British Politics

[SoulMonster]

19 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Not really. You have him as a ''flip-flopper in regards to Brexit'' before claiming that he is a supporter of remaining in the EU. Even the flimsiest glance at Corbyn's political career will demonstrate that he voted against every EU policy occurring, Lisbon, Maastricht - campaigned to withdraw in 1975 - etc etc. He was largely absent from the remain campaign much to the chagrin of Labour remainers. I also do not believe I have ever called Corbyn an antisemite per se unless I was being facetious, but said that his party is riddled in an antisemitic scandal which is factually correct. Boris Johnson bikes, and he holds antithetical beliefs to Corbyn; Adolf Hitler was a vegetarian: point? 

In other words, pretty spot on 

And what's your point on vegetarianism? That since Hitler was one you can't possibly hold that against Corbyn? 

[DieselDaisy]

Just now, SoulMonster said:

In other words, pretty spot on 

And what's your point on vegetarianism? That since Hitler was one you can't possibly hold that against Corbyn? 

I don't believe I have been overly critical of vegetarianism! You pull stuff out of your arse in your obsessive quest about me. 

[soon]

18 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

I think Labour are utterly rancid full stop. 

Thats Nandys party, you watch your mouth! 

9 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Corbyn wanting to flood the electorate with 16 year olds

Both our govts allow 16 year olds to join the military. https://www.studential.com/joining-the-army/british-army-FAQs

In both our Countries children as young as 13 can gain employment which benefits the GDP. And at 16 they can be taxed. https://www.localsolicitors.com/employment-guides/what-is-the-minimum-legal-age-of-employment-in-the-uk

Have you lot not learned your lesson about taxation without representation?? 

[Dazey]

Corbyn is what the American right try to pretend Bernie Sanders is to scare people. 

[SoulMonster]

6 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

I don't believe I have been overly critical of vegetarianism! You pull stuff out of your arse in your obsessive quest about me. 

I was just pointing out aspects of Corbyn that points to his awareness of environmental matters, including biking and being a vegetarian. That doesn't mean you are against vegetarianism. Yet, you opted to reply by pointing out that Hitler was a vegetarian, so... that means you can't be against it? 

[DieselDaisy]

2 minutes ago, soon said:

Thats Nandys party, you watch your mouth! 

Both our govts allow 16 year olds to join the military. https://www.studential.com/joining-the-army/british-army-FAQs

In both our Countries children as young as 13 can gain employment which benefits the GDP. And at 16 they can be taxed. https://www.localsolicitors.com/employment-guides/what-is-the-minimum-legal-age-of-employment-in-the-uk

Have you lot not learned your lesson about taxation without representation?? 

I am perfectly content with the franchise at 18. 

[soon]

3 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

I am perfectly content with the franchise at 18. 

i cant imagine all these climate action, class action lawsuits by youths are something you support. But its their only option without representation. So they will continue to proliferate. Making voting rights almost a move to quell that form of power that they currently wield.

[DieselDaisy]

4 minutes ago, soon said:

i cant imagine all these climate action, class action lawsuits by youths are something you support. But its their only option without representation. So they will continue to proliferate. Making voting rights almost a move to quell that form of power that they currently wield.

I am not sure why you desire an argument about the franchise, but regardless the wrecking amendments were thrown out. 

[soon]

Just now, DieselDaisy said:

I am not sure why you desire an argument about the franchise, but regardless the wrecking amendments were thrown out. 

Argument? 

You've not spoken to a point Ive made... this is hardly an argument just on that merit alone. Not to mention conversing is not inherently an argument 

You didnt know about the climate suits did ya? Thats okay, you could just ask  

[DieselDaisy]

1 minute ago, soon said:

Argument? 

You've not spoken to a point Ive made... this is hardly an argument just on that merit alone. Not to mention conversing is not inherently an argument 

You didnt know about the climate suits did ya? Thats okay, you could just ask  

Because I have no interest in this discussion beyond that I am perfectly satisfied with the current franchise. If you would like to see that lowered that is certainly your prerogative. 

[soon]

3 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Because I have no interest in this discussion beyond that I am perfectly satisfied with the current franchise. If you would like to see that lowered that is certainly your prerogative. 

Cool talk, grumpy pants 

[AtariLegend]

So 12th December election.

It's all over baring a miracle. The best case scenario is a hung parliment.

A year ago Boris and Ian Ducan Smith might have been lossing their seats, today it's looking like the Tories are heading towards victory... it's been a horrible year for Labour.

Edited October 29, 2019 by AtariLegend

[spunko12345]

5 hours ago, soon said:

Thanks. Sounds like some typical anti Marxist smear campaign stuff. Some accusations of antisemitism from within his own party though! Seems like people putting their own career ambitions ahead of the party, maybe?

Even the progressives in the US Congress are getting the whole antisemitism smear attacks

oddly the antisemitism that festered in the first international was against Marx, suggesting communism was just the flip side of the coin in some alleged ‘Jewish conspiracy.’

Corbyn strikes me as an admirable leader and devoted public servant.

I'm afraid you are discredited on this one slightly because in your previous post you said you got your information on Corbyn from "skimming Wikipedia" 😄

[soon]

17 minutes ago, spunko12345 said:

I'm afraid you are discredited on this one slightly because in your previous post you said you got your information on Corbyn from "skimming Wikipedia" 😄

Haha, but I'm fairly sure about the First International part 

Its true I am just trying to learn about him... So naturally, I get all my info from wikipedia. 

Honestly, he comes across well from over here, so Im thankful to the people who shared their views with me to help give me a broader understanding.

[Dazey]

1 hour ago, soon said:

Haha, but I'm fairly sure about the First International part 

Its true I am just trying to learn about him... So naturally, I get all my info from wikipedia. 

Honestly, he comes across well from over here, so Im thankful to the people who shared their views with me to help give me a broader understanding.

Corbyn is a proper old school socialist. Like really far far left wing. Not in the mould of modern Scandiwegian social democrats but proper old school.

The last time the UK had a proper socialist government this happened

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_of_Discontent

and we're not in a hurry to repeat it.

Unlike @DieselDaisy I would actually have no problem voting for Labour if they had a sensible leadership.

Edited October 29, 2019 by Dazey

[bucketfoot]

There are many criticisms that have been aimed at Corbyn, IRA sympathizing, anti-semitism and so on.

However, his biggest problem, for me anyway, is an uncanny resemblance to Albert Steptoe.

[janrichmond]

I hate Corbyn. 

[AtariLegend]

8 minutes ago, janrichmond said:

I hate Corbyn. 

I'm not fond of him, I think he's been a failure as a leader.

However the flip side is I think people who vote Tory and still think spending the next decade on Brexit, just so Boris can strike up a trade deal with Trump and his mates can make a buck, at the expense of our NHS are just generally cunts.

Edited October 30, 2019 by AtariLegend

[DieselDaisy]

4 hours ago, Dazey said:

Corbyn is a proper old school socialist. Like really far far left wing. Not in the mould of modern Scandiwegian social democrats but proper old school.

The last time the UK had a proper socialist government this happened

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_of_Discontent

and we're not in a hurry to repeat it.

Unlike @DieselDaisy I would actually have no problem voting for Labour if they had a sensible leadership.

If Michael Foot had gained power in 1983 then you would have had a socialist government. We'd have left the European Union a lot sooner since Labour ran on a hard-left manifesto (''the longest suicide note in history'') which included withdrawing from the European Communities (as it was known then). Thatcher won because of the ''Falklands Effect''.

I don't believe Scandinavia has that drinkers' face, tattooed, football obsessive, darts playing, working man's brand of far left culture we have here. It is a completely different animal from left liberalism, political correctness, LSHDHGDS rights, environmentalism, feminism. Just try going into a social club in the north of England or Glasgow and start talking about ''toxic masculinity'' haha.  

Edited October 30, 2019 by DieselDaisy

[AtariLegend]

There's no turning back now. If it's a Tory majority which odds are, there will be... then Brexit happens.

The only way back now for remain is another hung parliment, which imo is the best case scenario.

It'd also get rid off both Johnson and Corbyn. Puts a referendum back on the table, but it's unlikely.

I despise the Tories, Lib Dems and the Blarities equally for different reasons. The problem is my vote doesn't matter.

[DieselDaisy]

It is insanity to actually desire a hung parliament. A hung parliament would only lead to either a minority government (i.e., the present situation, incapable of legislating) or another general election!

PS

I suppose a third alternative is a Corbyn-led ''Frankenstein'' coalition, but the LDs and Labour seem to despise each other and the SNP are (well) the SNP.

Edited October 30, 2019 by DieselDaisy

[AtariLegend]

23 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

another general election!

With different actors in the play, yes.

[DieselDaisy]

15 minutes ago, AtariLegend said:

With different actors in the play, yes.

I cannot see that happening. 

The last time there were two consecutive general elections, 1974, the party leaders (Wilson and Heath) remained unchanged throughout. Hung Parliaments tend to indicate parity in bilateral parties, which does not really entail a colossal defeat of one (or the other) necessitating swift leadership changes. They are easier to ''spin'' also (''yes, we made some gains in safe seats blah blah'') because you are basically left with an ambiguous fudge.

 

Edited October 30, 2019 by DieselDaisy

[SoulMonster]

6 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

I don't believe Scandinavia has that drinkers' face, tattooed, football obsessive, darts playing, working man's brand of far left culture we have here. It is a completely different animal from left liberalism, political correctness, LSHDHGDS rights, environmentalism, feminism. Just try going into a social club in the north of England or Glasgow and start talking about ''toxic masculinity'' haha.  

You are right. Of course we have the type of people you mention here in Norway, too, but they aren't strongly attached to the left side of the political spectrum as fa as I know. We are probably also a bit more homogenous society than the UK and it is much harder to guess what a person votes based on appearances and social sort of class or whatever. That being said, I think the typical left voter in Norway is a young woman working in some governmental capacity with an average or below average income. That's sort of the hotspot for people who vote SV, Venstre, Rødt and AP (although AP has become more of a centrum party in later years). Then farmers tend to vote SP. People easily fooled vote FRP (far right). eople engaged in business and more fiscally conservative, vote Høyre (right). But all in all I would say it would be harder to guess political allegiance.

[DieselDaisy]

Say what you really think Rachel,