If GNR would have reunited sooner, would that tour have been more than just a boring cash grab?

[todreamofwolves]

Let's say that GNR reunited for their 2002 or 2006 tour, would we have gotten more than just a boring cash grab like now? Back then, Axl still recorded music. Izzy seemed less reclusive and actually made appearances with Guns. Slash may have had less of a 'fuck you, I'm just doing this to recoup from my divorce' mentality. Steven wasn't sober yet, so he could have actually brought some unpredictability back to the band.

So would a GNR reunion tour a decade or more prior made much of a difference in terms of quality output? At least Axl was willing to play for half attended arena shows during that time period, so apparently money wasn't of the utmost priority like now. Plus, since Axl wouldn't have been so old, maybe he wouldn't have insisted upon cutting out core members for an extra slice of the pie.

Thoughts?

 

Edited October 9, 2017 by todreamofwolves
grammatical

[IncitingChaos]

2006 would have been huge. The music industry was still ina place that GNR could do something creative and have a place. Axl was fit, not sure on Slash and Duff's condition at this time but a reunion in 06 would have been a bit special 

[Gibson87]

We probably would've had 2-3 more albums if they had reunited in 2002.

[GoBucky]

Im just curious, but how many people that went to shows on this tour were bored? I've been to 10 so far and haven't been bored for a minute of them. 

[ZoSoRose]

A stadium is a stadium. Itd be the same thing.

So maybe an album would sell 500k the first week then instead of 80k now. The lead single would have been just as itd be now, released and played on your local hard rock radio for 6 months and then forgotten by everyone except the diehards

[soon]

Steven?  Izzy?  Album?  Radio hit?  2006 sounds like it was great 

The fact that Slash threw Duff under the bus to Axl alone would've (and maybe did if Weilands reunion reports are accurate) screwed it up.  And I think we'd still have Fortus and Frank.

[DieselDaisy]

Yes. Don't forget that the hype of the VR thing was just before that, 2004ish. Rose had that mystique factor in those days. Imagine if there had been a pooling of ideas and a Guns release instead of VR and (the much later) CD?

[Chewbacca]

Well, yeah. IF they released new material, that is. they still can make it big, they just need to drop the nostalgia act.

[todreamofwolves]

1 hour ago, GoBucky said:

Im just curious, but how many people that went to shows on this tour were bored? I've been to 10 so far and haven't been bored for a minute of them. 

I don't know if people who went to the shows were bored or not, but generally speaking, this semi-reunion has been Bore-Fucking-City. Many who attend the live shows are drinking alcohol or are amongst friends, so that might help to compensate some for the predictability, shitty vocals, missing classic members, and lack of creativity. 

Seriously .. you attended 10 shows?? Hopefully you at least saw them change up a cover or two. Lol.

Edited October 8, 2017 by todreamofwolves

[Harlum Shake]

2 hours ago, GoBucky said:

Im just curious, but how many people that went to shows on this tour were bored? I've been to 10 so far and haven't been bored for a minute of them. 

Not many. No matter the year, the same people would be complaining here as they are today. And I've been to 4. Not bored yet either.

Edited October 8, 2017 by Harlum Shake

[Tonto]

1 hour ago, todreamofwolves said:

I don't know if people who went to the shows were bored or not, but generally speaking, this semi-reunion has been Bore-Fucking-City. Many who attend the live shows are drinking alcohol or are amongst friends, so that might help to compensate some for the predictability, shitty vocals, missing classic members, and lack of creativity. 

Seriously .. you attended 10 shows?? Hopefully you at least saw them change up a cover or two. Lol.

You are ridiculous. They are only enjoying the show because they are with friends and drinking alcohol? Really? Shit post of the year, mate, well done, you have my vote come awards season! If YOU think it's boring, fine, but don't lump the rest of us in with your miserable ass and make excuses for why we happen to enjoy the shows. Did you even go to a show? Or you at home sat in your pants, eating Pringles, periscoping 60 shows in a row? Now that does sound boring!

[ZoSoRose]

1 hour ago, todreamofwolves said:

I don't know if people who went to the shows were bored or not, but generally speaking, this semi-reunion has been Bore-Fucking-City. Many who attend the live shows are drinking alcohol or are amongst friends, so that might help to compensate some for the predictability, shitty vocals, missing classic members, and lack of creativity. 

Seriously .. you attended 10 shows?? Hopefully you at least saw them change up a cover or two. Lol.

The tour is a dream come true for casual fans only attending one show. Last year, I'd have even said it was a dream come true for die hards. The set is repetitive, but it is pretty damn solid. There is something for everyone, all the hits, some old staples like Estranged, some ChiDem songs, and deep cuts (DTTJ, Coma). Its just predictable and now there are WAY- TOO- MANY- COVERS. Why bother having a 3.5 hour show if half of it isn't your own music? It is just bloated at this point imo. Here we are, 2 years from the initial "announcement", and as die hards we are obviously bored. Most of us have already got out "magic" first show. The first show seeing Axl and Slash back on stage playing together. That is really what this tour is all about, and that is great, but 2 years is a long time. 

I knew a LOT of people at least year's stadium gig in my city. I got texts and calls all week about how incredible the show was. However, once is usually enough for a casual fan. Not one person from my friends or family (or even most of the local forum friends I have on here) are attending the Detroit show. Not because they didn't like the first gig, but because they already got what they wanted from the tour. Now, we have WAY higher ticket prices (you could get like 30-60 dollar nosebleeds last year, now they are 100-150 dollars to sit in the back) and they don't even know Axl's voice is significantly worse than it was in 2016. I feel weird about potentially missing a Guns snow in my back yard, but to shell out so much cash for an inferior show is tough for me. Is it really worth it? I'm not sure. I LOVED the 3 gigs I saw last year, I was up close for 2 of them and the one I was in the back for was the first of the legendary Vegas gigs. Now, I'd sit in the back, get maybe 2-3 GNR songs I haven't gotten before (My Michelle, Sorry, and Yesterday's), have to sit through a billion covers, have Axl in way worse vocal shape, and be like $150-$200 in the hole. If I want to bring a friend it'd be double that. 

I was really excited when the arena gig was rumored and even announced, but 2 years is LONGGGG and I'm not happy with the declining performances and ticket prices. 

Just my $.02

[todreamofwolves]

11 minutes ago, Tonto said:

You are ridiculous. They are only enjoying the show because they are with friends and drinking alcohol? Really? Shit post of the year, mate, well done, you have my vote come awards season! If YOU think it's boring, fine, but don't lump the rest of us in with your miserable ass and make excuses for why we happen to enjoy the shows. Did you even go to a show? Or you at home sat in your pants, eating Pringles, periscoping 60 shows in a row? Now that does sound boring!

Sorry champ, but I'm just calling it like it is. I couldn't even imagine shelling out bucks for 10 shows when it's the same predictable act EVERY SINGLE SHOW.  They're obviously dialing this thing in for money, and I wouldn't even want to contribute to that. The only way I'd pay to see more than 1 show would be if they actually did reunite GNR (drop Richard, the drummer, and the girl & replace them with the actual members who recorded AFD) OR if Axl and Slash could prove that they were capable of recording NEW quality music together instead of nauseating the fan base for the millionth time with the same stale set lists. Without Izzy's involvement, I personally do not see new music happening ... EVER.

But hey, if seeing Axl & Slash sell themselves out multiple times is your thing, have at it. Your money, not mine ..

[Tom2112]

4 hours ago, GoBucky said:

Im just curious, but how many people that went to shows on this tour were bored? I've been to 10 so far and haven't been bored for a minute of them. 

I was bored during a couple of songs, at both gigs, especially the extended jams / solo spots, and extended jams within actual songs (RQ, heaven's door). Coma is literally coma inducing live... Literally change it with any other song, just not another cover 👌

The previous line up were guilty of band jams and too many solo spots, but for me I was entertained just as much by that show as I was the one with Slash and Duff... In fact, I still think the best gnr show that I attended was with the 2006-2014 era band. Best guns gig for me were either Dublin '06 or 2012... 2010 was by far my favourite vocally... And it was entertaining in a way🤣 

 

[YourMother'sDruthers]

2 hours ago, ZoSoRose said:

The tour is a dream come true for casual fans only attending one show. Last year, I'd have even said it was a dream come true for die hards. The set is repetitive, but it is pretty damn solid. There is something for everyone, all the hits, some old staples like Estranged, some ChiDem songs, and deep cuts (DTTJ, Coma). Its just predictable and now there are WAY- TOO- MANY- COVERS. Why bother having a 3.5 hour show if half of it isn't your own music? It is just bloated at this point imo. Here we are, 2 years from the initial "announcement", and as die hards we are obviously bored. Most of us have already got out "magic" first show. The first show seeing Axl and Slash back on stage playing together. That is really what this tour is all about, and that is great, but 2 years is a long time. 

I knew a LOT of people at least year's stadium gig in my city. I got texts and calls all week about how incredible the show was. However, once is usually enough for a casual fan. Not one person from my friends or family (or even most of the local forum friends I have on here) are attending the Detroit show. Not because they didn't like the first gig, but because they already got what they wanted from the tour. Now, we have WAY higher ticket prices (you could get like 30-60 dollar nosebleeds last year, now they are 100-150 dollars to sit in the back) and they don't even know Axl's voice is significantly worse than it was in 2016. I feel weird about potentially missing a Guns snow in my back yard, but to shell out so much cash for an inferior show is tough for me. Is it really worth it? I'm not sure. I LOVED the 3 gigs I saw last year, I was up close for 2 of them and the one I was in the back for was the first of the legendary Vegas gigs. Now, I'd sit in the back, get maybe 2-3 GNR songs I haven't gotten before (My Michelle, Sorry, and Yesterday's), have to sit through a billion covers, have Axl in way worse vocal shape, and be like $150-$200 in the hole. If I want to bring a friend it'd be double that. 

I was really excited when the arena gig was rumored and even announced, but 2 years is LONGGGG and I'm not happy with the declining performances and ticket prices. 

Just my $.02

I agree. I'm in Detroit, went to the show last year in the pit, it was a great show, the first I'd ever seen with Slash, but I didn't even buy a ticket for next month's show, and neither has anyone else that I know who went last year. All of our reasons are the same... it's the same setlist, more or less, and I've already seen it. The only reason I'd care to go to another show would be to see new music played or to see Izzy back on stage. 

[ludurigan]

6 hours ago, todreamofwolves said:

Let's say that GNR reunited for their 2002 or 2006 tour, would we have gotten more than just a boring cash grab like now? Back then, Axl still recorded music. Izzy seemed less reclusive and actually made appearances with Guns. Slash may have had less of a 'fuck you, I'm just doing this to recoup from my divorce' mentality. Steven wasn't sober yet, so he could have actually brought some unpredictability back to the band.

So would a GNR reunion tour a decade or more prior made much of a difference in terms of quality output? At least Axl was willing to play for half attended arena shows during that time period, so apparently money wasn't of the utmost priority like now. Plus, since Axl wouldn't have been so old, maybe he wouldn't have insisted upon cutting out core members for an extra slice of the pie.

Thoughts?

 

i didnt get the "sooner" word on the title thread. it looked to me as if you are saying that GNR has reunited (!??). is that true? do you have sources? or it is just another rumour?

last time i checked (i kinda stopped following the news on axl after the NITL tour ended in 2021) axl gave an interview to "that metal show" where he said slash and duff did enjoy his tracks.

I also remember that 2022 (or was it 2023?) rolling stone interview of richard fortus (right after axl fired him) where he said they (axl, slash and duff) were on the verge of recording an album when he was fired and it was "the best lineup" and "exciting times" (cant remember the exact quotes).

and of course there was the slash drunk MTV thing last year (or was it 2030?)

man, i did stop following those guys but your news about the reunion do warm my heart and I really hope GNR reunites some day!

 

[ludurigan]

6 hours ago, IncitingChaos said:

2006 would have been huge. The music industry was still ina place that GNR could do something creative and have a place. Axl was fit, not sure on Slash and Duff's condition at this time but a reunion in 06 would have been a bit special 

yeah, being fit and the industry being in that place where you want it to be are truly necessary conditions for any creative endeavour

please dont let all the other people that write, record and release music know anything about that!

[ludurigan]

6 hours ago, ZoSoRose said:

A stadium is a stadium. Itd be the same thing.

So maybe an album would sell 500k the first week then instead of 80k now. The lead single would have been just as itd be now, released and played on your local hard rock radio for 6 months and then forgotten by everyone except the diehards

depends on who writes, records and release that single

are you talking about guns n aliens? then id say you are correct about what would happen to a single from this lineup

are you talking about GNR? then id say you are likely mistaken

to this day, no GNR single has ever been "forgotten by everyone" and there is no reason whatsoever (except axl's voice, of course) to believe that a GNR single would be "released and played on your local hard rock radio for 6 months and then forgotten by everyone except the diehards"

everything points in the very opposite direction

 

[ZoSoRose]

Just now, ludurigan said:

depends on who writes, records and release that single

are you talking about guns n aliens? then id say you are correct about what would happen to a single from this lineup

are you talking about GNR? then id say you are likely mistaken

to this day, no GNR single has ever been "forgotten by everyone" and there is no reason whatsoever (except axl's voice, of course) to believe that a GNR single would be "released and played on your local hard rock radio for 6 months and then forgotten by everyone except the diehards"

everything points in the very opposite direction

 

ACDC, Rolling Stones, Rush, Metallica, Aerosmith, Van Halen, etc, etc. 

Same thing over the past 15 years. Lead single gets radio play for 6 months, and then the mainstream abyss 

[ludurigan]

3 hours ago, Tonto said:

You are ridiculous. They are only enjoying the show because they are with friends and drinking alcohol? Really? Shit post of the year, mate, well done, you have my vote come awards season! If YOU think it's boring, fine, but don't lump the rest of us in with your miserable ass and make excuses for why we happen to enjoy the shows. Did you even go to a show? Or you at home sat in your pants, eating Pringles, periscoping 60 shows in a row? Now that does sound boring!

oh fuck, you had promised that award to me a few weeks ago and now you do that behind my back?

 

3 hours ago, ZoSoRose said:

There is something for everyone

i didnt find any "something"

 

3 hours ago, ZoSoRose said:

and deep cuts (DTTJ, Coma)

I was under the impression that Double Talking Jive was played a zillion times in 1991 and 1992 and 1993

but i must be confusing it with Bad Apples (?)

 

17 minutes ago, ZoSoRose said:

ACDC, Rolling Stones, Rush, Metallica, Aerosmith, Van Halen, etc, etc. 

Same thing over the past 15 years. Lead single gets radio play for 6 months, and then the mainstream abyss 

not talking about them

talking about GNR

===

and lets not forget airplay is absolutely irrelevant

gimme a GNR single with zero airplay over a NON-GNR single with eternal airplay anyday of the week!

Edited October 9, 2017 by ludurigan

[DieselDaisy]

Look at it this way. Roughly at the mid 00s point was the last time all these chaps were both creatively prolific and seemed to desire to play together again. Slash and Duff (and Matt) formed their own quasi-Guns N' Roses project (Velvet Revolver) and had a hit album from that, with rock singles 'Fall to Pieces'' and 'Slither'; they then proceeded to tour arenas from that. Izzy, who was briefly involved with the aforementioned, was immensely prolific then with his itunes albums and was even guesting with Rose in 2006. Rose was still pursuing his Chinese 'trilogy' or 'double album' or whatever it was meant to be and it was not a foregone conclusion that we'd be left with a truncated inferior version then - for all we know, we could have ended up with versions sounding like the demos or Rio 3 live tracks. Rose also regained his rasp in 2006.

All this activity, creative, (subjectively speaking) excellent in many areas, was happening. It just needed wiser heads to pull it all together. An Izzy, who had his feet in both camps at this stage, or Duff (if we fast forward history) to act as conciliator. A few egos to be put away in a box. 

We might have obtained a resumption of a proper studio-touring band rather than a nostalgia half-arsed thingy which we eventually gained. Running the risk of sounding like Wasted, one album, ''Slither'', ''Fall to Pieces'', ''Chop Away'', ''TWAT'' etc etc - better lyrics on the first two, better musicianship on the last song.

[DieselDaisy]

19 minutes ago, ZoSoRose said:

ACDC, Rolling Stones, Rush, Metallica, Aerosmith, Van Halen, etc, etc. 

Same thing over the past 15 years. Lead single gets radio play for 6 months, and then the mainstream abyss 

Doom and Gloom got a bit of airplay. Play Ball got a bit of play. Black Ice, the album before that, was even a hit album! The hardcore fans, even if they are a small minority of their given crowds which tend to be very casual, enjoyed some of those band's newer material.  

[ZoSoRose]

Just now, DieselDaisy said:

Doom and Gloom got a bit of airplay. Play Ball got a bit of play. Black Ice, the album before that, was even a hit album! The hardcore fans, even if they are a small minority of their given crowds which tend to be very casual, enjoyed some of those band's newer material.  

I like all of these songs. Doom and Gloom was awesome in particular and I love a lot of these band's newer material. I'm just saying the new stuff always gets solid airplay on whatever local rock station, and then that is it. You won't hear anything from Black Ice on the radio again. Same with Doom and Gloom, etc

Im not saying these bands shouldn't release new stuff (I say the opposite, release more!!), but the days of relevant staying hits from these legacy rock bands is done. A new GNR single would be the same thing. It'd get a year tops of being in the "mainstream" and then become nothing more than something for hardcore fans and concerts. It'd be like "Rock N Roll Train" or something. I think the same would have happened in 2006. 

[DieselDaisy]

2 minutes ago, ZoSoRose said:

I like all of these songs. Doom and Gloom was awesome in particular and I love a lot of these band's newer material. I'm just saying the new stuff always gets solid airplay on whatever local rock station, and then that is it. You won't hear anything from Black Ice on the radio again. Same with Doom and Gloom, etc

Im not saying these bands shouldn't release new stuff (I say the opposite, release more!!), but the days of relevant staying hits from these legacy rock bands is done. A new GNR single would be the same thing. It'd get a year tops of being in the "mainstream" and then become nothing more than something for hardcore fans and concerts. It'd be like "Rock N Roll Train" or something. I think the same would have happened in 2006. 

I think Black Ice had some legs. You have to remember that the original poster is discussing 2002 and 2006. This was the end, before it all went tits up. It is the end of the compact disc boom and the end of rock music if you are a cynic like me. I'd agree if you were discussing 2017.

[Tonto]

4 hours ago, todreamofwolves said:

Sorry champ, but I'm just calling it like it is. I couldn't even imagine shelling out bucks for 10 shows when it's the same predictable act EVERY SINGLE SHOW.  They're obviously dialing this thing in for money, and I wouldn't even want to contribute to that. The only way I'd pay to see more than 1 show would be if they actually did reunite GNR (drop Richard, the drummer, and the girl & replace them with the actual members who recorded AFD) OR if Axl and Slash could prove that they were capable of recording NEW quality music together instead of nauseating the fan base for the millionth time with the same stale set lists. Without Izzy's involvement, I personally do not see new music happening ... EVER.

But hey, if seeing Axl & Slash sell themselves out multiple times is your thing, have at it. Your money, not mine ..

So you haven't been a to a single Guns N Roses show? What's the matter, your mommy won't let you?

You haven't been to a show and you have no idea what you're talking about. No one cares that you "personally" don't see new music happening, you're not involved, you don't even go to the shows, you have an uniformed opinion, it's worthless. The setlist is great, it does it's job, they don't play the shows for you, they play them for the people who actually turn up and see the band play live.