SlashElvisTCB

You guys need to stop wanking on Appetite, it was a great record, but the Illusions Albums were an awesome period with many iconic songs that were just as big as Appetite.

"They didn't do anything like Appetite"...You Could Be Mine & Back Off Bitch from the Appetite Era say your argument is invalid!.

Izzy plays the first half of the first Nightrain solo. He plays the Double Talkin Jive solo except for the acoustic outro I think, Think About You solo. Izzy plays that great rhythm electric guitar on One On A Million that totally evolved the song.

Definitely no leads on Estranged.

You can totally tell its Slash playing Double Talkin Jive, that vibrato is finger print like. Back Off Bitch Intro is NOT Izzy btw.

The truth is: both of you are wrong because both of you wrote tl;dr posts about NOTHING literally

Theres always one of those guys on a forum and I guess you found his job, bravo! Sorry man guess the convo is too far out for your IQ if you found nothing to sink your teeth into on either one of our posts. At least 3rd Wheel had something to say. Your post literally said NOTHING. Get your post count up big boy.

You can call them out as wrong when they're in a position to affect other peoples opinions much as the douche writing the article. Sometimes people are wrong even when its "their opinion", some people may prefer a passive take on letting idiots run around but I like to take a more proactive approach. If a certain person likes a certain food that's fine and completely ok cuz it doesn't affect anyone but themselves, but reviews DO affect public opinion especially if that person is in a position to be heard by many. I run a club, reviews are HUGE! in determining who comes in and who doesn't.

I know Apollo used an analogy about pizza to get his point across and you agreed with him, so I will use one to counter his to show you the other side of the coin...

Imagine you have a brother and a wife, and at Christmas time he decides to tell your mom & dad in the middle of dinner that he thinks your wife is a slut and is cruising for new dick because of the way she dresses all the time and in reality you know its false because you tell her to dress that way and you tell your parents that because you know the real facts.

Is it ok he says that just because it is "his opinion"? are you going to sit quiet while he says it or are you going to refute his opinion? most people would refute it I'd bet. Plus even when you refute it, who do you think they are going to believe? in some cases people are in denial of their situation and you can't always count on others to be neutral when news is dumped on someone. I used the brother analogy because it shows that he is in a position of credibility to your parents when he tells the news about your wife, much the way this reviewer has more credibility than the average forum reviewer.

Another simple & quick analogy, human shit is full of bacteria, bacteria that can be killed at temps above 160-180 degrees, lets say a dumb person throws that in a 380 degree deep fryer & eats it and says its good. Now even though the bacteria is dead, does it make it anymore right to eat that? its still shit at the end of the day. Moral is: Sometimes things in life are WRONG no matter what and opinions be damned.

I know you're all probably wondering how this relates to music reviews, but it does and it honestly can relate to just about anything, the trouble is knowing when it relates and when it doesn't, you must as a person decide when its right to speak up & refute and when to let things be.

What?

1.) Saying "song A is better than song B" is based on taste. Preference. It's subjective. Everyone has a different opinion. You could take a poll of every single person in this thread and no one would have exact matching lists of even the top 20 GNR songs. Because it's all subjective. There isn't a right or wrong with having an opinion based on personal taste/subjectivity.

2.) Your analogy is not in any way the same as having an opinion. The wife is either "cruising for dick" or not. There isn't any subjectivity around someone's intentions or actions. The brother can make a PREDICTION, a statement of belief regarding present or future events without knowing, but that's not the same having a preference of one thing over another or having an opinion based off personal taste.

3.) The "shit" analogy is better. If someone says deep fried shit is good to eat, that's their life choices. 99.99999 percent of people will say it's bad, but someone somewhere might have a differing opinion based on his personal taste. As long as that opinion/personal taste isn't negatively affecting or harming someone, then it can't be considered morally or ethically "right" or "wrong."

So no.

I take it you scored low on reading comprehension in middle school? You at least failed on analogy understanding or didn't have the patience to read or understand the analogy at hand. The analogy did fit the situation perfectly as to how you can refute fact vs opinion. I honestly don't want to start a petty internet fight with you because you're probably a cool person and we'd probably buy each other drinks at a bar if we met, but I expected you as I wrote that post to not to grasp the analogy, because people with differing opinions usually don't see black & white. I gave you the long winded analogy and a short version, some people prefer depth, you prefer to the point I guess.

There are times when fact overrides personal opinions and that analogy pointed out that exact fact.

Now that that is over with, I really think that what ever ranking a song is could change day to day for even the same people and that with GNR, everything they did was great and one must really listen to every song within the context of a cd to realize its greatness, because can you really just pick one GNR song to listen to?

Being a GNR inspired guitar player in a Rock band is tough when it comes to choosing cover songs to play i'll tell ya! at one point my band did 35-40 GNR songs over the course of 2 years.

You can't say somebody's opinion on song ratings is wrong.

You can say you don't agree with it.

Imagine saying that Pizza is your favorite food. Then steak. Then seafood. And then somebody says "you are wrong. I don't agree with your list."

It just isn't logical.

I complete agree with this. But it is fun to argue and debate if you have strong feelings over it.

You can call them out as wrong when they're in a position to affect other peoples opinions much as the douche writing the article. Sometimes people are wrong even when its "their opinion", some people may prefer a passive take on letting idiots run around but I like to take a more proactive approach. If a certain person likes a certain food that's fine and completely ok cuz it doesn't affect anyone but themselves, but reviews DO affect public opinion especially if that person is in a position to be heard by many. I run a club, reviews are HUGE! in determining who comes in and who doesn't.

I know Apollo used an analogy about pizza to get his point across and you agreed with him, so I will use one to counter his to show you the other side of the coin...

Imagine you have a brother and a wife, and at Christmas time he decides to tell your mom & dad in the middle of dinner that he thinks your wife is a slut and is cruising for new dick because of the way she dresses all the time and in reality you know its false because you tell her to dress that way and you tell your parents that because you know the real facts.

Is it ok he says that just because it is "his opinion"? are you going to sit quiet while he says it or are you going to refute his opinion? most people would refute it I'd bet. Plus even when you refute it, who do you think they are going to believe? in some cases people are in denial of their situation and you can't always count on others to be neutral when news is dumped on someone. I used the brother analogy because it shows that he is in a position of credibility to your parents when he tells the news about your wife, much the way this reviewer has more credibility than the average forum reviewer.

Another simple & quick analogy, human shit is full of bacteria, bacteria that can be killed at temps above 160-180 degrees, lets say a dumb person throws that in a 380 degree deep fryer & eats it and says its good. Now even though the bacteria is dead, does it make it anymore right to eat that? its still shit at the end of the day. Moral is: Sometimes things in life are WRONG no matter what and opinions be damned.

I know you're all probably wondering how this relates to music reviews, but it does and it honestly can relate to just about anything, the trouble is knowing when it relates and when it doesn't, you must as a person decide when its right to speak up & refute and when to let things be.

Honestly picking between GNR songs sounds a lot like choosing your favorite kid or family member. On any given day any of them could be #1 depending on your mood, as a guitar player you just can't beat a song like Paradise City to end a show with, it exhausts you, it excites and it embodies everything about Rock N' Roll and will make me play air guitar even while I'm doing dishes, but are there GNR songs I listen to more? hell yeah! Use Your Illusions 1-2 I usually treat as one big album though the tone is a bit different & darker on UYI2.

About the only 2 he got right on the list were "Look at Your Game Girl" & My World as far as GNR goes. Its So Easy & Mr Brownstone are great songs when compared to other bands of the era and in their own right, but there are a lot better GNR songs that deserve the air play these two over played songs get.

Sometimes people are just simple minded, Elvis Presley did 900 better songs than Blue Suede Shoes, Jailhouse Rock & Heartbreak Hotel yet they never get talked about, they are still great songs but not when compared to the rest of his music archive.

If you're looking for lyrics from the last two albums try a 15 year old girl's journal. Any one will do! They may not be exact but it should be darn close.

Oh wow you're real funny.

Jackass.

Sorry, that WAS kind of a cheap shot when someone was just asking for information.

My blood just boils when I think about all the cool ruined guitar parts by Myles simplistic cliche lyrics.

If you're looking for lyrics from the last two albums try a 15 year old girl's journal. Any one will do! They may not be exact but it should be darn close.

and if you're looking for lyrics from Axl, try a rich, bitter 40 something dude's diary. They may be exactly the same

"but i don't want to do eeeeet"

"So if you ask me why

She wouldn't say goodbye

And I know somewhere inside

There is a special light still shining bright

And even on the darkest night

She can't deny"

"They're out to get me

They won't catch me

I'm innocent

So you can

Suck me

Take that one to heart

"

"And then you tell me 'bout singin' the blues

You get what you pay for

An freedom's real high priced

An while your rippin' off children

Somebody's fuckin' your wife

It's never made a difference

It's only how you survive"

Give me any Myles song vs. any Axl song and I will break down for you why Axl is far superior.

Axl Rose IS a better writer and he has many emotions that fuel his singing and vocal range, but Myles is probably right behind him for me and I like a lot of his approach, he works hard and does a great job.

NOW the douche bag everyone hails from the first Snake Pit album boils my blood, I couldn't even listen to that album to be honest and as a hardcore Slash fan I've listened to that Album & skimmed it maybe 3 times total, just couldn't wrap my ears around Eric Dover, his name should have been Ben Dover.

Pretty much everything on World On Fire was Great in my opinion, personal favorites are Beneath The Savage Sun, Wicked Stone, Iris Of The Storm, Automatic Overdrive....oh fuck why even list the songs, it was all GREAT!

It really jerks me off about "Don't Damn Me"...that riff is so bad ass and boss and then it has a verse riff almost equally as boss and a blistering solo. Obviously the idiot doing the review isn't a guitar player and should therefore shut his God Damn pie hole!. its an almost perfect song to play as a guitarist, bad ass riff & great solo!

I lol'ed at the acoustic version of "You're Crazy" being the definitive version to the reviewer. I also LOL'ed at the fact of how much he ripped on The Spaghetti Incident but somehow every song was a rare highlight hahaha. I'm one of the few fans who really enjoyed that cd evidently.

Plus "You Ain't The First" above Don't Damn Me & Shotgun Blues is a crime within itself.

If you're looking for lyrics from the last two albums try a 15 year old girl's journal. Any one will do! They may not be exact but it should be darn close.

Oh wow you're real funny.

Jackass.

Look what just showed up on Reverb yesterday: https://reverb.com/item/1417601-1978-marshall-jmk-mkii-39-slash-tim-caswell-mod-appetite-for-destruction-100-watt-head

There was a white Caswell (can't remember if it was #36 or #39, on eBay several weeks ago).

I like the T75's, depending on the head. I thought the Diezel Hagen sounded great through a newer 1960A. Also, the older ones are better, but I'm guessing you know that? I have an 80's 800 cab with the stock 75's, very good sounding cab. I haven't found that there's one speaker that universally sounds amazing through every amp, the heads I've played have really preferred certain speakers over others.

I'm actually not a huge fan of Slash's tone, even from the AFD/UYI/Snakepit days. His tone works for him, but it wouldn't really work for me. Not to say I don't like his tone. Interesting tidbit about the KT88's, I did not know that! And I thought I knew it all, . Paul Gilbert's modded Super Lead had KT88's too.... now I'm curious to try a Marshall with them. I thought the AFD sounded quite good, and close enough to Slash's GNR recorded/live tone to pass as something close enough to put his name on it. I heard the handwired prototypes were spades better than the production run, but I've never played either so I can't really say.

You're absolutely correct about older speakers sounding better, especially higher wattage speakers, it takes a bit of jamming to loosen them up. You're also probably correct that there is an amp the G12-75s sound good with, I just haven't found that amp or setup that does them any justice. With Marshall tube amps their distortion tone is very organic & natural and with G12-75s you lose speaker distortion due to the higher wattage resistance to that distortion that would normally occur in lower wattage speakers, they would probably be great with a 200watt tube amp with a ton of pre amp gain or a regular Marshall with a boost pedal, but I personally don't like to mess around with boost pedals for my main guitar tone, for solo boost yes but for the main tone I go with all amp & guitar I love it all natural for better playing response. Oddly enough G12-75s are probably the most common Marshall cabs I see when looking to buy used cabs lol If you play jazz then I'll bet that G1275s would be great for that since they resist output distortion a bit better than V30s.

When I bought my H&K Vortex Cab they had Celestion G12F60s which are pretty much a rebranded Vintage 30 for H&K (I guess they wanted to save the V30 name for Marshall cabs) anyway the tone of those speakers changed almost 40-50% over the course of a month of jamming when I paired it with my 2466 100watt Vintage Modern, they got tighter & sweeter, more response and just mature, it was noticeable even on recordings of my band through that month. They broke in pretty fast probably due to the volume we jammed at, always ran the Vintage Modern around 7-8 in my drummers basement for a mostly output distortion tone, we used to go home half deaf but it was a very religious experience lol.

As for the AFD100, the AFD tone it made was great and that was the sole purpose of that amp, the bonus #34 tone on the other channel just isn't true to the real #34 mod of the illusions era and that's mostly due to the resistor value they would have had to cut out of the pre amp input on AFD mode as well as a ground to make it true, so basically without complicating the circuit they couldn't get both true to life tones to be on the same amp so the #34 channel was compromised a bit.

Ice pick thin tone. No smoothness, no depth, no density - what are you doing Slash!?!?! Go back to the Jub/2555SL, or at the very least the AFD.

He sounds amazing in concert, what you're hearing is a bad audio recorder and/or an amp that's set not to feedback in an open air stadium. The amp is probably not messed with much because its not like he gets to sound check in front of 70,000 people for a halftime/pregame jam. Chillax, his tone rocked in Chicago this year, videos don't do it justice.

Since this is a one off event I'm certain he didn't pay $1000s of dollars to haul his real gear across the country, the amps used are JCM 800s provided by whoever hired him, much easier to get ahold of than a Jubilee, or AFD100, for easily available amps, he should have used a Marshall Vintage Modern but JCM 800s are what he's used to. EL34's sound harsh compared to the 6550s he normally uses and I would surely bet the EL34 power tubes are in those amps cuz of the tone and the fact 6550s aren't very common in your average JCM 800.

Even in light of that, your typical recording device in front of two dimed Marshalls doesn't stand a chance at capturing tone acurately without clipping & compression distorting the original tone.

I've seen Slash (including VR) 12 times over the past 8 years. His tone in concert with the 800s sounds pretty much exactly like it does in that video. He tours with the 800's. Rarely uses a boost/OD/EQ through them. Slash's 800's have 6550's in them, I prefer EL34's, I don't think they're "harsher," but their mid spike is more prominent. If anything, 34's are smoother/warmer than 6550's. I've owned old Marshalls with both.

To me the EL-34's sound a little sterile, and maybe that's because of that pronounced mid spike...almost the same kinda sterile you get when using a G12-75 cab vs a V-30 cab, more life & bite out of the 6550s...for the record I wouldn't take a free G12-75 cab to play on my own, I'd take it just to sell it for a V30 cab or Greenback cab. I've always preferred the sound of 6550s in 800s and especially the Slash's SIR #34 modded Marshall JCM 800 Amp which to me is the most bad ass recorded distorted tone of all time, it shaped what I wanted to sound like!.

Its also interesting to note, that Slash's old Jubilees used KT-88s live regardless of what you may hear to the contrary, spent many years chasing that tone dragon of the Illusions Tour sound on a few Jubilees and something was ALWAYS missing in those amps until I played my guitar through my friends KT-88 equipped Slash SL2555 signature, it was like Heaven once I finally got that unique tone at almost any amp setting. Unfortunately I never did get a chance to buy my own Jubilee, and I went back to tone chasing the #34 sound, then bought a brand new Vintage Modern 2466 and then figured I'd make my own minds eye version of a Slash kind of tone.

But in all honesty the secret to Slash's tone is the single conductor Alnico 2's or what we now know as the Slash signature pickups along with 600v 22uf Orange drop caps, and the pickups must be set at the right height (bridge 1/8 inch, 7/32 Neck from bottom of the strings) and contrary to impulse the neck pickup cannot be too close to the string or you'll ruin the sustain of the strings, what you lose in pickup output you'll gain back in spades with string volume & sustain. I've chummed with Marshall amp designers Santiago and Steve Dawson many nights on the attributes of the Vintage Modern, AFD100 and Slash's tone, those guys are super informative and LOVE what they do. The #34 tone on the AFD100 is only a ballpark tone, due to the pre amp grounding needs for the exact #34 cocked wah tone there had to be a compromise and that was to have an accurate AFD tone and not a #34, tis why its a thin brittle tone and not accurate to what Slash's actual #34 amp sounds like.

People should respect her perspective, good or bad, that's her outlook and her story and she obviously feels strongly about it. Take it with a grain of salt and don't use it as the sole source to judge Scott by or to love Scott by. Like with Elvis, time has proven what a great man he was then as well as now, history gives perspective and 20/20 vision.

Its also very possible Mary is like Priscilla Presley in the fact she can say what she wants to vindicate herself now that the talented singer we all loved isn't able to defend himself, in which case, as I said earlier History will either vindicate her or vindicate him.

RIP Scott, we can only judge you by how you made us feel as fans. You weren't a child molester or rapist so whatever you did in life could have been redeemed, maybe you were working on things slowly but surely, history may still have a chance to show your true intentions that you figured you had time to sort out.

I was never a STP Fan growing up, neither disliked or liked their music, their stuff just flew under the radar to me, but when Scott joined VR I grew to appreciate his STP work and like songs like "Sex Type Thing" and "Vasoline" and realized it was on Gran Tourismo 2 racing game and if it were not for those 3 guys from Guns N' Roses I may never have had the outlet to hear Scotts music none the less appreciate his music.

I'm sad about his passing and always hoped they'd do a mini VR tour again with him for old time sake and that he'd straighten his life out and right the STP ship, but now I just hope he's good with God and got everything he desired out of life or at least most of it.

Ice pick thin tone. No smoothness, no depth, no density - what are you doing Slash!?!?! Go back to the Jub/2555SL, or at the very least the AFD.

He sounds amazing in concert, what you're hearing is a bad audio recorder and/or an amp that's set not to feedback in an open air stadium. The amp is probably not messed with much because its not like he gets to sound check in front of 70,000 people for a halftime/pregame jam. Chillax, his tone rocked in Chicago this year, videos don't do it justice.

Since this is a one off event I'm certain he didn't pay $1000s of dollars to haul his real gear across the country, the amps used are JCM 800s provided by whoever hired him, much easier to get ahold of than a Jubilee, or AFD100, for easily available amps, he should have used a Marshall Vintage Modern but JCM 800s are what he's used to. EL34's sound harsh compared to the 6550s he normally uses and I would surely bet the EL34 power tubes are in those amps cuz of the tone and the fact 6550s aren't very common in your average JCM 800.

Even in light of that, your typical recording device in front of two dimed Marshalls doesn't stand a chance at capturing tone acurately without clipping & compression distorting the original tone.

Its a shame that the Spaghetti incident doesn't get much love, I really enjoyed Attitude, Black Leather, Raw Power, Down On The Farm, Since I Don't Have You & Human Being. Those were good tracks and Slash's guitar tone took the place of porno's growing up and I'm straight as an arrow. That #34 Marshall Amp really shines on these.

Certainly enjoyed those a lot more than ANYTHING on Chinese Democracy, granted there were times that "C.D" almost took flight and sounded good, it was overshadowed by guitars that were self serving rather than serving the music at hand.

Its funny how you guys debate what Appetite songs will be on a reunion tour, truth is, the last time they shared the same stage together 90% of Appetite was played regardless of how long their setlists were.

Appetite is a great record, but honestly GNR were more than just that record, my ex Girl friend had great boobs but I didn't dwell just on them, I enjoyed her whole body!.

Honestly as a GNR fan I love the songs Mr Brownstone & Its So Easy but when songs like "Don't Damn Me" and "Get in The Ring" have never been played live I think the cookie cutter generic GNR songs need to take a back seat for a bit and let the stuff with meat on the bone go to the crowd.

Obviously theres no way in Hell Paradise City won't be played, its probably the top 1 or 2 hard rock guitar songs & best end solo of all time and theres no way to top it as a closer. Unlike "Its So Easy" & "Mr Brownstone" Paradise City NEVER gets old, weather I'm jamming it with my band or playing air guitar while washing dishes between bartending in front of everyone, Paradise City is BOSS.

As for the Appetite stuff in general, you don't even need to ask for it because you'll receive it anyway!, the real question is WHAT Illusions & Lies stuff or even TSI stuff do you want to hear?. In light of that here are my picks I'd like to see played at some point in a potential tour...

"Don't Damn Me"

"November Rain"

"Shotgun Blues" (Never Played Live)

"Coma"

"Back Off Bitch" Only in the VERY early days was it played live and once by request during 91 in Toronto, would love to hear the Illusions style done properly Live.

"Estranged"

"Pretty Tied Up"

"Locomotive"

"Get In The Ring" but updated to reflect the newer generations of GNR shit talkers, it was also never played live so I feel it needs to be vindicated.

They need to right the wrongs of the past and first and foremost play "Don't Damn Me" without any doubt, then if they have time play "Shotgun Blues" & "Get In The Ring" as those were NEVER played live and its a shame.

Oh and Axl could totally pull off Beneath The Savage Sun". No question.