once in an honest interview. He should also be asked "why did he do it to begin with." These are honest questions imo. 

Look, I'm not saying that Trump is honest Abe either, but the left likes to call him a liar at every turn. Shouldn't their candidate be held to the same standard?

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3 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

Because it doesn't matter who posted the video. Its the content that should be the focus, anything else is a distraction from the point. 

I bring this up for the following reasons, first and foremost, it CLEARLY shows that Biden will say and do anything to get elected. It was true then, and I'm sure it is true now. It also gives a glimpse into the quality of his character. Finally, it is interesting that none of the liberal news media has asked him about any of this. Im not saying it should be used to beat him over the head with, but it deserves to be brought up at least once in an honest interview. He should also be asked "why did he do it to begin with." These are honest questions imo. 

Look, I'm not saying that Trump is honest Abe either, but the left likes to call him a liar at every turn. Shouldn't their candidate be held to the same standard?

Of course it matters who posted the video you ignoramus. Who created the video and what is the purpose of its existence? 

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Let me also add that, YES the Trump campaign posted it. But it's FULL of actual media coverage from the time of the incidents (yes multiple incidents). 

Just now, Dazey said:

Of course it matters who posted the video you ignoramus. Who created the video and what is the purpose of its existence? 

Clearly you didn't watch the video, did you. Because, truth be told it was "created" by ABC, CBS, NBC and possibly others back in the 80s.

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Just now, Iron MikeyJ said:

Because it doesn't matter who posted the video. Its the content that should be the focus, anything else is a distraction from the point. 

I bring this up for two reasons, first and foremost, it CLEARLY shows that Biden will say and do anything to get elected. It was true then, and I'm sure it is true now. It also gives a glimpse into the quality of his character. Finally, it is interesting that none of the liberal news media has asked him about any of this. Im not saying it should be used to beat him over the head with, but it deserves to be brought up at least once in an honest interview. He should also be asked "why did he do it to begin with." These are honest questions imo. 

Look, I'm not saying that Trump is honest Abe either, but the left likes to call him a liar at every turn. Shouldn't their candidate be held to the same standard?

I largely agree that most of the media is not going to ask Biden tough questions. I would say that this particular question is probably not being asked because it seems very insignificant having decades behind us, but you are correct that they really won't even ask him the more relevant and recent tough questions that they could ask. Maybe we'll see it come debate time.

 

I still think it's useless to do what you're describing. Politics is always a series of choices, and especially in America, often between two that you don't like. If we were to weigh each politician in a vacuum, COMPLETELY void of comparison to the other candidate, then most of us would probably never vote! Because they all have some quality or qualities that suck. There is actually no point in judging Biden's honesty unless it's in comparison to Trump. We only care about them because they are running for office against each other.

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2 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

Let me also add that, YES the Trump campaign posted it. But it's FULL of actual media coverage from the time of the incidents (yes multiple incidents). 

Clearly you didn't watch the video, did you. Because, truth be told it was "created" by ABC, CBS, NBC and possibly others back in the 80s.

The individual clips were created by the networks. Who edited them together and released the video? Also it’s interesting that they had to go back 32 years to find the material. You could make 20 such videos with lies Trump has told in the last month. 

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1 minute ago, Jakey Styley said:

I largely agree that most of the media is not going to ask Biden tough questions. I would say that this particular question is probably not being asked because it seems very insignificant having decades behind us, but you are correct that they really won't even ask him the more relevant and recent tough questions that they could ask. Maybe we'll see it come debate time.

 

I still think it's useless to do what you're describing. Politics is always a series of choices, and especially in America, often between two that you don't like. If we were to weigh each politician in a vacuum, COMPLETELY void of comparison to the other candidate, then most of us would probably never vote! Because they all have some quality or qualities that suck. There is actually no point in judging Biden's honesty unless it's in comparison to Trump. We only care about them because they are running for office against each other.

I said "don't bring up Trump" because people will use Trump as way to side step the issue. I see a ton of things being posted here that are shots at Trump, which is fair. I just wanted to hear people discuss these issues. People that are true blue Biden supporters should be able to at least discuss this, even if Biden/ the media won't.

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Just now, Sosso said:

Neither Trump or Biden can save America. They are both representives of their old, bureucratic parties. 

I agree

2 minutes ago, Dazey said:

The individual clips were created by the networks. Who edited them together and released the video? Also it’s interesting that they had to go back 32 years to find the material. You could make 20 such videos with lies Trump has told in the last month. 

You have to admit they are some pretty bad lies though. 

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4 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

I agree

You have to admit they are some pretty bad lies though. 

He plagiarised a few speeches and lied about his college record. Am I missing something?

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5 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

That doesn't at least raise your eye brow?

32 years ago? He looked like a dick but this is why you have to look at the whole picture. The only reason this has been released is to make Biden look bad compared to Trump but if the accusation is that Biden is a liar and therefore unfit for the presidency you only need to look as far as the current occupant of the Oval Office to see that as far as lying is concerned he is many orders of magnitude worse than Biden has ever been. 

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25 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

 Look, I'm not saying that Trump is honest Abe either, but the left likes to call him a liar at every turn. Shouldn't their candidate be held to the same standard?

The left doesn’t like Biden at all.

But yes, the centre-conservative  politician, running for the centre-conservative dems should indeed be held to the same standards.

I don’t consume junk infotainment and call it news though. In my feeds both candidates are scrutinized equally. 

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2 hours ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

I would like to hear people defend this WITHOUT mentioning Trump's name, because he has NOTHING to do with these blatant lies. But of course Trump is the "big bad lier."

 

I would say first, what does this have to do with a new President that will be responsible for managing one of the largest health and economic crisis in 100 years?  Biden is guilty of exaggerating his academic history, something I would argue is quite common.  He's also guilty of paraphrasing the sentiments of another politician without credit.  Is that enough for you and others not to vote for him?  Maybe.  If so, there are many people running to vote for President.  Nobody is forced to vote for Biden. 

But if you're going to vote for Biden due to these two incidents of dishonesty, then you also have to disqualify voting for Trump as well.

Again, I'm not sure what the Trump campaign is trying to accomplish with this video.  If honesty and willingness to speak the truth one hundred percent of the time are the values needed to be President, doesn't that disqualify Trump?

 

 

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45 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

I bring this up for the following reasons, first and foremost, it CLEARLY shows that Biden will say and do anything to get elected.

No it doesn't.  

If that were true, you would think the Trump campaign could find more recent examples (say, not 30 years old) of Biden committing egregious lies.  But in his 50 years as an elected official, they focus on two incidents from 30 years ago.  

Moreover, Biden apologized for the remarks and has never repeated them again.  If he was willing to say anything to become President, he would have continued with the lies (gee, I wonder who does that?).  

48 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

It also gives a glimpse into the quality of his character.

So you've never exaggerated or misrepresented yourself?  Do you have evidence that Biden has continued to speak with such dishonesty that we should no longer trust what he says because of something from 30 years ago?

49 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

Finally, it is interesting that none of the liberal news media has asked him about any of this.

Because it's baked in.  Anyone who is familiar with Biden knows about these incidents.  Why aren't the media asking Trump about grabbing women by the pussy anymore?  We already know the answer to what Trump would say.  You seem like you don't spend much time paying attention to how campaigns and elections work relative to media coverage.  Once an issue has been litigated, people move on.

51 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

He should also be asked "why did he do it to begin with."

He has.  It's even answered in the video you posted.

 

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42 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

I said "don't bring up Trump" because people will use Trump as way to side step the issue. I see a ton of things being posted here that are shots at Trump, which is fair. I just wanted to hear people discuss these issues. People that are true blue Biden supporters should be able to at least discuss this, even if Biden/ the media won't.

Why can't it be enough to support Biden solely because he's not Trump?

Many people in 2016 voted for Trump solely because he wasn't Clinton.  It is not accurate or fair to suggest that people can't vote against someone.

I'll tell you exactly what Biden would say if he were asked about it again: "Look, I messed up, I should have been more accurate about those incidents, but I apologized at the time, learned from it, and I have never made the same mistake around those issues again."  And then the reporter would move on.  What else would you want?  

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5 minutes ago, downzy said:

Why can't it be enough to support Biden solely because he's not Trump?

Many people in 2016 voted for Trump solely because he wasn't Clinton.  It is not accurate or fair to suggest that people can't vote against someone.

I'll tell you exactly what Biden would say if he were asked about it again: "Look, I messed up, I should have been more accurate about those incidents, but I apologized at the time, learned from it, and I have never made the same mistake around those issues again."  And then the reporter would move on.  What else would you want?  

He probably should have put it down to locker room talk because that’s a great excuse. 

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44 minutes ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

You have to admit they are some pretty bad lies though.

Biden said he had three degrees when he meant, according to him, he had three majors.  He exaggerated the extent of his scholarship.  He failed to give credit for paraphrasing another politician.

Honestly, how many people died because of those "lies"?  

Now contrast that to the lies Trump has told about covid-19 and not being honest with Americans about the severity of the virus. 

Politics is rarely a normative consideration.  A review of Biden on his own would not lead many to support him as the one person in 330 million to become the official head of state.  Politics is a comparative exercise.  A candidate's traits and positions must be viewed relative to their opponent's.  Nobody here will claim that the mistruths and distortions Biden uttered from 30 years ago are signs of a great leader (at the time).  But relative to Trump, who has lied about numerous national emergencies that has resulted in the deaths of tens of thousands of Americans, Biden's foibles seem a little less pertinent.  This is what politics is in a democracy.  We rail on Trump not because we think Biden is the paragon of human virtue, but because Trump is really that terrible.  

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6 minutes ago, downzy said:

Why can't it be enough to support Biden solely because he's not Trump?

Many people in 2016 voted for Trump solely because he wasn't Clinton.  It is not accurate or fair to suggest that people can't vote against someone.

 

This is fair, and I don't dispute this form of logic. 

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If you hate Trump you're going to spend most of your time hating on Trump in places like these and elsewhere.  

If you hate Biden, you do the opposite.  

There are elements of both candidates that are hard or impossible to objectively defend.  No one would claim that either are the best two candidates a country of 330 million could produce.  But it is what it is.

I do think there's plenty about Biden that's worth defending (his decency, many of his policies, his willingness to speak to all Americans).  But that post likely won't generate much discussion here and elsewhere.  I did post a clip of Biden a day or two ago that demonstrated a smart response to Trump's alarms about the suburbs.  But really, there's just so much about that Trump that is utter shit that it makes it so much easier to talk about that versus writing about Biden.  

Elections that involve re-electing an incumbent are almost always about the incumbent.  Trump will try to make the election about Biden and try to tie him to the "radical left," and Biden will try to make the election about Trump and how utter dog shit he is as a person and as a leader.  Anyone who has paid attention to US politics (and politics pretty much anywhere) understands this dynamic.  

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2 minutes ago, downzy said:

Biden said he had three degrees when he meant, according to him, he had three majors.  He exaggerated the extent of his scholarship.  He failed to give credit for paraphrasing another politician.

Honestly, how many people died because of those "lies"?  

Now contrast that to the lies Trump has told about covid-19 and not being honest with Americans about the severity of the virus. 

Politics is rarely a normative consideration.  A review of Biden on his own would not lead many to support him as the one person in 330 million to become the official head of state.  Politics is a comparative exercise.  A candidate's traits and positions must be viewed relative to their opponent's.  Nobody here will claim that the mistruths and distortions Biden uttered from 30 years ago are signs of a great leader (at the time).  But relative to Trump, who has lied about numerous national emergencies that has resulted in the deaths of tens of thousands of Americans, Biden's foibles seem a little less pertinent.  This is what politics is in a democracy.  We rail on Trump not because we think Biden is the paragon of human virtue, but because Trump is really that terrible.  

I don't feel it's fair to blame the corona virus on Trump, and it's misleading when people do that. I don't have faith that ANY politician (right or left) would have done a "good" job during an election cycle. What I mean by that is, it would be used against them no matter what. Honestly governors and local government deserve MORE of the blame than the federal does. In my state, it's been the governor calling all the shots, not the president. 

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On 9/15/2020 at 11:20 AM, Basic_GnR_Fan said:

All my arguments have been nuanced and accounted for this. I literally said the asians who came to the US pre 65 didn't have it as rough as black slaves, but they themselves had a very rough experience. I think you're projecting a different argument on me than I'm actually making.

So then what is the argument you're trying to make?

Black Americans had it worse than anyone else, but other minorities also had it bad and their communities have done relatively better?  And therefore systemic racism doesn't exist because of this fact?  

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