True Story of Axl Rose/Kurt Cobain MTV Bust Up By Those Who Were There

[Silverburst80]

16 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

i hope i haven't positioned myself as a Guns over Nirvana fan, point of fact i think Kurt is streets ahead of Axl Rose creatively and Nirvana were 100 times the better band, i was just stating, as an obvious fact, that no one in Nirvana or GnR could have it with Axl.

The thing with the whole fighting Kurt thing though, he was deliberately winding him up as a sort of a macho cliche and resulting in Axl acting like a macho cliche, the only way Axl could've got one up in that situation is by taking the piss back and making them look equally ridiculous, by threatening to kick his head in you just sort of descend into the farcical aspect of what Kurt was pointing out in the first place.  And stomping off in a huff would've made you look easily as big a tart.    Axl could've easily wound him the fuck up...just go 'hey did you take the kid for vaccinations yet or has she had more than enough off the point of a needle from you?', that would've more than likely wound Kurt right the fuck up bearing in mind how that Vanity Fair shit annoyed him (bit grim of me to suggest but hey if you're gonna start cunting people off you're not really in a position to dictate boundaries of taste, are you?) Axl just played right into his hands...and got laughed out of the place as per the accounts.

Then again Axl was never exactly quick witted in that way, ready with a sharp answer in a John Lennon or John Rotten sense.

Oh Cobain played it very well even down to going to the press about it, with little Frances Bean on his lap looking like butter wouldn't melt...and people lapped it up. End of the day though whatever Cobain was trying to achieve with his obsessive taunting of GNR he failed and it only highlighted the insecurities he himself had to me. Would be interesting to see if they would have ever buried the hatchet, everything seems cool with everyone else in that camp now even Courtney.

[BlueJean Baby]

4 minutes ago, Silverburst80 said:

Oh Cobain played it very well even down to going to the press about it, with little Frances Bean on his lap looking like butter wouldn't melt...and people lapped it up. End of the day though whatever Cobain was trying to achieve with his obsessive taunting of GNR he failed and it only highlighted the insecurities he himself had to me. Would be interesting to see if they would have ever buried the hatchet, everything seems cool with everyone else in that camp now even Courtney.

True.  out of likes today

[jettesnel]

Reading this story brings me back to my high school days, great times. The only difference  Is I was 13 and they were 25-30...

[Silverburst80]

19 minutes ago, double talkin jive mfkr said:

very disapointing indeed in another one of my topics that got binned, i made the claim that the establishment really feared GNR and made it's objetive to bring on its demise and i honestly believe this theory 

GNR brought alot of their demise on themselves. Not only internally but turning any friends they had in the press against them. Remember this was before the web when music mags like Rolling Stone, Kerrang, Circus, Spin etc reigned supreme and when you threaten the owners and jounalists from these magazines you're not really gonna get too many positive articles written about you. I fucking loved that they did that though haha.

Edited December 21, 2016 by Silverburst80

[BlueJean Baby]

5 minutes ago, jettesnel said:

Reading this story brings me back to my high school days, great times. The only difference  Is I was 13 and they were 25-30...

I'm around their age, brings back memories to me too. Making me miss the old MTV, when it actually was Music Television, and not like it is today.

[BlueJean Baby]

26 minutes ago, double talkin jive mfkr said:

very disapointing indeed in another one of my topics that got binned, i made the claim that the establishment really feared GNR and made it's objetive to bring on its demise and i honestly believe this theory 

I think you might just be right. Which is most likely why the media has always been on Axl's ass.

[BlueJean Baby]

12 minutes ago, Silverburst80 said:

GNR brought alot of their demise on themselves. Not only internally but turning any friends they had in the press against them. Remember this was before the web when music mags like Rolling Stone, Kerrang, Circus, Spin etc reigned supreme and when you threaten the owners and jounalists from these magazines you're not really gonna get too many positive articles written about you. I fucking loved that they did that though haha.

I have a huge collection of those mags from back then, anything that had GNR in it, I saved.

[-W.A.R-]

well the shut your bitch up was corny but i think Kurt looked more like an asshole than Axl.

Axl extended his hand and Kurt pretty much spit on it by dissing GNR for no reason.

Edited December 21, 2016 by -W.A.R-

[Original]

Look how young they all were.....   And as fucked up as Guns was drug wise look at Nirvana- wow.  Cobain- biggest pussy of all time.  Always hated the guy.  Used to hate/not like Grohl but via the Foo's I now respect/like him..........kindaa.  I guess Guns/Axl won the battle.  

[Blackstar]

Kurt told that story twice in interviews:

Quote

-Didn't Axl Rose say something nasty to you at the MTV Video Music Awards in September?

They actually tried to beat us up. Courtney and I were with the baby in the eating area backstage, and Axl walked by. So Courtney yelled, "Axl! Axl, come over here!" We just wanted to say hi to him--we think he's a joke, but we just wanted to say something to him. So I said, "Will you be the godfather of our child?" I don't know what had happened before that to piss him off, but he took his aggressions out on us and began screaming bloody murder.

These were his words: "You shut your bitch up, or I'm taking you down to the pavement." [laughs] Everyone around us just burst out into tears of laughter. She wasn't even saying anything mean, you know? So I turned to Courtney and said, "Shut up, bitch!" And everyone laughed and he left. So I guess I did what he wanted me to do--be a man. [laughs]

[...] Later, after we played our show and were walking back to our trailer, the Guns N' Roses entourage came walking toward us. They have at least 50 bodyguards apiece: huge, gigantic, brain-dead oafs ready to kill for Axl at all times. [Laughs] They didn't see me, but they surrounded Chris, and Duff [McKagan of Guns N' Roses] wanted to beat Chris up, and the bodyguards started pushing Chris around. He finally escaped, but throughout the rest of the evening, there was a big threat of either Guns N' Roses themselves or their goons beating us up. We had to hide out.

http://www.burntout.com/kurt/interviews/int4.html

 

 

Quote

Cobain: Well, apparenty Axl was in a really bad mood. Something set him off, probably just minutes before our encounter with him. We were in the food tent and I was holdong my daughter, Frances, and he came strutting by with five of his hugge bodyguards and a person with a movie camera. Courtney jokingly screamed at him, "Axl, will you be the godfather of our child?" Everyone laughed. We had a few friends around us, and he just stopped dead in his tracks and started screaming these abusive words at us. He told me I should shut my bitch up, so I looked at Courtney and said, "Shut up, bitch, heh!" Everyone started howling with laughter and Axl just kind of blushed and went away. Afterward, we heard that Duff [McKagan GNR bassist] wanted to beat Chris up.

http://www.oocities.org/sunsetstrip/cabaret/4866/inter13a.html

The second time the story was slightly different, less dramatic and didn't include the "or I’m taking you down to the pavement" part. This makes me think that maybe he had added some salt to make Axl look even more like an asshole.

There's also this version from Doug Goldstein:

Quote

DOUG GOLDSTEIN: I'd love to straighten out the story about Axl and Kurt Cobain. Axl loved Kurt's music, but Kurt used to say not very nice things about Axl. And Axl could never understand why.
So we're walking along, it's me and Stephanie and Axl, and all of a sudden I hear this voice: "It's Asshole Rose. It's Asshole Rose." It was Courtney. Axl said, "Fuck off," and kept walking. She said, "Asshole. What are you doing, Ass­hole?" So finally, Axl was pissed off and he walked over to Kurt and said, "Look, if you can't shut that bitch's trap, maybe I should shut yours." The instigator in this situation was Courtney.

 

Edited December 21, 2016 by Blackstar

[SteveAJones]

9 hours ago, Len Cnut said:

Nirvana were 100 times the better band

Nirvana sucks! Every fucking song sounds the same and seems to convey one whiny theme..."wah wah wah, my stomach hurts, wah wah wah". I use to loathe Dave Grohl but I've come to appreciate his easy going nature and sense of humor. 

[Len Cnut]

10 hours ago, double talkin jive mfkr said:

very disapointing indeed in another one of my topics that got binned, i made the claim that the establishment really feared GNR and made it's objetive to bring on its demise and i honestly believe this theory 

I wouldn't go that far personally.

[Len Cnut]

10 hours ago, Silverburst80 said:

Oh Cobain played it very well even down to going to the press about it, with little Frances Bean on his lap looking like butter wouldn't melt...and people lapped it up. End of the day though whatever Cobain was trying to achieve with his obsessive taunting of GNR he failed and it only highlighted the insecurities he himself had to me. Would be interesting to see if they would have ever buried the hatchet, everything seems cool with everyone else in that camp now even Courtney.

I hardly think Frances being there was part of some scheme by Kurt, she was with him all day long, are you suggesting that he had some sort of psychic premonition that Axl was gonna kick off with him so it was a good idea to bring Frances as a human sheild?

1 hour ago, SteveAJones said:

Nirvana sucks! Every fucking song sounds the same and seems to convey one whiny theme..."wah wah wah, my stomach hurts, wah wah wah". I use to loathe Dave Grohl but I've come to appreciate his easy going nature and sense of humor. 

Well thank you for that illuminating appraisal sir

[Len Cnut]

10 hours ago, Silverburst80 said:

GNR brought alot of their demise on themselves. Not only internally but turning any friends they had in the press against them. Remember this was before the web when music mags like Rolling Stone, Kerrang, Circus, Spin etc reigned supreme and when you threaten the owners and jounalists from these magazines you're not really gonna get too many positive articles written about you. I fucking loved that they did that though haha.

Perhaps they were just a three album band?  Perhaps thats the extent of their mileage.  I'm not a big one for woulda coulda shoulda, i think you do what you do and thats what you live and die by, the fact is they weren't the next Stones for no other reason than they simply weren't good enough.

As far as 'the establishment' having an issue with GnR, dont make me laugh, GnR are an establishment wet dream, the establishment throw their weight behind entertainers like that.

[Silverburst80]

29 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

I hardly think Frances being there was part of some scheme by Kurt, she was with him all day long, are you suggesting that he had some sort of psychic premonition that Axl was gonna kick off with him so it was a good idea to bring Frances as a human sheild?

Well thank you for that illuminating appraisal sir

No i'm talking about the interview with MTV after, i do think he was a scheming cunt though yeah and let's face even people close to him have said as much...he'd tell a tale or two to seem more interesting than he actually was, and with Courtney in the mix fuck me i wouldn't put anything past those two. End of the day he was the aggressor with the whole deal, when things got a little bit hairy he went and bitched to the press. Cunt move wherever your from no?.

Edited December 21, 2016 by Silverburst80

[jettesnel]

12 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

I hardly think Frances being there was part of some scheme by Kurt, she was with him all day long, are you suggesting that he had some sort of psychic premonition that Axl was gonna kick off with him so it was a good idea to bring Frances as a human sheild?

Well thank you for that illuminating appraisal sir

He obviously meant that Kurt made him self the victim by telling that he had his daughter with him.

Edited December 21, 2016 by jettesnel

[Silverburst80]

33 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

Perhaps they were just a three album band?  Perhaps thats the extent of their mileage.  I'm not a big one for woulda coulda shoulda, i think you do what you do and thats what you live and die by, the fact is they weren't the next Stones for no other reason than they simply weren't good enough.

As far as 'the establishment' having an issue with GnR, dont make me laugh, GnR are an establishment wet dream, the establishment throw their weight behind entertainers like that.

Most good/great bands  generally have that hot period of 5-8 years when they're really on fire anyway, the ones that stay together longer than that may release a shit tonne of more material but generally your wading through a tonne of shit find any gems or anything close to their early work. So maybe yeah they were just a 3 album band, of those 3 i can only pick a couple of songs i find really crap which can be an advantage of a small discography. Having said that though with the music various members have released such the split i can confidently say Guns could piece together another very good album or 2 with the old line up.

Yeah disagree, Guns were no media darlings well not compared to ya boy Kurt that's for sure!. I don't however think it affected Guns much either way which is what i alluded to in my post, most was self inflicted.

Edited December 21, 2016 by Silverburst80

[J Dog]

I love both Kurt and Nirvana, but always felt like Kurt came across as a little bitch here. He would have probably let Courtney fight Axl while he held the baby and said shit like, guys come on, stop it, what are we doing.

[Silverburst80]

7 minutes ago, J Dog said:

I love both Kurt and Nirvana, but always felt like Kurt came across as a little bitch here. He would have probably let Courtney fight Axl while he held the baby and said shit like, guys come on, stop it, what are we doing.

That would have been more a fair fight! Solange Knowles v Jay-Z would have nothing on that shit.

Edited December 21, 2016 by Silverburst80

[Black Sabbath]

Axl would have easily beat the shit out of Kurt and I wish it would have gotten to that point.

 

 

Cool that him and Dave are friends nowadays though.

[Jane M.]

Poor baby Frances surrounded by a bunch of rockstars morons.

[Len Cnut]

55 minutes ago, Silverburst80 said:

No i'm talking about the interview with MTV after, i do think he was a scheming cunt though yeah and let's face even people close to him have said as much...he'd tell a tale or two to seem more interesting than he actually was, and with Courtney in the mix fuck me i wouldn't put anything past those two. End of the day he was the aggressor with the whole deal, when things got a little bit hairy he went and bitched to the press. Cunt move wherever your from no?.

Honestly i think fans make a lot more of this shit that is actually there, it was a moment in time and its just two parties having a bit of minor league aggro, just fans think that by suckin' ones dick over the other says something for em.   The best evidence of that shit is how the parties in question appear to get on now.  I mean how massive of a thing is it, two people made some snidey comments to each other once 20 years ago.

As far as Kurt engineering the situation to make himself look better well he was taking the piss out of Axl so obviously hes gonna tell it in a way thats gonna make Axl look a bigger cunt without compromising the overall honesty of the narrative.  

I dont think he was the 'aggressor', the aggressor is surely the one who threatens to thump someone surely?  

[Len Cnut]

49 minutes ago, Silverburst80 said:

Most good/great bands  generally have that hot period of 5-8 years when they're really on fire anyway, the ones that stay together longer than that may release a shit tonne of more material but generally your wading through a tonne of shit find any gems or anything close to their early work. So maybe yeah they were just a 3 album band, of those 3 i can only pick a couple of songs i find really crap which can be an advantage of a small discography. Having said that though with the music various members have released such the split i can confidently say Guns could piece together another very good album or 2 with the old line up.

Yeah disagree, Guns were no media darlings well not compared to ya boy Kurt that's for sure!. I don't however think it affected Guns much either way which is what i alluded to in my post, most was self inflicted.

They were both massive media darlings, the media loves anyone who makes great copy and sells papers and Guns n Nirvana both did that.  The very idea that 'the establishment' sought to attack GnR is ridiculous to the point of delusional, you think Feds were sitting around investigating GnR like Axl was fucking John Lennon or something?

[J Dog]

39 minutes ago, Silverburst80 said:

That would have been more a fair fight! Solange Knowles v Jay-Z would have nothing on that shit.

 Guess that leaves Kurt to play Beyoncé 

[Len Cnut]

1 hour ago, jettesnel said:

He obviously meant that Kurt made him self the victim by telling that he had his daughter with him.

Perhaps he was just telling the story?