Brunzopolis

I'd LOVE to read a decent book of this sort, rather than one that's been sourced entirely from Google and YouTube. I mean you Mick.

I know, right?

It sounds like there was some real work that went into this.

On different book selling sites, I guess just before it was ready to sell, they often show the cover, the isbn number, the amount of pages (352). So, does that mean it was actually printed and everything?

There's very little about all this I could find here, and on HTGTH. But it looks like she posted in an old thread about Rapidfire?

http://www.mygnrforum.com/index.php?/topic/148447-rapidfire/#entry2420631

What happened with this?!

She was/is an experienced music writer. Worked on the 99' Spin mag article. Looks like it was ready to go and everything? Then what happened? Can anyone shed any light on this? It's the first I've heard of it.

"I've been working on this book for six years. I worked on the Spin cover piece with Marc Spitz in 1999. My own book research was already underway, but I agreed to help in exchange for permission to use all the mag research, so the book became sort of an extension of that piece. At that time, we did over 40 interviews, and less than 5% of that material (at best) was published. I also worked on a VH1 special on [GUNS N' ROSES] in 2002 that never aired (I believe it was a pilot for a new series that died on the vine after the company was restructured), and made the same deal with them — I retained transcripts of those interviews. Over the years I've conducted my own interviews with band personnel for my writing/research jobs with MTV, Rolling Stone and Allstar/CD Now. And since that time, I've conducted dozens and dozens of new interviews exclusively for the book, many of them with people who have never been interviewed before. I believe the count is well over 130 original sources, and I've sorted through well over 10,000 pages of documents.

http://www.blabbermouth.net/news/axl-rose-more-details-about-unofficial-book-revealed/

Yeh, that book is complete crap. Mick Wall painted a very one side picture of Axl. There's almost nothing positive about Axl in that entire book. I know some of you would argue that Axl is a complete tool and that he is everything that Mick wall says, that's fair enough, but from reading Duffs book, and listening to the Craig Duswalt interviews etc. he comes across a whole lot more compassionate and loyal than Mick Wall would have you believe.

I agree. I am not a fan of Mick Wall at all. I mean, the title of the book is "William Axl Rose," he couldn't even get the guy's name right? That's never, ever been Axl's name. Mick Wall had an axe to grind, and he did. And there seems to be a British-American cultural divide there as well. I remember there's one stupid story about how Mick asked Axl's brother for an egg cup and Stuart had no idea what he was talking about, and Mick took that as a sign of low breeding...um, maybe it's more that people in America don't routinely use friggin' egg cups?!

Yeah, that egg story bugged me too. He paints Stuart as being borderline retarted.

With the exception of those couple of years in the late 80's, and maybe an interview or two with Izzy, years later, he hasn't had any access to the band, or Axl. The book is based almost entirely on source info that is accessible to all of us: articles, interviews, etc. Which is fine. You work with what you got. But you shouldn't then take this info, which is very incomplete and open to interpretation, and give your interpretation of it, without making it crystal clear that it is just that: your interpretation. He does this constantly.

And quotations! He fucked up (or purposefully changed) a lot of them. You're reading along and you're like "Oh yeah, I remember that. But hmmm, that doesn't sound quite right. I thought that line was a bit different." And sure enough, you look it up and the quote is wrong. That's the whole fucking point of a quote! To relay exactly what someone else said! Jesus.

An example of this that stands out for me (probably because it came near the end) is his butchering of what Billy Joe Armstrong said during his R n' R Hall of Fame speech. He completely misquoted him - basically changed the entire meaning.

It's also, absolutely full of spelling mistakes, grammatical errors, and missing punctuation. It's almost like he took the final draft that he originally sent off to the publisher, which hadn't been proofread, tacked on his new intro and final chapter, and put it up for sale without bothering to look it over. Like seriously, you can get away with this kind of stuff and still be a semi-famous writer?! Good news for anyone wanting to pursue a writing career, I guess. The bar is low.

I wonder if West's death was one of the things that really made Axl withdraw (or continue to) in the late 90s. First Shannon Hoon, and then West, died horribly. On the Eddie Trunk interview when Baz asked about West, he still seemed very upset about it, and understandably so.

And in between those two deaths, his mom died, and Slash left. Hoon in Oct. 95. Then his mother on May 28, 96', then almost exactly one year later, Arkeen dies. Then five months after that, Slash leaves.

I think you're totally right. He'd been in a bad state already (you could maybe argue his whole life) with the Stephanie stuff, then this quick succession of more bad news, and that all led to the recluse years/the person Axl is today.

Jeez. I didn't realize his Mom's death was right in that same time frame, too. And when I think of it, Duff left around 97ish which isn't too far after all of this. No wonder he felt abandoned by the world; he basically lost almost every close friend he had between 1995 and 1997. That's enough heartbreak to make anyone want to go live in a cave and withdraw from the world.

Stephanie Seymour sues Axl in August 1993, his lawsuit is settled with her sometime in 1994

Axl has a relationship with Jenny Driver from 1993 through at least June 1994

Erin Everly files suit against Axl in March 1994

Kurt dies April 5th 1994

Duff's pancreas explodes May 10th, 1994

Gilby is fired in June 1994

The Paul Tobias fight over Sympathy is October 1994

Erin's lawsuit with Axl is settled April 20th 1995

Stalker Karen MacNeil breaks into Axl's house April 27th 1995, is removed, returns April 30th

Shannon Hoon dies October 21st, 1995

Gilby sues Axl/GNR in early 1996

Steven sues GN'R for a second time in 1996

Axl's mother dies May 28th 1996, around this time wild fires nip at his home

Slash makes his departure official October 31st 1996

West Arkeen dies May 30th 1997

Duff leaves the band the first week of August 1997

As far as Moby is concerned, however, "the ruthlessness that these people attribute to Axl, I can't relate to it. I've never seen it in him. Since I've become involved with him, I've developed this weird sort of protective, paternal feeling with him." (1997)

“He seemed emotionally reserved and a little bit suspicious,” says the techno whiz Moby, who spent some time with Axl in California in 1997. “He seemed a little bit like a beaten dog.”

Great post. I forgot about some of that stuff.

It was all so close together.

And there was also that "White Trash Wins Lotto" satirical play/musical that was partly inspired by the Axl/GNR story, that started running around this time as well.

http://articles.latimes.com/1998/aug/08/entertainment/ca-11079

I wonder if West's death was one of the things that really made Axl withdraw (or continue to) in the late 90s. First Shannon Hoon, and then West, died horribly. On the Eddie Trunk interview when Baz asked about West, he still seemed very upset about it, and understandably so.

And in between those two deaths, his mom died, and Slash left. Hoon in Oct. 95. Then his mother on May 28, 96', then almost exactly one year later, Arkeen dies. Then five months after that, Slash leaves.

I think you're totally right. He'd been in a bad state already (you could maybe argue his whole life) with the Stephanie stuff, then this quick succession of more bad news, and that all led to the recluse years/the person Axl is today.

Jeez. I didn't realize his Mom's death was right in that same time frame, too. And when I think of it, Duff left around 97ish which isn't too far after all of this. No wonder he felt abandoned by the world; he basically lost almost every close friend he had between 1995 and 1997. That's enough heartbreak to make anyone want to go live in a cave and withdraw from the world.

I got confused when writing that timeline out, so just for the sake of being factual: Slash left in Oct. 96; so, five months after Axl's mom died.

And then, yeah, like you say, Duff soon after. Aug 97' is what seems to be the agreed upon date. And Matt, sometime a little before that.

I've always found it a bit odd that Duff was the last one to leave.

I just finished reading Mick Wall's Axl bio, which he just recently updated and re-released. There are a lot of things wrong in, and about, the book, but one thing reading it did for me, was seeing this time period we are discussing, in a new way.

I wonder if West's death was one of the things that really made Axl withdraw (or continue to) in the late 90s. First Shannon Hoon, and then West, died horribly. On the Eddie Trunk interview when Baz asked about West, he still seemed very upset about it, and understandably so.

And in between those two deaths, his mom died, and Slash left. Hoon in Oct. 95. Then his mother on May 28, 96', then almost exactly one year later, Arkeen dies. Then five months after that, Slash leaves.

I think you're totally right. He'd been in a bad state already (you could maybe argue his whole life) with the Stephanie stuff, then this quick succession of more bad news, and that all led to the recluse years/the person Axl is today.

I really like that first clip OP posted, Nightrain in Bucharest. I've never heard a post 93' performance like that. It's not at the same level as 93' and before, but it's there. I thought it was gone forever. I have some hope now.

2010 was the last time Axl delivered incredible performances throughout the entire show.

Hmmm, didn't realize it was from 2010. My hopes are slightly dashed.

I would feel so much better if we could just get an acknowledgement from the man himself on this issue. With the total silence on the subject from Axl, his bandmates, and even the entire press, it makes me feel sometimes like maybe there is no issue. His voice is fine, and it's just my ears that are wrong.

I really like that first clip OP posted, Nightrain in Bucharest. I've never heard a post 93' performance like that. It's not at the same level as 93' and before, but it's there. I thought it was gone forever. I have some hope now.

With this and a few mentions by Eddie Trunk and Mitch Lafon, I think there's something to Axl and Slash at least talking in recent months, even if it's just through intermediaries at this point.

As one ages, one perceives time moving more quickly. But aging is not the cause - it's what goes along with aging, in our society, at least.

Anticipation and activity/events, slow down time. When you're young, there's lots of new things (to you) going on, and there is a lot to look forward to. As you age, the frequency of new/novel events decreases. So when you look back, there aren't a lot of milestones (comparatively) to make demarcations in the timeline.

You can take this idea and apply it to our whole culture as well, which just compounds things.

I don't agree with all of this article, but I think the gist is correct:

http://www.vanityfair.com/style/2012/01/prisoners-of-style-201201

I don't agree with the 404!

http://www.vanityfair.com/style/2012/01/prisoners-of-style-201201

As one ages, one perceives time moving more quickly. But aging is not the cause - it's what goes along with aging, in our society, at least.

Anticipation and activity/events, slow down time. When you're young, there's lots of new things (to you) going on, and there is a lot to look forward to. As you age, the frequency of new/novel events decreases. So when you look back, there aren't a lot of milestones (comparatively) to make demarcations in the timeline.

You can take this idea and apply it to our whole culture as well, which just compounds things.

I don't agree with all of this article, but I think the gist is correct:

http://www.vanityfair.com/style/2012/01/prisoners-of-style-201201

I've read Duff's, Steven's, and Slash's. I honestly liked them all. I remember, at the time, wishing Steven hadn't gone into such detail, near the end of his book, on his various relapses. But it's his book, and his life, and it's an autobiography, so you can't fault him for his thoroughness. I just wasn't super interested in all of it. I'm sure a major Steven fan would be though.

I'm fascinated by the stories surrounding the creation of songs - when and where riffs were come up with, etc. etc. Slash had a lot of stuff on the whole songwriting thing, so I dug his book the most.

Reunion starts now

2016. Ten booked stadium shows. Eight are actually played. Izzy, Axl, Slash, Duff, and Sorum. Axl kills the 2nd, and last shows.

what i think

in the early 90s i couldnt understand how a person could NOT love GNR

in my book, it was the best band in the world

today i cant understand how you guys care to watch this

i just dont understand it

i can understand going to a show to see axl rose live in person

but if you are going to watch a video please do yourself a favor

I'm like this too. Only reason I ever watch nuGNR clips is for Finck's guitar work. Don't think I've ever been able to make it through a clip of a live, post 06' show.

I tried again in this thread, but to me it always sounds like Axl is trying to do an imitation of his own, old voice.

But I guess these things are subjective. That clip you posted of wttj at 2nd night of Rio 91', is I think one of the worst of the old era. He killed so many songs that night, but was totally off for wttj, and I don't even care about the messing up of the lyrics.

Thank you so much for this, Limulus!!!

Absolutely not, the studio version of this song kinda sucks really...

This is how I feel as well.

PC was a song I always skipped when listeting to AFD. Wasn't until I heard live versions that I realized how awesome the riff from the verses is. One of the greatest riffs ever. The lyrics of the verses are maybe my favorite GNR lyrics. Somewhat for the words themselves, but more just for how they sound/flow. They're sort of 'rap' like and fit the riff so perfectly.

When you talk of one night being clearly better, I think you're talking about the second night. Which was I think, actually a few days later.

I think he realized the first night was shit and stepped up his game. Or maybe (likely) the first night was the first time he had sung in along time. So there was some rust to shake off. It's one of my fave shows for sure. PC in particular really stands out. *EDIT* - And Pretty Tied Up. He kills it.

I wish they'd remaster some of these old shows and release them.

From 24:44-ish:

On the Tokyo DVD there's a beautiful blonde woman in a black dress, a few rows from the stage. I think this is the same woman.

This was really good. Well done.

I hadn't seen a lot of this footage. And good job on keeping the quality decent. I know how big of a pain it can be to combine multiple sources like this. Not to mention trying to get the best quality of each source.

I hadn't realized how many shows on this tour were cancelled or rescheduled. Seems like anytime the frequency of shows were too close together, they'd end up cancelling the next few.

---

In seeing Axl respond the same way, to nearly identical situations, over and over and over, I now give more trust to the stories of his ex girlfriends and the domestic violence stuff.

He's got a little of the "bad crazy" in him. Like, "Jesus, wtf is wrong with this guy? Let's get out of here."

I'd never really noticed it before. But when you see all these instances played in successsion, it sort of pops out at you.

Someone recently mentioned that some tentacle of GNR official management has an actual controlling interest in HTGTH, and that Jarmo doesn't like having this brought up. I can't find it now though. Does anyone know what I'm talking about?

He's an arrogant knob. He's a great politician too. Not in the sense that his policies benefit most Canadians, but in the sense that he's good at politics: spinning and controlling the narrative.

Back in the Reform/Canadian Alliance days, when the narrative was: "One day soon, we'll take back control from the baby killing, gay loving liberals, and install ourselves as puppets of Jesus from now until the Rapture, which is about to happen!", this shit would have never flew. Can you imagine?!

But then somehow, they got a minority gov't. To get a majority though, they'd have to drop the whole moralistic/christian/700 club stuff. So they did. People have short memories, and they're also succeptiable to good marketing and the occult arts of "branding". A couple of years later, they had their majority. The evangelical base waited for them to make their big reveal - to go back to talking about Family Values and making veiled allusions to the Rapture. But it never happened.

Everything this guy does is calculated. He won't give impromptu interviews to the media, but he starts a cover band? I guarantee there was a conversation about how playing SCOM would increase his likablity among certain demos.

Absolutely worth the wait. It's a bit of a miracle they even came out. For that, I am grateful.

"Yep, we're fucked" is good. It's funny. Perfect for a cover song.

Sex moaning/clapping flesh on RQ is great cuz it was real and fits that album perfectly. Of course, if something like that was done today it wouldn't have much effect.

Most of the other examples of this kind of thing - I'm ambivalent towards them. A few are cheesy though. Maybe to the point of cringe inducing, depending on the mood I'm in when I hear them.

Been a while. Any updates, Limulus?

1. Hair of the Dog

2. Human Being

3. Down on the Farm

-significant drop-off

4. Buick Makane

I love these 4 and never listen to the rest of the album.