RZ4

Originally gave this its own thread, but given the abundance of HoF discussion twas decided it might be better to try and import it in here.

The ceremony's been something I've been thoroughly uninterested in since its announcement and I've pretty much kept quiet on my general feelings about it, which were that it was always going to be an industry back-slapping festival and neither really about Rock n Roll, nor really about giving anything back to the fans given the ludicrous exclusivity of the event itself and the limited range of its immediate broadcast.

But the more I think about it, the more I'm quite disturbed about the fact that with Guns N Roses, the induction only encompassed certain members of the band based on some abstract criteria I'm still having trouble deciphering really... The members inducted; Axl, Izzy, Slash, Duff, Steven, Dizzy and Matt... how were they selected to be the only members of the rather lengthy list of people who've come and gone through Guns N Roses both before and after some of them?

Before I get a ludicrous number of posts saying "How could you expect them to induct Pitman?" etc. talking about how it's the most ridiculous thing to expect in the world... They inducted Rob Trujillo with Metallica without batting an eyelid. At the time, he'd been in Metallica for a significantly shorter period than Tommy, Chris and even Richard have been in Guns and they'd only put out two records during his tenure. The complete industry dismissal of post-1994 GNR and these guys who've given up a lot of time and effort touring the world seems like a much more brutal snub than anything which Axl did...

I can understand why acknowledging any of post '94 GNR would present the HOF with an enormous logistical problem, where then would they stop? But the degree of hypocrisy involved in the selection process means that the ceremony itself is not something I can view as honourable or admirable in any way.

I guess what I'm trying to ask ultimately is, is there anyone here who is absolutely accepting of Rob Trujillo's induction with Metallica who can also honestly justify Tommy, Chris and Richard not being inducted with GNR. If so, why?

I mean beyond the abstract field of personal opinion, i.e. "Metallica is still Metallica." That might work for you on a personal level, but overall we're looking at a similar scenario, a collective of musicians releasing music under a particular name where personnel has changed... this happens all the time in bands. Accepting it in this instance should be no more traumatic.

On paper, the Metallica/Rob Trujillo comparison is a good point. However, I think the main difference is that Metallica had stayed in the public eye and been relatively mainstream for all of the years after Jason Newsted left, and with three other guys still in the band that are considered more or less originals to the masses (not enough people know that Mustaine came before Kirk) - it made it acceptable that their new bassist was included in the proceedings. Also, it helped that James and Lars seemingly tried to publicly make Rob look and feel like a "legit" full member of the band after he joined and the way they demonstrated that in the "Some Kind of Monster" documentary. The key was there were still more original members than replacements and the band was still out in the open.

In contrast, despite all of the intricate details that GNR fans on the internet know about the band post-94, it's really been a mystery to most casual music fans out there. A lot of people know that Axl still carried on with the name (the 2002 VMAs helped with that, even if the performance in hindsight didn't), but Axl never really had a smooth transition due all of those dark years and the lack of publicity and promotion. Metallica has stayed in the public eye the entire time, even after going through a few different bass players, whereas GNR was completely torn down and built back up and there was never a proper primer put out there for people to connect to the dots. Lack of consistent musical output of course plays a big factor too, as Metallica released music right after Rob joined, whereas with GNR, it's been a lot more complicated and drawn out, and again - with very little promotion. The world has never gotten a chance to really get to know or appreciate the years of work that the post-94 members contributed to the ongoing GNR brand. Even with the US tours every few years starting in 2002 and the eventual release of CD, it didn't do enough to bridge that gap that became so large to the public and the media in general. So it makes it much easier for something like the RNRHOF to solely zero in on the members that were a part of the band's successes before the long hiatus began.

MSG show in 2006 - I was in the section with the foldup chairs right behind the General Admission area. Throughout the night, cycles of people kept coming and going in the two seats directly in front of me. By the time Paradise City was playing, I noticed that nobody was standing in those spots anymore. My brother (whom I had purchased a ticket for, and was in the seat to the left of me), looked around and said, "Y'know, I think Axl is going to end up throwing the mic somewhere nearby where we are. Seems like it's usually around this spot, based on the videos I've watched on YouTube." I laughed it off and shook my head at his shameless admission of studying where Axl throws the microphone in grainy online videos (remember, this was several years ago, we're spoiled now with some of the quality bootlegs we see).

Next thing I know, I notice that Axl is cranking his arm back and I look up and see the mic in the air. And then you hear it, "BFFFFTT!" It hit the ground somewhere very close and I look forward and see about five dudes (including my younger brother), wrestling each other, thinking that the mic is somewhere on the ground. Then, it almost felt as if I went back a few seconds in my head and realized that I could have sworn I felt something hit the very tip of the front of my right sneaker. Without thinking twice about it, I bend my back down and reach with my right hand to the ground right in front of my right shoe without taking my eyes off of the mayhem in front of me. I feel something there, grab it, and as I'm straightening my back, I tuck it under the front of the navy colored hoodie that I was wearing (NYC in November is cold!)

I then leaned forward again, bending my back as if I were watching what these guys were doing, but didn't have the guts to jump into the fray myself (figured any onlookers would think it seemed pretty normal, blending into the background and all that). I eventually grab my brother with my left hand and pull him away. He just had some poor kid in what looked like a Camel Clutch maneuver, and he wasn't happy that I was pulling him away. I just looked at him and assured him that it was for the best.

Then, the two of us quickly walk through the massive crowds leaving the arena, and once we get outside of MSG, I meet back up with two of my friends that I had also hooked up with tickets to the show (they were sitting in a few sections behind us).

I waited until we got to Penn Station and were about to board the train to make the announcement. Once everybody was looking at me, I reached out into the front of my jeans (yes, I had the mic tucked in there - it is what it is) and pulled out the mic to show them that out of everybody in the arena that night, I walked away with Axl Rose's mic, and no one there in attendance may have even realized it. It literally rolled to my feet and came to a stop in the dark.

It was a great night, and for a longtime fan like me - it was the ultimate payoff for continuing to follow this band and get some of my friends and family to see how great they were too. Here's a picture I just snapped of the mic and the original ticket stub:

Megadeth, no contest.

Epic you say? Look no further than Queen II, by Queen.

Damn, a blast from the past.

Queen.

Queen kills U2 in every freakin' category. The frontman was better, his voice was better and the musicians were better. Queen as a band is so versatile, they could play anything. They could play epics as well as fast rockin' punk stuff.

Indeed. B)

i think guns should play all day, with all 90 songs worth of material taking an hour break here and there to snort a couple lines and get back out there and do it again

Haha, that's an interesting suggestion.

Hmm, long story short; my pick would have to be my favorite band of all-time: Queen.

Probably, Achilles Last Stand.

Ha, "my boy." Then, the "little bastard."

That one DJ with the dumb, loud voice annoys me. He sounds like a complete fool.

Queen then Led Zeppelin

Indeed.

I prefer Bon Scott to Brian Johnson

Not me, buddy. I much more prefer Brian to Bon. Tons more!

And by the way, this is a no contest. AC/DC all the way!

Oh yeah? Well, that's cool. I still think that Bon was the man, but Brian did do a great job of stepping in his shoes, and allowing the band to continue without missing a beat.

I'd have to give AC/DC the nod, as well. Kiss have their played out anthems that are still fun to listen to today, but AC/DC has had a much better track record, and have put out great albums. I prefer Bon Scott to Brian Johnson, but what that band managed to do on Back in Black after bringing in a brand new singer, will always be something that is looked on in admiration by rock fans for generations to come.

Plus, Phil Rudd > Peter Chriss

what you fuckers who want the cd instead of the reunion tour need to realise that Chinese Democracy is an Axl solo project and has nothing to do with guns n roses. The band ended 10 years ago, this new band that Axl has put together should have another name.

We realize that. I think once VR and Axl start releasing albums we'll be better off because will have two great bands to see. If they went back now they'd implode, they said so themselves that if it happened it would be ONE show ONE night only. That would suck.

Yep, Slash himself said that before Axl dragged the GNR name through the mud, he was willing to get back together for one last show.

"lol"

Hmm...that's an original name.

Jon reminds me of Axl for some reason.

I don't think Axl would agree with that notion.

Ha, and what if the new GNR were planning on coming out and playing 10-12 brand new songs on stage? Would it still be a "seen it once, seen it all" explanation? B)

Never know indeed.

i wouldn't go and see the new gnr again.

Why not?

I was suppose to go to this show, but my friends couldn't make it so we went to Philly instead!  :'(

Oh yeah? How did that go?

My CD player will have orgasms playing Chinese Democracy.It will be THAT good.

Ha. B)

Thanks for posting the radio interview, he sounds so HOT! Funny thing happened today at Coconuts, I stopped by and bought a CD, then this woman that was next to me asked the salesperson when "CHINESE DEMOCRACY", was being released, then I heard him tell her -he gets so many people coming in asking about it. So he looked in some book and said he didn't have a date yet. That just blew me away!

Cool.

The shirt said "GNR = Slash" right?

Yeah, I think the shirt read Slash is GNR.