Sledge Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 On 31/08/2019 at 8:33 PM, djones1225 said: I remember when an old leak of riad came out and people went nuts over what they thought sounded like axl saying "black heroin". I'm hearing more than that on this mix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 For some reason I have it in my head that Perhaps and IF could be the same song. I remember that back cover mockup & think it's real, but it will probably have been one of many with different tracklists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rovim Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 (edited) 13 hours ago, gabfm said: To me, the 99' versions sounds better because they are more aggressive. The mix is clearly pointing to industrial, the bass, the guitars, drums. I remember AXL looking for the "smell like teen spirit" drums sound. I think the album changed a lot when they realized that industrial rock wasn't selling anymore and decided to turn the songs to a hard rock style. With that change, the essence of the music was kind of lost. Yeah, and that's what I like about this version of the album: more agressive, more faithful to the sound Axl was initially trying to achieve based on what he and others that worked on the album talked about. Just as important maybe, it was also way more organic and the songs weren't lost in the sea of layers. But while argressive hard rock with balls was always a big part of what Guns music sounded like, super polished was also how every main Gn'R album of original material was. Appetite for example is agressive and yet it's played and recorded like the opposite of a Punk album. It's meticulously refined. Chinese ended up sounding more like an old Gn'R album in a way. Not nearly as raw as the 1999 version, more polished and with more prominent guitar moments and Axl maybe trying to find a balance between his ambition to incorporate new influences to Gn'R but keeping more classic elements. It's like Bumble said how he thought the album sounded too mechanical for Gn'R to him. It lacked the sleazy element when it came to the guitars. So take for example the title track: the problem with it is that the 1999 version with Josh sounds great with the drums and bass hitting you hard, without the long intro. It's aggressive and it works, but it's too empty if you look at it as a Guns tune. This is why the official version makes sense to me: Bumble added the sleazy rhythm fretless parts, Bucket added his main solo which elevated the song imo and his leads throughout the song were more like how Slash would have handled it probably. (more focus on guitar) I think trying to create a Guns album without Slash must have been hard as fuck. He naturally brings a certain balance with him to the sound but I think each of the two versions of the album have their strengths and weaknesses. Perhaps the ideal approach really was to release more than just 1 album and that way it could have been more natural. Releasing the first album in 1999 and then taking it from there. Instead Axl tried to cram everything into the same tunes so now priorities change as you're trying to find a sonic and artistic balance with way more elements so you end up doing a disservice to the songs one way or another which is exactly what happened. Edited September 2, 2019 by Rovim 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Live Like a Suicide Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 1 hour ago, rocknroll41 said: Yeah I don’t see Silkworms, Going Down, or OMG ever making it onto a record at this point, which is fine imo. Make room for other songs! OMG was on the alt. setlist last year, so there may be some interest in it among the current band members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vloors Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 (edited) 9 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said: Thyme = PRL. Perhaps is the 3rd song with Brian May. I don't think PRL and Perhaps are the same song? Thyme is an instrumental piece intended for PRL, like a 'stem', as far as I know. Translation may not be great but this article advises the followup to chinese democracy was to be a album called PRL so I highly doubt its a instrumental. If someone could translate it better than google translate please go ahead. Axl told the fans questions by the pool. And he said that in China Dem one song is dedicated to J. Lennon and one is about child abuse. And then he said that: - the second GNR album is to be called "PRL" (the author of the article gave a question mark after the title, no matter if he heard it right) Edited September 2, 2019 by vloors 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lio Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 10 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said: Thyme = PRL. Perhaps is the 3rd song with Brian May. I don't think PRL and Perhaps are the same song? Thyme is an instrumental piece intended for PRL, like a 'stem', as far as I know. I'm sure I read on here PRL and Perhaps are the same. PRL was short for Perhaps ??? I can't recall what it was exactly and I can't seem to find it anymore, but I remember thinking: Odd, it's only two words and PRL is three letters. So if Thyme is the 'intro' to PRL/Perhaps, those three titles seem to be only one song. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambler Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 (edited) These are all interesting ideas. I think, however, that a big role was played by the record company. In 1996 it seems that the record with Slash and Duff was almost done. Slash leaves the band and Axl decides to put the tracks aside. With other bands and in other years the record company would never have accepted this. Instead the label would have pushed for the release of the album allowing Robin to complete the work. What I mean? That a normal band between 1997-2008 would have produced at least three albums. The first with Slash, Duff; the second 1998-2000 with Beavan producer. The third between 2006-2008 with the most recent tracks released on CD Edited September 2, 2019 by Rambler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caedo Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 9 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said: Riad (album version), Scraped, Hardschool and Silkworms all have unnecessary intro's. CD with the shorter intro could've easily been in the middle of the album. Scraped's intro is the best part of the song Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Blue Phoenix Posted September 2, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted September 2, 2019 13 hours ago, rocknroll41 said: Earlier in this thread we were talking about how the leaks from 2003-2008 probably influenced the final tracklist of the 2008 album. another piece to the puzzle is this alleged back cover that leaked in 2006: everyone thought it was fake at the time, but it had almost the exact same back cover format that ended up on the final album, and pre-dates the Antiquiet leaks of Riad and Prostitute (both missing here). Plus, it lines up with Axl’s claim from around that same time that the record would only have 13 songs, as well as Dizzy’s claim from also that same time that Riad wouldn’t be on the record. I think this screenshot also predates the first ever Catcher leak (again missing here), and lines up with Bumble’s claim that Atlas was almost on the album. Also, why else would the band be using a sample from The General as their tour intro around that time unless it was for a reason? Assuming the rumor of an EP at the end of this year ends up being true, it’d be interesting if the songs on it end up being The General, Atlas, Thyme, Ides of March, and Seven. This was fan made by someone on Chinesedemocracy.com many years ago! 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamillos Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 Plus I don't think Sorry would be a suitable track to close the album with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocknroll41 Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 4 hours ago, Live Like a Suicide said: OMG was on the alt. setlist last year, so there may be some interest in it among the current band members. Can’t see in my head how Slash fits into that song. Besides, he dissed it back when it came out, but oh well. People change I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocknroll41 Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 2 hours ago, Blue Phoenix said: This was fan made by someone on Chinesedemocracy.com many years ago! Ah ok. That closes the book on that then. Thanks for clarifying! Pretty interesting that they guessed the format of the back cover so closely tho! Coincidences happen, I guess. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sl4yer Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 3 hours ago, Caedo said: Scraped's intro is the best part of the song Scraped intro is gay 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombux Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 31 minutes ago, sl4yer said: Scraped intro is gay its working name was Thyme. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChineseDemocracy2004 Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 2 hours ago, jamillos said: Plus I don't think Sorry would be a suitable track to close the album with. I agree. Prostitute is one of the best album closers of all time imo. 23 minutes ago, zombux said: its working name was Thyme. I thought Scraped's other name was Lies They Tell? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussTCB Posted September 2, 2019 Author Share Posted September 2, 2019 4 minutes ago, ChineseDemocracy2004 said: Prostitute is one of the best album closers of all time imo. Totally agree. Even after hearing the latest demos, I still think it was always intended to be the album closer. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombux Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 4 minutes ago, ChineseDemocracy2004 said: I thought Scraped's other name was Lies They Tell? just kidding, obviously 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amir Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 9 minutes ago, RussTCB said: Totally agree. Even after hearing the latest demos, I still think it was always intended to be the album closer. It does sound like an album closer, but I wonder if it was always meant to be the closer for Chinese Democracy I when the whole project was envisioned as a trilogy? It sounds like a closer to Axl's career more than anything, can imagine it being the closer on ChiDem III. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swedish Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 41 minutes ago, Amir said: It does sound like an album closer, but I wonder if it was always meant to be the closer for Chinese Democracy I when the whole project was envisioned as a trilogy? It sounds like a closer to Axl's career more than anything, can imagine it being the closer on ChiDem III. The possibility of it being the closer to Axl’s studio career is sadly not totally out of the question 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Towelie Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 (edited) Found this recently in an older thread. This was apparently the tracklisting according to BestBuy before it was changed last minute: 1. Chinese Democracy 2. Scraped 3. Shacklers Eevebge 4. Street of Dreams 5. If The World 6. Better 7. This I Love 8. There Was A Time 9. Riad N The Bedouins 10. Sorry 11. IRS 12. Catcher in The Rye 13. Madagascar 14. Prostitute I gave it a listen the other night and I think I prefer it in that order. Not totally sold on the placement of CITR so late in the album, but Scraped works really well as track 2, leading into Shacklers. Man, I love geeking out with stuff like this. Remember that big-ass 8 page thread I started about CD not having aged well? I was talking out my ass. Hard School has reminded me how much I love Chinese Democracy. Edited September 2, 2019 by Towelie 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gackt Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 I agree that Prostitute is the perfect closing track for ChiDem given its extended outro; however I'd give the "leaked tracklist" above a chance if we were getting a double (quadruple?) album similar to Illusions, with Prostitute closing the second disc. Catcher would also make sense being on the separate album, so we don't have two songs named after popular books on the same disc. But that's all just wishful thinking. What makes me the most skeptical about the validity of the apparent leaked back cover is at what point in time The Blues was renamed to Street of Dreams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
©GnrPersia Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 1 minute ago, Towelie said: Remember that big-ass 8 page thread I started about CD not having aged well? I was talking out my ass. Hard School has reminded me how much I love Chinese Democracy. I recommend give it a couple of weeks more before you change your mind about CD. I still completely agree with you on that thread. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Guapo Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 (edited) After letting the excitement cool down a bit... I think some of these leaked versions are far superior to the album versions, some are worse in some parts and better in others. Hard School is great but sounds unfinished. That being said, the songs are mostly not that great and Axls singing is nowhere near his level of the old days. I think the strongest track is Going down actually. I'm soo tired of everything Chinese Democracy, so I REALLY hope the first song they come out with is new. Like, NEW new. Edited September 2, 2019 by El Guapo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post El Nono Pololo Posted September 2, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted September 2, 2019 1 minute ago, El Guapo said: I think some of these leaked versions are far superior to the album versions, some are worse in some parts and better in others. Hard School is great but sounds unfinished. That being said, the songs are mostly not that great and Axls singing is nowhere near his level of the old days. I'm soo tired of everything Chinese Democracy, so I REALLY hope the first song they come out with is new. Like, NEW new. New School The Seargent Sphace Heracles Made a Gesture of Indifference Eight Me and My Roy Orbison 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocknroll41 Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 15 minutes ago, El Nono Pololo said: New School The Seargent Sphace Heracles Made a Gesture of Indifference Eight Me and My Roy Orbison Up By the Sea Retard The Lone Ranger’s Sidekick C-Tune 29 minutes ago, Gackt said: I agree that Prostitute is the perfect closing track for ChiDem given its extended outro; however I'd give the "leaked tracklist" above a chance if we were getting a double (quadruple?) album similar to Illusions, with Prostitute closing the second disc. Catcher would also make sense being on the separate album, so we don't have two songs named after popular books on the same disc. But that's all just wishful thinking. What makes me the most skeptical about the validity of the apparent leaked back cover is at what point in time The Blues was renamed to Street of Dreams. Axl still called it The Blues in a 2006 interview. Make of that what you will. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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