"Slashing ‘Chinese Democracy’ to 45 Minutes" (Ultimate Classic Rock article)

[jamillos]

1 hour ago, bumcheecksmcghee said:

Yep agreed same here...

They should have changed the name from scraped to skipped..... Lol ? 

That inspired me...

01. Axl’s Democracy 
02. Pitman’s Revenge
03. Beta 
04. Sheet of Schemes (aka Axl’s Briefcase) 
05. If the Tour (Would End Today) 
06. Their Loss Not Mine 
07. Snatch Her in the Rye 
08. Skipped 
09. Pee at Chunks of Heroine 
10. Sherry for You (Not Sherry for Me) 
11. I Digress 
12. Mad at Nascar (Live 2002) 
13. Decide Not 
14. Press Is Screwed 

Edited November 26, 2021 by jamillos

[rocknroll41]

11 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said:

Something like this would've been cool

Vol. 1 (2006)

Chinese Democracy (Village intro)
Scraped (live intro)
Rhiad (Village intro)
Better
The Blues
Zodiac
State Of Grace
Madagascar
IRS
Prostitute

Vol. 2 (early 2007)

Hardschool (Village intro)
Quicksong
Realdoll
Silkworms (Absurd intro)
Tommy Demo #1
If The World
Perhaps
Atlas Shrugged
Catcher In The Rye
Oklahoma

Vol. 3 (late 2007)

The General
Shackler's Revenge
Sorry
This I Love
Soul Monster
Tonto
Going Down
There Was A Time

Throw Mustache and Curly Shuffle onto the third album and there’s your trilogy! Tho only thing really missing would be, well, lyrics…

Edited November 26, 2021 by rocknroll41

[MYWIFEMYLIFE]

Only thing that I dont like about Chin Dem is that it ends, especially Prostitute being the last song is terrible, I never want it to end. Best last song would be Scraped imo.

[Top-Hatted One]

Scraped is by far the worst gnr song ever recorded 

[SOH]

On 11/25/2021 at 5:26 AM, Nice Boy said:

I really don't understand why he didn't put Hard Skool on CD. I think it alone would have changed the perception of the album. The inclusion of a more classic style rock track would have assured sceptics that it had an aspect of GnR that people expected, and meant less of the "load of tortured ballads with a couple of weird industrial tracks" criticism. 

I'm pretty sure "Scraped" was the biggest attempt at that on the album and most people hate it.

[Gordon Comstock]

1 hour ago, Top-Hatted One said:

Scraped is by far the worst gnr song ever recorded 

 

Nah, that honor definitely goes to Absurd.

[Sweersa]

17 minutes ago, Gordon Comstock said:

 

Nah, that honor definitely goes to Absurd.

My World or Shotgun Blues (I could probably name a few more UYI filler tracks)

[rocknroll41]

Get in the Ring gets my vote for worst GnR song ever.

[Gordon Comstock]

2 hours ago, Sweersa said:

My World or Shotgun Blues (I could probably name a few more UYI filler tracks)

 

My World sucks but it's just an experimental outro, basically. Shotgun Blues is filler but it's not outright bad like Absurd is. Get In The Ring, So Fine, etc. are definitely in the bottom tier of GNR songs but at least there's some redeeming qualities to those songs, like decent guitar solos or y'know, actual choruses.

[Neider]

6 hours ago, MYWIFEMYLIFE said:

Only thing that I dont like about Chin Dem is that it ends, especially Prostitute being the last song is terrible, I never want it to end. Best last song would be Scraped imo.

Prostitute seems like a perfect album ending to me. Not only because of how good the song is, but because the piano at the end with the orchestra fading away sounds melancholic and like a farewell.

[Neider]

4 hours ago, SOH said:

I'm pretty sure "Scraped" was the biggest attempt at that on the album and most people hate it.

I think the problem with Scraped is those screams from Axl and that it does not have a proper intro. Musically it is OK, it is not the worst but it is not something outstanding, and Axl sings the verses very well. But those catchy screams sound too bad for the song. Rhiad has them but they are less recurrent and that song has its own, it's really good if you listen to the Village version. But Scraped… I wish they had put Hardschool in its place, which was always very rocker.

[moreblack]

There's a lot that could be cut. Not just songs, but entire sections of the songs that are kept. He really needed a producer to tell him when it was too much.

[-W.A.R-]

Considering how long it took to come out, a hefty runtime made it feel more substantial. However you could cut it down to under an hour without missing anything by removing 4 of the following: Shacklers, If The World, Scraped, Riad, IRS, This I Love, Sorry. You could also do things like clip the ridiculously long and pointless intro on the title track - Just start with the riff tease like the earlier versions.

Edited December 1, 2021 by -W.A.R-

[-W.A.R-]

4 hours ago, rocknroll41 said:

Get in the Ring gets my vote for worst GnR song ever.

The song is actually fine musically with a really nice intro. It's Axl's immature lyrics that really drag it down to misery  

Whereas Absurd has both terrible music and immature lyrics.

[Manfisman]

3 hours ago, -W.A.R- said:

Albums were longer then but you could cut it down to under an hour (and 10 songs) without missing anything by removing 4 of the following: Shacklers, If The World, Scraped, Raid, IRS.

Considering how long it took to come out, it's length was probably appropriate to make it feel more substantial.

I think only Scraped and Riad are kind of fillers. I enjoy all the other songs

[Mr Mini Mite]

Chinese. 

Better.

Sorry.

IRS.

Street.

There was a Time.

Catcher.

This I Love.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[drlaban]

Chinese (minus intro)

TWAT

Sorry

Madagascar

TIL

Prostitute

[Sweersa]

I feel the album would have been way better if it was the Sean Beavan album.

A handful of the songs had intros that were too long (CD, Riad, the Scraped intro was just awful, etc.) they could have fit another song on the album without some of the pointless intros. 

[Gunner Gilby]

On 11/27/2021 at 12:15 PM, moreblack said:

There's a lot that could be cut. Not just songs, but entire sections of the songs that are kept. He really needed a producer to tell him when it was too much.

But every time a producer would stand up to Axl and suggest something he didn't like the producer got replaced. I mean how many producers worked on the album? 

[Cosmo]

IMO, no album should be longer than 45min, with a few very rare exceptions. I'd take out Scraped, Riad, Sorry and TIL and trim a few of the songs down.

[TiedHands]

I can't believe how many of them cut 'Madagascar'. Someone cut 'Better' and 'There Was A Time'? Good lord. Its an interesting experiment but most of them sound like pretentious hipster critics. 

[Gunner Gilby]

3 hours ago, Cosmo said:

IMO, no album should be longer than 45min, with a few very rare exceptions. I'd take out Scraped, Riad, Sorry and TIL and trim a few of the songs down.

Depends on the quality of the songs and if they're all good enough to hold your interest. As we've only had one new album of original material since 91 and that was thirteen years ago. I certainly wouldn't want any of Guns albums to be shorter. 

Besides which everyone's favorite album tracks are different. So if  as some have discussed you cut Illusions to a single album or Chinese to 45 minutes, you'd be removing songs some love.

[moreblack]

On 11/30/2021 at 2:29 PM, Gunner Gilby said:

But every time a producer would stand up to Axl and suggest something he didn't like the producer got replaced. I mean how many producers worked on the album? 

And really, when Queen and Pink Floyd's producers are telling you to change shit, you better fucking well change it.

[History2010]

On 11/28/2021 at 8:25 AM, Sweersa said:

they could have fit another song on the album without some of the pointless intros.

This is a very good point! Bumblefoot said that Atlas Shrugged was ready to go on the album but had to be cut because of CD time limits, so they totally could have edited the intros and added Atlas on:

 

Quote

Atlas Shrugged, I was going to tell a little story about that song. Right now on my laptop, I actually have the old guitar solo that I played for that song, when, two days before the album was going to be mastered, I was like, let's see if we can squeeze it on to the album. I busted out some guitar tracks for it, I have my own studio...

But, because the CD could only be 74 minutes max, and it would've taken it past the limit of what a CD can store, we couldn't put Atlas Shrugged on Chinese Democracy. It wasn't worth making a two-CD album with just one song on the other CD, so hopefully, on ChiDem 2, it'll have Atlas Shrugged on there. Interesting song.

 

Edited December 4, 2021 by History2010

[Nintari]

On 11/25/2021 at 4:26 AM, Nice Boy said:

I really don't understand why he didn't put Hard Skool on CD. I think it alone would have changed the perception of the album. The inclusion of a more classic style rock track would have assured sceptics that it had an aspect of GnR that people expected, and meant less of the "load of tortured ballads with a couple of weird industrial tracks" criticism. 

I never understood a lot of the specific criticisms toward the actual music. When you listen to songs like Estranged and Breakdown, it's very easy to see the natural progression toward songs like Catcher in the Rye and Prostitute. Even if Slash and Duff had remained in the band, I still think those songs would have made whatever album came out next because they seem completely logical in the context of Axl's evolution as a songwriter.

Edited December 6, 2021 by Nintari