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The US Politics/Elections Thread 2.0


downzy

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1 hour ago, downzy said:

The problem is with the American system.  The public largely stays disengaged and only really tunes in during elections.  But industry does not.  They work the system, hire lobbyists, offer six figure incomes to compliant politicians when they leave politics to sit on boards or serve as a "consultant."  Because America chose to not go the parliamentary route, there are numerous access points where special interest engagement can nix meaningful reform.  With Democrats having a slim majority in the House and razor thin majority in the Senate, it only takes a handful of House members or one senator to kill meaningful drug price reform.  The vast majority of Democrats are for it, but guys like Manchin help kill it.  So even when Democrats get in, they rarely have the numbers to overcome the institutional deficits the American system has setup.  That's why Obamacare was such a rarity.  It's unlikely Democrats, the only party that gives a shit about drug price reform, will ever have that kind of power at the federal level for a generation or two to make any substantive changes.  

It is scary how much hate there is now between the two parties. Many Democrates are getting "hate mail" and threats to kill them. What the hell is going on? Trump started all this hate and I want to know who is going to end it before it's too late?

I have never experienced this kind of behavior ever. I don't want my daughter living in a world where everyone reacts with hate.  Common sense is out the window again.

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So is Donald Trump ever going to have any charges stick to him? With the way things are going he's going to wipe the floor with the Republican Primary, and he very well could win the Presidency in 2024. Where are all these charges that he was facing? Is any of this going to stick? I've gone from a guy who voted for him in 2016 to being so sick of him I'd like to see him put away.

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4 hours ago, Basic_GnR_Fan said:

So is Donald Trump ever going to have any charges stick to him? With the way things are going he's going to wipe the floor with the Republican Primary, and he very well could win the Presidency in 2024. Where are all these charges that he was facing? Is any of this going to stick? I've gone from a guy who voted for him in 2016 to being so sick of him I'd like to see him put away.

Yeah, the whole SDNY investigations have not panned out (yet).  The thinking there might have been that they needed more and better evidence and have sought to roll up his underlings in the hopes that they can bolster their case against Trump.  Charging a former President is no simple or easy thing.  As the old saying goes, if you aim for the king, you better not miss. 

Why he was never charged for campaign finance crimes relating to the Stormy Daniels payout is beyond me.  He was referenced directly in Michael Cohen's indictment as "Individual-1."  Cohen did hard time for that crime.  Unfortunately the statute of limitations has run its course for Trump on that charge.

There was a lot of reporting about how the Trump Organization would devalue properties to the IRS but over-inflate their value to banks.  That's a clear case of fraud and tax evasion.  Why that has yet to be openly litigated, against Trump or his company, is yet to be revealed. 

It would appear that the tax-case is still ongoing, with prosecutors revealing two months ago that large tranches of documents and information have been recently discovered in a co-conspirator in the Wisselberg (Trump Org's CFO) case.
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/09/allen-weisselberg-donald-trump-trump-organization-evidence

There's also a lot of movement in Georgia, with reports indicating a local DA convening a Grand Jury on whether to prosecute Trump over election interference.  That also seems to be cut and dry, but I suppose all of this stuff takes time.

It's been interesting to watch some the more established Republican operatives attempt to put some distance between Trump and the Republican Party.  Chris Christie has come out swinging of late.  Rupert Murdoch also made it clear that the conservative movement needs to move on from Trump if he doesn't shut the fuck up about the 2020 election (good luck with that Rupert).

Trump does plan on running again.  While I doubt this is a factor, it makes more sense in terms of hurting him politically to follow through on prosecutions closer to the primary season.

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18 minutes ago, downzy said:

Good day for Rittenhouse.

Acquitted of all charges AND received job offers from three sitting Republican House members. 

That kid is going places!

Well Matt Gaetz at least has form If he’s gonna have to cross state lines to take up the job. 😂

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5 minutes ago, Dazey said:

Well Matt Gaetz at least has form If he’s gonna have to cross state lines to take up the job. 😂

Gaetz wants to be his +1 for Rittenhouse's highschool parties.  

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11 hours ago, downzy said:

Good day for Rittenhouse.

Acquitted of all charges AND received job offers from three sitting Republican House members. 

That kid is going places!

It's fucking insane!!! :no: The guy took his AR-15 with him. Nobody travells with a gun if there no plan to use it at any given situation :shrugs: This guy went there to stop a riot. Or at the very least to fight against those people. Somebody who is not a police officer. Nor he is from Wisconsin. It was none of his fuckin business to be there. How can he claim self defense?

I'm assuming the veredict can be appealed

Edited by Padme
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Bill Maher had the Mayor elect of New York city on his show last night. Wish we could have a mayor like this guy. He's got common sense and knows exactly what to do to help his people. This guy should run for President one day. I really like him alot. Sorry I forgot his name, but he seems like a really good guy who actually wants to change things for the better.

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10 hours ago, Padme said:

It's fucking insane!!! :no: The guy took his AR-15 with him. Nobody travells with a gun if there no plan to use it at any given situation :shrugs: This guy went there to stop a riot. Or at the very least to fight against those people. Somebody who is not a police officer. Nor he is from Wisconsin. It was none of his fuckin business to be there. How can he claim self defense?

I'm assuming the veredict can be appealed

There's a serial murder here in Dallas, who had his trial this week.  There's proof this guy has killed many older women and yet one juror held out. The judge was livid. Anyway, he sat there smiling the whole time, but the judge said he will be tried again since he's killed many other women. What the fuck was that juror thinking?

As for the young guy, he wasn't supposed to be able to buy that gun, yet he did and traveling over state lines was okay? The gun lawas really have to be changed here in the US. This is crazy.

Can't wait to see how the Georgia trial goes with the white guys who killed that poor innocent black man.  They are definitley guilty, but who knows how the jurors will go?

As for the kid with the gun, I knew he would be innocent because you just knew the judge was on his side, by his actions. Crazy.

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15 hours ago, Padme said:

It's fucking insane!!! :no: The guy took his AR-15 with him. Nobody travells with a gun if there no plan to use it at any given situation :shrugs: This guy went there to stop a riot. Or at the very least to fight against those people. Somebody who is not a police officer. Nor he is from Wisconsin. It was none of his fuckin business to be there. How can he claim self defense?

I'm assuming the veredict can be appealed

You do realize one of the guys he shot also had a gun, as well as the guy (assume to be a protester) who fired into the air before Rosenbaum charged Rittenhouse. This was about a charge of first degree murder, not about was it smart to go to a potential riot zone that the police aren't doing their job for with a gun.

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6 hours ago, Basic_GnR_Fan said:

You do realize one of the guys he shot also had a gun, as well as the guy (assume to be a protester) who fired into the air before Rosenbaum charged Rittenhouse. This was about a charge of first degree murder, not about was it smart to go to a potential riot zone that the police aren't doing their job for with a gun.

That's a job for the police, not for some guy who thinks he is Terminator. If the guy wanted to protect himself and his relatives. He could stayed inside his house holding his rifle. If he sees a mob going to his house, then shoot.  The guy decided to put himself in a dangerous situation when he went to the streets knowing what was going on.

 

 

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18 hours ago, Padme said:

That's a job for the police, not for some guy who thinks he is Terminator. If the guy wanted to protect himself and his relatives. He could stayed inside his house holding his rifle. If he sees a mob going to his house, then shoot.  The guy decided to put himself in a dangerous situation when he went to the streets knowing what was going on.

 

 

That was kind of the problem, the police decided to not enforce anything in certain parts of the city which led to anarchy. I'm not saying I'd recommend someone go down there with a gun to try and be an unofficial national guardsman, but he did, and was attacked by each person he eventually shot. Each person that got shot was legitimate self defense in relation to a 1st degree murder charge, and that's what the jury found. And as I said, he wasn't the only one there with a gun, people who were there to protest or be protest-adjacent also had guns.

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5 hours ago, Basic_GnR_Fan said:

I'm not saying I'd recommend someone go down there with a gun to try and be an unofficial national guardsman

And that's why he can't claim self defense. He went down there. He thought it was his duty to stop the riot. He put himself in harm ways. Nobody broke into his house. Nobody picked him or his property as a target. 

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10 hours ago, Basic_GnR_Fan said:

Several people have been killed in Waukesha, WI (north of Kenosha, WI) in a car attack. I wonder if this attacker was hyped up on the Rittenhouse coverage?

https://www.cbs58.com/news/breaking-waukesha-holiday-parade-evacuated-following-emergency-event-involving-gunshots-speeding-vehicle

They're saying so far it has nothing to do with domestic or international terror; that it has nothing to do with the Rittenhouse case.  I'm not sure how they can make that determination so soon, so I guess we'll have to wait and see.

It's just tragic.  I really hope there was no kids amongst the five have died so far.  

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8 hours ago, Padme said:

And that's why he can't claim self defense. He went down there. He thought it was his duty to stop the riot. He put himself in harm ways. Nobody broke into his house. Nobody picked him or his property as a target. 

Your right to self-defense doesn't magically go away when you leave your property. The men who attacked him that night had no right to do so and a jury found Kyle acted in self-defense.

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1 hour ago, Basic_GnR_Fan said:

Your right to self-defense doesn't magically go away when you leave your property. The men who attacked him that night had no right to do so and a jury found Kyle acted in self-defense.

He went there. If he decided to get in the mess. He had to deal with anything that may happen to him. And that's the  case when anyone  goes to a place knowing there is a riot going on there :shrugs:

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Padme said:

He went there. If he decided to get in the mess. He had to deal with anything that may happen to him. And that's the  case when anyone  goes to a place knowing there is a riot going on there :shrugs:

 

 

 

I agree it was dumb to go down there, but the fact of the matter is he was charged with 1st degree murder, which implies he went there specifically to murder people. What actually happened is each person he shot attacked him first (one of them with a gun). That's just not first degree murder, and the jury agreed.

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10 hours ago, Basic_GnR_Fan said:

I agree it was dumb to go down there, but the fact of the matter is he was charged with 1st degree murder, which implies he went there specifically to murder people. What actually happened is each person he shot attacked him first (one of them with a gun). That's just not first degree murder, and the jury agreed.

No, neither guy had a gun. Rosembaum was unarmed and Huber was "armed" with a skateboard. Of course the 3 of them could've avoided this tragedy had they stayed at home.

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