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How Well Do You Think 2000 Intentions era CD Would Have Been Received?


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Track list aside I think the album should have been out 2002 at the latest. 

From the start Nu-GNR was doomed to fail when it didn't have a record of their own to promote. If Axl truly wanted a 'new' era for GNR he'd have had CD out, have it make up the majority of the setlist, and play smaller venues. 

CD should have been the radio-friendly/casual introduction to the new band which could have been followed up by experimental albums once they'd established themselves. 

I think Going Down would actually have been a better "single" than anything on CD in terms of casual appeal, the album always lacked a short ballad for radio play. 

 

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20 hours ago, ©GnrPersia said:

If CD material would come out in 2000-2002 it would shake the rock scene. It could be a defining moment in new era Rock music, at least for its own decade. 

And people of 2021 would always think of it as an art piece that was way ahead of its time.

 

 

 

...Forget about all of that, instead we've got laundry bag + toy truck and son of Axl's toilet cleaner ridiculing passionate fans and trolling us in Reddit.

Fernando on reddit annoys the piss out of me haha. 

Like already mentioned, I think it would have been accepted much more than it did in 08. And honestly, I think it was a better product in 2000. I recently came across the recordings of Going Down, Oh My God, and Silkworms with Ron on them. Between those, and listening to the earlier versions of what we got in 2008, Ron for me didn't add anything good to the tracks. I say that loving Ron as a person, but IMO he made the tracks harder to enjoy. Like the bridge in Oh My God with him. There was nothing wrong with it on the 99 release. The aimless noodle and wah pedal combo just takes me out of it. 

Not to mention the title track. On the album version his fretless on the verses buried Tommy's bass, which I think majority here felt brought a lot more to the song. 

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16 hours ago, DefinitelyInThisLifetime said:

I think you’re quite wrong there. There was a different scene in 2000, it was a strange time, but one that people would have said “ok Slash and those guys aren’t there” and perhaps it would have been as well received as some Sabbath albums, even Ozzy solo stuff. Slash brings no Guns to the Roses.

Axl and Slash are both GNR. Casual fans  and the AFD5 fans (myself included in the AFD5) would say that they are equally important. Like I said before in this thread, CD likely wouldn't have succeeded in 2000-2002 since it was under the GNR brand name. Like with any brands, people expect certain things.

 You bring up Ozzy. Ozzy went solo and didn't use the Black Sabbath name. Axl is my childhood idol, but he made the wrong calculation in thinking that GNR would be successful without Slash.  I think Axl could have been successful as just a solo artist. He could have experimented with music  and probably would have had a better reception.  It just would have been better if GNR just went on hiatus and let people do their own thing for a bit rather than Axl trying to fit something that wasn't there. 

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On 1/20/2021 at 7:03 PM, ©GnrPersia said:

and they Axl blew it.

Unless by "they" you meant the voices in his head.

Axl is to blame but the label should have realized much earlier that there was going to be no SCOM Pt.2 also.

I do wonder without Best Buy bailing them out would we have ever got the album.

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Better, but not much better. People like us would have eaten it up three ways to Sunday but in the year 2000, it was the Bizkit, Rage Against the Machine, Korn and bands of that ilk who were all the rage.

Edited by Nintari
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3 hours ago, Nintari said:

Better, but not much better. People like us would have eaten it up three ways to Sunday but in the year 2000, it was the Bizkit, Rage Against the Machine, Korn and bands of that ilk who were all the rage.

That’s why I think an industrial/heavy album would have worked well. People would have said “they’ve moved with the times” and “Axl gets modern music” etc.

You can’t say that something like State Of Grace wouldn’t hold with songs like Spiders by System Of A Down and the other similar bands. 

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Many people, even casual fans thought Slash was on 2008 CD, and I've talked to people today who think Slash is still out of GN'R.

Point is, I'd bet a majority of the market who would purchase an album don't even know who is playing on the record they are buying.

We are a clear exception, being hardcore fans. 

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4 hours ago, DefinitelyInThisLifetime said:

That’s why I think an industrial/heavy album would have worked well. People would have said “they’ve moved with the times” and “Axl gets modern music” etc.

You can’t say that something like State Of Grace wouldn’t hold with songs like Spiders by System Of A Down and the other similar bands. 

State of Grace is really good, but songs like Scraped, Riad, OMG, Eye on You, Silkworms are pretty bad any anyone's standard.

I'm fairly confident if a band like Sum 41 or Good Charlotte (or someone equally shit) came back with a new album that included Scraped - it would be the worst song on that album by some distance.

It's fairly unbelievable that that song was written in the first place, let alone worked on by several musicians and actually released.

 

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2 hours ago, Pele said:

State of Grace is really good, but songs like Scraped, Riad, OMG, Eye on You, Silkworms are pretty bad any anyone's standard.

I'm fairly confident if a band like Sum 41 or Good Charlotte (or someone equally shit) came back with a new album that included Scraped - it would be the worst song on that album by some distance.

It's fairly unbelievable that that song was written in the first place, let alone worked on by several musicians and actually released.

 

Except for the weird awkward vocal intro, I like Scraped. It's a straight rocker with a killer guitar solo. 

Re-worked OMG with Bucket was not bad, Silkworms improved too. 

Definitely not "big guns" but, better than some of the songs on the Illusions IMO.

I liked Eye On You, but I can see it not being album material for GN'R in the state we heard it in. Riad, yeah not the best.

With a guitar solo and a final vocal take, State Of Grace definitely has potential. 

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On 1/21/2021 at 2:44 PM, Sisyphus said:

They had so many chances if you really think about it. If they released it anywhere between 2000 and 2002 they would have avoided the whole "most expensive album never made" and all the other jokes regarding the delay.

I don't remember the details but I was browsing the Billboard data some time ago and I was stunned how many albums GN'R were still selling in 1996, 1997, 1998. Like a lot. And they were even more popular in Europe. A new album in 2000 had potential to be huge because the demand was still there.

They could have released in 2001 after Vegas and Rio and then go on tour. But the tour got canceled. They had another chance in 2002. Could have done it before the start of the tour or after the VMA but a good performance at the VMA would've been crucial. They botched it up. The VMA show wasn't all bad though but Axl appeared to be out of breath during Jungle and that completely overshadowed the medley, new band and Madagascar. Anoter big opprotunity wasted. They could have released Better before VMA and then play Madagascar at the event. A lot of people would recognize the potential "oh, the second cool new GN'R song I've heard in a week". It would get the ball rolling. But no.

Album could have been dropped at the end of 2002 but you'd have to pull your shit together and complete the tour. Didn't happen. Just so many mistakes. After that the whole thing became a joke. They had some momentum again in 2006 and yet they blew it again. Not to mention they always made mistake on the biggest stages or televised events. VMA 2002, Axl's scream in 2006 VMA is cringeworthy, Bridge School disaster, Rock in Rio 2011. Even Rock in Rio in 2006 was not nearly as good as Rock Am Ring for example. So many mistakes.

In the end the album was released in the worst possible way. Limited accessibility in the US probably didn't help. No promotion. Axl in hiding. I belive Axl did it so protect himself. That way he could blame the lack of success on zero promotion and his non-involvement. If he had gone all out and the album flopped, it would be really hard on him. Which is a shame because the material is strong enough.

All in all I'm happy we got the album in the end. 

Well said.

But the man want to do it "his way". I respect that.

And was a fail? Idk. Only he knows. Sometime you won.... sometimes you learn.

 

Adding. Maybe next time?

Edited by axlvai
Naaa
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6 hours ago, Pele said:

State of Grace is really good, but songs like Scraped, Riad, OMG, Eye on You, Silkworms are pretty bad any anyone's standard.

:lol: lol okay granddad, we'll put Appetite on again for you

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Riad is not industrial. I don't even know how you guys still think it is. The song is literally the most traditional riff-based on the record (Shackler too, but that's way too heavy), considering that almost every other heavy track has a power chord driven riff. The drums are taken straight from Muse's Time is Running Out. The few synths and the pulse intro are just there. With different production, it would've take minimal effort to make it sounding more like classic rock. 

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I honestly think that be it 2008 or in 2000, the biggest mistake Axl made was to attach this project with the GNR name.  And that isn't even a "this isn't GNR" thing, I just think that not having the immediate association with one of the biggest and most famous rock discogs from the 80s onwards would have done Chinese some good and set it apart from preconceived notions

I know Axl probably wanted the big record deal funding that comes from the GNR name, but maybe a tighter and stricter budget would have forced him to make a more cohesive musical statement in a shorter amount of time as well

Edited by WhazUp
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53 minutes ago, Voodoochild said:

Riad is not industrial. I don't even know how you guys still think it is. The song is literally the most traditional riff-based on the record (Shackler too, but that's way too heavy), considering that almost every other heavy track has a power chord driven riff. The drums are taken straight from Muse's Time is Running Out. The few synths and the pulse intro are just there. With different production, it would've take minimal effort to make it sounding more like classic rock. 

I haven’t mentioned Rhiad too much as I actually felt it needed work on it in its 2000s incarnation. It’s a brilliant song and if it was slower with a more chugging vibe it could EASILY have been almost a Kashmir-esque vibe to it. 

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11 minutes ago, DefinitelyInThisLifetime said:

I haven’t mentioned Rhiad too much as I actually felt it needed work on it in its 2000s incarnation. It’s a brilliant song and if it was slower with a more chugging vibe it could EASILY have been almost a Kashmir-esque vibe to it. 

It's an awful song.

Opens up with those horrible wails.  Then probably the worst opening lyrics in GNR history, 'But I don't give a fuck about them cause I am crazy!!"

I can't believe they actually presented this as a serious piece of work.

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5 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said:

Well... Eye On You, Silkworms and Scraped are the worst of the CD era tracks we've heard, and Rhiad seemed to get worse with each passing year. :ph34r:

OMG is a good song with a bad mix, though.

I think Scraped's instrumental is great, it's definitely the low point on the album lyrically for me though.  I get what Axl was going for with the uplifting lyrics and message, but there's none of his trademark balls or aggression to his delivery.  The day can't come soon enough where a pre-Bumble Scraped demo comes to light.  Eye On You and Silkworms are unfinished so it's hard to really grade them, but I think both songs have great potential; even if you don't care for Silkworm's lyrics, its energy is undeniable.  :P  I've always liked Riad, the Village demo kinda buries the studio version though.

Oh My God is easily one of GNR's most underrated tunes, all it needed was a proper album mix which it had likely got at some point.

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It’s really simple IMO: if Axl had the balls to have gone solo, he could have been on top of the world again while he still had a decent voice. His insecurities are the root of GnR falling apart in the first place, and they’re why he has only released 15 songs under the GnR brand in over 25 years. 

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It would have sold well because albums still had a chance, back then and something like a GN'R comeback would have been very big for its time.

It would have been reviewed much more divisively and would not have gotten the kind of warm reception that came with eighteen years of anticipation, finally rewarded.

It would have actually have been "of it's time" and that would have been both a big plus and a point of derision, for the band. 

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Riad is great, the locker leaks version is killer. The tambourine and heavy drums and bass, I listen to that a lot. And the Brain new drums version. 

The album version is lame, as with everything on the final release it had its balls chopped off and sounded so weak and thin. Where did Tommy's bass go!? 

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