Nobody has to defend Axls new sound

[Nick85]

I think I have every right to call Axl a fuckin' dick. That's what he is. He was a cool dick back in the AFD days when he'd pick fights with uncool dicks like Vince Neil and the dead guy from Nirvana. He was a cool dick when he'd have the balls say a bunch of racist, homophobic, sexist shit on albums. Now he's an uncool dick because he's arrogant and doesn't rock anymore.

F*ck Fear - being a fan of someone doesn't mean you have to choke down any bullshit they feed you can call it candy. Those are the kinds of people Axl's surrounded himself with for years and look where it's gotten him. No real tour. No real album.

As for "every" major summer festival - c'mon, you can't be seriously saying that. Rock In Rio? That's every summer festival now? Coachella, Bonnaroo, Vegas Bonaroor, Teluride, Lollapalooza... they don't count anymore? Big deal that Axl manages to scrape together his traveling side show for the same one concert year after year. When he can put out an album and play more than a handful of shows from a tour, maybe I'll change my mind. But if IRS is any indication, the album's going to suck anyways.

Believe me, there's nobody on this planet who'd want to see an Axl Rose comeback more than I do. But I just think it's many years off. Axl's going to have to get over himself, swallow his pride and admit that Izzy, Slash and the rest of the band had as much to do with the music as he did. Maybe when Chinese Democracy comes out and fails, it'll humble Axl to the point that he can mend fences with the old band mates. I'm ready for the Axl comeback, but I don't think it'll happen for another ten years.

For the record, I thought VR's album was weak, but at least they were putting out music. There were a couple of good riffs on there. From the interviews I've read, their new sprawling concept album sounds retarded.

And I've read mygnr.com for years. I only bothered posting when there was something worth talking about. Thanks Axl!

Yes, I like to make fun of Axl's weight. I'll make sure to send you a copy of my performance on Conan.

I'm sorry you are so right. It is awesome to be a "cool dick" by being a bigot, homophobe, and starting fights with the "dead guy from Nirvana." I completely forgot that is why I got into GNR in the first place. It wasn't about the music, it was about Axl being a "cool dick." If this is intended as a joke, it's not very funny. If it is indeed your honest opinion, than do me a little favor. Turn off the computer, and log back on once your sack drops and you graduate from middle school.

[Nightcrawler]

I think alot of the criticism Axl recieves from fans in terms of the wall of silence and secracy is valid, from a fans point of view, It's created alot of bitterness is alot of fans because it's gone on for so freakin long.

In terms of the new stuff I think there is a more critical ear applied to it because it's not instantly recognizable or catchy. People have a weird standard for music Guns n roses. It was a Hardrock band but people apply a pop standard to it. That's where Axl, like VR is running into a problem amoung fans.

In a simplification of terms Slash Duff and Matt were the Hardrock guys who didn't take themselves seriously, Axl the guy with pop sensibilties, not bubblegum pop, just pop in the way Paul McCartney was pop, and took himself a little more seriously.

With VR people got upset because they didn't record pop rock songs, they recording "boring" hard rock for the most part.

Axl is the more pop guy of the band and this stuff does have a pop feel to it , but then people are upset because it's not hardrock enough.

Kind of ironic.

It is.

They get mad at Axl's vision,but it's clearly ok for VR to work with Pharell and Macy Gray

I like Axl for his "exploring" vision,and I like VR for the hardrock element.

Well, let's be honest, VR caught and catches shit for not being GNR too, which is the root complaint behind all the comments of boring and dull. Izzy took the classic rock riffs and Steven took the fun drumbeat when they left. VR was left with straight up hard rock mostly, Axl took the pop appeal with him and scott was too involved in his drama to bring it out like he did in STP on contraband. I bring this up because it's the same problem Axls stuff is hitting with alot of people, but for lacking punch.

I have to admit I was taken aback by the sound of IRS and better at first, even though I knew to expect something different, I'm willing to bet Axls album will be one that takes some getting used to because of his style change for those of us who remember the old stuff, it was so powerful it can't help but leave it's impression on us to this day which makes me envy a new fan who is without preconcieved notions hearing the album.

I think the idea of VR working with Pharell is cool, the end product may be a mess though, that's part of the excitement of that, same with the prospect of Axl and his new band to me.

Macy Gray? Really? I really don't want other singers on the album.

But back to what i was saying, I think when Axl presents his album or the first official taste of it to us it'll be different and we'll be blown away, even the most harsh critic who is a fan. Merck said afterall that IRS was not a top track.

Edited February 22, 2006 by Nightcrawler

[ralebava]

Why I chose to do it that way is that, you know, I can sit and write poetry 'til hell freezes over, and getting attached to any particular set of words... I felt that I would write to those words in a dated fashion, and we really wouldn't get the best music. "Oh My God" is a perfect example. When we finally got "Oh My God" where it needed to be, then I got the right words to it. With "Appetite," I wrote a lot of the words first, but in, like, "Oh My God," I wrote the words second, but the music was written like "Appetite." We kept developing it until it we got it right. [With] "Appetite," everything had been worked on, and worked on, and worked on. That was not the case with "Use Your Illusion."

Hmm, considering that "Oh My God" is a piece of shit, maybe he should go back to the old strategy.

I'm tired of hearing about how anyone who doesn't like the new material isn't "advanced" enough for such "complex" music, or is stuck in the 80's. That's bullshit. Let's not act like Axl Rose is curing AIDS or even inventing a new form of music here, he's just mixing in some electronic elements into rock music..

"Hello Axl, this is Trent Reznor calling from 1989. I did that on a CD called 'Pretty Hate Machine'. It doesn't take 10 fuckin' years"

The sound Axl WAS going for would have been fresh if he haden't taken so long to release it, but at this point it's nearly outdated.

Man, i wanna know: how long takes to u compose a song like Better, The Blues, Madagascar, IRS.... i guess you´ll never do it, so dont say that it doesnt take 10 years... You dont know nothing about music.

[DirtyDeeds]

Why I chose to do it that way is that, you know, I can sit and write poetry 'til hell freezes over, and getting attached to any particular set of words... I felt that I would write to those words in a dated fashion, and we really wouldn't get the best music. "Oh My God" is a perfect example. When we finally got "Oh My God" where it needed to be, then I got the right words to it. With "Appetite," I wrote a lot of the words first, but in, like, "Oh My God," I wrote the words second, but the music was written like "Appetite." We kept developing it until it we got it right. [With] "Appetite," everything had been worked on, and worked on, and worked on. That was not the case with "Use Your Illusion."

Hmm, considering that "Oh My God" is a piece of shit, maybe he should go back to the old strategy.

Isn't that funny...the guy who wrote "that piece of shit" is now headlining pretty much every major festival this summer. Wierd, huh?

Show me one guy in this entire world that knows Axl Rose and/or Guns n' Roses as "That guy/band that wrote 'Oh My God.'" Face it. Unless you really adore Metallica's "Reload," then "Oh My God" is probably a piece of shit in your eyes, too.

[GooseKiller]

Why I chose to do it that way is that, you know, I can sit and write poetry 'til hell freezes over, and getting attached to any particular set of words... I felt that I would write to those words in a dated fashion, and we really wouldn't get the best music. "Oh My God" is a perfect example. When we finally got "Oh My God" where it needed to be, then I got the right words to it. With "Appetite," I wrote a lot of the words first, but in, like, "Oh My God," I wrote the words second, but the music was written like "Appetite." We kept developing it until it we got it right. [With] "Appetite," everything had been worked on, and worked on, and worked on. That was not the case with "Use Your Illusion."

Hmm, considering that "Oh My God" is a piece of shit, maybe he should go back to the old strategy.

Isn't that funny...the guy who wrote "that piece of shit" is now headlining pretty much every major festival this summer. Wierd, huh?

Show me one guy in this entire world that knows Axl Rose and/or Guns n' Roses as "That guy/band that wrote 'Oh My God.'" Face it. Unless you really adore Metallica's "Reload," then "Oh My God" is probably a piece of shit in your eyes, too.

Well, lets just say I wouldn't put it on my list of favorite GnR songs, but at least it's better than most music out there today...

[DirtyDeeds]

F*ck Fear - being a fan of someone doesn't mean you have to choke down any bullshit they feed you can call it candy. Those are the kinds of people Axl's surrounded himself with for years and look where it's gotten him. No real tour. No real album.

That's fine,and I sure as hell ain't being fed fuck all.

My point is,why the fuck are you here if you are not a fan?

He is a fan. He's probably more of a fan than a lot of people here. He's a fan that realizes what is shit and what is not shit. He doesn't have his head up his ass. Except for when he thought Axl was cool for saying the N-word and whatnot. Then he has his head so far up his ass that it is poking back up through his mouth.... wait... is that possible?

Sometimes, however, making fun of Axl's weight or this or that can be unwarranted, but whatever. You shouldn't get horribly offended over it unless you are indeed Mr. W. Axl Rose himself.

Edited February 22, 2006 by DirtyDeeds

[Gunner]

Great read, thanks a lot.

I really think that Oh My God has some of the coolest music and flow to it. If the CD is anywhere near that (and the leaks), I'll be more than happy. Honestly Silkworms is the only song by the new GnR that I've been disappointed with.

Almost guessed by the topic, this'd turn into a new gnr-bashing contest on a level or another.

[DirtyDeeds]

Why I chose to do it that way is that, you know, I can sit and write poetry 'til hell freezes over, and getting attached to any particular set of words... I felt that I would write to those words in a dated fashion, and we really wouldn't get the best music. "Oh My God" is a perfect example. When we finally got "Oh My God" where it needed to be, then I got the right words to it. With "Appetite," I wrote a lot of the words first, but in, like, "Oh My God," I wrote the words second, but the music was written like "Appetite." We kept developing it until it we got it right. [With] "Appetite," everything had been worked on, and worked on, and worked on. That was not the case with "Use Your Illusion."

Hmm, considering that "Oh My God" is a piece of shit, maybe he should go back to the old strategy.

I'm tired of hearing about how anyone who doesn't like the new material isn't "advanced" enough for such "complex" music, or is stuck in the 80's. That's bullshit. Let's not act like Axl Rose is curing AIDS or even inventing a new form of music here, he's just mixing in some electronic elements into rock music..

"Hello Axl, this is Trent Reznor calling from 1989. I did that on a CD called 'Pretty Hate Machine'. It doesn't take 10 fuckin' years"

The sound Axl WAS going for would have been fresh if he haden't taken so long to release it, but at this point it's nearly outdated.

Man, i wanna know: how long takes to u compose a song like Better, The Blues, Madagascar, IRS.... i guess you´ll never do it, so dont say that it doesnt take 10 years... You dont know nothing about music.

It takes about 5 minutes to do somehting like IRS. Better, TWAT, The Blues, and Madagascar take a little more time than that. I would think Madagascar would take the longest.

[Gunner]

It takes about 5 minutes to do somehting like IRS. Better, TWAT, The Blues, and Madagascar take a little more time than that. I would think Madagascar would take the longest.

Dude, you should really go into music business. I'm not even kidding. You have some talent there. Maybe you could write something for VR.

Edited February 22, 2006 by Gunner

[DirtyDeeds]

It takes about 5 minutes to do somehting like IRS. Better, TWAT, The Blues, and Madagascar take a little more time than that. I would think Madagascar would take the longest.

Dude, you should really go into music business. I'm not even kidding. You have some talent there.

Dude, not even kidding, already there.

There is nothing to IRS. A bunch of friggen power chords. You know how long it takes to put a power chord progression together? Throw a simple drum beat over it...

I can't make out most of Axl's lyrics, I'll admit that. I guess I haven't tried all that hard, but the "Gonna call the president...etc." chorus is pretty simple and I doubt meant to be more than a catchy arena rock line.

Oh how witty your edit was.

Edited February 22, 2006 by DirtyDeeds

[Gunner]

It takes about 5 minutes to do somehting like IRS. Better, TWAT, The Blues, and Madagascar take a little more time than that. I would think Madagascar would take the longest.

Dude, you should really go into music business. I'm not even kidding. You have some talent there.

Dude, not even kidding, already there.

There is nothing to IRS. A bunch of friggen power chords. You know how long it takes to put a power chord progression together? Throw a simple drum beat over it...

I can't make out most of Axl's lyrics, I'll admit that. I guess I haven't tried all that hard, but the "Gonna call the president...etc." chorus is pretty simple and I doubt meant to be more than a catchy arena rock line.

Nice. What band you're in? Have an album out? I just might buy your record.

[angry anderson]

F*ck Fear - being a fan of someone doesn't mean you have to choke down any bullshit they feed you can call it candy. Those are the kinds of people Axl's surrounded himself with for years and look where it's gotten him. No real tour. No real album.

That's fine,and I sure as hell ain't being fed fuck all.

My point is,why the fuck are you here if you are not a fan?

HE KEPT THE NAME GNR

Thats all fine and good..... but axl (and axl fans) can't expect to have their cake and eat it too.

He kept the name of the band that 5 guys built together (and the name was WORTHLESS before those 5 guys came together, regardless of what axl says). That band is known worldwide because of the music they created together. Now axl is cashing in on the name built on the songs written by the original band it to promote something completely different.

Of course there's going to be comparisions, and backlash, and as far as I'm concerned, they're completely justified. He's left the door open to it. Fans come here because they've heard about some new music released bu Guns n Roses, and they come to here only to be let down when it doesn't sound anything like the Guns n Roses they know.

........remember "New Coke"?

Edited February 22, 2006 by angry anderson

[JennaSide]

''I'd like to take some of the old Guns fans along with me gradually into the twenty-first century,''

I feel slightly offended by that! we're not ALL stuck in the 80's... ok, maybe I am... but not everyone

[DirtyDeeds]

Go learn some power chords. I guarantee you can do an IRS-y tune soon, too.

This isn't superhuman ability here. Read about what bands did back in the 70s and 80s. They spat out stuff that was mostly better than IRS with lightning speed. IRS sounds like a warm-up tune, feeling people out. I think it could very well be just that. Like I said, other tunes sound much better and sound like they took a bit more time, especially Madagascar, especially with picking out appropriate quotations and whatnot.

Don't worry, I'm not insulting the almighty Axl. I like a lot of 5-minute tunes. Nightrain for example.

If you must know, I'm recording and producing my second local charity album and attending college music classes before actually going to full-time music college next year. I've been playing music professionally for 6 years.

Not bad for a high school senior.

[jimb0]

True,

I mean its not like AFD is "sooooo hard" to play or compose. It just "ROCKS"

But GNR was going downhill. They lost the riff man - Izzy and they lost their groove man - Adler.

The origional GNR was dead when Izzy left. Thats why they just put out covers after that.

Their Ego's were huge and their passions were gone and they didn't like eachother very much.

I am glad GNR broke up, I wouldn't have wanted to see them turn into Metallica or get really f'n bad.

I guess that is why I am enjoying this new project of Axl's. He still has "the passion" for making something he thinks is great. I'm not going to expect phenominal guitar though, I'm not going to expect the old guns.

I will only expect the direction Axl took the old guns in music wise "estranged" "november rain" that is all.

I only really liked the chorus of oh my god and the end part. I've hated the main riff for many years up until now, i appreciate the over energy now.

[SlashisGOD]

I go back to listening to Queen -- you know, we're still hoping to have Brian May come in and do some tracks, and I got a fax today that he's coming in -- Queen had all kinds of different-style songs on their records, and that's something that I like. 'Cause I do listen to a lot of things, and I really don't like being pigeonholed to that degree, and it's something that Guns N' Roses seem to share [with Queen] a bit. With "Appetite," even though it seems to have the same sound, if you really go back, you can pull all the little parts from different influences. That's not really the case by the time we're on "Use Your Illusion." People are kind of set in their ways. ["Chinese Democracy"] is coming from all over the place.

Hmmm, the Illusions seemed to be a helluva lot more experimental than AFD. I wouldn't call a song like Garden of Eden "set in their ways." The Illusions are my favorite Guns records so I may be a bit biased here. As far as I'm concerned, GnR need not experiment beyond anything they did on the Illusions.

I just want a kick ass hard rock record. No fancy loops and hip hop drum beats. Fuck that shit! I'm not hating on Axl, I have been a big supporter of his since day one of CD, but I want good hard rock.

[T.W.A.T.]

Some people here eat shit, and when they open their mouths their breath stinks—for example: OTHAFA. This guy goes from thread to thread bashing everything he can about the new songs, which are fucking demos by the way, and says they don’t deserve to be called an exceptional work of art and can’t understand why they have taken song long to be released. I mean here’s a guy ripping apart something that he couldn’t do to the same degree as Axl in a lifetime, and telling everyone else his opinion like it matters. Give me a break.

The thing is Axl Rose has never said, or pretended, that he is trying to change the face of music. In fact, he’s even said in past interviews that people may not like his music. It’s the fan base that has hyped the record for so long and has tried to make it seem like it will “change the face of music,” not Axl. Axl is writing these songs in the best way he knows how…and he is doing it for himself.

Appetite For Destruction was a success because no one expected it. It came out of the blue and couldn’t be compared to anything else easily. It’s a bit like the original Star Wars—no one had any idea of what was in store for them the first time they saw the movies and were completely blown away. By the time the new Star Wars were made, everyone had their own ideas and opinions as to what should happen and what they should be like; most people were bitterly disappointed in the movies because of this. People forget though that art is created from the artist’s own perception of how things should be. Axl Rose, just like George Lucas, is creating his own art in the way he feels it should be created. Some will like it, others will not. Deal with it…but don’t stand their going on about what crap it is, because it’s not crap, it’s simply not your cup of tea.

[OTHAFA]

Some people here eat shit, and when they open their mouths their breath stinks—for example: OTHAFA. This guy goes from thread to thread bashing everything he can about the new songs, which are fucking demos by the way, and says they don’t deserve to be called an exceptional work of art and can’t understand why they have taken song long to be released. I mean here’s a guy ripping apart something that he couldn’t do to the same degree as Axl in a lifetime, and telling everyone else his opinion like it matters. Give me a break.

Well shit, that's just about the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Hey, how many people in the United States do you think could handle being President? Not many, but that doesn't stop everyone and their father from bashing the shit out of Bush.

The thing is Axl Rose has never said, or pretended, that he is trying to change the face of music. In fact, he’s even said in past interviews that people may not like his music. It’s the fan base that has hyped the record for so long and has tried to make it seem like it will “change the face of music,” not Axl. Axl is writing these songs in the best way he knows how…and he is doing it for himself.

I don't have the quote at hand but I'm pretty sure I remember reading an interview where Axl said he wanted to make the best album ever made. Either way, he's done plenty of hyping, talking about how excited people will be to hear his new stuff because it's "new" and "exciting" and he's tinkering with new things, and how some arrangements are like Queen, and how he's "saving the big guns" for later. That ALL builds hype.

Appetite For Destruction was a success because no one expected it. It came out of the blue and couldn’t be compared to anything else easily. It’s a bit like the original Star Wars—no one had any idea of what was in store for them the first time they saw the movies and were completely blown away. By the time the new Star Wars were made, everyone had their own ideas and opinions as to what should happen and what they should be like; most people were bitterly disappointed in the movies because of this. People forget though that art is created from the artist’s own perception of how things should be. Axl Rose, just like George Lucas, is creating his own art in the way he feels it should be created. Some will like it, others will not. Deal with it…but don’t stand their going on about what crap it is, because it’s not crap, it’s simply not your cup of tea.

AFD was not some overproduced garbage that took a decade to make. Axl wants perfection and nothing is ever perfect, there's not one thing on this earth that doesn't have flaws, so he has to keep going back and going back and tinkering with this and that, and now he's 10 years in and where has it gotten him? It's gotten him a beer belly, a bad facelift and a weave.

He doesn't need to come out and say "this is gonna be groundbreaking", it should be pretty well excepted that it better be some earth shattering stuff, or else why the fuck did it take so long? The only song even close to being worthy of that is The Blues.

[F*ck Fear]

You don't like the new material which is fine.

But I have a strong feeling what you read about Axl was misread. He didn't say "I want to make the best album" more likely along the lines of "I want to make the best album I can"

[SWINGTRADER]

I do remember a few yrs ago on the official gnr website where someone in the GNR camp wrote ( regarding chinese democracy) " this is going to be Axl's best work it will surpass all of the bands earlier material' . Axl also said that he couldn't wait to prove all of his doubters wrong. I forgot the exact quote maybe someone here can post it. If none of this is hyping up the album and making people believe it is going to be great and revolutionary than i don't know what is . You can't say you are going to release a masterpiece and then a few yrs later say something different . Axl is the reason why this album has been hyped so big . He let the old band mates leave because he believed his "vision"of what the band should be was the only way. People are interested to hear the "vision" that broke up one of the greatest bands ever. These reasons and the fact that it has taken axl 10 yrs to make this album is why this is one of the most anticipated albums ever. Axl is the only one to blame if this album tanks .

[F*ck Fear]

The quote about "Proving the doubters wrong" was about playing live in 2002. Alot of people said he couldn't do it without the other guys.

He never called his album a masterpiece or anything like that. Sure the guy is going to hype what he is working on,it's not like he's going to come out and say "Hey,I'm working a new album,and I think it sucks cock". Get real.

[T.W.A.T.]

Well shit, that's just about the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Hey, how many people in the United States do you think could handle being President? Not many, but that doesn't stop everyone and their father from bashing the shit out of Bush.

I’m talking about art and not politics--something a whole nation should be involved in and have the right to talk about and judge harshly. You’re right, not many people can be president, or even want or have the means to be president for that matter, but people do have the right to criticize their government—the personal attacks on Bush go too far in my opinion, just like I think they go too far with regards to Axl’s appearance. Art is something you like, or you don’t like. If you don’t like it, just move on and find something that you do like.

I don't have the quote at hand but I'm pretty sure I remember reading an interview where Axl said he wanted to make the best album ever made. Either way, he's done plenty of hyping, talking about how excited people will be to hear his new stuff because it's "new" and "exciting" and he's tinkering with new things, and how some arrangements are like Queen, and how he's "saving the big guns" for later. That ALL builds hype.

I’ve never seen a quote of that nature from Axl. Prove it. Sure he’s talked about saving his “big guns,” and I’m sure he has. You haven’t heard a lot of the new material yet…and I.R.S. is considered a lesser song on the album—that’s according to Merck too, and not Axl who you claim has gone to all ends to build the “hype.”

Yeah, Axl says he has been tinkering with the songs and making some of the arrangements like Queen—why did he say that? Because he was being interviewed and was asked what he has been doing!!!

AFD was not some overproduced garbage that took a decade to make. Axl wants perfection and nothing is ever perfect, there's not one thing on this earth that doesn't have flaws, so he has to keep going back and going back and tinkering with this and that, and now he's 10 years in and where has it gotten him? It's gotten him a beer belly, a bad facelift and a weave.

He doesn't need to come out and say "this is gonna be groundbreaking", it should be pretty well excepted that it better be some earth shattering stuff, or else why the fuck did it take so long? The only song even close to being worthy of that is The Blues.

Axl said he wants to make the best record he can, and that’s precisely what he is doing. That doesn’t mean you or anyone else will like it. It also doesn’t mean it’s going to be earth shattering. So what if it’s taken ten+ years to make? You’ve already pointed out that you have AFD and that it’s far better, so what’s it to you? Sounds like you’re just being another cupcake and bashing something that others enjoy.

[wasted]

When I listen to There was a Time I can see why this album took 10 years to write. TWAT is a monster track it's crafted in ways that are so devious, I see something different everytime.

I think AFD did take 10 years to make but it just wasnt in the studio it was in a live situation or just worked on by the band before. Look at Hollywood Rose - Anything Goes is on that in various formats - that's all preperation for AFD. Axl had been dreaming of AFD his whole life it seems and some songs like orginated in Indiana.

[T.W.A.T.]

When I listen to There was a Time I can see why this album took 10 years to write. TWAT is a monster track it's crafted in ways that are so devious, I see something different everytime.

Exactly. All these people are bashing something that they couldn't hope to compose in their own lifetime...

[gerrit78]

I have a question not relating to this subject. Can any of you remember an old Axl photo of him I think in the trunk of a car drinking a bottle of whiskey and flicking off the camera?