Michael Jackson

[PatrickS77]

42 minutes ago, TheGeneral said:

I don't mind "2000 Watts". If we're talking Invincible, I have a much bigger problem with the length of some songs. "Heartbreaker" is ruined by it's length, I mean the song itself is fine but it's around 2 minutes too long which makes me not want to listen to it. "Unbreakable" is a personal top 10 MJ track for me, but it also could have very well ended around the 4:45 minute mark.

My favorite lesser known songs have to be "2 Bad" and "We've Had Enough" and I agree, "Is It Scary" and "Ghosts" are fantastic.

EDIT: I've always been wondering: Am I the only one thinking "Unbreakable" and "Invincible" sound incredibly similar?

Yep, that is a problem with the latter day songs. They don't know when to stop. Then you think the song is over and it goes on again.

I always liked 2Bad, but I really fell in love with it, when I saw that sick choreography in Ghosts. Absolutely amazing.

Nope.  I don't think the two songs sound similar.

[PatrickS77]

52 minutes ago, Jw224 said:

A few of the Invincible songs blend together for me. I honestly think MJ's idea to change direction with the project and start again was a mistake. We could have gotten songs like APWNN or Chicago but ended up with mostly mediocre material that Darkchild produced (IMO). I know that MJ always took the current trends and elevated them to his standard but I think in this instance his documented total lack of interest in the project caused it to not be as great as it could have been. 

Don't get me wrong I don't hate Invincible but compared to anything that had come before it wasn't the best.

End of rant 

Also yes 2Bad is a tune.

Like I said. Damn children. I do not think his heart was really in it and he was more occupied being a dad than making music. Hence the pathetic 2 songs he wrote by himself, whereas all the other songs where mainly written by someone else. He once said that he is married to his music and that he needs the closeness to do what his doing and thus there is no room in his life for other stuff. It kinda shows. While Invincible in and itself is a solid effort, but on an MJ level it is lacking and the "worst" of his solo albums.

[Jw224]

2 hours ago, PatrickS77 said:

Like I said. Damn children. I do not think his heart was really in it and he was more occupied being a dad than making music. Hence the pathetic 2 songs he wrote by himself, whereas all the other songs where mainly written by someone else. He once said that he is married to his music and that he needs the closeness to do what his doing and thus there is no room in his life for other stuff. It kinda shows. While Invincible in and itself is a solid effort, but on an MJ level it is lacking and the "worst" of his solo albums.

Yeah I definitely agree with what you're saying. Invincible was apparently due in 99-2000 and was delayed a lot. He reportedly booked studio time and hotel rooms and just didn't show up. People were left sitting doing nothing for a long time. I think you are right in saying that his kids were his main priority. Outside writers weren't always a problem but I think by this time it was expected that MJ would bring many of his own tracks to the table and the lack of that is what makes it feel like less of an MJ album.  I also think that he was going through a tough time during that period mentally and other issues that are probably obvious if you've observed him at that time. It all contributed to the way the album came out.

Edited September 9, 2021 by Jw224

[-Jaro-]

6 hours ago, Jw224 said:

Yeah I definitely agree with what you're saying. Invincible was apparently due in 99-2000 and was delayed a lot. He reportedly booked studio time and hotel rooms and just didn't show up. People were left sitting doing nothing for a long time. I think you are right in saying that his kids were his main priority. Outside writers weren't always a problem but I think by this time it was expected that MJ would bring many of his own tracks to the table and the lack of that is what makes it feel like less of an MJ album.  I also think that he was going through a tough time during that period mentally and other issues that are probably obvious if you've observed him at that time. It all contributed to the way the album came out.

You describing Axl here? 🤣

Just a thing I forgot to say, MJ is guilty for my love for GNR. I heard about them, but did't take them for granted until I saw Slash mentioned on Dangerous CD... and after I saw BRAVO magazine with Slash - only then I connected dots and my discovery of GNR started...

[RussTCB]

3 hours ago, -Jaro- said:

You describing Axl here? 🤣

Just a thing I forgot to say, MJ is guilty for my love for GNR. I heard about them, but did't take them for granted until I saw Slash mentioned on Dangerous CD... and after I saw BRAVO magazine with Slash - only then I connected dots and my discovery of GNR started...

Speaking of Slash & Michael: I still maintain that the best solo Slash ever played is on Give In To Me. 

[Towelie]

5 minutes ago, RussTCB said:

Speaking of Slash & Michael: I still maintain that the best solo Slash ever played is on Give In To Me. 

It's definitely a contender. A toss up between GITM, Nov Rain and Messages for me.

[lilacmess]

1 hour ago, RussTCB said:

Speaking of Slash & Michael: I still maintain that the best solo Slash ever played is on Give In To Me. 

I don't know about the best solo by Slash ever, because there are so many anazing ones. It sure is special, very moving.

Here in Europe GITM was played a lot on MTV. I got a kick out of seeing Teddy and Gilby in the video as well.

I'm still loving it!

Edited September 9, 2021 by lilacmess

[PatrickS77]

20 minutes ago, lilacmess said:

I don't know about the best solo by Slash ever, because there are so many anazing ones. It sure is special, very moving.

Here in Europe GITM was played a lot on MTV. I got a kick out of seeing Teddy and Gilby in the video as well.

I'm still loving it!

Yeah. It was recorded in Munich, Germany in the week between my first GNR concert and my first MJ concert. 2 hours from where I live. Had I only known. I heard about them recording the video at the MJ show. And then I had to wait for 8 months until I finally got to see it. The agony. It's one of my most favourite MJ songs. Being an MJ fans since years at that point, getting into GNR in '91, having Slash show up on the Dangerous album and then at concerts and in videos... it just all alligned.

Edited September 9, 2021 by PatrickS77

[TheGeneral]

I'd really like "You Are My Life" if it wasn't for that coat hanger sound inbetween. You know, when you go shopping and you push those metal coat hangers aside ... that's what it reminds me of.

And speaking of MJ and Slash: some "This Is It" notes mentioned Slash being a guest for some shows. Michael wanted to have him on Dirty Diana. Just imagine that.

[RussTCB]

2 hours ago, lilacmess said:

I don't know about the best solo by Slash ever, because there are so many anazing ones. It sure is special, very moving.

Here in Europe GITM was played a lot on MTV. I got a kick out of seeing Teddy and Gilby in the video as well.

I'm still loving it!

It's such a bad ass song and what a vocal from Michael. It's like my friend says "angry Mike is the best Mike" 😂 

7 minutes ago, TheGeneral said:

I'd really like "You Are My Life" if it wasn't for that coat hanger sound inbetween. You know, when you go shopping and you push those metal coat hangers aside ... that's what it reminds me of.

And speaking of MJ and Slash: some "This Is It" notes mentioned Slash being a guest for some shows. Michael wanted to have him on Dirty Diana. Just imagine that.

Slash on Dirty Diana? STFU, that would have been amazing. 

[lilacmess]

Inspired by our discussion I compiled a list of my favorite MJ songs. Every single song on this list is a true gem in my treasure box of songs forever. ❤

Dirty Diana 10/10

Human Nature 9,5/10

Who Is It 9,5/10

Beat It 9,5/10

They Don't Care About Us 9,5/10

Man In The Mirror 9/10

Smooth Criminal 9/10

Morphine 9/10

Billie Jean 9/10

Liberian Girl 8,5/10

Another Part Of Me 8,5/10

Give In To Me 8,5/10

Wanna Be Startin' Something 8/10

Bad 8/10

Black or White 8/10

Earth Song 8/10

IJCSLY 7,5/10

Speed Demon 7,5/10

Leave Me Alone 7,5/10

 

And I want to mention We Are The World 8/10

Edited to add: I'm clearly drawn to the angsty/angry stuff. I love drama in my art. Not in my life though. 😃

Edited September 9, 2021 by lilacmess

[RussTCB]

On 9/9/2021 at 12:44 PM, lilacmess said:

Inspired by our discussion I compiled a list of my favorite MJ songs. Every single song on this list is a true gem in my treasure box of songs forever. ❤

Dirty Diana 10/10

Human Nature 9,5/10

Who Is It 9,5/10

Beat It 9,5/10

They Don't Care About Us 9,5/10

Man In The Mirror 9/10

Smooth Criminal 9/10

Morphine 9/10

Billie Jean 9/10

Liberian Girl 8,5/10

Another Part Of Me 8,5/10

Give In To Me 8,5/10

Wanna Be Startin' Something 8/10

Bad 8/10

Black or White 8/10

Earth Song 8/10

IJCSLY 7,5/10

Speed Demon 7,5/10

Leave Me Alone 7,5/10

 

And I want to mention We Are The World 8/10

Edited to add: I'm clearly drawn to the angsty/angry stuff. I love drama in my art. Not in my life though. 😃

The is kinda related, but I drove from Detroit to Cleveland for work once. When I got in the car, I had an MJ mix on Spotify and We Are The World was played soon after I got in the car. 

I called a friend of mine to talk about the song while I was driving and we ended up talking about it for almost the whole three hour drive lol. 

In any case, when I got to Cleveland I ended up with some free time before I had to work so I decided to stop in at the Rock $Roll Hall of Fame. They rotate through their MJ artifacts but that day they happened to have the jacket from We Are The World on display. 

I thought it was cool that I just got done talking to a friend about that song for nearly 3 hours, then the Rock Hall just happened to have that jacket on display. 

[lilacmess]

I was at a wedding reception tonight. Wandering around, looking for my husband and kids I saw a group of people at the parking lot gathered around a boom box listening to Billie Jean. Having a good time dancing around, trying to moonwalk. Of course I joined in!

In the end I found out my husband had initiated it. 🥰

Would you guys care to share some of your favorite MJ related Youtube clips? Concert footage, rehearsals, etc. Thanks for 😊

[RussTCB]

2 hours ago, lilacmess said:

I was at a wedding reception tonight. Wandering around, looking for my husband and kids I saw a group of people at the parking lot gathered around a boom box listening to Billie Jean. Having a good time dancing around, trying to moonwalk. Of course I joined in!

In the end I found out my husband had initiated it. 🥰

Would you guys care to share some of your favorite MJ related Youtube clips? Concert footage, rehearsals, etc. Thanks for 😊

One of my favorite MJ short films that's still on YouTube is Ghosts

 

[nickzark]

Happy to see that there are other MJ fans here . I am a big fan to . Actually one reason to hear Guns N Roses was Michael . For me his best album is Dangerous . Best songs They don’t care about us , Dirty Diana , Give in to me , Who is it , Smooth criminal Beat it . Of course like more songs 

[jimisbatman]

On 9/12/2021 at 11:21 AM, RussTCB said:

One of my favorite MJ short films that's still on YouTube is Ghosts

 

I love Ghost's and IIS. I would have loved a music video for Threatened 

[Dean]

What's all your thoughts on the collaboration with Freddie Mercury on There Must Be More To Life Than This? The William Orbit mix is the only one the estate signed off on. According to Roger and Brian, the mix they came up with was much better (probably closer to the demo that has been floating around for decades from the Mr. Bad Guy sessions. 

[Stay.Of.Execution]

Almost got to see him live in 92, but the show got cancelled at the last minute. One of the greatest there ever was. 

[Jw224]

12 hours ago, Dean said:

What's all your thoughts on the collaboration with Freddie Mercury on There Must Be More To Life Than This? The William Orbit mix is the only one the estate signed off on. According to Roger and Brian, the mix they came up with was much better (probably closer to the demo that has been floating around for decades from the Mr. Bad Guy sessions. 

The William Orbit mix was honestly awful imo. I'm pretty sure Roger Taylor described working with the MJ Estate like wading through mud. This is apparently an unfinished Queen version of the song that never got released. It is much better imo. It features never before heard vocals from Freddie, so it must be in some way official if not a direct Queen mix.

 

Edited September 14, 2021 by Jw224

[Jw224]

I often wish MJ would have done an intimate acoustic concert, it always seemed like he felt the pressure to be a spectacle and dance when I know people would have been just as captivated had he sang totally live with a sparse backing.

[RussTCB]

16 minutes ago, Jw224 said:

I often wish MJ would have done an intimate acoustic concert, it always seemed like he felt the pressure to be a spectacle and dance when I know people would have been just as captivated had he sang totally live with a sparse backing.

I found this on YouTube a while back. It's pretty well done and gives you a cool idea of what it back have been like. 

 

Edited September 14, 2021 by RussTCB

[jimisbatman]

54 minutes ago, Jw224 said:

The William Orbit mix was honestly awful imo. I'm pretty sure Roger Taylor described working with the MJ Estate like wading through mud. This is apparently an unfinished Queen version of the song that never got released. It is much better imo. It features never before heard vocals from Freddie, so it must be in some way official if not a direct Queen mix.

 

Wow, simply majestic. Didn't know this mix existed, thanks alot, it's amazing. And, the MJ estate are crazy for not making this the official version. It definitely sounds 'Queenified' with the guitars, but they took a simple, if not bland melody, and made it shine as a lost gem. 

[lilacmess]

7 hours ago, RussTCB said:

I found this on YouTube a while back. It's pretty well done and gives you a cool idea of what it back have been like. 

 

Oh, that's nice! And proofs my point he was a GREAT songwriter and vocalist. No distractions. 😊  

[Jw224]

16 hours ago, jimisbatman said:

Wow, simply majestic. Didn't know this mix existed, thanks alot, it's amazing. And, the MJ estate are crazy for not making this the official version. It definitely sounds 'Queenified' with the guitars, but they took a simple, if not bland melody, and made it shine as a lost gem. 

Yeah it's much better, hopefully Brian and Roger will be able to release their version eventually. 

17 hours ago, RussTCB said:

I found this on YouTube a while back. It's pretty well done and gives you a cool idea of what it back have been like. 

 

It was actually this video that made me post that hahaha 

Edited September 15, 2021 by Jw224

[TheGeneral]

17 hours ago, Jw224 said:

I often wish MJ would have done an intimate acoustic concert, it always seemed like he felt the pressure to be a spectacle and dance when I know people would have been just as captivated had he sang totally live with a sparse backing.

Well he was supposed to do that HBO special in 1995 which was cancelled because he collapsed during the rehearsals. Wouldn't have been acoustic or anything, but certainly intimate since I believe it was taking place in a theatre. Songs like Childhood and Smile were rehearsed, also Bad and Billie Jean with a completely new choreography which we ultimately never got to see.

With MJ I always feel like there could have been "more". He did his tours and some award shows, but other than that he never did anything out of the ordinary. Even his setlists for every tour followed the same order, with similar songs replacing each other from tour to tour. I wish he would have changed things up a bit here and there, but he was too much of a perfectionist to be like "You know what guys, it's not on the setlist but I want to do 'Pretty Young Thing' tonight."

So many things were cancelled or he just didn't pull through with it. The Royal Brunei concert in '96 was supposed to be a mix of the Bad and Dangerous tours, I think there's even a setlist out there somewhere - in the end he just did the regular Dangerous setlist with two new songs added.

"State of Shock" was on the alternate setlist for the HIStory tour and also was rehearsed for This Is It - however he likely would have never performed it in the end even if he got to do the shows. There was also a Millenium concert planned in 1999/2000 which never happened.