newusedillusion

 

Given the number of mixes that were supposedly done, I don't see them ever agreeing on what to put on the set.

1 hour ago, Stress Fracture said:

Nirvana was the end of rock IMHO. Yes, there have been good and highly successful rock acts since, including Foo Fighters, but ultimately Nirvana killed rock.

Beyond that, nothing in the genre can compare with what the likes of Kendrick Lamar are offering the youth of today. Even pop acts do it better. There’s nothing to excite any more, no edge. It’s all nostalgia and recycling.

That's why GNR, Metallica and Iron Maiden will continue to headline rock festivals until they retire. There are no 20-somethings out there doing it better.

Oh, I don't know. I think it was an accumulation of things. GNR breaking up, the big acts with their dead frontmen, but I'd say the biggest factor then and to a large degree since is the forge had cooled down, so to speak. The 70s and 80s, they had a lot of anger going on which gave us that boom in rock. We could maybe see that again, but I doubt it because of the expansion of the music industry. You don't need to work your ass off in that same make it or starve to death way. You can just put it on soundcloud or youtube.

 

I like rockers. I don't know if I'd say they're my favorite, but who doesn't get a little pumped when PC kicks up or Back In Black? In terms of albums, the ideal for me is a mix of everything. I think that's why I prefer UYI over AFD. They're a good mix of both despite the "filler" gripes about them.

Too many of any variety is a bad thing. I'm a big fan of epics but a whole album of them is boring, same with any one style.

3 hours ago, RedHook said:

With Scott's passing not long before the beginnings of the GNR Tour I was very surprised Fall to Pieces was not played as a tribute to him.

It never happened, but they did play Black Hole Sun when Chris Cornell died.

Maybe Axl couldn't get over the little internet spat he had with Scott in 2006

FTP's lyrics were personal to Scott. I don't think Chris was ever able to explain what BHS was ever even about. It's not really the same.

I don't doubt what kicked off the spat happened and had merit. Contraband and Libertad are different because Scott had a flare-up of LSD and wanted to write all the lyrics for the next album (and later demanding more $$$ before continuing because he wrote the lyrics), which is different than how Slash, Duff, Sorum and Dave did Contraband. My guessing is the band was split about it with Slash wanting to keep the same dynamic and the others compromising to keep going. I have little doubt that Slash, drunk, high and pissed off said much of what Axl claimed because he saw it as "spineless". I don't think he really meant it, just pissed off rambling spurred by drugs and booze.

I liked VR but I think SW was the weak link in it. Those guys need a "dirty" sounding singer. I have the same problem with Miles. You hear the band going and you expect an Axl or Brian Johnson-sounding singer coming on and you get these clean vocals. Takes me out. They were on the right track with Josh Todd but I guess he didn't have the range they wanted.

21 minutes ago, RONIN said:

Kinda surprised by the amount of interest in an album w/ fortus and frank even though the poll asks for your ideal scenario and lists Izzy as a possibility. Yowza. 

Is this a function of people resigning themselves to the fact that Izzy is long gone or because Fortus/Frank have endeared themselves to the fanbase? Both? 

Who can say. Me, I think people tend to diminish Izzy's (and Duff's and prime Steve's) contributions to the old GNR sound, namely their influences, style and how it all comes through in the music.

1 hour ago, Free Bird said:

Yes, but the system itself works. You just have to give credit where credit's due.

The songwriting process for the Illusions was a mess. It seems like a lot of the issues from back in the day do not exist any more.

If it worked best, I don't think he'd have taken the time to point out that it was random.  My impression is he, Duff and Izzy were too estranged, high and sedated to complacency to really fight for anything in those days, which fed into the problems. Rather than address anything, they hid in drugs and booze. THAT problem doesn't exist anymore. The system that worked best (for people not named Steve) was AFD's 25/20/20/20/15 split.

1 hour ago, Free Bird said:

Honestly, I don't think they'll have this kind of isues with a new record since they could use the payment system they used for the UYIs. Everybody gets his share for the songs he is credited for.

The credits in UYI are rather arbitrary, according to Slash.

17 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

Although indeed Doug couldn't make Axl show up late, I could see him sucking up to Axl telling him "don't worry, go on stage when you feel ready, it's your health that matters" etc. and then going to Slash/Duff and going along with whatever they were saying.

Also I think the "turning them into employees" thing has been a perpetuated misconception. There were taking over/control issues, but no such thing as turning them into employees. Izzy's case was most likely about cutting his percentage in the partnership.

I could buy that once, but at some point you know the fans and other acts don't care for it... or after you've spent all your money paying fines. I believe Slash mentions that at some point, that the only time he knows of Goldstein getting on Axl was when it was costing him money.

Izzy has outright said the contract was to "demote" him, cutting his royalties being a part of it.

I do think Axl at that point was rather paranoid, not helped by coke and people around him. There were certainly parasites causing issues. But showing up late, you can't blame anyone but Axl for that. In fact, I think Duff (maybe it was Slash) mentions that after Izzy quit, Axl stopped showing up late for that leg of the tour.

Eh, all water under the bridge.

1 hour ago, ironmt said:

It's hard to believe that with the fan reaction that they received and with the money they made on this tour that they are willing to part ways and do solo shit. None of these guys are taking Guns N Roses very serious. They could finish the final leg of the tour at the end of the year, take a few months off, hit the studio around March of 2019, release a new album or a few new songs and be back on the road by the winter of 2019. But this Is Guns N Roses and nothing ever makes sense. It does make a person wonder if the past 2 years was nothing more than a money grab as some have suggested in the past. I am not sure how anyone could think that Slash and Duff are any different than previous hired hands when Slash makes comments  like   "Will be coming back to see if they are going to do anything new" or "hopes that GNR will reconvene to work on an album next year"

Same old story with a new cast of characters. 

They have to hedge what they say, though. Even if, say, they're currently working on music right now, they wouldn't say anything. These questions don't stop. One leads to the other. If Slash answers "We've talked about a new album, kicked around some ideas for songs." This immediately becomes "Guns and Roses currently working on a new album." Then there's the constant "whens" to follow.

1 hour ago, Sydney Fan said:

"somebody who will remain mentionless", suppose this would be doug?.

I think both Slash and Duff both mention management, namely Goldstein, doing this in their books and largely blame their actions or inactions for band problems.

Thing is, I really don't see how they were responsible for Axl's stage antics back then. How is Doug making him show up late show after show and walking off stage? Rumor mongering, forming different camps, sure, but the stage crap, turning Slash, Duff and Izzy into employees, that was Axl.

42 minutes ago, default_ said:

I cant link it right now but theres some videos of Melissa singing and playing piano on youtube, she doest it perfectly. 

I dont like her hole in GNR either but technically speaking? Shes the most skilled musician this band probably ever had. 

Most of the old crew, save Slash and Steve, sing and play multiple instruments.

2 hours ago, RussTCB said:

I've of two minds about this myself but it's been cool to read everyone's opinions on it.

Part of me says "It's Slash & Duff, there's no way they could ever be considered equal to Fortus, etc". However, everyone keeps using the term "force" when they say Slash can't get Axl to release new music. 

So for me, that puts them back in the same category as everyone else who's come and gone. 

If that's your logic, then hired hands is all they ever were. They couldn't force music to be put out back in the early 90s, either.

We don't know any details of the new partnership. If there was a new album, what would happen if one of them wasn't happy with it like what happened with UYI when Axl wasn't happy with Slash's mix and Slash not happy with Axl's.

44 minutes ago, nycgunner said:

Seriously, I would take any new music, especially with Axl’s vocal in 2008 Chinese Democracy quality.  

A lot of opinions on here. I too don’t love the idea of Bucket and Robin’s solos getting deleted, but it’s a price I am sure we’d all pay to get ANY new Guns album, especially with Slash and Duff 

I’ll believe it when i see it  

glad Slash is communicating with the press and, indirectly, fans! The virtual media black out for 28 months was bizarre.  

 

I don't see why folks are so adamant this stuff is CD stuff being reworked. It's been a decade since that. Beyond that, it could be nothing more than barely worked-out melodies or lyrics equivalent to the ditties Slash has on his phone. It could be but why assume it? I find it a bit hard to believe that Slash and Duff would be cool with reworking NuGuns stuff. Playing it live is one thing, it's really nothing more than a cover just like Axl doing Slither, but slapping your name to it is something else.

 

No, not really. All Slash has done is confirm there is material there, which I never really doubted at all. Whether it's good or not or if Axl is confident enough in it to release, that's another question.

Music is there, Slash has heard it and has some ideas for it. That's it. What would you like him to do, lie about it? Give a "no comment" which people will just take as confirmation?

3 hours ago, WhenYou'reTalkinToYourself said:

Actually, it was Axl and Slash who turned Izzy's simple scratch rhythms and structures into great songs.

 

I think Axl, Slash and Duff could put out a good album. Sure, it would be great to get Izzy back since I do think his more bluesy style helps to round out other elements, but he's not the lynch pin to me. I think it was all of them together with Slash and Izzy being more idea guys and Axl and Duff being more structure guys.

But you never know, of course. Aside from age and distance, these guys are all sober now unlike when all the AFD/UYI stuff was written.

23 minutes ago, Amir said:

I've always reckoned it was Watch This, since that was released as an instrumental.

Grohl was supposed to sing that but didn't want to, so he played drums. Possible he could have thought of Axl after or before, though.

1 hour ago, Tom2112 said:

I'm more interested in this bit of information than any other news related to gnr albums in the last almost ten years since CD. I think Slash is a much more clued in and powerful member than Fortus or Dizzy so when talks about having material waiting and a real desire to make a new gnr record - it holds water. When? Who knows! 🤣

Didn't help in 94.

It boils down to Axl. Always will. Has he changed from his notion of having players try to fulfill his ever-shifting vision or is he back to giving and taking like the golden years.

Myself, I think he works better within the constraints of what he's given. Being forced to come up with lyrics to songs formed without him gave us stuff like Coma and Locomotive. Some creative people work best within a defined framework. Axl definitely seems like one of those people.

10 minutes ago, wasted said:

Axl did, Slash even said Axl wanted a few songs but it was too late. That’s what both Slash and Axl said. 

There was also this dynamic where Slash rejected working on Stephanie seymour ballads, Axl/Duff rejected Snakepit as it was as Slash wanted Snakepit to be Guns as he said. 

Do we really have to through this again?

Yes, Axl did... much later after it went to his side project. Which is where the problem lies. Not that it was rejected. Not that Slash now had a side project (Duff had one as well even prior to this), but that it was rejected then Axl changed his mind and wanted it back.

Slash's rejecting Axl's ballads is irrelevant. Axl is allowed to disagree and so is Slash. Axl didn't want the Slashpit stuff, then changed his mind and got cranky when Slash wouldn't bring it back.

 

y/n/m?

28 minutes ago, wasted said:

The last part of the second quote hints at what both Axl and Duff said, they just wanted to develop it. Slash even says Axl called wanting to use 4 songs and he told him it was already finished and ready to release. Axl said it was impossible to finish a record in 2 weeks etc. Slash said  well I can. 

Duff says in his book that Axl thought it was too southern rock and not Guns material.  Duff agreed with Axl. Nowhere does anyone say anything about developing it.

36 minutes ago, surforia said:

I think we are overstating the significance of the Sanctuary deal.

If the original value of the deal was $19m, and we’re already 65% into it, then it’s not inconceivable that Axl would dedicate a small portion of the truckload of cash he’s hauling in off NITL tour to buy the contract out.   Plus, if he wants to cut Slash and Duff back in, I’m sure they would contribute to the buyout as well.  If guns bought the contract out at even half the original estimated value of $19m (ie, $9.5m), then isn’t that basically the payday for only like 3 NITL shows?  No big deal.  Plus, guns has leverage - they could just tell Sanctuary, “You can either accept the buyout or we’ll just sit tight for 8 more years and not release anything.”  

Moreover, the deal with Sanctuary obviously didn’t stop the AFD box set from being released.  

Why would it stop it? He only has 1/3 of that material. It wouldn't even make sense for Axl or Sanctuary to stop it because 100% of nothing is less than 33.3% of something.

What you say is true, I guess, but why would Slash and Duff help to buy out Axl's contract? They already have their share of the most valuable parts of the catalogue.

I'm going to throw out the conjecture that there is a stipulation somewhere that Sanctuary can take action on if they can confirm Axl is deliberately ripping them off and a threat by the band to shelve music would probably open up a lawsuit.

Except Axl was in large part the reason Izzy was gone and Duff was apathetic. It's not as if his antics were specifically aimed at Slash, it was everyone. When you have 5-6 guys saying one thing and 1 the other, it gets a tad hard to buy it's all make believe especially when those other dudes have gone on to form bands with each other and get along fine while the one dude is going through personnel like a football team.

It just sounds to me like the other guys wanted to be Guns n' Roses and Axl wanted to Axl Rose and The Guns.

4 hours ago, RussTCB said:

Maybe it's just me, but I don't consider that an industrial track at all. That's before you even worry about whether or not Slash is on it lol

Maybe they cut him out or messed around with it. Either way, as far as industrial goes, there is a big difference between playing on a legend's song and being in an industrial band.

From what I have read, Slash's issues were not necessarily with musical direction, though we all know what he prefers, so much as the way Axl was going about doing it. It seems to me as if Axl himself might not have had a clear idea and once Slash quit, was lost at sea which lead to Duff quitting since nothing was happening other than racking up studio fees.

23 minutes ago, Fashionista said:

I want Brain back.
Honestly, if we can't have a full AFD lineup, my dream would be Axl, Slash, Duff, Gilby, Brain, Dizzy, Melissa. It's nothing against Richard, it's just Gilby rings more legit to me as he was there for the glory days. If they're never gonna make new music, why not? Gilby and Slash complemented eachother really well live and there would be a nostalgic element in having Gilby back.

It will be insanely sad to me if TSI stands as the last offering from Axl/Slash/Duff. As it is, any release by them now would be bitter sweet because it would feel hollow; they're middle aged men now and the zeitgeist they were part of (late 80s to mid 90s rock/meyal scene) no longer exists in any form. I would've liked to have seen GN'R bow out with an album somewhere between 94 and 96, even if it had been subpar.

The best thing they could do, IMO, is something completely different. I don't even know what, but I agree that if they try to come out with an AFD vol. 2 or UYI III, it will be lame. Well, maybe not lame but like CD, it could never live up to expectation. I'd love to have new stuff but I'm afraid just the same.

I think it's perhaps unfair to assume we know all the details of the touring agreement and it's presumptuous to pass judgment on any of them. Given the history, I would have to imagine there are a lot of stipulations, agreements and possible penalties in that contract to insure it wouldn't be a fiasco. Both Stevie and Izzy are liabilities. Steve for obvious reasons. Izzy is known to flake out and just leave if he doesn't like the vibe of things. It's why we think he's cool. But from the other perspective it's a huge WHAT IF? that they preferred not to deal with.