themadcaplaughs Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 19 hours ago, downzy said: I was there for that too and it did not land well. It certainly didn't help that it was the fourth or fifth straight new song played in a row. This is easily my least liked song on the album. It blows my mind having heard some of the leaks from a couple of years ago that this song was included. There were so many better options. At best, this should have been a b-side to a fourth or fifth single released from Chinese Democracy. Per certain wrestlers who used to run message board about GN'R, the track list for Chinese Democracy remained fairly solid over the years, despite the leaks. That being said, he did say "Riad" was possibly a tacked on at the last minute since it had already leaked. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walapino Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 (edited) In general the "fast rocker songs" on CD suck! I hate Scrapped, Shackler and Rhiad are meh and IRS is good but nothing to get too excited. Axl really needs classic GNR alumni to pull good rockers off for sure! Edited May 25, 2021 by Walapino Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowOfTheWave Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 Shacklers is one of the best GNR rockers from any era. IRS is a bottom 5 GNR song. Just an Axl rant pasted over a bland string of notes, not a touch of melody in the thing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Guapo Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 1 minute ago, ShadowOfTheWave said: Shacklers is one of the best GNR rockers from any era. No, just no Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowOfTheWave Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 (edited) 1 minute ago, El Guapo said: No, just no Well, I don't like a lot of the stuff classic GNR fans like, I think songs like Perfect Crime, You're Crazy & Garden Of Eden are pure uninspired shit, so my taste is probably different than most here. Edited May 25, 2021 by ShadowOfTheWave 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr-fukaji Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 I really liked the music/band on the 2002 bootlegs, havent heard them in ages but I think the Japanese shows maybe, sounded great and I love the middle 8 bit, but the lyrics have always been really awkward Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 On 5/24/2021 at 7:27 AM, Underhardy said: Axl probably heard you. Ate him alive for a week and a half and he cracked, tour over. Thanks... Sure, it could have been all @RussTCB's fault. Or it might have been the hundreds of other people in attendance that night that were openly booing after the fourth or fifth new song in a row. Tough to say 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussTCB Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 1 minute ago, downzy said: Sure, it could have been all @RussTCB's fault. Or it might have been the hundreds of other people in attendance that night that were openly booing after the fourth or fifth new song in a row. Tough to say That's another thing about that night: the overall crowd size. It'll 20 years ago next year (Jesus Christ!) but I remember The Palace being about 3/4 full at one point but less then half full by the time GN'R even went on. Am I remembering that right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 1 minute ago, RussTCB said: That's another thing about that night: the overall crowd size. It'll 20 years ago next year (Jesus Christ!) but I remember The Palace being about 3/4 full at one point but less then half full by the time GN'R even went on. Am I remembering that right? I can't say one way or another. I was on the floor and only really remember it not being a packed show and it being even less packed half-way through the show. By the time Axl had introduced his fifth new GNR song, the audience might have been cut in half from where it started. I do remember it was one of the easier GNR shows to get out of since there weren't that many people around by the end of the aborted show. I think some stuck around in the hopes Axl was coming out to finish the set. I had a long drive back to my friend's place in London, ON so didn't stick around once I saw Axl storm off halfway through Patience. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mystery Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 2 hours ago, Walapino said: In general the "fast rocker songs" on CD suck! I hate Scrapped, Shackler and Rhiad are meh and IRS is good but nothing to get too excited. Axl really needs classic GNR alumni to pull good rockers off for sure! I think the thing is these songs would have made more sense had they released closer to the time they were recorded (realize Scraped came later). They're not great songs, but the in the late 90's, industrial tinged rock was still popular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay410 Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 It's one of my favorite tracks, particularly the “ohhhh my salvation” chorus bit. Production-wise it suffers similarly to the rest if CD except worse, just a bunch of extra bullshit bleep loops that serve no purpose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mystery Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 5 minutes ago, TeeJay410 said: It's one of my favorite tracks, particularly the “ohhhh my salvation” chorus bit. Production-wise it suffers similarly to the rest if CD except worse, just a bunch of extra bullshit bleep loops that serve no purpose. Yeah, that's why the Locker leaks were so fascinating. I'm haven't listened to Chinese enough to notice all the nuances, but the earlier versions are really noticeable in their differences. The most interesting part to me is that pretty much all the vocals from 99/00 made it onto the final album. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Guapo Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 4 hours ago, ShadowOfTheWave said: Well, I don't like a lot of the stuff classic GNR fans like, I think songs like Perfect Crime, You're Crazy & Garden Of Eden are pure uninspired shit, so my taste is probably different than most here. Fair enough, with music it's all about personal taste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToonGuns Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 It's an average GnR song made to sound slightly below average due to the production. With a decent producer to properly work on it there's actually a fantastic song in there - slow it down a touch, sleaze up the riff, cut the pointless intro, drop it down a pitch or two (bring out more rasp in doing so), cut back on the "ooohs", tidy up the outro (far too much going on), and have the drums play a little simpler and behind the beat (even the original Josh version sounded rushed) you'd actually end up with the most AFD song off CD. As it is, I like it, but it feels like there's more there that was missed. I prefer the Bucket solo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redteakor Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 At least it's better than Scraped. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19AT5 Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 On 5/25/2021 at 11:41 PM, ToonGuns said: It's an average GnR song made to sound slightly below average due to the production. With a decent producer to properly work on it there's actually a fantastic song in there - slow it down a touch, sleaze up the riff, cut the pointless intro, drop it down a pitch or two (bring out more rasp in doing so), cut back on the "ooohs", tidy up the outro (far too much going on), and have the drums play a little simpler and behind the beat (even the original Josh version sounded rushed) you'd actually end up with the most AFD song off CD. As it is, I like it, but it feels like there's more there that was missed. I prefer the Bucket solo. That's similar to my view on November Rain... if they dropped all the synth keyboards, made the intro shorter, took the reverb off the drums, cut the cheesy Slash solo but kept the cool one, changed all the chord patterns completely except the outro, re-wrote all the lyrics, eradicated that God awful video from memory, stuck in a few killer riffs, changed the subject matter, and shortened the song to 4 minutes, then I genuinely think there would be a good song in there. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom2112 Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 47 minutes ago, 19AT5 said: That's similar to my view on November Rain... if they dropped all the synth keyboards, made the intro shorter, took the reverb off the drums, cut the cheesy Slash solo but kept the cool one, changed all the chord patterns completely except the outro, re-wrote all the lyrics, eradicated that God awful video from memory, stuck in a few killer riffs, changed the subject matter, and shortened the song to 4 minutes, then I genuinely think there would be a good song in there. That's what I say about Coma, but it hurts nonetheless😄 "You put me in a coma, And I don't think I wanna, ever hear this song.... again" my basic sentiments at hearing this live... twice😞😋 Is there a cheesy solo in NV? I think they are some of his most emotive solos alongside Estranged or even Fall to pieces, maybe I just like the cheese! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom2112 Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 1 hour ago, redteakor said: At least it's better than Scraped. But is it? Sometimes I fell they are both catastrophes. I think I kinda like one, one day and then the next time I hear both it flips. Neither are great songs IMO, but with a lot of effort they could have been at least consistent rockers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19AT5 Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 17 minutes ago, Tom2112 said: That's what I say about Coma, but it hurts nonetheless😄 "You put me in a coma, And I don't think I wanna, ever hear this song.... again" my basic sentiments at hearing this live... twice😞😋 Is there a cheesy solo in NV? I think they are some of his most emotive solos alongside Estranged or even Fall to pieces, maybe I just like the cheese! Coma is a bit long and overdrawn right enough but a decent tune nonetheless. Bizarrely, I really like Estranged but November Rain just never gelled with me. That said I didn't actually mind the piano only version found on the Appetite 30th. But I do find it all a little too happy for my liking! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom2112 Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 1 minute ago, 19AT5 said: Coma is a bit long and overdrawn right enough but a decent tune nonetheless. Bizarrely, I really like Estranged but November Rain just never gelled with me. That said I didn't actually mind the piano only version found on the Appetite 30th. But I do find it all a little too happy for my liking! Yeah, one day he has to come out and play the version from remastered collection... well the studio version but just him on Piano. It would breathe some life into the song, and at the end like you said the cool bit can start with the full band! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 4 minutes ago, 19AT5 said: Coma is a bit long and overdrawn right enough but a decent tune nonetheless. Bizarrely, I really like Estranged but November Rain just never gelled with me. That said I didn't actually mind the piano only version found on the Appetite 30th. But I do find it all a little too happy for my liking! I agree. It is meandering an rather boring. The ending is absolute killer, though. Estranged is a bit more dynamic, and the solos through, as well as the vocal melody, is simply better, in my never humble opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweersa Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 28 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: Estranged is a bit more dynamic, and the solos through, as well as the vocal melody, is simply better, in my never humble opinion. I've always liked November Rain, but grew to enjoy Estranged more after I gave it an honest listen. I'm hoping the song of your username is as epic as Estranged. Same with The General. Of course, after we finally get to hear them, they could be in the Scraped or Catcher realm. Atlas was a bit underwhelming for me, but not too bad. Perhaps was a nice surprise. Hardschool was my favorite, the complete song sounded so much better than I imaged it from the short 2006 snippet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 8 minutes ago, Sweersa said: I'm hoping the song of your username is as epic as Estranged. Same with The General. Of course, after we finally get to hear them, they could be in the Scraped or Catcher realm. Atlas was a bit underwhelming for me, but not too bad. Perhaps was a nice surprise. Hardschool was my favorite, the complete song sounded so much better than I imaged it from the short 2006 snippet. That's exactly how I see it. I have stopped caring what guys like Sebastian Bach has said or others who rave about individual songs. But based on experience, I can be quite confident I will like some of the unreleased/unleaked songs if I ever get to hear them. And feel mighty underwhelmed over others. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dangom1 Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 1 hour ago, SoulMonster said: That's exactly how I see it. I have stopped caring what guys like Sebastian Bach has said or others who rave about individual songs. But based on experience, I can be quite confident I will like some of the unreleased/unleaked songs if I ever get to hear them. And feel mighty underwhelmed over others. Remember when Bach said Sorry was doom metal 😂 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweersa Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 On 5/25/2021 at 12:40 PM, themadcaplaughs said: Per certain wrestlers who used to run message board about GN'R, the track list for Chinese Democracy remained fairly solid over the years, despite the leaks. That being said, he did say "Riad" was possibly a tacked on at the last minute since it had already leaked. Catcher made it last minute too, probably for the same reason. It was going to be on the next record, commonly referred to as CD2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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