PHILLY

[silverrose721]

[silverrose721]

[Sherlock]

Wow, what a mess!  I'm just glad that these people weren't at the concert I went to!

[PhillyGuy22]

Mr_Sparkle, you seem to miss understand my referal to historically important riots.  I did not intend to imply that riots over concerts and riots over political issuses have no differences.  Political riots naturally have much more justifacation then concert riots as well as being much less trivial.  The riots caused by the Rodney King verdit must have had an incrediable impact on future court decisions, were as the riot in Philadelphia over Guns and Roses had the largest impact of ending the tour Axl Rose and Buckethead that wasn't even selling out its concerts at smaller venues.  I in no way intended to imply that a concert riot has the same moral ground as a riot against communist dictatorships or similar situations.

However, you clearly don't grasp the emotion behind concert riots or even the irony in your own words.  Such riots are because people get angry and try in the most convient and immediate way possible to get revenge.  The irony in you words comes from such statements as:

NO REASON TO RIOT OVER A FU*KING CONCERT. YOU ARE AN ANIMAL AND SHOULD BE PUT TO SLEEP.

That statement is filled with anger and malice and want of revenge.  You feel wronged by the actions of Philadelphia fans and wish to cause them harm, just as the Philadelphia fans felt wronged by Guns and Roses and try to cause them harm.  You are closer to what you hate then you will admit.

By the way, another droplet of irony I found was that you curse and call Philly people animals, which includes me.  I however have not resorted to name calling and only cursed once in this forum but it wasn't in a spitefull maner.

If you want to call people who riot at concerts animals, fine, thats your opinion but do not single out Philly.  Point the finger at all who fall short of your expectations and your personal glory.

Since silverrose721 practically asked for a comment on his "Axl doesn't have to do this" statement, I'll make one now.  You are right.  Axl, when its all said and done, doesn't have to go on tour.  I don't think though that he did it for his fans.  I say this because I know how nutorious his ego is and I believe he thought he could pull it off, become king of the world again, and show up all his old band mates once and for all.  Another reason I find it hard to believe Axl went on tour again for his fans is how he has treated his fans.  He has made his fans wait until he was good and ready, he has let his fans down by leaving them, and he has even assaulted a fan for video tapping something he shouldn't have.  I just don't believe Axl has the fans on his mind that much.

P.S. Those pictures do accurately depick the aftermath of the riot.  Most of the damage was on the floor, being knocked over folding chairs, lots of litter, and damaged electircal equipment (the worst of it).

[Mr_Sparkle]

You see, I speak words... I did not go out and trash my neighbors house when you made a statement I did not agree with.   :  No justification in the world can make a riot at a concert acceptable.  Maybe if the band broke out with AK47's and started shooting at the crowd. But that would be more of a 'panic' then a riot.  Mob mentality is equal to animal mentality.  You obviously have mental issues if you feel the need to cause $1000's of dollars of damage to other's property over a silly concert.  You should all be put to sleep, or be placed in a zoo.   :

[gnrlies]

haha

i bet youd be the first one in there throwing chairs n stuff.!

Haha

I mean its mob mentality.. If everyones doing it, its ok!

[gnrlies]

well the thing is that the same thing would of happened anywhere in the world, so its not really a situation where you can blame the people who did it...

[Mr_Sparkle]

WTF?  You can't blame them? I don't recal anyone putting a gun to their head and say 'riot or you die'..   :

[Sherlock]

I'll blame who I want.  gnrlies, what is your purpose in life?  My guess is that all you do is follow Mr. Sparkle around, like a puppy dog, and try to piss him off.  I'd say if you think he's important, he's defiantly outdone you.  

[gnrlies]

I'll blame who I want.  gnrlies, what is your purpose in life?  My guess is that all you do is follow Mr. Sparkle around, like a puppy dog, and try to piss him off.  I'd say if you think he's important, he's defiantly outdone you.  

haha, something like that!

[gnrlies]

well my point was that its a natural human reaction....

Just like its a natural reaction for a dog to bark..

Or whatever...

[Sherlock]

Oh

[gnrlies]

YES!  

[madison]

well my point was that its a natural human reaction....

Just like its a natural reaction for a dog to bark..

Or whatever...

So you think it's ''natural'' to act like an animal then?

I don't think so. Speak for yourself.

Blaming the rioters is just being in defense for Axl...

Not true. If those drunken fans hadn't gone on a rampage - tearing up the arena and looting GNR equipment - the tour would likely still be on.  

..   Rioting is wrong.

It sure is.

.. but it is not as wrong as what Axl continuously does.  So can you really blame the rioters that much.

How is destroying someone else's property not as bad as Axl not showing up for a gig?    Any long-time GNR fan knew when they bought tickets to see GNR that Axl has a history of showing up late -- if at all -- for gigs. I'm not condoning Axl's behavior, but he's always been that way. Fans know it. So it makes no sense for some selfish drunken fans to act surprised and outraged -- and then selfishly go on a rampage that ruins it for other GNR fans.

[badZan]

what is the problem.....people

[PhillyGuy22]

Mr_Sparkle, you speak your words and fill them with malice because they are the quickest and easiest way to strike back at me or any one else with conflicting views.

I am not saying concert riots aren't wrong, I'm saying they are understandable.  Have you ever thought about whats wrong that you do?  Profanity, masterbation, glutiny, lying, theft, violence, blasphamy, murder, jelousy, permisquity, all are wrong.  The list could be much longer if I felt like it.  You can't tell me that you've never done anything on that list (not that you did all of them).  You have done wrong, and you've had your reasons.  You must have done something wrong for the wrong reason because you're human.  Humans are creatures of flesh and blood.

..."If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her"  John 8:7

[Sherlock]

First off, don't bother replying directly to me, I'm only making a one time post and won't be back to check it.  I only want to speak my peace.

I was at the concert from 7:30 until 11:30.  I know what went on.

Shortly after 7:30, a band called something like "Cassy" {{I apologize for not getting the name correct, they were good in my opinion.}} played for close to an hour.  After a wait of about 20 or 30 minutes, Mix Master Mike began his act.  He played about an hour and ended between 9:30 and 9:45.  He did not endear himself to the crowd.  {{Does a D.J. really belong at a rock and roll concert anyway?  Seriously!}}  He played a few songs that got the crowd interested but then kind of slaughtered those very same songs.  {{I actually stood out in the hall for sometime to avoid his act.}}  The crowd was not enjoying Mix Master Mike very much but he did his job: using up time and getting the crowd pumped for Guns and Roses.

Now for when things really go down hill.

At 10:00 the concesion stands where closed; no beer{{I'm not one of the drunks or even one of the pot heads if thats what you're thinking}}, no pretzels, nothing!  For about the next half hour, the crowd grew impatent and chanting became worse and worse.  It however did not start off bad.  The crowd would boo every time a Rob Zombie song would end and the lights did not dim for the main act.  It was around 10:30 people began to throw things, mostly from the upper levels.  {{Unfortunately, I was on the lower level were most of the stuff would lose its force and fall.}}  The stage lights flickered two different times and the crowd would cheer wildly for a few seconds then would quickly change to boos.  The crowd still wanted Guns and Roses.  At about 10:45 the event staff began to pack up the equipment quitely.  Some of the crowd noticed the electric equipment in the middle of the floor covered up and began to leave.  It was about 11:00 went the staff finally annouced the show was cancelled, giving only "an illness in the band" as a reason.  Keep in mind, this is 20,000 Guns and Roses fans, from Philly, without food or drink for an hour, without entertainment for an hour and a half, without Guns and Roses for 10 years, deeply disappointed.  A roit happened.  {{Go figure.}}

I saw many things thrown; some chairs from the floor area, many cups and such from the upper level, and even some small tables from the upper level onto empty seats.  I saw the floor chairs knocked over, which wasn't too hard since whole rows went over at once.  I saw chairs being ripped into and railings destroyed. {{I myself threw some dropped rost beef, tipped over a row of chairs, and broke off two railings.}}

Outside wasn't a whole lot better.  I saw plastic cases for binocullars kept under the seats in the upper levels scattered like newspaper on a windy day.  One case had acctually been burned.  I saw a couple who had the nuts off their wheels stolen and a tire slashed.  {{I stopped and spoke with them and felt sorry I could not help them.  I hope they got home alright.}}  I saw a group of men walking off with seat cushions and a poster from the laddies bathroom.

These 20,000 fans were not happy and wanted to vent.  {{Personally, I wanted Guns and Roses to pick up the tab for any damage I caused.}}  Don't get me wrong, that riot was illegal and dangerous.  However, that riot was also avoidable with a little fore sight of Guns and Roses.  An explanation, perferably by Axel Rose himself {{I wouldn't have wanted to come out on stage by 10:30 myself if I where him.}} would have most likely lessened the severity of this riot if not eliminate it entirely.

Afterwards I heard such things as "Guns and Roses sat courtside at the Lakers game in New York" and "The cops showed up 20 minutes after the riot even though they where called before the cancelation".

The crowd was irresponsilbe, as humanity tends to be.

Guns and Roses was irresponsible, as Axel Rose tends to be.

Even the police where irresponsible, as government tends to be.

I look at what could have been done and how the riot could have been stopped.  I see only a few people who could have made a difference.  No indiviual in that crowd could have swayed the mob.  No low level event staff could have made a decision to annouce the cancelation earlier.  Only Guns and Roses, and those who held control over those procedings that night, could have made any difference.

{{I'm sorry Axel Rose, but you F'ed up.}}

WHEN YA GOT A JOB TO DO YA GOT TO DO IT WELL

YOU GOT TO GIVE THE OTHER FELLA HELL

---Axel Rose, "Live and Let Die", "Use Your Illusion 1" 1973

This is one of the Ten Commandments..."Thou shalt not lie".  Look at the first paragraph in your post. Caught you!  Seems like your here again.

"Judge not lest you be judged youself".  You're judging!

I can't stand a hypocrite christian.  You should be ashamed of yourself.  Mr. Sparkle rules!

[Mr_Sparkle]

Mr_Sparkle, you speak your words and fill them with malice because they are the quickest and easiest way to strike back at me or any one else with conflicting views.

I am not saying concert riots aren't wrong, I'm saying they are understandable.  Have you ever thought about whats wrong that you do?  Profanity, masterbation, glutiny, lying, theft, violence, blasphamy, murder, jelousy, permisquity, all are wrong.  The list could be much longer if I felt like it.  You can't tell me that you've never done anything on that list (not that you did all of them).  You have done wrong, and you've had your reasons.  You must have done something wrong for the wrong reason because you're human.  Humans are creatures of flesh and blood.

..."If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her"  John 8:7

Still doesn't make it right... I have control overmyself and my actions unlike some people   :

[gnrlies]

So you think it's ''natural'' to act like an animal then?

I don't think so. Speak for yourself.

Well that the end of the day we are animals...

I mean its like a natural human being reaction. Mbe not for gals, but certainly for males loaded up with too much testosterone that there d*cks are about to explode.

Especially in such an emotional situation...

it certainly doesn't make it right, but it is understandable.

[Mr_Sparkle]

Well that the end of the day we are animals...

I mean its like a natural human being reaction. Mbe not for gals, but certainly for males loaded up with too much testosterone that there d*cks are about to explode.

Especially in such an emotional situation...

it certainly doesn't make it right, but it is understandable.

For an idiot maybe with a 70 IQ.

[gnrlies]

go shove your 299 iq up your arse...

Nobody cares...

[madison]

Well that the end of the day we are animals...

I mean its like a natural human being reaction. Mbe not for gals, but certainly for males loaded up with too much testosterone that there d*cks are about to explode.

Especially in such an emotional situation...

it certainly doesn't make it right, but it is understandable.

You know Gnrlies, it's statements like this that make me truly believe that if women ruled the world, there'd be no wars. We'd all live in peace and harmony.  ;D

[gnrlies]

You know Gnrlies, it's statements like this that make me truly believe that if women ruled the world, there'd be no wars. We'd all live in peace and harmony.  ;D

you know, your probably right there!

[PhillyGuy22]

I guess Sherlock4444 didn't read my second post where I explained why I've put more then one post.

I also guess Sherlock4444 has mistaken my "looking to not be judged as an animal" as "looking to pass judgement on others".  I wonder how Sherlock4444 thinks I'm judging.

Mr_Sparkle, you are correct; it's not right.  Never said it was.  Just that its understandable.  By the way, are you serious that you never lost control and, say, punched a wall or something?  If you are, I find that hard to believe.

[estranged74]

I was at the show in Philly.  I'll tell you, it had been 10 years since I was 18 and saw GNR in Buffalo.  Axl and the gang had us wait over 2 hours between sets.  Obviously some things never change.  In Philly, the crowd waited for well over an hour and the band never showed up to play.  If they were there, they don't show too much respect for their fans.  I think that Axl Rose is a genious, but his social skills suck.  He needs to get his head back into the game if he ever wants to take this band to the top again.  Creating hype and news is one thing.  But disrepecting his fans and creating a situation like the Philly show is complete BS.  The fans were into the music, but by 10:45, it's time to play (when people know that it has to be over by midnight).  Axl, please get your head together, get the band together, and more importantly get your shit together.  If you can't, stay out in California and just release albums.  I've been the most loyal fan throughout the past 15 years, but I can't stomach your tired act anymore.  Best of luck, and keep the music coming (because there were times in my life when your words were the only thing that kept my butt alive).

Keith