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08 Universal fire


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Don’t wanna sound bitter, but yes, of course we always should look at all these various external sources when trying to work out the root cause of the miserable release history of this band. There are always some unexpected obstacles and difficulties (that other bands don’t seem to be pelted with), there’s always something – anything but their own doing. Management not being able to secure the rights, technical difficulties, legal issues, unexpected plan changes, fire, miscommunication with the organizer, travel issues and delays... I’ve said it before: Axl must be cursed or something.

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4 hours ago, Blackstar said:

It doesn't seem that any live recordings or footage were stored there. It was only master studio recordings.

GN'R was not among the artists that sued Universal. Maybe this suggests something. Or maybe it doesn't. Who knows...

One has to wonder if the eventual estate of Axl Rose would have the ability to sue, should there have been anything lost that could be capitalized on. 

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1 hour ago, MattyIce3924 said:

One has to wonder if the eventual estate of Axl Rose would have the ability to sue, should there have been anything lost that could be capitalized on. 

From what I hear, Axl is pretty fond of litigation, so if anyone was going to sue, it would be GNR. I reckon @Blackstar is right, the fact that Axl hasn't sued probably tells us everything we need to know.

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The fire contained master recordings of songs/albums. Now could some of those have been destroyed? Very possible. There are backups though. Sometimes the tape degrades and isn’t usable as well.   

If a reissue doesn’t say it was sourced from the original master, then there’s a good chance it was wasn’t.  That’s if you even believe them when they say they are sourced from the original masters

None of this really matters if you’re streaming from Spotify and using ear buds 

Edited by guitarpatch
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3 hours ago, invisible_rose said:

It makes me sad that people think this is what music sounds like

Just as sad to me that some people think you have to obsess over quality to be able to enjoy the music. I enjoy it streaming through my airpods just as much as I do at home with my stereo, not even mentioning the fact that I don't have a fucking choice when I'm at the gym or on the train do I? Just like most people when I have time to listen to music, I am somewhere else and not at home.

Edited by StrangerInThisTown
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2 hours ago, StrangerInThisTown said:

Just as sad to me that some people think you have to obsess over quality to be able to enjoy the music. I enjoy it streaming through my airpods just as much as I do at home with my stereo, not even mentioning the fact that I don't have a fucking choice when I'm at the gym or on the train do I? Just like most people when I have time to listen to music, I am somewhere else and not at home.

lol are you ok?

I mean, without getting in to it, of course you have a choice. Especially on the train. But I'm not sure I said anything about that. Seems you just worked yourself up for absolutely no reason.

Again, just for you, it makes me sad that people think that compressed MP3 over Bluetooth is what music sounds like (notice I didn't say anything about choice or enjoyment)

Edited by invisible_rose
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2 hours ago, StrangerInThisTown said:

Just as sad to me that some people think you have to obsess over quality to be able to enjoy the music. I enjoy it streaming through my airpods just as much as I do at home with my stereo, not even mentioning the fact that I don't have a fucking choice when I'm at the gym or on the train do I? Just like most people when I have time to listen to music, I am somewhere else and not at home.

I agree with your point BUT there is a huge difference in sound quality when listening through hi-fi speakers. It’s pretty much like you’re sitting in the studio with the entire band while they are recording. 

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On 8/17/2022 at 9:14 PM, invisible_rose said:

lol are you ok?

I mean, without getting in to it, of course you have a choice. Especially on the train. But I'm not sure I said anything about that. Seems you just worked yourself up for absolutely no reason.

Again, just for you, it makes me sad that people think that compressed MP3 over Bluetooth is what music sounds like (notice I didn't say anything about choice or enjoyment)

What, how do I have a choice on the train? You want me to bring my vinyl record player with me so I can get the mega full quality awesome audio experience everytime I listen to a song? Haha

On 8/17/2022 at 9:16 PM, HollyWoodRose84 said:

I agree with your point BUT there is a huge difference in sound quality when listening through hi-fi speakers. It’s pretty much like you’re sitting in the studio with the entire band while they are recording. 

Yes, but my point was unless I'm an unemployed loser with nothing else to do that's simply not realistic to do that all the time. Sitting in your home listening to music through hi-fi speakers is only possible if you aren't busy or don't have other things to do. While yes it IS better audio, hearing the same song through bluetooth compressed MP3 still gives me almost the same amount of enjoyment, when I do that I don't feel like "oh man this sounds so bad", I just enjoy the song. It is the way most people consume music these days because it is not a hassle and you can do it anywhere.

Technology improved a lot the last 20 years, like 15 years ago I used to listen to downloaded songs on my MP3 player with 64 kb/s quality, THAT was bad. Now it's really good if you have a streaming service that has CD quality of 320 kb/s. That quality is really good enough, whatever these elitist "oh but it's compressed" snobs say.

Edited by StrangerInThisTown
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10 hours ago, StrangerInThisTown said:

What, how do I have a choice on the train? You want me to bring my vinyl record player with me so I can get the mega full quality awesome audio experience everytime I listen to a song? Haha

Yes, but my point was unless I'm an unemployed loser with nothing else to do that's simply not realistic to do that all the time. Sitting in your home listening to music through hi-fi speakers is only possible if you aren't busy or don't have other things to do. While yes it IS better audio, hearing the same song through bluetooth compressed MP3 still gives me almost the same amount of enjoyment, when I do that I don't feel like "oh man this sounds so bad", I just enjoy the song. It is the way most people consume music these days because it is not a hassle and you can do it anywhere.

Technology improved a lot the last 20 years, like 15 years ago I used to listen to downloaded songs on my MP3 player with 64 kb/s quality, THAT was bad. Now it's really good if you have a streaming service that has CD quality of 320 kb/s. That quality is really good enough, whatever these elitist "oh but it's compressed" snobs say.

You realize people can listen in multiple different ways? Streaming is great for on the go. I stream fairly often as well. You do you. No one is telling you not to. People also make time to do many things. Sitting down and listening to a record can be one of them 

We’re talking about the use of an original master for remasters as it pertains to the Universal fire in this thread. Typically at that level, that involves audiophile talk as that’s really where anyone will hear any discernible difference between using an original master as a source or a copy

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10 hours ago, StrangerInThisTown said:

Yes, but my point was unless I'm an unemployed loser with nothing else to do that's simply not realistic to do that all the time. Sitting in your home listening to music through hi-fi speakers is only possible if you aren't busy or don't have other things to do. While yes it IS better audio, hearing the same song through bluetooth compressed MP3 still gives me almost the same amount of enjoyment, when I do that I don't feel like "oh man this sounds so bad", I just enjoy the song. It is the way most people consume music these days because it is not a hassle and you can do it anywhere.

Technology improved a lot the last 20 years, like 15 years ago I used to listen to downloaded songs on my MP3 player with 64 kb/s quality, THAT was bad. Now it's really good if you have a streaming service that has CD quality of 320 kb/s. That quality is really good enough, whatever these elitist "oh but it's compressed" snobs say.

I don't mean to argue (and it's good that we're not able to listen to music of our choice outside of home) but that's how people mostly used to listen to music (even after walkman's had been invented): at home, theirs or someone else's, and it didn't mean that they were unemployed or loiterers. People would sit and listen to music just like they would sit to read a book or watch TV.

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It's all going to hell anyway. We are the last generation lucky enough to have experienced concerts without cell phones and world class musicians in their prime.

I don't envy the youth. Their music sucks on both vinyl and streaming. Empty. No soul. No spirit. It's over.

"They" will likely set more things on fire to destroy the remains of the last real humans.

And I looked, and behold a pale horse, and his name that sat on him was death, and hell followed with him.

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11 hours ago, StrangerInThisTown said:

almost the same amount of enjoyment, when I do that I don't feel like "oh man this sounds so bad", I just enjoy the song.

It's different for everyone. I can still enjoy a song through crappy mp3 quality obviously, but when I really want to enjoy music, I have to listen through my stereo to get the best listening experience because there's usually some nuance missing with mp3 and streaming quality. 

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4 hours ago, EvanG said:

It's different for everyone. I can still enjoy a song through crappy mp3 quality obviously, but when I really want to enjoy music, I have to listen through my stereo to get the best listening experience because there's usually some nuance missing with mp3 and streaming quality. 

In my experience, once you have heard a song played on a good quality LP (or a hi res digital file) on a good system, it's hard to go back to listening to a bog standard MP3 through earpods or a Bluetooth speaker.

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6 hours ago, EvanG said:

It's different for everyone. I can still enjoy a song through crappy mp3 quality obviously, but when I really want to enjoy music, I have to listen through my stereo to get the best listening experience because there's usually some nuance missing with mp3 and streaming quality. 

I get that this makes sense, but would you be able to point at some nuance that's missing in MP3 in a GNR song? I would like some hard evidence that I would actually go "wow that's missing from the streaming I've been doing" compared to stereo? Maybe it's all in your mind, I mean, we are all playing the same audio file in the end.

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1 hour ago, StrangerInThisTown said:

I get that this makes sense, but would you be able to point at some nuance that's missing in MP3 in a GNR song? I would like some hard evidence that I would actually go "wow that's missing from the streaming I've been doing" compared to stereo? Maybe it's all in your mind, I mean, we are all playing the same audio file in the end.

I can't give a specific example off the top of my head right now, but little things like additional guitar licks or riffs in the background of a song that you can barely hear through an MP3 but you can hear very clearly through a stereo system. You said streaming services have become much better in recent years, so maybe it's not that noticeable anymore nowadays (at the moment I really only listen to music through youtube or else through my stereo), but when I used to listen to MP3's I noticed not hearing added instruments that I did hear when I listened to the CD through my stereo.

Edited by EvanG
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On 8/17/2022 at 7:32 AM, AxlRQ93 said:

is it possible that a lot of old GNR stuff was burnt in the 2008 fire n that’s why we didn’t get any 80s live videos with locked & loaded and why UYI boxset has been delayed cause they need 3rd party sources for things ?

no, because "Used To Love Her live Belgium 1993" was released on YouTube and "Live at the Ritz 1988" with very good quality was shown on some official Locked N' Loaded release party or something. They have live footages. 100%

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If GNR own their masters there was no reason for them to be stored at universal, Metallica bought back their masters in 2012. 

I’d suggest Axl/GnR probably purchased them back many years ago or always owned them to begin with.

Also I remember reading an interview with slash a long time ago where he said that recording all of the concerts was at the bands expense, not the label, so all of that live stuff is probably in Axls basement.

Edited by megaguns1982
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