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On 13/12/2016 at 11:04 PM, Graeme said:

Well, I don't regard it as an "English Kilt". I wear the kilt, in full awareness of the historical discussion around its origin, as Scottish national dress. I regard it as a culturally valid, modern expression of Scottishness for the contextual reasons I've outlined, irrespective of one Englishman's involvement in its development. Given that to be a dupe carries connotations of ignorance, wilful or otherwise, your contributions to this conversation thus far would possibly imply I was possessing such characteristics.

However, I feel your use of the term "English Kilt" carries discursive implications that the garment was created in England (it was not), that the garment was worn commonly by the people of England (it has never been) and that the garment is of any significance to the culture of England (it is not). It did originate in Scotland, one way or another, it has been worn commonly by the people of Scotland for 300 years and it is, as a result, significant to the culture of Scotland. I would contest, therefore, that it is far less English than it is Scottish, irrespective of Rawlinson's country of birth.

Also, the kilt in the picture was 100% made in Scotland from Scottish wool, so it's a Scottish object, "English Kilt" is definitely contestable in that context too :P.

The original Scots of Dal Riada were an Irish tribe so you could argue that Ireland, such as it was, invented "Scotland"... Scotland's just an amalgamation of all the people who came to this bit of land at the end of Europe: Picts, Gaels, Britons, Normans, English, Italians, Indians, Chinese... all bringing their cultural baggage with them and adding it to the melting pot. Nationalities are imagined, but that doesn't mean they're not real and I don't care if it was adopted, Haggis Pakora is ours now!

Up yours, my lot invented the pakora!

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17 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

They call em onion bhajis down here or something, respect to the jocks for getting the name right at least.

We have Onion Bhajis too, but Pakora is much more popular (I mean, it's things deep-fried in batter, how could it not be universally loved?)

 

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Tartans are an invention of the British royal family. Queen Victoria at Balmoral. A family of Germanic pudding faces. They invented this faux Scottish romanticism. It has its roots in Walter Scott. I rather like Scott. I suspect Graeme doesn't on account of his Unionism but I regard him as Scotland's greatest persona, much superior to Burns.

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On the subject of jocks i was watching an interview with Kevin Bridges on Graham Norton and there was this yank bird on and apparently she couldnt understand a word he was sayin.  Like literally not a word, how fuckin' difficult is it, hes speaking fuckin' English isnt he?  Wheres the problem.  I've certainly never had one and nor has anyone I've ever met.

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44 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

On the subject of jocks i was watching an interview with Kevin Bridges on Graham Norton and there was this yank bird on and apparently she couldn't understand a word he was sayin.  Like literally not a word, how fuckin' difficult is it, hes speaking fuckin' English isnt he?  Wheres the problem.  I've certainly never had one and nor has anyone I've ever met.

I'm pretty sure she was just kidding cuz Graham brought it up...

That being said, it's often surprising when yanks can understand anything, much less plain ol English. :P

 

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3 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

I'm pretty sure she was just kidding cuz Graham brought it up...

That being said, it's often surprising when yanks can understand anything, much less plain ol English. :P

 

I dont think she was at all, i think she literally didnt understand, it was bought up a number of times to the extent of her citing specific parts of his story that she couldnt understand, she joked about struggling to understand the convict that was also on the show but she was being real about Kev.

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7 hours ago, Len Cnut said:

On the subject of jocks i was watching an interview with Kevin Bridges on Graham Norton and there was this yank bird on and apparently she couldnt understand a word he was sayin.  Like literally not a word, how fuckin' difficult is it, hes speaking fuckin' English isnt he?  Wheres the problem.  I've certainly never had one and nor has anyone I've ever met.

You really have not much contact with jocks? Did you know I have  a tartan?

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12 hours ago, Len Cnut said:

On the subject of jocks i was watching an interview with Kevin Bridges on Graham Norton and there was this yank bird on and apparently she couldnt understand a word he was sayin.  Like literally not a word, how fuckin' difficult is it, hes speaking fuckin' English isnt he?  Wheres the problem.  I've certainly never had one and nor has anyone I've ever met.

I googled this to see what you were talking about, and in Lily Tomlin's defense, (btw she's 77!) I had a hard time understanding him too when he really got going. :lol:

 

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On 28/12/2016 at 9:24 PM, DieselDaisy said:

You really have not much contact with jocks? Did you know I have  a tartan?

I know quite a few jocks actually, one of em, lad called Craig, used to box middleweight until he got into selling gear, one of the hardest bastards I've ever come across.  He's from Dundee i think.

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2 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

I know quite a few jocks actually, one of em, lad called Craig, used to box middleweight until he got into selling gear, one of the hardest bastards I've ever come across.  He's from Dundee i think.

Did you tease him by pretending to be a Thatecherite, conveniently leaving her autobiography on the table etc.

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