Granny

The blame doesn't rest soley at the press' feet of course-however i have had people actually say to me - "I hear Axl was being a wanker again last night" they believe everything they read and don't even actually bother to watch videos of the gig and form their own opinions.THATS the problem.

My saying. The press made sure he is perceived as the one and only to blame for whatever goes wrong. And people look at him this way without thinking twice.

The press focus on anything that makes a story more interesting-and that is unfortunatly the negative. Some well balanced reviews wouldn't go amiss- good and bad points-but thats not how they work.!

It is not only going for negative aspects. It is all about PR for whoever pays the editors bills, be it owners or advertising customers. Axl is a nonconformist, and that's not well-liked unless it can be instrumentalised somehow. I do not deem it conspirational thinking to have a look at the grand picture of the media's function in society.

At the end of the day-the tour has practically sold out-the band are being talked about again.

Yeah, but let's hope Axl doesn't go too ballistic. He should vent himself in a good old rant on stage. Everybody is wating for it and it would clear the air a bit, I think.

And Granny, you are being sarcastic in all your posts, right? You really aren't being serious with most of your comments, but being sarcastic or trying to be funny?

I'm afraid, I'm not.

As for all the ridiculous talk about witch hunts and being biased against axl......why? What would the point or purpose be? How is it going to help a reporter's career to lie about Axl?

1. Witch hunt as an example for mob action incited by public opinion. Public opinion being directed by political interests.

2. Get rid of symbols of noncompliance.

3. Pleasing his superiors by feeding the desired public opinion.

And it is a nice power trip to be able and allowed to publicly rip a legend to pieces with a few scorching words.

And how is Axl sticking it to The Man exactly?

'To hell with the pressure, I'm not caving in.' He has given up talking to the press for a good reason. If he makes public statement nowadays, it is directly to the fans. He has his principles, and he sticks to them. One of the principles is to ensure a great show for the fans. This requires the stage being ready, him being ready and nothing harmful being thrown at the stage. See Belfast.

Because 2 idiots threw plastic bottles on stage, axl decided to punish the remaining 13,998 fans by phoning in the rest of the show.

He made his statement. Stop throwing things and we play. Go on throwing and the show stops. And so it happened. When they came back on, there was no throwing anymore. Looks like mission accomplished. He requires nothing being thrown at him or the band since the early years. Absolutely no news.

We don't know what went on behind the scenes, and why there were no adequate announcements made. I agree, Axl should have spoken to the crowd after CD or so to make sure they know they will get a full show despite the delay. Him not speaking, not apologising and, after the return, merely doing "work to rule" did not help things. What came out of this way to deal with the situation is definitely self-induced, yes.

People were left to think they would only get a 40min show, that's why they booed. And they did not like that there was no communication with Axl apart from the warning and the good night. That was about it.

I really think, people's attitude changed during the last 20 years. They got used to service. But Axl's attitude didn't change. He doesn't serve, he performs. And that's is the core of the problem as far as I can tell.

Everybody is free to disagree with me.

Edit: All journalists are whores of the printing industry unless they work for really independent outlets or are into investigative journalism. They are either lapdogs happy to have somebody keeping them or bloodhounds that are unleashed or kept chained up as convenient to their master. In other words: they write what they are supposed to write. Otherwise they don't get published.

those recent incidents are warning for axl .

I hope he will stop being a selfish prick and show up on time for the next gigs and respect fans.

Maybe press won't be so negative with new guns if axl does a (very easy) effort and they can be considerated as a real band and not a joke.

Press will always be negative as they are the mouthpiece of the establishment. And the establishment wants obedience. Obedience is the diametric opposite of Axl Rose though. Was in 1987, is in 2010. If he sees a good reason to do things, he will do them. If he doesn't, you can throw tons of shit at him, he will not do it.

If it counts as being a selfish prick to not cave in - I'm guilty of that crime myself.

... the true disdain Axl has for his fans ... the conscious decision to short change the fans to settle a score with a promoter really drove home how little he cared ...

Everybody who works with him says the opposite. People who were there in Reading and Leeds reported in the boards and in comments that the delays were not that long, not Axl's fault and the crowd was not as mad as the press pictured it. Yet you keep on riding the media's lies about it. You even claim it was Axls "conscious decision to short change the fans" based on a silly girl's allegations readily spread in the media.

While he didn't realize it at the time, the decision to call the promoter's bluff at Reading is looking like a major turning point in public sentiment about Axl and the late starts. He may have just pushed his luck one too many times, and now he is going to start paying the price for it without a major behavior modification.

Does it feel good to be part of a spiteful mob? Making Axl "pay the price" for not showing enough "behaviour modification"? You are using him as a scapegoat for your dissatisfaction with your own lives. For your information: They tried to make him change his "behaviour" since Lafayette times. Did they succeed? No. And I rather have him hidden in his mansion again than him to give in to the system's "behaviour modification" requests.

It's about Axl being respectful to his fans that pay his wages and put money in his pocket. It's down to us that he is in the lofty position of being able to show up whenever he feels like it... the fans are treated with distain by Axls refusal to play a show at the time it says on our tickets! It aint that hard... unless your sleeping I guess...

He is not being disrespectful. He wants to put up the best show possible - for the sake of the fans. But he wants no shit thrown at him or the others on stage, which is reasonable, I tink. He's also improved a lot regarding turning up for shows and getting on stage ... ah, closer to the set time.

And - no, you don't pay him. He is not your employee like you are your boss's if you have a job. He gets a steady income from royalties. He probably wouldn't have to tour at all if he didn't want to. (No, I don't know for sure. But it seems likely.)

For you to make notes if you like: The fans are not Axl's boss. He is not going to work when he goes on stage. He is an artist and he performes for people who like his art.

The best fucking crowd control I ever saw was Iron Maidens Bruce Dickenson in Red Rocks Colorado.. some fucker was firing bottle rockets at the band...one of them hit a banner and started it on fire...He stopped the show and told the crowd to identify is ass and hand his ass over to security...the crowd lifted the fucker up and beat the shit out of him all the way as they passed his ass to the front...brutal? yes violent? yes. But I bet the fucker never fires bottle rockets at the another band ever!!!! The show was spectacular and one of my first time ever seein Maiden.

Axl could have done something like that...stopped the show.. made an example of the pricks throwing stuff and continued on.

Sounds like a good idea. Axl, please try this next time. Tell them you're gonna continue after the thrower has been thrown out by the audience, so it's in their hands to make you continue and everybody can be happy - apart from the bottle throwing idiots, of course. :xmasssanta:

And you, ignorant fuck. Were you there? No. You've no idea what happened. It was a problem in 2006. It's always been a problem. You're fucking lucky this was Dublin or else that arena would've been torn apart. More respectful fans? I hope the Italian fans rip someone a new one for that.

Ignorant fuck, eh? Axl's being late has never been that much of a problem. It was a given whenever you went to see GNR. Quite on the contrary, people are totally taken by surprise if he goes on stage at the set time. Him stopping shows or not turning up at all - that was what caused riots.

But if the press ram it into every reader's brain that Axl's being late is the main feature of GNR's performances and also lie about what the audience gets delivered once GNR hits the stage - then the audience expects it, their minds are set to see it this way - Axl as a ridiculous joke of the star he once was, old, fat, out of breath, sounding like a squalling cat, with a hired band of musicians who by far cannot match the AFD line-up, their performances not worth to wait for any longer than 10 minutes ... etc. pp.

No, they did not tear apart the place. But throwing full bottles onto stage - after being warned - is not exactly repectful behaviour either.

The original poster is a fucking moron

Very convincing argument, indeed.

The press has totally driven this false narrative, and stirred the pot to the point that the narrative is inciting these people. Guns could go onstage on time, and the press will find a way to say they are late. This phenomenon of bogey-men, and mob mentality is easily stoke these days, as people don't seem to know how to analyze data, and think for themselves---they just believe what they are told.

Well pointed out. This is what happens all the time in he mainstream media. Lies make about ... I guess at least 50-60% of what is printed and aired reporting nowadays - very often on purpose and advice from top levels - so you can never tell whether the reported is what actually happened or what you are supposed to believe that happened. The media are meant to manilupate people. That is their job nowadays. And it has become worse than ever during the last few years.

Must be why they like schedules to run on stop watches...and rock n' roll shows to be organized with bullet points like a fucking corporate meeting.

Exactly. Do what you are told, be well-behaved human capital that can be conveniently used and disposed of as needed for making money. Believe what you are being told, don't question it, don't criticise your boss or you're out. And the more people are trained or forced to accept his way of living, the more they hate people who like Axl openly live the freedom they themselves don't have.

I don't think each of these "journalists" was/is conscious of the agenda they were/are following when writing lies about Axl being a joke, audiences hating him and him always oh so inacceptably late on stage. But Axl is not just another artist on stage, he is a symbol of disrespect for the establishment. And it might well be a full-blown witch hunt going on there in the press.

As far as I am concerned, Axl giving the middle finger to the establishment and their rules is more endearing than ever! There aren't any young bands out there with balls anymore!

Which might be exactly the reason for the smear campaign going on. He is a kind of last man standing not only in terms of the AFD line-up.

Man, how many times did he repeat the phrase 'ticket payers'?

He repeated it twice.

4 times. Not that matters anyway, as it was a very positive review!

Let's compromise: He wrote it 4 times, but repeated it 3 times after the first. :xmasssanta:

I take it you didn't see Axl totally contradict himself?.......

30th August

So u know, we allegedly had a deal in place pre show w/the city at least at Leeds to do a bit longer performance that was either miscommunication, someone wasn't informed, changed their mind, didn't care or was a con. Regardless the nonsense just seems so unnecessary but w/out real management or industry presence is unfortunately beyond r control. We hope the fans feel they got at least what they could from us under the circumstances as 4 us all things considered that's the main thing.

31st August

I didn't organize, arrange, authorize, have knowledge of or was even consulted about our being booked for these shows till after the fact nor did I choose to work with anyone I'm aware of other than our manager who was involved in arranging these dates. Yet it would appear we're amazingly often legally obligated to honor such arrangements whether against our will or better judgment. That's simply and unfortunately how this business often works with the artist and imo seems is legally supported to benefit managers, agents, promoters and ticket vendors.

Acutally, he didn't condradict himself. The bookings were obviously arranged for by Azoff without Axls knowledge, but as they are actually doing the gigs now, Azoff is not their manager anymore, so at the venues, they are more or less on their own. They have been without official management since the Asian Tour started, if I remember correctly.

Man, how many times did he repeat the phrase 'ticket payers'?

He repeated it twice.

Dear me, that is so badly written it's embarrassing! Makes me wonder if English is the reviewer's first language.

Pardon me? Which parts exactly do you consider badly written? Just for me to learn from you.

Review from "NewGNRnOldGNR":

The media, may I query you as to ... for their newly bought “Chinese Democracy” t-shirt tomorrow morning.

Your review, Sir, is literature. Thank you for the pleasure of reading it.

Edit: Just noticed it was copied from the newgnr.com forum. Nevertheless, I was impressed reading it, although it is not the typical style you expect to find in GNR reviews.

My last words off-topic in this thread: Stating and agreeing that Slash could be replaced in GNR with another guitar player whereas Axl could not be replaced by another singer, does not count as dissing. Not in my eyes, at least.

It is a proven fact, it has been done - with the resulting sound being unmistakingly GNR. However, without Axl's unique voice it would always sound like a cover, even with all the other AFD line-up members playing as a band again. (I am open for proof of the opposite.)

Axl, please tweet something today, so we have some new topic-related material in this thread, will you?

What I'm saying is that Axl had much more charisma and presence than Slash. Slash was/is just another guitarist. Replaceable. Axl isn't.

Absolutely.

I've responded to you about 5 times in the *years* I've been on this board, SunnyDRE, so actually, I'm pretty sure that's not "most all your posts."

I do, however, think you're one pathetic excuse for a "fan" and frankly, you're also a majorly hypocritical pot calling the kettle black given you're probably the biggest cupcake on this board. Your only purpose here seems to be to stir up trouble, and really - do you have nothing better to do with your life than, for years and years, run around yelling "it's not Guns N' Roses!" - I mean really, it's also no longer 1996. It's also not the Smashing Pumpkins, Foo Fighters, Wolfmother, Weezer, Alice in Chains, Hole, Bush, Evanescence, Megadeth, Iron Maiden, or any other number of bands who have only one or two original members remaining (as do every single band in that list!).

So really... if you have a point of being here, other than to antagonize people, I sure as hell don't see it. But then, what I can picture you as is the heckler at the comedy club, or at the local bar gig, trying more to get attention for themselves by being a prick than anything. It's not like you have anything constructive to offer - you just need everyone to know how much you HATE the current lineup.

We know. Mission accomplished.

Signed. Thank you.

Just as a reminder: The initial claim of this thread was that DJ Ashba has embarassed himself by tweeting to back Axl in the Reading "incident".

That's not my opinion, but I can kind of see, where the poster was coming from. But some of you guys felt immediately prompted to pour acid over DJ Ashba as a person and artist which was not only totally out of place in this thread but embarassingly disrespectful. You are free to not find him cool, of course. Everybody is. But the way you use every opportunity to diminish this man and his artistic personality just because he is not Slash (or Buckethead, for that matter) and because you don't want this band to be successful without Slash - you go far beyond just stating your opinion. You act as shit-stirrers and you seem to get something out of it, otherwise you wouldn't do it.

You must be very unhappy people to behave like this. Sad, really. Sad and pitiful.

Thanks for the detailed reviews, guys. I really like it when a review makes me being there and feeling everything. Splendid!

thats my opinion and u know im right

@plonker88: Thank you, that's what I've been waiting for - your review. One of the best and balanced ones I've ever read. Good to read that you enjoyed yourself.

Definitely.

Don't fool yourself. I'm not mad at all. Just stating the obvious. :xmasssanta:

Sorry, but all those posters dissing DJ Ashba in this thread seem to me like a bunch of miserably jealous bastards, if you'll excuse my language. Just like those jokes of music journalists denying the evident fact that GNR are still a great band that easily pleases the audience.

Now, DJ Ashba is

- goodlooking,

- self-confident,

- good-natured and likeable,

- magnificently charming,

- a very good guitar player,

- a brilliant showman

and on top of it all he has the luck to have become an integral part of the current GNR line-up, touring the world and quite possibly getting any woman he wants - a perfect person to show you everything you haven't got. I'm sorry for you, guys. But whatever you post here says little about DJ Ashba, yet very much about yourselves. May his good luck come upon you, too.

ffs sometimes i wonder if im the only person over 12 years old on here

No, you are not. But sometimes I wonder myself.

So if u didn't like the show - you are just biased. But if u are a diehard GnR fan - then u are giving an honest review of the show. Makes sense now.

spending hours a day reading about a band online proves you have a completely neutral view of them.