Chinese Destruction

What is the meaning?

I don't think “This I Love” can be defined. To me it sort of encapsulates a whole barrage of emotions Axl went through during mid-nineties period (relationship struggles and so on). I think to fully understand the song one would have to visit that dark and desolate place Axl seemed to have been when he wrote those almost haunting lyrics. It's a really beautiful piece if you can empathize with it.

I think it's quite clear that when Axl referred to Slash as a cancer he was implying that Hudson has been an ever present burden upon him in which he struggles to liberate himself from. Whilst the metaphor used by Axl was in slightly bad taste, what Rose stated about Hudson was absolutely not in connotation with Slash's mother's sufferings.

No, not from a guitar standpoint, because those strangely dressed gentlemen, at least both used Les Pauls from the get go.

I'm referring to what is and what isn't “genre Guns N' Roses” (from a traditional viewpoint). Buckets, nun-chunks, gothic battledress and foot themed guitars aren't compatible with the “GN'R genre” if you want to be conservative about the whole hard rocker image thing. The reality is that from a GN'R perspective a Les Paul didn't compensate for Bucket's/Finck's appearance abnormality in the same way Thal's abnormal guitar apparatus isn't compensated for by his normal image. What I'm trying to say is that GN'R as a concept has moved on from concern about its appearance (largely because of Bucket's involvement) therefore we shouldn't judge its members based on their appearance choice or indeed equipment selection (unless of course the equipment in question compromises the standard of a show).

Yes as I said I was unsure. If that is the case then that is a good thing

They were certainly available in Belfast (because I was there). I have also seen images of merchandise stalls elsewhere (other dates) which have also stocked “Chinese Democracy”. Therefore I would assume the album has been available to buy at most dates (if not all).

Do we have to discuss this again?

That's the point. Having had a guy raised by chickens (Buckethead) and guy who'd pass for a town goth in 2002 (Finck) as accepted members of GN'R prohibits us to an extent from complaining in terms of weird on stage props deployed by certain members of the band (e.g. Ron's foot guitar).

Rolling Stone took Axl's comment out of context... honestly, most journalists are fucking stupid.

No they aren't. They just use people's words to suit their own agenda. Which is incredibly effective when you consider how much publicity it obtains them.

TIL is just a little gayer than the usual ballad.

Why? Because there's a little intimacy to “This I Love” and therefore you're too scared to embrace it? “This I Love” is a decent enough track which isn't going to compromise your masculinity if you enjoy it. If anything both “November Rain” and “This I Love” are equally as “gay” because they both encapsulate really strong emotions felt by Axl during some period in his life. Usually people who refer to something as homosexual because it isn't “macho” may need to look closer to home if you know what I mean.

agreed it is gay

If a guy wearing a K.F.C bucket, playing with nun-chunks and free styling during a GN'R gig is acceptable, then so too is a foot themed guitar.

Some people unfamiliar with the new stuff might buy it, I think they would after seeing it live ya know?

You're right. That's why copies of "Chinese Democracy" have been available at each date (to the best of my knowledge).

ya, but there was ppl here who bought one for the car, one for the ipod, one for the kitchen, one to keep sealed in a vacuumed vault, one for the bathroom, one for the other car, one to give to their girlfriend, abunch to give to their friends, another bunch as Xmas presents, one to put under their pillow, etc...

Even if everybody on this forum purchased ten copies of “Chinese Democracy” we'd still only make up about 6% of the total number of buyers. So really your use of hyperbole serves no purpose other than to reaffirm the fact that the vast majority of people who bought “Chinese Democracy” were inclined to hold no membership of a GN'R forum.

No. I think the only people who cared or bought CD were on GN'R forums.

What? "We" (assuming "we" all bought "Chinese Democracy") equate to about 0.6% of the total number which bought a copy of "Chinese Democracy". I personally believe that the vast majority of music enthusiasts (on an international (not forum) level) maintained some degree of interest in in terms of what the new incarnation of GN'R (and Axl in particular) could produce.

This is certain to develop some degree of interest from potential (GN'R) ticket buyers. Hopefully Dj alludes to the February tour. Maybe we'll get a brief interview as well (with a question pressing him on the new record claim).

I got an idea...

They could finish off the rest of CD and than record a new album with the current members. Than release 2 albums simultaneously on Sept,17/2011 - 20 years to the day after UYI 1&2.

Market is as "One album by the Old Band, One Album by the New Band." See how that goes down...

That would create a capacity for the twentieth anniversary of Use Your Illusion to overshadow a new release from the present incarnation of Guns N' Roses. Plus you would be effectively dealing with three eras on the one day. Which is ludicrous when you think about it.

Marketing the double release as that (your suggestion) would create a false notion within non-hardcore fans that Oh my God Axl is releasing the stuff from 1995 along with the stuff from the new band. So as you can see your idea isn't exactly fall proof. If Axl were to deploy your phrasing it would have to be One album by the Old New Band (With New touches), One Album by the New Band. Not exactly the easiest slogan to utter is it?

There wasn't a deal outside of the US, it was available everywhere... and the worldwide sales were strong.

Are you stupid? I was suggesting that deals in areas such as the U.K (specifically with H.M.V) could have been beneficial for album sales. Deals with retailers in regions like the U.K, Germany and so on probably would have enhanced already "strong" record sales significantly.

I think it would have sold more if it was available more widely. But would it have sold enough, could they take the risk? Did they want to take that risk? Perfectly good albums can sell 60 000. Then they'd be majorly fucked.

Bingo. To be honest I think the Best Buy deal lulled camp GN'R into a false sense of security. It's disappointing really that the morale by 2008 was so low that they settled for such an unambitious release process. Or maybe I'm just thinking illogically and a release from a “new” Guns N' Roses was a water tester and therefore in need of a fall back plan (which the Best Buy mechanism sort of offered).

The Best Buy deal was only for the States.

Okay. Well that reinforces hat the mentality was having a pop at the U.S really. Where was the European deal? Let's not forget that Europe outdone the U.S in terms of buying “Chinese Democracy”, therefore deals throughout the region (e.g. H.M.V in the U.K) would have been logical. However, I imagine securing Best Buy was an intricate process and thus not a process the camp would have wanted to engage in again (hence the lack of dealing elsewhere).

Releasing “Chinese” II before the U.S tour makes perfect sense. As well as being released to stores (hopefully no-one in particular) the record could be made available in large quantities at each date. But let's be realistic. At what stage of completion is the next album? Sure we all want the rest of “Chinese” but is that really a logical move for a band which doesn't really have any strong connotations with that era? Of course it mightn’t be a very popular reality but an album with eight to ten tracks from the new band with three to four from the old is the most sensible option to pursue. Needless to say I can't see the band getting eight to ten new tracks penned before February, therefore I can't see a new album before then. Maybe Axl will go for “Chinese” II though, with the intention of the third record being a largely Dj/Thal/possibly Fortus, it's really hard to determine, in fact pointless without any “inside” perspective.

This.

I wonder how many copies would it have sold if it wasn't an exclusive? Or if the exclusive had been with Wal Mart instead?

More? Less?

I'd say Chinese Democracy would have sold the same or possibly more if it hadn't been released exclusively through Best Buy. Why? Well because Best Buy is largely concentrated in North/Central America. Outside of the region already mentioned Best Buy outlets are dispersed over Europe and aren't all that accessible. Chinese Democracy shouldn't have been reduced to a shot at America in terms of sales.

It is my belief that Chinese Democracy shouldn't have been subjected to any one chain. I believe it would have been a lot more beneficial for the project had the album been made available in large quantities to multiple outlets. For example not singling out H.M.V as a major target was a horrible horrible mistake.

Let's not flatter ourselves. Best Buy aren't stupid. If they wanted to survey the web to establish whether or not there was a want for a new GN'R album they'd have gone to a neutral music forum and started a “Chinese Democracy” thread. Going to My GN'R to develop a notion in terms of whether or not a large scale business should exclusively release a new GN'R album is like the European Union going to a group of German neo-Nazis to see if there's a want for mass Jewish extermination. Strange simile but it gets my point across nonetheless.