The JRE

[Tom2112]

2 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

The lab leak theory has not been "found to be correct". Scientists are very divided. 

Scientists who are being funded by certain people say "we can't be sure", anyone can have their conclusion land the way they want it if they have enough incentive. I think we can safely say it's as confirmed as it ever will be though just like other suspicious things thstvhage occured like nord streams sabotage that countries refuse to reveal their conclusions on.

The evidence is compelling what's the argument against? Someone ate something and it developed into a world wide plague? In the same area as a lab creating viruses that were criticised for their poor lab security/protocols. It's a huge reach to accept the "official" story.

Edited October 29, 2024 by Tom2112

[Sweersa]

5 hours ago, downzy said:

But if he's going to interview guests with deranged and dangerous opinions, he could do the very least and educate himself on the subject to push back on their insanity.  The fact that he rarely does this and gives cart blanche for assholes and lunatics to speak to his massive audience is irresponsible.

The way I look at it, it is his podcast, so he can do as he pleases. Hopefully the viewers are intelligent enough to formulate their own opinions and research anything of question.

[Sweersa]

6 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

Scientists who are being funded by certain people say "we can't be sure", anyone can have their conclusion land the way they want it if they have enough incentive. I think we can safely say it's as confirmed as it ever will be though just like other suspicious things thstvhage occured like nord streams sabotage that countries refuse to reveal their conclusions on.

The evidence is compelling what's the argument against? Someone ate something and it developed into a world wide plague? In the same area as a lab creating viruses that were criticised for their poor lab security/protocols. It's a huge reach to accept the "official" story.

I believe the official current US government stance is it most likely was a lab leak, but is still uncertain. (We may never know)

https://oversight.house.gov/release/classified-state-department-documents-credibly-suggest-covid-19-lab-leak-wenstrup-pushes-for-declassification/

[HOOSIER GUNZ]

The intel state aka the blob

[vloors]

6 hours ago, downzy said:

Fine, then have comedians and UFC fighters on.

But if he's going to interview guests with deranged and dangerous opinions, he could do the very least and educate himself on the subject to push back on their insanity.  The fact that he rarely does this and gives cart blanche for assholes and lunatics to speak to his massive audience is irresponsible.

Like?

 

Thats your opinion of who you think is dangerous and deranged not everyones. Its funny you give the impression of someone that is against the right to have freedom of speech (your countries first amendment), very closed minded and against any differences of opinion.

[SoulMonster]

1 hour ago, Tom2112 said:

Scientists who are being funded by certain people say "we can't be sure", anyone can have their conclusion land the way they want it if they have enough incentive. I think we can safely say it's as confirmed as it ever will be though just like other suspicious things thstvhage occured like nord streams sabotage that countries refuse to reveal their conclusions on.

The evidence is compelling what's the argument against? Someone ate something and it developed into a world wide plague? In the same area as a lab creating viruses that were criticised for their poor lab security/protocols. It's a huge reach to accept the "official" story.

Nah, scientists in Norway who are objective here, are divided. 

The alternative is a zoonotic event, spread from animals to humans, a fairly common occurence. 

[downzy]

6 hours ago, Tom2112 said:

One is that covid came from a lab leak, he was heaviliy criticised for suggesting it, even though we all knew the bat story the media was running with was BS. I suppose you still disagree with this though😄

You're missing a lot of context here.

First, it was never conclusively proven one way or another covid-19 was the result of a lab leak.

Second, it was not so much a conspiracy, but critics asked for proof that was more than just tangential or coincidental.

Third, one of the big reasons why the lab leaker theory was promoted as much as it was in 2020 was as a means to excuse Trump's poor handling and downplaying of the pandemic.  Trump supporters were quick to blame China as a means to distract discussions about how badly Trump had managed the crisis.  People who were critical of the theory were simply asking for definitive proof (of which there still isn't any) while also countering the notion that the pandemic was all China's fault and that Trump beared little or no responsibility for downplaying the crisis (that led to deaths of tens, if not hundreds, of thousands).

6 hours ago, Tom2112 said:

And have your opinions, but also if you can't handle him having people on that are giving side two of the story then again that's on you! 

This is why having a discussion with you is difficult.

You have no idea what news I consume.  You don't know that I read conservative columnists all the time, that I listen to any argument so long as it's well reasoned or made with sincerity.  Instead you just assume something about me personally as a means to attack rather than address the point at hand.

I have no issue with listening to those who I disagree with.  Frankly, I find it boring to read only opinions that adhere to my own bias or views.

The problem I have with Rogan isn't that he has "both sides" on, but he's ill equipped or insincere in his responsibilities as an interviewer.  Having someone like Bret Weinstein or RFK Jr,. on to spout nonsense isn't about hearing "both sides," it's about generating engagement to justify that $250 million Spotify deal Rogan signed.  Rogan is more about generating content for his audience that keeps them engaged.  And conspiracy and absurd nonsense that validates the delusions of many is a great way to do that.

7 hours ago, Tom2112 said:

End of the day, if he wants to talk to a scientist, politician, doctor, musician or whatever he can do that, and you can choose not to listen if you want to. This idea that he needs to be more thoughtful about how his podcast is influencing the weak minds is hilarious. If you're so worried about that, let's get rid 99% of news media, and social media or are the mega companies safe from criticism because they tend to lean blue😄

Ah, the old "everything is biased so let's not shit on the worst offenders" argument.

Look, I don't care about bias.  What I care about is validity.  Some truth is biased one way or another.  It's not biased to say the world is warming up and that human beings are responsible for it.

I will listen to almost anyone if their arguments are made in good faith.  But so many of Rogan's guests aren't making good-faith arguments.  They know it.  He knows it.  But they don't care because they both benefit financially from it.  They're not actually interested in getting to the truth of the matter since few of them will ever admit they're wrong.  They'll continue to push nonsense long after it's been debunked.  Some of it is harmless, but often it is not.  You can't say the about many of the reputable news outlets because they take their jobs extremely seriously.  Getting it wrong isn't the litmus test.  Admitting you're wrong and making changes is.  And Rogan and many of guests never admit fault or change their opinions regardless of what facts say.  There is no financial motive to do so for them.  

2 hours ago, Sweersa said:

The way I look at it, it is his podcast, so he can do as he pleases.

Right.  And I don't have an issue with that.

But others, including myself, are within our right to call him and his listeners out for propagating misinformation that has real world consequences. 

Rogan is free to do what he wants.  And we're free to criticize him for it.

[downzy]

2 hours ago, Sweersa said:

I believe the official current US government stance is it most likely was a lab leak, but is still uncertain. (We may never know)

https://oversight.house.gov/release/classified-state-department-documents-credibly-suggest-covid-19-lab-leak-wenstrup-pushes-for-declassification/

This is a Republican opinion based on classified information. 

Unless we can see the information in question, it's difficult to know whether the Republican-led house report is fair in its assessment.

[downzy]

1 hour ago, vloors said:

Thats your opinion of who you think is dangerous and deranged not everyones. Its funny you give the impression of someone that is against the right to have freedom of speech (your countries first amendment), very closed minded and against any differences of opinion.

First off, I'm not American, and where I live there is no first amendment.

Second, I have no issue with Rogan saying whatever he wants.  Just as I have no issue with anyone saying what they want here (so long as they follow the rules).

But I'm also free to criticize Rogan for failing his audience by allowing grifters and con-man on as means to boost his audience through engagement.  

[Sweersa]

4 minutes ago, downzy said:

Right.  And I don't have an issue with that.

But others, including myself, are within our right to call him and his listeners out for propagating misinformation that has real world consequences. 

Rogan is free to do what he wants.  And we're free to criticize him for it.

Yes, of course. 

2 minutes ago, downzy said:

This is a Republican opinion based on classified information. 

Unless we can see the information in question, it's difficult to know whether the Republican-led house report is fair in its assessment.

Maybe time will tell. At first glance though, it shouldn't be surprising, given where the outbreak started... 

[Tom2112]

1 hour ago, downzy said:

You're missing a lot of context here.

First, it was never conclusively proven one way or another covid-19 was the result of a lab leak.

Second, it was not so much a conspiracy, but critics asked for proof that was more than just tangential or coincidental.

Third, one of the big reasons why the lab leaker theory was promoted as much as it was in 2020 was as a means to excuse Trump's poor handling and downplaying of the pandemic.  Trump supporters were quick to blame China as a means to distract discussions about how badly Trump had managed the crisis.  People who were critical of the theory were simply asking for definitive proof (of which there still isn't any) while also countering the notion that the pandemic was all China's fault and that Trump beared little or no responsibility for downplaying the crisis (that led to deaths of tens, if not hundreds, of thousands).

This is why having a discussion with you is difficult.

You have no idea what news I consume.  You don't know that I read conservative columnists all the time, that I listen to any argument so long as it's well reasoned or made with sincerity.  Instead you just assume something about me personally as a means to attack rather than address the point at hand.

I have no issue with listening to those who I disagree with.  Frankly, I find it boring to read only opinions that adhere to my own bias or views.

The problem I have with Rogan isn't that he has "both sides" on, but he's ill equipped or insincere in his responsibilities as an interviewer.  Having someone like Bret Weinstein or RFK Jr,. on to spout nonsense isn't about hearing "both sides," it's about generating engagement to justify that $250 million Spotify deal Rogan signed.  Rogan is more about generating content for his audience that keeps them engaged.  And conspiracy and absurd nonsense that validates the delusions of many is a great way to do that.

Ah, the old "everything is biased so let's not shit on the worst offenders" argument.

Look, I don't care about bias.  What I care about is validity.  Some truth is biased one way or another.  It's not biased to say the world is warming up and that human beings are responsible for it.

I will listen to almost anyone if their arguments are made in good faith.  But so many of Rogan's guests aren't making good-faith arguments.  They know it.  He knows it.  But they don't care because they both benefit financially from it.  They're not actually interested in getting to the truth of the matter since few of them will ever admit they're wrong.  They'll continue to push nonsense long after it's been debunked.  Some of it is harmless, but often it is not.  You can't say the about many of the reputable news outlets because they take their jobs extremely seriously.  Getting it wrong isn't the litmus test.  Admitting you're wrong and making changes is.  And Rogan and many of guests never admit fault or change their opinions regardless of what facts say.  There is no financial motive to do so for them.  

Right.  And I don't have an issue with that.

But others, including myself, are within our right to call him and his listeners out for propagating misinformation that has real world consequences. 

Rogan is free to do what he wants.  And we're free to criticize him for it.

Likewise it's really difficult to argue with someone that doesn't join the dots for themselves and needs this essentially impossible standard of proof. I wish there would be one concise document released that would outright say conclusively that that is what happened, but there's far too much political pressure to ever really hang it directly it on the wuhan lab theory. The best we get is knowing this is the story and not having them directly admit it.

As if America is the only country in the world. There was many countries that mishandled covid. And there was many other countries and leaders that were looking east when the virus sprouted its head. Disagree/agree whatever😄

Rogan doesn't admit when he's wrong or change his opinion.... is absolute horseshit and only spoken by people who do not listen to him, I have heard him on several occasions backtracking on positions on the podcast saying he was wrong and then giving the more correct information. Again, you don't have to like him or his politics but at least be honest in your analysis. Now... as far as his guests go, I do agree there are some people on there that I have no idea why they are repeat guests, I disagree with just about everything they say, and you are entirely correct some are on there being completely false and selling misinformation a d in so e cases he does not push back in the way i'd like him to. That's SOME of his guests, the other 90% aren't doing that, so you have to have some balance in the criticism.

But yeah, Axl would be great on Rogan🤣

[Tom2112]

2 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

Nah, scientists in Norway who are objective here, are divided. 

The alternative is a zoonotic event, spread from animals to humans, a fairly common occurence. 

Nah, who paid these objective scientists. I don't care what country they come from. This idea that scientists can't be pressured to say something that isn't entirely true. For example when the WHO  was investigating and the Chinese wouldn't participate unless it was agreed beforehand that the verdict would be that the lab theory was not the cause and would need no further examination.

Many reasons why a team might bow to pressure. Political pressure. Financial pressure, career opportunities pressure. Again just like Downzy, believe what you like. We're way off the rails here, if you want to discuss we can PM

[Tom2112]

4 hours ago, Sweersa said:

I believe the official current US government stance is it most likely was a lab leak, but is still uncertain. (We may never know)

https://oversight.house.gov/release/classified-state-department-documents-credibly-suggest-covid-19-lab-leak-wenstrup-pushes-for-declassification/

Exactly, conclusive closed book standard proof is just not on the cards. 

[downzy]

24 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

Likewise it's really difficult to argue with someone that doesn't join the dots for themselves and needs this essentially impossible standard of proof. I wish there would be one concise document released that would outright say conclusively that that is what happened, but there's far too much political pressure to ever really hang it directly it on the wuhan lab theory. The best we get is knowing this is the story and not having them directly admit it.

I asked you what "conspiracy theory" promoted on Rogan (largely by Bret Weinstein) that later proved to be true.

Your response is a theory that still has yet to be substantiated with definitive proof.  That isn't an example of something being true.  That's you "connecting the dots" on an issue where many others disagree and where there's a lack of supporting evidence to connect those dots.  That doesn't mean the lab leak theory isn't true, but you're not in a strong position to use it as an example of a conspiracy theory being actually true. 

A theory around covid-19 that was at first rejected by world health organizations that was later proved to be true (and substantiated) was that Covid-19 was an airborne transmitted virus.  But this was never viewed as a "conspiracy theory" because or adopted by Trump defenders because to argue that claim would necessitate the use of greater mask use.  That's an example of a theory that was at first discarded but later proven true.  The lab leak theory, for all intents and purposes, is still just a theory.

24 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

As if America is the only country in the world. There was many countries that mishandled covid. And there was many other countries and leaders that were looking east when the virus sprouted its head. Disagree/agree whatever😄

But almost every other country did better than America.  There were few, if any countries, that denied the scope of the problem like America did under Trump.  Few other countries looked for "alternative" forms of medicine like America did with Hydroxychloroquine and invermectin.  Few others disparaged the use of masks as a means to slow down transmission or deny the severity of the virus.  No country was perfect, but to say that because other countries also did poorly is somehow to excuse the U.S. under Trump's leadership is absurd.  Prior to covid-19 the U.S. was considered the most capable of managing an epidemic or pandemic due to its resources and medical expertise.  And when all is said and done, the U.S. faced one of the worst infection and death rates than any other developed nation on the planet.

27 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

I have heard him on several occasions backtracking on positions on the podcast saying he was wrong and then giving the more correct information.

Like?

And does he still continue to book the same guests who spout nonsense? 

Sorry, just read the rest of your post.

Look, ultimately we're swimming in a world of more misinformation than ever.  There are few places where a lot of people get their news.  People will claim that it's the responsibility of listeners to fact check what they're hearing over a three hour program.  But that's not how that works (moreover, I have a hard time believing that anyone who has three hours to listen to Rogan's program has the time to do further investigation and research).  I took and take the same issue with Jon Stewart when he claims he's just a comedian and his program shouldn't be held accountable for what he's saying.  That's bullshit.  If you know a vast portion of your audience relies on you for information, you owe it to them and to society at large to try your best to get it right.  Rogan has made little to no effort on that front.  Why challenge what his listeners want to hear when he knows they'll just go elsewhere?

22 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

Exactly, conclusive closed book standard proof is just not on the cards. 

As I mentioned, this isn't the definitive view of the U.S. government.  It's a summary report issued by the Republican-led house.  We have no idea whether their summary is an accurate reflection of what the classified information says.  

[evilfacelessturtle]

Jesus Christ, this is the ultimate proof that you cannot get anywhere trying to have a conversation with the right. They're still on talking points that were addressed 4 years ago.

The possibility that it came from a lab was never the conspiracy theory, the conspiracy theory was that it was deliberately leaked from a lab as a bioweapon.

If you were to insist for 30 years that OJ was innocent despite the available evidence pointing otherwise, and then 30 years later new research shows there's a 50/50 chance he is innocent, you haven't been vindicated and it doesn't mean the original prosecution was "misinformation", they were simply working off the best available data at that time.

This is the same dumb fallacy antivaxxers keep falling for with everything, whether it's early guidelines about preventing the spread of a novel emerging disease or early research on its origins.

[evilfacelessturtle]

4 hours ago, Sweersa said:

The way I look at it, it is his podcast, so he can do as he pleases. Hopefully the viewers are intelligent enough to formulate their own opinions and research anything of question.

What ever happened to personal responsibility? Rogan has no responsibility with his powerful platform?

Multiple people in this very thread are proving that they do not form their own opinions, that they take his guests seriously and are not critical of the things they say. Just look at Tom's blind parroting of Rogan's covid lies.

It's literally being proven right here in front of our eyes.

4 hours ago, vloors said:

Thats your opinion of who you think is dangerous and deranged not everyones. Its funny you give the impression of someone that is against the right to have freedom of speech (your countries first amendment), very closed minded and against any differences of opinion.

Quote where he said Rogan should be thrown in jail. I'll wait...

With rights come responsibilities. Democracy cannot function if the people do not take seriously the responsibility that comes with their rights.

The more you cry "free speech violation!" at anyone who disagrees with or criticizes you, the less anyone will take you seriously. There's a good book on this, it's called "The Boy Who Cried Wolf".

Criticism is not censorship.

Apparently this needs to be taped to the back of every right winger's hand so they don't keep forgetting it every time they get triggered by criticism.

59 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

Likewise it's really difficult to argue with someone that doesn't join the dots for themselves and needs this essentially impossible standard of proof.

AKA "any standard whatsoever" or "the same scientific standards that are used for everything else on earth"

Just jump to conclusions, baby! It's genuinely hilarious that you can say that with a straight face and not die of embarrassment.

Boy, if you distrust scientists this much, I hope you never drive a car or use technology of any kind. Because that would be admitting you do trust them, you just choose to ignore them when it suits your partisan agenda.

Because they used the exact same scientific process and peer review to develop your alternator that they used to conclude that global warming is anthropomorphic (human-caused) and that the covid vaccine is effective and safe.

Tough break.

1 hour ago, Tom2112 said:

there's far too much political pressure to ever really hang it directly it on the wuhan lab theory.

So wait, this means that if there's political pressure form the right on any subject at all, it can never be determined?

There's far too much political pressure by the right on crime stats to ever trust the numbers reported by police, right? And police are well known to lean conservative! Just join the dots yourself!

There's far too much political pressure by the right on border issues to ever trust the numbers reported by ICE, right? And ICE are well known to lean conservative! Just join the dots yourself!

1 hour ago, Tom2112 said:

Nah, who paid these objective scientists.

Good question. Let me know the answer when you finish your research on that. Because I know you aren't just throwing that out there to sow doubt with zero intention of actually getting the answer.

Or maybe every scientist in every country on Earth is somehow funded by the US Democratic party.

1 hour ago, Tom2112 said:

Exactly, conclusive closed book standard proof is just not on the cards. 

Wait, so then how can you say the lab leak was proven true and that zoonotic origin is "BS"?

Man, it's almost like everything a right winger says is an ad hoc justification...

[evilfacelessturtle]

"Network news has become so partisan, distorted and fake that licenses must be revoked." -  Donald Trump

“FAKE NEWS SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO ‘STINK UP’ OUR AIRWAVES!” - Donald Trump

"ABC’s license should be TERMINATED." - Donald Trump

"Our so-called “government” should come down hard on them and make them pay for their illegal political activity." - Donald Trump

Where were the "Defenders of Free Speech" on these ones?

Crickets...

Edited October 30, 2024 by evilfacelessturtle

[SoulMonster]

6 hours ago, Tom2112 said:

Nah, who paid these objective scientists. I don't care what country they come from.

That's ridiculuos. 

[D..]

11 hours ago, downzy said:

But almost every other country did better than America.  There were few, if any countries, that denied the scope of the problem like America did under Trump.  Few other countries looked for "alternative" forms of medicine like America did with Hydroxychloroquine and invermectin.  Few others disparaged the use of masks as a means to slow down transmission or deny the severity of the virus.  No country was perfect, but to say that because other countries also did poorly is somehow to excuse the U.S. under Trump's leadership is absurd.  Prior to covid-19 the U.S. was considered the most capable of managing an epidemic or pandemic due to its resources and medical expertise.  And when all is said and done, the U.S. faced one of the worst infection and death rates than any other developed nation on the planet.

Not a Trump supporter here as I don't care, I'm french, but let's be more precise.

When you look at which country did better regarding this pandemic, you will have a hard time understanding why and establishing the reasons they have more or less deaths than another country.
If we judge by the data "Deaths per million" regarding every country, you have to believe every country counted every covid deaths without cheating (I know for a fact a lot of covid deaths weren't counted

in the covid deaths in France, knowing several persons that worked in hospitals in 2020, they often attributed deaths to other diseases), and that every country's data

is legitimate when we know a lot of african countries are under-developed and didn't have the means to test everyone and didn't know if a specific death was due to covid because they

couldn't even test the person.

We could compare rather comparable countries that chose a different strategy like Sweden (who didn't put their population in quarantine) and France (who put our population in quarantine) and the deaths per million are almost the same.

If you were the believe the hard cold datas, most african countries did better than most developed countries from Europe. Does that really mean a thing when they couldn't test properly and

didn't even take measures? Maybe it's due to their hotter & more favorable climate, who knows, that was a theory from some scientists.

 

Regarding the death rate in the US, France and the US took most of the same strategies for two years (regarding masks, quarantine, absence of treatment -more on that afterwards - and then vaccinating

everyone threatening they'd lose their job without thinking about side effets), but the US did worse regarding death rate.

There's an explanation as to why the US did worse than France for example during the pandemic, and no, it's not because of  Trump or the US decisions.

It's because there are a lot more obese people in the US than we have in France. Americans have bad habits with fast foods and transformated food, and do less sport. People are way more healthy in France for example.

Being obese was stated time and again as an underlying condition to have much more severe side effets from being infected by covid, and often times dying.

Regarding hydroxychloroquine, it was promoted by a top french scientist named Didier Raoult after he studied datas from China. Trump saw that and thought it could be a treatment, as there

was no known treatment and no vaccine back then. And back then Didier Raoult was one of our most respected microbiologists. His career was extremely damaged since then because he was vocal about vaccines, and he promoted hydroxychloroquine, BUT he had the best results in France in his hospital during the pandemic. A lot of politics like Christian Estrosi (mayor of Nice) went to his hospital and were cured with hydroxychloroquine. Because of political pressure & consensus, they turned their back on Didier Raoult afterwards, but he cured them. It's crazy.

The person who put pressure on France to stop the use hydroxychloroquine was Doctor Anthony Fauci. We learnt that because of a leaked mail between Jean-François Delfraissy (a corrupt politician in France) and

Anthony Fauci. For what reason? We'll never know for sure.

What we can observe for sure is that France followed the US decisions and overall, Trump didn't take much decisions, it was essentially Fauci, and France followed.

What's interesting is that Trump did take an interesting decision at the early stage, when there was a boat with infected people, and he refused to let passengers come on the US territory.

There wasn't even talks of quarantine at this stage. People thought he was crazy, but then how many countries decided to isolate people and close their borders? Trump was the one with that intuition.

Still, regarding the datas, whether borders were closed or not, whether people were quarantine or not, the results didn't improve. It wasn't a solution.

 

I could go on and on, but I feel it's already a lot of information to digest.

Bottom fact: there wasn't a miraculous solution regarding this f virus, we still don't completely understand why some healthy young people died. It's said that must have had some kind of underlying

condition that wasn't known and that combined with covid, it killed them. What's for sure is that a lot of people died because they were in bad condition, especially if they were obese.

Trump did try to find solutions (sometimes with a very poor language as he once confused hydroxychloroquine with something you

put in aquariums with fishes and I think I recall someone dying after eating this, blindly listening to Trump, the fact he wasn't better advised and how he doesn't study more before talking is beyond me)

but ultimately, he followed Fauci on most decisions and it turns out one of the only possible treatments was banned in the early stages.

I'd also add that when the pandemic began, we were told in France not to wear masks, that it was dangerous. It tooks several weeks before they strongly advised to wear masks.
 

 

 

[Sweersa]

12 hours ago, evilfacelessturtle said:

What ever happened to personal responsibility? Rogan has no responsibility with his powerful platform?

That is correct! You can start your own podcast and run it how you like. He doesn't live in some nanny country where he has to worry about what he talks about.

As my friend would say, it's the internet, man!  Rogan is very light in the God-less abyss of the Internet. 

[Tom2112]

12 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

That's ridiculuos. 

Ha! OK, back to sleep so, don't worry about it, the grown ups will take it from here pet😄

[SoulMonster]

11 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

Ha! OK, back to sleep so, don't worry about it, the grown ups will take it from here pet😄

What does that even mean? But hey, tell us more about how the different scientific opinions on how the Covid-19 virus originated comes from scientists being paid off. More specifically, who paid thousands of Norwegian scientists off?

[Tom2112]

 

18 hours ago, downzy said:

I asked you what "conspiracy theory" promoted on Rogan (largely by Bret Weinstein) that later proved to be true.

Your response is a theory that still has yet to be substantiated with definitive proof.  That isn't an example of something being true.  That's you "connecting the dots" on an issue where many others disagree and where there's a lack of supporting evidence to connect those dots.  That doesn't mean the lab leak theory isn't true, but you're not in a strong position to use it as an example of a conspiracy theory being actually true. 

A theory around covid-19 that was at first rejected by world health organizations that was later proved to be true (and substantiated) was that Covid-19 was an airborne transmitted virus.  But this was never viewed as a "conspiracy theory" because or adopted by Trump defenders because to argue that claim would necessitate the use of greater mask use.  That's an example of a theory that was at first discarded but later proven true.  The lab leak theory, for all intents and purposes, is still just a theory.

But almost every other country did better than America.  There were few, if any countries, that denied the scope of the problem like America did under Trump.  Few other countries looked for "alternative" forms of medicine like America did with Hydroxychloroquine and invermectin.  Few others disparaged the use of masks as a means to slow down transmission or deny the severity of the virus.  No country was perfect, but to say that because other countries also did poorly is somehow to excuse the U.S. under Trump's leadership is absurd.  Prior to covid-19 the U.S. was considered the most capable of managing an epidemic or pandemic due to its resources and medical expertise.  And when all is said and done, the U.S. faced one of the worst infection and death rates than any other developed nation on the planet.

Like?

And does he still continue to book the same guests who spout nonsense? 

Sorry, just read the rest of your post.

Look, ultimately we're swimming in a world of more misinformation than ever.  There are few places where a lot of people get their news.  People will claim that it's the responsibility of listeners to fact check what they're hearing over a three hour program.  But that's not how that works (moreover, I have a hard time believing that anyone who has three hours to listen to Rogan's program has the time to do further investigation and research).  I took and take the same issue with Jon Stewart when he claims he's just a comedian and his program shouldn't be held accountable for what he's saying.  That's bullshit.  If you know a vast portion of your audience relies on you for information, you owe it to them and to society at large to try your best to get it right.  Rogan has made little to no effort on that front.  Why challenge what his listeners want to hear when he knows they'll just go elsewhere?

As I mentioned, this isn't the definitive view of the U.S. government.  It's a summary report issued by the Republican-led house.  We have no idea whether their summary is an accurate reflection of what the classified information says.  

That last comment is a little weird to me. If a democrat led house came to the same conclusion, would you doubt it's authenticity?

I think you truly believe he is deliberately pedalling false claims. I just don't think it's accurate, while I also appreciate thst he isca entertainer in search of views and is looking for content that is edgy. He has made efforts to have guests in from all perspectives, have guests debate each other. It's not just one view point. I don't leave thinking this is everything I need to know on this subject. Often times you hear something, pause the episode and look things up. I don't listen to all 3 hours back to back. I mean if you were then I'd imagine most of it is not being digested. I appreciate that, that's how I do things and others as you say treat it as their sole piece of news. You just can't be entertaining while also stopping every other sentence to put disclaimers. These shows aren't aimed at children these are adults that are supposed to be able to come to their own conclusions. 

End of day, let's say you were listening to Rogan. You have respiratory and other health issues and yet you listen to his podcast and say I'm not wearing masks etc. That's on you, your own personal health and safety as a mentally stable adult lands on your shoulders. 

[Sweersa]

29 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

End of day, let's say you were listening to Rogan. You have respiratory and other health issues and yet you listen to his podcast and say I'm not wearing masks etc. That's on you, your own personal health and safety as a mentally stable adult lands on your shoulders. 

I remember people here, were more or less saying I was responsible for the deaths of others for not wearing a mask and not getting vaccinated against covid.

I don't think this forum is representative of most GN'R fans, as the show my dad and I attended in Detroit, which had all walks of life, very, very few masks, and it was in 2021.

[Tom2112]

1 hour ago, Sweersa said:

I remember people here, were more or less saying I was responsible for the deaths of others for not wearing a mask and not getting vaccinated against covid.

I don't think this forum is representative of most GN'R fans, as the show my dad and I attended in Detroit, which had all walks of life, very, very few masks, and it was in 2021.

Largely the same group fighting for (rightly so) 'your body your choice' which is ironic considering they think your right to choose was wrong and should have been mandatory.

I took the vaccine, got boosters, isolated and wore my mask. Only thing I regret was taking the vaccine, which i won't get into because i'll just get shouted down. Anyway, you're always going to run into people with differing opinions, some you can talk to others are just so moronic you have to put them on ignore both in real life and online.