What songs has vocals after 1999

[Pele]

On 12/18/2021 at 7:15 PM, CubanSkies Dummy said:

Aagghh, @Pele I see you coming, boy!

This is My personal take of what was going on during those "Chinese Democracy" years. Look at me, pal. You won't forget me again.

_______________________________________________

1998:

"The Robin Finck/Josh Freese/Tommy Stinson/Billy Howerdel/Dizzy Reed version of the album that existed in 1998 was pretty incredible. It still sounded like GNR but there were elements of Zeppelin, Nine Inch Nails and Pink Floyd mixed in." (James Barber, Poptones, 10/16/05)

Songs with vocals:

• "Madagascar"
• "Prostitute"

Finished songs in instrumental form:

• "Chinese Democracy"
• "T.W.A.T."
• "Atlas Shrugged"
• "Perhaps"
• "Rhiad"
• "Catcher In The Rye"
• "The Blues"
• "Quick Song"
• "Zodiac 13"
• "State Of Grace"
• "Oklahoma"
• "IRS"
• "Hard School"
• "Dummy"
• "Me & My Elvis"
• "Ides Of March"
• "D Tune"
• "Curly Shuffle"
• "Thyme"

_______________________________________________

1999:

A - Tier Songs with vocals:

• "Madagascar"
• "Prostitute"
• "T.W.A.T."
• "Atlas Shrugged"
• "Perhaps"
• "Rhiad"
• "Chinese Democracy"
• "Catcher In The Rye"
• "The Blues"
• "Silkworms"
• "If The World"
• "State Of Grace"
• "IRS"
• "Hard School"
• "Oh My God"

B - Tier Songs with vocals:

• "Eye On You"
• "Quick Song"
• "Nothing"
• "This I Love"

A - Tier instrumentals:

• "P.R.L."
• "Moustache"
• "Zodiac 13"
• "Tonto"
• "I'm Sorry"
• "Oklahoma"
• "Dummy"
• "Me & My Elvis"
• "Circus Maximus" renamed after "Ides Of March"
• "D Tune"
• "Curly Shuffle"
• "Thyme"

B - Tier instrumentals:

• "Real Doll"
• "Shackler's Revenge"
• "Billionaire"
• "Dub Suplex"
• "Devious Bastard"
• "As It Began"

 

_______________________________________________

2000:

Finished songs:

• "Madagascar"
• "Prostitute"
• "T.W.A.T."
• "Atlas Shrugged"
• "Perhaps"
• "Riad N' The Bedouins" renamed after "Rhiad"
• "Chinese Democracy"
• "Catcher In The Rye"
• "The Blues"
• "Silkworms"
• "If The World"
• "State Of Grace"
• "IRS"
• "Hard School"
• "Thyme"
• "Oh My God"

A - Tier instrumentals:

• "I'm Sorry"
• "Oklahoma"
• "Dummy"
• "Me & My Elvis"
• "Circus Maximus"
• "D Tune"
• "Curly Shuffle"

B - Tier instrumentals:

• "Quick Song"
• "Zodiac 13"
• "Shackler's Revenge"
• "Dub Suplex"

Most likely abandoned songs:

• "PRL"
• "Eye On You"
• "Moustache"
• "Tonto"
• "Real Doll"
• "Devious Bastard"
• "Nothing"
• "As It Began"
• "This I Love"

 

_______________________________________________

2001:

Finished songs:

• "Madagascar"
• "Prostitute"
• "Atlas Shrugged"
• "Perhaps"
• "Riad N' The Bedouins"
• "Chinese Democracy"
• "Catcher In The Rye"
• "The Blues"
• "Silkworms"
• "If The World"
• "State Of Grace"
• "IRS"
• "Hard School"
• "Thyme"
• "Oh My God"
• "Oklahoma" [Vocals added]
• "Going Down"

A - Tier instrumentals:

• "Sorry For You" renamed after "I'm Sorry"
• "100 Cuban Skies" renamed after "Dummy"
• "Leave Me Alone" renamed after "Me & My Elvis"
• "Circus Maximus"
• "D Tune"
• "Curly Shuffle"
• "Three Dollar Pyramid"
• "Prom Violence"

B - Tier instrumentals:

• "Quick Song"
• "Zodiac 13"
• "Shackler's Revenge"
• "Dub Suplex"

Most likely abandoned songs:

• "Inside Out"
• Tommy Home Demo

 

_______________________________________________

2002 - MAJOR "RESET" OF THE ALBUM:

Finished songs ready to master:

• "Chinese Democracy" [Soft remake; plus BH solo]
• "Better" renamed after "Three Dollar Pyramid" [Vocals added]
• "The Blues" [Soft remake; orchestra]
• "If The World"
• "There Was a Time" renamed after "T.W.A.T." [Soft remake; plus BH solo; orchestra]
• "Riad N' The Bedouins"
• "IRS"
• "Madagascar" [orchestra]
• "Prostitute" [orchestra]
• "Atlas Shrugged"
• "Perhaps"
• "Silkworms" [Remake]
• "State Of Grace"
• "Oklahoma"
• "Hard School"
• "100 Cuban Skies" [Vocals added]
• "Thyme" [Orchestra]
• "Oh My God"
• "Going Down" [Remake]

Demos began to circulate.

A - Tier instrumentals:

• "Leave Me Alone" [Orchestra]
• "The General" [Orchestra]
• "Seven" [Orchestra; possible mix between "Circus Maximus" / "D Tune" / "Curly Shuffle"]

B - Tier instrumentals:

• "Quick Song"
• "Zodiac" renamed after "Zodiac 13"
• "Shackler's Revenge" [Remake; possible mix between "Shackler's Revenge" / "Dub Suplex" / "Prom Violence"]

_______________________________________________

Late 2004 - Early 2005:

Finished songs:

• "Chinese Democracy"
• "Better"
• "The Blues"
• "If The World"
• "There Was a Time"
• "Catcher In The Rye"
• "Riad N' The Bedouins"
• "Sorry For You" [Vocals added]
• "IRS"
• "Madagascar"
• "Prostitute"
• "Thyme"
• "Elvis Presley & The Monster Of Soul" renamed after "Leave Me Alone" [Vocals added]
• "The General" [Vocals added]
• "Seven" [Vocals added]

B - Tier finished songs:

• "Atlas Shrugged"
• "Silkworms"
• "Berlin" renamed after "Oklahoma"
• "Oh My God"
• "Going Down"
• "Jackie Chan" renamed after "Hard School"
• "Cuban Skies" renamed after "100 Cuban Skies"

A - Tier instrumental songs:

• "Shackler's Revenge"
• "This I Love" [Previously abandoned]
• "Lies They Tell"

Most likely abandoned songs:

• "Perhaps"
• "Quick Song"
• "Zodiac"
• "State Of Grace"

_______________________________________________

2005 / EARLY 2006- "ANTIQUIET" / FINISHED UNRELEASED ALBUM:

Finished mastered album:

• "Chinese Democracy"
• "Shackler's Revenge" [Vocals added; 2007 incident nothing to do with this song, only a reminder by Rose]
• "Better"
• "The Blues"
• "If The World"
• "There Was a Time"
• "Riad N' The Bedouins"
• "Lies They Tell" [Vocals added]
• "Sorry For You"
• "IRS"
• "Madagascar"
• "Prostitute"

Mastered and finished songs not to be included:

• "Catcher In The Rye"
• "This I Love" [Vocals added]
• "Atlas Shrugged"
• "Berlin"
• "Seven"
• "The General"
• "Elvis Presley & The Monster Of Soul"
• "Thyme"
• "Oh My God"
• "Silkworms"
• "Cuban Skies"
• "Jackie Chan"
• "Going Down"

Instrumentals leftovers:

• "Light My Fire" [previously abandoned; renamed after "Moustache"]
• "Tonto" [previously abandoned]
• "Monstrosity"

 

_______________________________________________

2007 - FINISHED:

Finished album - Release in 2008:

• "Chinese Democracy"
• "Shackler's Revenge"
• "Better"
• "Street Of Dreams" renamed after "Stardust" renamed after "The Blues"
• "If The World"
• "There Was a Time"
• "Catcher In The Rye"
• "Scraped" renamed after "Lies They Tell"
• "Riad N' The Bedouins"
• "Sorry" renamed after "Sorry For You"
• "IRS"
• "Madagascar"
• "This I Love"
• "Prostitute"

Finished songs - released in 2021:

• "Absurd!" renamed after "Silkworms"
• "HardSkool" renamed after "Jackie Chan"

Finished unreleased songs:

• "Oh My God"
• "Atlas Shrugged"
• "Berlin"
• "7" renamed after "Seven"
• "The General"
• "Soul Monster" renamed after "Monster Of Soul" renamed after "Elvis Preslery & The Monster Of Soul"
• "Thyme"
• "Cuban Skies"
• "Going Down"
• "Tonto" [Vocals added]
• "Light My Fire" [Vocals added]
• "Monstrosity" [Vocals added]

___________________

 

So, @Pele what do you think?

 

What do I think?

I appreciate the detail - I just don't know why you drift from fact to opinion to complete fantasy.

The stuff from 99-00 looks about right, then you drift into opinion by claiming Zodiac/Oklahoma have vocals, then just into pure fantasy with the 2024 tracklist that you made up yourself.

This is what I think:

Tracks with complete vocal

• "Madagascar"
• "Prostitute"
• "T.W.A.T."
• "Atlas Shrugged"
• "Perhaps"
• "Rhiad"
• "Chinese Democracy"
• "Catcher In The Rye"
• "The Blues"
• "Silkworms"
• "If The World"
• "IRS"
• "Hard School"
• "Oh My God"
• "This I Love"
• "The General" (may be incomplete)
• "Going Down" (Tommy on vocals)
• "Better"
• "Sorry"
• "Scraped"

Tracks with incomplete vocal

• "Eye On You"
• "State of Grace"
• "Quick Song"
• "Nothing"
• "Blood in the Water"

Abandoned instrumentals

• "Oklamoma" (may have incomplete vocal)
• "Tonto" (may have incomplete vocal)
• "Monstrosity" (may have incomplete vocal)
• "Thyme"
• "PRL"
• "Moustache"
• "Zodiac 13"
• "Dummy"
• "Me & My Elvis"
• "Circus Maximus" renamed after "Ides Of March"
• "D Tune"
• "Curly Shuffle"
• "Real Doll.Com"
• "Billionaire"
• "Dub Suplex"
• "Devious Bastard"
• "Seven"
• "Soul Monster"
• "As It Began"
• "The Rebel"

 

Edited December 22, 2021 by Pele

[SoulMonster]

1 hour ago, Pele said:

I've repeatedly said that not my claim.

I've said over and over that he worked on vocals 05-07, and likely recorded Better, General, Shacklers, Scraped etc.

I couldn't have made it any clearer tbh

Read what I wrote again. 

[Pele]

4 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

Read what I wrote again. 

Sorry, just did

[CubanSkies Dummy]

19 hours ago, Pele said:

What do I think?

I appreciate the detail - I just don't know why you drift from fact to opinion to complete fantasy.

The stuff from 99-00 looks about right, then you drift into opinion by claiming Zodiac/Oklahoma have vocals, then just into pure fantasy with the 2024 tracklist that you made up yourself.

 

 

Aagghhh... Peleee..... Aghhhr....

 

I never said Zodiac have vocals. 

It was an abandoned instrumental in 2005 (look the Sp1at interview). 

Quick Song was another abandoned song.

Atlas Shrugged and Silkworms were outtakes, even in 2005.

Look that interview.

 

As part of writing an article to be released in March in The New York Times, journalist Jeff Leeds got to hear some of the new music and Sp1at would describe what he had heard [Sp1at, April 14, 2005]. 'Atlas Shrugged' would described as "being somewhere between 70's glam rock and 'November Rain'", 'Quick Song' would be described as "a rock song with a riff similar to 'Smells Like Teen Spirit'", and 'Zodiac' as "an electronic, industrial song" [Sp1at, April 14, 2005].

Well... I actually thought that there are more... but if Axl says there are 32 then I guess. But what's already in the bank is unbelievable material. There's a lot. There's at least three dozen. There's a shitload of stuff. We've actually been doing stuff... we haven't been sittin' around. There really is a lot of stuff.

Madagascar88, September 26, 2005

 

 

And check this out Pele, you're gonna love it:

 

In July 2005, Sp1at would publish a gossip column speculating on the tracklist of Chinese Democracy, listing the songs, "Prostitute", "Madagascar", "The Blues", "Chinese Democracy", "IRS", "TWAT", "This I Love", "Catcher in the Rye" as highly probable, while "Rhiad and the Bedouins", "Leave Me Alone", "Seven", "Quick Song", "Zodiac", "Atlas Shrugged", "The General" and "Thyme" were less likely to be included [Sp1at, July 28, 2005].

 

That confirms my list for what was the "Antiquiet" Chinese Democracy (Fall 2005 / Early 2006):

 

1. Chinese Democracy
2. Riad N' The Bedouins
3. Better
4. The Blues
5. If The World
6. There Was a Time
7. This I Love
8. Sorry For You
9. IRS
10. Catcher In The Rye
11. Madagascar
12. Prostitute

And the unfinished or even DISCARDED songs (even in early 2006!!):

• Elvis Presley & The Monster Of Soul
• Seven
• Atlas Shrugged
• Oh My God
• Silkworms
• The General
• Thyme
• Going Down
• Perhaps
• State Of Grace
• Cuban Skies

Highly regarded instrumentals:

• Shackler's Revenge
• Lies They Tell
• Berlin (NEVER FINISHED?)

Discarded abandoned instrumentals:

• Quick Song
• Zodiac

 

 

 

 

 

[SoulMonster]

2 hours ago, CubanSkies Dummy said:

 

Aagghhh... Peleee..... Aghhhr....

 

I never said Zodiac have vocals. 

It was an abandoned instrumental in 2005 (look the Sp1at interview). 

Quick Song was another abandoned song.

Atlas Shrugged and Silkworms were outtakes, even in 2005.

Look that interview.

 

As part of writing an article to be released in March in The New York Times, journalist Jeff Leeds got to hear some of the new music and Sp1at would describe what he had heard [Sp1at, April 14, 2005]. 'Atlas Shrugged' would described as "being somewhere between 70's glam rock and 'November Rain'", 'Quick Song' would be described as "a rock song with a riff similar to 'Smells Like Teen Spirit'", and 'Zodiac' as "an electronic, industrial song" [Sp1at, April 14, 2005].

Well... I actually thought that there are more... but if Axl says there are 32 then I guess. But what's already in the bank is unbelievable material. There's a lot. There's at least three dozen. There's a shitload of stuff. We've actually been doing stuff... we haven't been sittin' around. There really is a lot of stuff.

Madagascar88, September 26, 2005

 

 

And check this out Pele, you're gonna love it:

 

In July 2005, Sp1at would publish a gossip column speculating on the tracklist of Chinese Democracy, listing the songs, "Prostitute", "Madagascar", "The Blues", "Chinese Democracy", "IRS", "TWAT", "This I Love", "Catcher in the Rye" as highly probable, while "Rhiad and the Bedouins", "Leave Me Alone", "Seven", "Quick Song", "Zodiac", "Atlas Shrugged", "The General" and "Thyme" were less likely to be included [Sp1at, July 28, 2005].

 

That confirms my list for what was the "Antiquiet" Chinese Democracy (Fall 2005 / Early 2006)

Explain how a gossip column speculating on tracklist confirms anything. 

[Pele]

2 hours ago, CubanSkies Dummy said:

 

Aagghhh... Peleee..... Aghhhr....

 

I never said Zodiac have vocals. 

It was an abandoned instrumental in 2005 (look the Sp1at interview). 

Quick Song was another abandoned song.

Atlas Shrugged and Silkworms were outtakes, even in 2005.

Look that interview.

 

As part of writing an article to be released in March in The New York Times, journalist Jeff Leeds got to hear some of the new music and Sp1at would describe what he had heard [Sp1at, April 14, 2005]. 'Atlas Shrugged' would described as "being somewhere between 70's glam rock and 'November Rain'", 'Quick Song' would be described as "a rock song with a riff similar to 'Smells Like Teen Spirit'", and 'Zodiac' as "an electronic, industrial song" [Sp1at, April 14, 2005].

Well... I actually thought that there are more... but if Axl says there are 32 then I guess. But what's already in the bank is unbelievable material. There's a lot. There's at least three dozen. There's a shitload of stuff. We've actually been doing stuff... we haven't been sittin' around. There really is a lot of stuff.

Madagascar88, September 26, 2005

 

 

And check this out Pele, you're gonna love it:

 

In July 2005, Sp1at would publish a gossip column speculating on the tracklist of Chinese Democracy, listing the songs, "Prostitute", "Madagascar", "The Blues", "Chinese Democracy", "IRS", "TWAT", "This I Love", "Catcher in the Rye" as highly probable, while "Rhiad and the Bedouins", "Leave Me Alone", "Seven", "Quick Song", "Zodiac", "Atlas Shrugged", "The General" and "Thyme" were less likely to be included [Sp1at, July 28, 2005].

 

That confirms my list for what was the "Antiquiet" Chinese Democracy (Fall 2005 / Early 2006):

 

1. Chinese Democracy
2. Riad N' The Bedouins
3. Better
4. The Blues
5. If The World
6. There Was a Time
7. This I Love
8. Sorry For You
9. IRS
10. Catcher In The Rye
11. Madagascar
12. Prostitute

And the unfinished or even DISCARDED songs (even in early 2006!!):

• Elvis Presley & The Monster Of Soul
• Seven
• Atlas Shrugged
• Oh My God
• Silkworms
• The General
• Thyme
• Going Down
• Perhaps
• State Of Grace
• Cuban Skies

Highly regarded instrumentals:

• Shackler's Revenge
• Lies They Tell
• Berlin (NEVER FINISHED?)

Discarded abandoned instrumentals:

• Quick Song
• Zodiac

 

 

 

 

 

Ok.

Why did you drift completely into fantasy with El Hernando and Here Today etc?

[CubanSkies Dummy]

4 hours ago, Pele said:

Ok.

Why did you drift completely into fantasy with El Hernando and Here Today etc?

No fantasy, man. Like the Sorry lyrics, believe me when you hear it.

 

 

[Pele]

26 minutes ago, CubanSkies Dummy said:

No fantasy, man. Like the Sorry lyrics, believe me when you hear it.

 

 

But that wasn't you that posted that.

[GNFNRUK]

On 12/20/2021 at 11:37 PM, CubanSkies Dummy said:

No, pal. I only listed the songs from 1998 - 2008. 

The songs (I believe) that were working after 2008 (and after 2009? 2010?):

• "Roll On 2 You"
• "Feelin' It"
• "CNZ" (Casino Night Zone)
• "Elvis" (Soul Monster)
• "OMG" (Oh My God)
• "Atlas" (Atlas Shrugged)
• "7" (Seven)
• "Absurd!" (Silkworms)
• "El Hermano"
• "Perhaps"
• "General" (The General)
• "Here Today"
• "Riders Out Of Sight"
• "Hard Skool" (Jackie Chan)

Songs discarded after 2009? 2010?:

• "Thyme"
• "Berlin"
• "Cuban Skies"
• "Light My Fire"
• "Ode To Dodoria"
• "Blue Volcano"
• "Tonto"
• "Dragon"
• "Monstrosity"
• "War Schemes"
• "Going Down"
• "Quick Song" (probably abandoned before 2006)
• "Zodiac" (probably abandoned before 2006)
• "State Of Grace" (probably abandoned before 2006)

 

‘Casino Night Zone’?!

GNR have recorded a song about a level in Sonic The Hedgehog? I hope that’s bullshit 😂

[CubanSkies Dummy]

Pele, your theory is possible.

I only said that Cuban Skies, Seven and Soul Monster has vocals.

[Pele]

31 minutes ago, CubanSkies Dummy said:

Pele, your theory is possible.

I only said that Cuban Skies, Seven and Soul Monster has vocals.

And your theory behind that?

Some guy claimed to have heard Cuban Skies (and even admitted he didn't hear vocals)

Axl said on here he sang Soul Monster (even if true - doesn't mean he recorded it or completed it)

Brain said "Seven has a suck your nutsack bridge and punch you in the face chorus" in an obvious troll answer to a question he was sick of hearing.

 

Yet despite all that, they needed those 99 vocals again for the new singles!

[Blackstar]

3 hours ago, Pele said:

Brain said "Seven has a suck your nutsack bridge and punch you in the face chorus" in an obvious troll answer to a question he was sick of hearing.

Brain brought up Seven himself, so it doesn't look like a troll answer to me:

Q: What's your favorite released and unreleased GN'R song?
A: TWAT and SEVEN

Q: TWAT is my favorite GN'R song hands down -- and I've been a huge fan since 1988 -- so now I am very excited about Seven. Can you tell us anything about this song? Is it a rocker?
A: ITS AN TIMELESS BALLAD WITH A BLOW YOUR FACE OFF CHORUS AND A SUCK YOUR BALL SACK BRIDGE!!!!!

https://www.a-4-d.com/t163-qa-with-brain-august-18-2010

[Pele]

33 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

Brain brought up Seven himself, so it doesn't look like a troll answer to me:

Q: What's your favorite released and unreleased GN'R song?
A: TWAT and SEVEN

Q: TWAT is my favorite GN'R song hands down -- and I've been a huge fan since 1988 -- so now I am very excited about Seven. Can you tell us anything about this song? Is it a rocker?
A: ITS AN TIMELESS BALLAD WITH A BLOW YOUR FACE OFF CHORUS AND A SUCK YOUR BALL SACK BRIDGE!!!!!

https://www.a-4-d.com/t163-qa-with-brain-august-18-2010

Well it sounds like a full on troll answer to me.  He was asked to list an unreleased song so he just picked one of his.

 

What do you think the more likely scenario is here?

Seven gets released on the new album, will full vocals 

or

It's never heard of again.

[Blackstar]

7 minutes ago, Pele said:

Well it sounds like a full on troll answer to me.  He was asked to list an unreleased song so he just picked one of his.

 

What do you think the more likely scenario is here?

Seven gets released on the new album, will full vocals 

or

It's never heard of again.

I have no idea.

It's not clear from Brain's description whether he was talking about a song with vocals or an instrumental. It wasn't a troll answer, though.

Like I said the other day, I don't think the band members of that era had full knowledge of what became of every instrumental they wrote/worked on unless Axl decided to let them know.

[Pele]

15 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

I have no idea.

It's not clear from Brain's description whether he was talking about a song with vocals or an instrumental. It wasn't a troll answer, though.

Like I said the other day, I don't think the band members of that era had full knowledge of what became of every instrumental they wrote/worked on unless Axl decided to let them know.

I think they all worked out that nothing was going to become of the majority of the instrumentals, so they stopped submitting them and left (as per Bucket, Brain, Josh, Robin).

[rumandraisin]

12 hours ago, Pele said:

Well it sounds like a full on troll answer to me.  He was asked to list an unreleased song so he just picked one of his.

 

What do you think the more likely scenario is here?

Seven gets released on the new album, will full vocals 

or

It's never heard of again.

Or just like Perhaps or State of Grace pre locker leaks we just haven't heard it yet. Just because we haven't heard it doesn't mean it doesnt exist. I think that's the point people try to get through to you. I'm not optimistic for an album. I believe these songs exist but in Axls mind stuff like The General is a big gun and he'll never be ready to let it go

[rumandraisin]

I think the thing that gives me hope is stuff like Scraped and the further work on Better, Shacklers etc that, if we based what is left solely on the locker discs wouldn't exist. Its clear work carried on, not a huge amount but enough the have stuff like The General, Absurd fully rerecorded vocals aside. 

[Pele]

On 12/27/2021 at 10:52 AM, rumandraisin said:

I think the thing that gives me hope is stuff like Scraped and the further work on Better, Shacklers etc that, if we based what is left solely on the locker discs wouldn't exist. Its clear work carried on, not a huge amount but enough the have stuff like The General, Absurd fully rerecorded vocals aside. 

Yeah there was definitely work done after the Village sessions - which included what you've said.  We just don't know how much, and I believe it to be the following:

• Better vocals
• Shacklers
• Scraped
• Sorry vocals
• TIL new Vocals
• The General
• Blood in the Water (which could be a line from The General)

We've just got to hope there was more.  If there was (incredibly unlikely IMO), it would possibly be Tonto, Monstrosity and Cuban Skies.

[SoulMonster]

5 hours ago, Pele said:

Yeah there was definitely work done after the Village sessions - which included what you've said.  We just don't know how much, and I believe it to be the following:

• Better vocals
• Shacklers
• Scraped
• Sorry vocals
• TIL new Vocals
• The General
• Blood in the Water (which could be a line from The General)

We've just got to hope there was more.  If there was (incredibly unlikely IMO), it would possibly be Tonto, Monstrosity and Cuban Skies.

And this is the main weakness of your position: What is the likelihood that we have heard every thing they have worked on after the Village sessions? Every song on that list above has come to us, either on CD or through different leaks. What is the probability of that? Up until the Village leaks a few years ago, we knew nothing about the majority of the songs they had worked on in 2001 (!). It makes a lot more sense to assume the band, post 2001, worked on more than exactly those few songs in that list of yours, and that similar to before the Village leaks, that what we have heard through releases and leaks, is just the tip of the iceberg. This is how it has been previously and we know Axl has worked on adding vocals since then. Additionally, Slash saying he has worked on lots of songs would imply that lots of songs with vocals exist. Taking the position of, "If I haven't heard it, it doesn't exist", is kind of ridiculous (the world doesn't center around you) and suggests your antipathy of Axl leads you into making irrational conclusions. 

[jamillos]

9 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

And this is the main weakness of your position: What is the likelihood that we have heard every thing they have worked on after the Village sessions? Every song on that list above has come to us, either on CD or through different leaks. What is the probability of that? Up until the Village leaks a few years ago, we knew nothing about the majority of the songs they had worked on in 2001 (!). It makes a lot more sense to assume the band, post 2001, worked on more than exactly those few songs in that list of yours, and that similar to before the Village leaks, that what we have heard through releases and leaks, is just the tip of the iceberg. This is how it has been previously and we know Axl has worked on adding vocals since then. Additionally, Slash saying he has worked on lots of songs would imply that lots of songs with vocals exist. Taking the position of, "If I haven't heard it, it doesn't exist", is kind of ridiculous (the world doesn't center around you) and suggests your antipathy of Axl leads you into making irrational conclusions. 

Exactly. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. 

[Pele]

14 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

And this is the main weakness of your position: What is the likelihood that we have heard every thing they have worked on after the Village sessions? Every song on that list above has come to us, either on CD or through different leaks. What is the probability of that? Up until the Village leaks a few years ago, we knew nothing about the majority of the songs they had worked on in 2001 (!). It makes a lot more sense to assume the band, post 2001, worked on more than exactly those few songs in that list of yours, and that similar to before the Village leaks, that what we have heard through releases and leaks, is just the tip of the iceberg. This is how it has been previously and we know Axl has worked on adding vocals since then. Additionally, Slash saying he has worked on lots of songs would imply that lots of songs with vocals exist. Taking the position of, "If I haven't heard it, it doesn't exist", is kind of ridiculous (the world doesn't center around you) and suggests your antipathy of Axl leads you into making irrational conclusions. 

I must take issue with "Up until the Village leaks a few years ago, we knew nothing about the majority of the songs they had worked on in 2001"

Obviously discounting those instrumentals that were untouched by Rose on the tapes (as they are irrelevant to my point that Axl has done very little vocal recording), we knew the following: 

• "Madagascar" WE KNEW
• "Prostitute" WE KNEW
• "T.W.A.T." WE KNEW
• "Atlas Shrugged" WE KNEW
• "Rhiad" WE KNEW
• "Chinese Democracy" WE KNEW
• "Catcher In The Rye" WE KNEW
• "The Blues" WE KNEW
• "Silkworms" WE KNEW
• "If The World" WE KNEW
• "IRS" WE KNEW
• "Hard School" WE KNEW IT EXISTED AS A CLIP LEAKED
• "Oh My God" WE KNEW
• "This I Love" WE KNEW
• "The General" WE KNEW
• "Better" WE KNEW
• "Sorry" WE KNEW
• "Perhaps" WE KNEW - SONG-TITLE WAS ON A CIRCULATED TRACKLIST FOR A POTENTIAL FOLLOW UP
• "Quick Song" WE KNEW, WAS MENTIONED IN AN ARTICLE WAY BACK
• "Nothing" WE KNEW - SONG-TITLE WAS ON A CIRCULATED TRACKLIST FOR A POTENTIAL FOLLOW UP
• "Going Down" WE KNEW - MSL MENTIONED IT AS A TITLE AND IT LEAKED PRIOR TO LOCKER LEAK
• "State of Grace" WE DIDN'T KNOW - ALTHOUGH 'SOG' WAS APPARENTLY LISTED ON A FORM POST PRIOR TO LOCKER LEAK
• "Eye On You" - WE DIDN'T KNOW - BUT IT'S BARELY A SONG

So I'm gonna say we knew about ALL the songs Rose had recorded on in 2001, apart from Eye on You (which is barely a demo) and State of Grace (however someone listed S.O.G. as a song in a list on the Steve Hoffman forum apparently)

 

Edited December 29, 2021 by Pele

[SoulMonster]

12 minutes ago, Pele said:

I must take issue with "Up until the Village leaks a few years ago, we knew nothing about the majority of the songs they had worked on in 2001"

Obviously discounting those instrumentals that were untouched by Rose on the tapes (as they are irrelevant to my point that Axl has done very little vocal recording), we knew the following: 

• "Madagascar" WE KNEW
• "Prostitute" WE KNEW
• "T.W.A.T." WE KNEW
• "Atlas Shrugged" WE KNEW
• "Rhiad" WE KNEW
• "Chinese Democracy" WE KNEW
• "Catcher In The Rye" WE KNEW
• "The Blues" WE KNEW
• "Silkworms" WE KNEW
• "If The World" WE KNEW
• "IRS" WE KNEW
• "Hard School" WE KNEW IT EXISTED AS A CLIP LEAKED
• "Oh My God" WE KNEW
• "This I Love" WE KNEW
• "The General" WE KNEW
• "Better" WE KNEW
• "Sorry" WE KNEW
• "Perhaps" WE KNEW - SONG-TITLE WAS ON A CIRCULATED TRACKLIST FOR A POTENTIAL FOLLOW UP
• "Quick Song" WE KNEW, WAS MENTIONED IN AN ARTICLE WAY BACK
• "Nothing" WE KNEW - SONG-TITLE WAS ON A CIRCULATED TRACKLIST FOR A POTENTIAL FOLLOW UP
• "Going Down" WE KNEW - MSL MENTIONED IT AS A TITLE AND IT LEAKED PRIOR TO LOCKER LEAK
• "State of Grace" WE DIDN'T KNOW - ALTHOUGH 'SOG' WAS APPARENTLY LISTED ON A FORM POST PRIOR TO LOCKER LEAK
• "Eye On You" - WE DIDN'T KNOW - BUT IT'S BARELY A SONG

So I'm gonna say we knew about ALL the songs Rose had recorded on in 2001, apart from Eye on You (which is barely a demo) and State of Grace (however someone listed S.O.G. as a song in a list on the Steve Hoffman forum apparently)

 

Read what I wrote. I didn't only talk about the songs Axl had worked on. 

[Blackstar]

16 minutes ago, Pele said:

I must take issue with "Up until the Village leaks a few years ago, we knew nothing about the majority of the songs they had worked on in 2001"

Obviously discounting those instrumentals that were untouched by Rose on the tapes (as they are irrelevant to my point that Axl has done very little vocal recording), we knew the following: 

• "Madagascar" WE KNEW
• "Prostitute" WE KNEW
• "T.W.A.T." WE KNEW
• "Atlas Shrugged" WE KNEW
• "Rhiad" WE KNEW
• "Chinese Democracy" WE KNEW
• "Catcher In The Rye" WE KNEW
• "The Blues" WE KNEW
• "Silkworms" WE KNEW
• "If The World" WE KNEW
• "IRS" WE KNEW
• "Hard School" WE KNEW IT EXISTED AS A CLIP LEAKED
• "Oh My God" WE KNEW
• "This I Love" WE KNEW
• "The General" WE KNEW
• "Better" WE KNEW
• "Sorry" WE KNEW
• "Perhaps" WE KNEW - SONG-TITLE WAS ON A CIRCULATED TRACKLIST FOR A POTENTIAL FOLLOW UP
• "Quick Song" WE KNEW, WAS MENTIONED IN AN ARTICLE WAY BACK
• "Nothing" WE KNEW - SONG-TITLE WAS ON A CIRCULATED TRACKLIST FOR A POTENTIAL FOLLOW UP
• "Going Down" WE KNEW - MSL MENTIONED IT AS A TITLE AND IT LEAKED PRIOR TO LOCKER LEAK
• "State of Grace" WE DIDN'T KNOW - ALTHOUGH 'SOG' WAS APPARENTLY LISTED ON A FORM POST PRIOR TO LOCKER LEAK
• "Eye On You" - WE DIDN'T KNOW - BUT IT'S BARELY A SONG

So I'm gonna say we knew about ALL the songs Rose had recorded on in 2001, apart from Eye on You (which is barely a demo) and State of Grace (however someone listed S.O.G. as a song in a list on the Steve Hoffman forum apparently)

 

You're contradicting your own theory with this post. Among the songs "we knew" existed before the Village leaks you have included songs that we hadn't heard but only knew the titles of (Atlas Shrugged, Quick Song, Perhaps, Nothing, etc.). Yet your theory is that other songs we know the titles of but were not in the Village Leaks (e.g. Seven) or were there just as instrumentals don't exist because we haven't heard them.

[Pele]

46 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Read what I wrote. I didn't only talk about the songs Axl had worked on. 

But my overall theme is Axl very rarely records vocals.

You said I'm wrong because "Up until the Village leaks a few years ago, we knew nothing about the majority of the songs they had worked on in 2001"

There could be a thousand instrumentals given to him by a thousand musicians - I've never claimed otherwose.

 

Out of the 23 songs Axl has recorded on as above, we knew about 21 of them (maybe 22).  The one that was never ever mentioned anywhere is barely a demo.

 

Was this your argument that Axl has loads of songs with vocals that we don't know about?

[Pele]

49 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

You're contradicting your own theory with this post. Among the songs "we knew" existed before the Village leaks you have included songs that we hadn't heard but only knew the titles of (Atlas Shrugged, Quick Song, Perhaps, Nothing, etc.). Yet your theory is that other songs we know the titles of but were not in the Village Leaks (e.g. Seven) or were there just as instrumentals don't exist because we haven't heard them.

Yes, but the point is we knew about them (because they existed).

If the Village Disks were full of songs with vocals nobody had ever heard, then I'd be completely wrong.

However by 2001, there were 19 songs that  we know 100% Axl had sung on, and we knew about 17 or 18 of them.  The 1 definite unknown isn't really a song.

Songs with vocals (complete or incomplete) done by 2001

• "Madagascar" WE KNEW
• "Prostitute" WE KNEW
• "T.W.A.T." WE KNEW
• "Atlas Shrugged" WE KNEW
• "Rhiad" WE KNEW
• "Chinese Democracy" WE KNEW
• "Catcher In The Rye" WE KNEW
• "The Blues" WE KNEW
• "Silkworms" WE KNEW
• "If The World" WE KNEW
• "IRS" WE KNEW
• "Hard School" WE KNEW IT EXISTED AS A CLIP LEAKED
• "Oh My God" WE KNEW
• "Perhaps" WE KNEW - SONG-TITLE WAS ON A CIRCULATED TRACKLIST FOR A POTENTIAL FOLLOW UP
• "Quick Song" WE KNEW, WAS MENTIONED IN AN ARTICLE WAY BACK
• "Nothing" WE KNEW - SONG-TITLE WAS ON A CIRCULATED TRACKLIST FOR A POTENTIAL FOLLOW UP
• "Going Down" WE KNEW - MSL MENTIONED IT AS A TITLE AND IT LEAKED PRIOR TO LOCKER LEAK
• "State of Grace" WE DIDN'T KNOW - ALTHOUGH 'SOG' WAS APPARENTLY LISTED ON A FORM POST PRIOR TO LOCKER LEAK
• "Eye On You" - WE DIDN'T KNOW - BUT IT'S BARELY A SONG

 

Vocals were likely done after 2001 for the following:

• "This I Love" WE KNEW
• "The General" WE KNEW
• "Better" WE KNEW
• "Sorry" WE KNEW

 

So the point that SoulMonster raised about the Village Disks unearthing loads of material Axl was working on that we knew nothing about is completely false.  We knew about it all apart from maybe 1 song (which some say they saw) and 1 throwaway demo/rap.

It unearthed the opposite.  A bunch of songs we knew about (with a few that we hadn't heard) and a load of instrumentals submitted by ex-employees.

 

And again - he's just put out 2 'new' singles and guess where they've came from?

Edited December 29, 2021 by Pele