SoulMonster Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 2 hours ago, Ace Nova said: If this doesn't bring a smile to your face... Why should that bring a sdmile to my face? The only positive was some people helping a police man out. The rest was just sickening violence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 9, 2020 Author Share Posted September 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: Why should that bring a sdmile to my face? The only positive was some people helping a police man out. The rest was just sickening violence. I guess you could smile then frown? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, Ace Nova said: I guess you could smile then frown? Pretty much what I did That smile got turned upside down pretty quick! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillionsOfSpiders Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 19 hours ago, Blackstar said: Absolutely sickening. What kind of person must you be to be able to shoot a child having a mental breakdown? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverburst80 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 Reminds me of the time the cops hunted down a mentally ill man who was camping in the mountains and shot him to death in Albaquerque....his back was turned ( have we seen this before?) and they also had police dogs that could have handled the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 More than 93 % of all Black Lives Matter protests in the USA have been peaceful: "In more than 93% of all demonstrations connected to the movement, demonstrators have not engaged in violence or destructive activity. Peaceful protests are reported in over 2,400 distinct locations around the country. Violent demonstrations, meanwhile, have been limited to fewer than 220 locations — under 10% of the areas that experienced peaceful protests."https://acleddata.com/acleddatanew/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/ACLED_USDataReview_Sum2020_SeptWebPDF.pdf Despite this, "one recent poll suggested that 42% of respondents believe most protesters [associated with the BLM movement] are trying to incite violence or destroy property". Hmm...how can this be? How can people have such an erroneous perception of the movement? Can it be due to people deliberately focusing on the rare examples of violence and destruction to undermine the BLM movement because they don't agree with racial equality? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 10, 2020 Author Share Posted September 10, 2020 11 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: More than 93 % of all Black Lives Matter protests in the USA have been peaceful: "In more than 93% of all demonstrations connected to the movement, demonstrators have not engaged in violence or destructive activity. Peaceful protests are reported in over 2,400 distinct locations around the country. Violent demonstrations, meanwhile, have been limited to fewer than 220 locations — under 10% of the areas that experienced peaceful protests."https://acleddata.com/acleddatanew/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/ACLED_USDataReview_Sum2020_SeptWebPDF.pdf Despite this, "one recent poll suggested that 42% of respondents believe most protesters [associated with the BLM movement] are trying to incite violence or destroy property". Hmm...how can this be? How can people have such an erroneous perception of the movement? Can it be due to people deliberately focusing on the rare examples of violence and destruction to undermine the BLM movement because they don't agree with racial equality? You mean like how 99.9999% of police encounters are safe and non violent? Just like people deliberately focusing on the on even rarer occurrence of police violence? To undermine the police in the US for political gain because they know that most people have no idea what the facts and true statistics are. If you think 7% is a rare occurrence, what is 0.0001%? Amazing how that works both ways, huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 Just now, Ace Nova said: You mean like how 99.9999% of police encounters are safe and non violent? Just like people deliberately focusing on the on even rarer occurrence of police violence? To undermine the police in the US for political gain because they know that most people have no idea what the facts and true statistics are. If you think 7% is a rare occurrence, what is 0.0001%? Amazing how that works both ways, huh? But no one is denying that the majority of police encounters are safe . It is just that with law enforcement you expect there to be zero examples of officers shooting people in the back, and it is even more worrisome when these people tend to be black. As for mass movements of people you would expect there to be some looting and vandalizations. That's par for the course when unruly masses of people rise up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 And further to my point: https://www.prisonpolicy.org/blog/2020/06/05/policekillings/ We can't just swipe away police killings by pointing to the fact that the majority of police encounters are non-violent. That is doing the police force a disservice. And its victims. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 10, 2020 Author Share Posted September 10, 2020 Just now, SoulMonster said: As for mass movements of people you would expect there to be some looting and vandalizations. That's par for the course when unruly masses of people rise up. How about people getting killed? Are you aware that you are (at least) 100x more likely to get killed at a BLM/Antifa vs. Militia protest/riot than you are by police? (And it's likely more than "100x more likely" but I just don't feel like doing the math now ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Ace Nova said: Are you aware that you are (at least) 100x more likely to get killed at a BLM/Antifa vs. Militia protest/riot than you are by police? Are you arguing that since you are more likely to be killed during a mass protest like BLM than at the hands of the police, the police are not to be critisized? Is that how low you have set the bar for the police who are supposed to protect us, supposed to be trained in non-violent conflict resolution, and is an accountable arm of the government? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 10, 2020 Author Share Posted September 10, 2020 (edited) 20 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: Are you arguing that since you are more likely to be killed during a mass protest like BLM than at the hands of the police, the police are not to be critisized? Is that how low you have set the bar for the police who are supposed to protect us, supposed to be trained in non-violent conflict resolution, and is an accountable arm of the government? No. I'm saying it's a two-way street. There are "bad people" in the U.S. that commit violent (sometimes deadly) acts. To defend them (all) as being "innocent" victims is just ignoring reality. Edited September 10, 2020 by Ace Nova Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 10, 2020 Author Share Posted September 10, 2020 (edited) 29 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: And further to my point: https://www.prisonpolicy.org/blog/2020/06/05/policekillings/ We can't just swipe away police killings by pointing to the fact that the majority of police encounters are non-violent. That is doing the police force a disservice. And its victims. Police officers in the U.S. are shot, killed and injured at much higher rates than any other country. https://nleomf.org/facts-figures/law-enforcement-facts It's correlated to a "culture of violence" (among a very small % of the population that tends to commit the vast majority of violent acts) more than anything else... and the statistics support it. Edited September 10, 2020 by Ace Nova Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 10, 2020 Author Share Posted September 10, 2020 @SoulMonster Sometimes it can be difficult to understand the "other side of it"....take a look at this.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 23 minutes ago, Ace Nova said: There are "bad people" in the U.S. that commit violent (sometimes deadly) acts. To defend them (all) as being "innocent" victims is just ignoring reality. No one is denying that many of the people shot by the police are criminals and might have done something bad immediately prior to being shot by the police. What we are saying that this is irrelevant, the police killings are still not justified. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 22 minutes ago, Ace Nova said: Police officers in the U.S. are shot, killed and injured at much higher rates than any other country. https://nleomf.org/facts-figures/law-enforcement-facts It's correlated to a "culture of violence" (among a very small % of the population that tends to commit the vast majority of violent acts) more than anything else... and the statistics support it. And as I have said before, one of the reasons why you have a "culture of violence" is the fact that the police are so quick to shoot, which results in people arming themselves and being quicker to fire at the police, too. This is a two-way street, and the militarization of your police is part of the problem. This "culture of violence" is also evident in people defending the police when they shoot people in the back and people cheer civilians who use violence on others, even when helping the police. You are a fucked up society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 10, 2020 Author Share Posted September 10, 2020 1 minute ago, SoulMonster said: No one is denying that many of the people shot by the police are criminals and might have done something bad immediately prior to being shot by the police. What we are saying that this is irrelevant, the police killings are still not justified. The few you see on social media may not be. But the majority of police shootings in the U.S. are likely justified....you just don't see them on social media because the cops are probably getting shot at or assaulted first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 Just now, Ace Nova said: The few you see on social media may not be. But the majority of police shootings in the U.S. are likely justified....you just don't see them on social media because the cops are probably getting shot at or assaulted first. The majority of police shootings everywhere are likely justified in the sense that it is the last resort to protect the officers or bystanders. Bu fact still remain that the police in USA more frequently commit unjustified killings (a result of bad police) and in general shoot more (a result of bad society). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 10, 2020 Author Share Posted September 10, 2020 Just now, SoulMonster said: And as I have said before, one of the reasons why you have a "culture of violence" is the fact that the police are so quick to shoot, which results in people arming themselves and being quicker to fire at the police, too. This is a two-way street, and the militarization of your police is part of the problem. This "culture of violence" is also evident in people defending the police when they shoot people in the back and people cheer civilians who use violence on others, even when helping the police. You are a fucked up society. No...lol. Most of the "violent people" in the U.S. are likely drug dealers, armed robbers, gang members, murderers, rapists, etc that are on the streets and they have guns because they commit crimes with their guns....not because they are "scared to be shot by police". Smh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 1 minute ago, Ace Nova said: No...lol. Most of the "violent people" in the U.S. are likely drug dealers, armed robbers, gang members, murderers, rapists, etc that are on the streets and they have guns because they commit crimes with their guns....not because they are "scared to be shot by police". Smh. I said "one of the reasons".... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 10, 2020 Author Share Posted September 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: The majority of police shootings everywhere are likely justified in the sense that it is the last resort to protect the officers or bystanders. Bu fact still remain that the police in USA more frequently commit unjustified killings (a result of bad police) and in general shoot more (a result of bad society). That is possible but like that gentleman said in the video...the police would "love additional training and resources" ...but the "bad elements" in society need to be dealt with as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 10, 2020 Author Share Posted September 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: I said "one of the reasons".... Fair enough. Watch that video when you get a chance. It paints a much clearer picture from a guy that deals with it every day of his life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, Ace Nova said: That is possible but like that gentleman said in the video...the police would "love additional training and resources" ...but the "bad elements" in society need to be dealt with as well. And this balance between not committing unjustified killings and actually doing proper police work including dealing with "bad elements" is something most other relevant countries do better than USA. So yeah, training is one of the solutions and I made a post some weeks ago where I went in more detail on this. But as long as your society is so fucked up -- when police are defended and cheered when they shoot people and when so many civilians carry guns -- we cannot realistically expect everything to be solved through training of the police aloe. Your whole society needs to grow up a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 10, 2020 Author Share Posted September 10, 2020 1 minute ago, SoulMonster said: So yeah, training is one of the solutions and I made a post some weeks ago where I went in more detail on this. But as long as your society is so fucked up -- when police are defended and cheered when they shoot people and when so many civilians carry guns -- we cannot realistically expect everything to be solved through training of the police aloe. Your whole society needs to grow up a bit. I agree with this to an extent except that it's a small % of society that "cheers the police shooting people". It's likely a very small % of society that commits violent acts. Maybe some of fringe elements would "cheer the police shooting people". (I doubt it's more than 5%-10%). It just seems like a lot more than that because they scream the loudest. Just like you would think that a high % of the left are violent radicals..but it's likely around 5-10% on that side as well. So let's say 5-10% of the fringe left and 5-10% of the fringe right "need to grow up". With another 1% or so that needs to stop committing crimes, etc. That would leave about 80% (or so) of people in the U.S. that would agree with most of what your saying. A more moderate (less violent) society + better police training and funding would likely be a great start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 12, 2020 Author Share Posted September 12, 2020 (edited) And it's only 3 pm or so in Chicago...we still have 56 hours to go before the weekend is over. Just so everyone can see a clear picture - there have already been more unarmed people (By other people) shot today in Chicago alone than police shot (unarmed) all of last year (in the entire U.S.) Think about that. Edited September 12, 2020 by Ace Nova 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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