oneway23

Say what you want, don't necessarily care for either song too much (though I do like Ace), but, at least Ace & Baz had the fkn stones to write new songs that are representative of who they are now and didn't just fart out a song with a decades-old vocal take because they were either too lazy or too scared that they couldn't hack it anymore.

They put out brand new music because that's ostensibly what musicians are inclined to do.

15 minutes ago, yourcrazy said:

This song is just plain bad and no amount of mixing can fix that.  Unfortunately, it looks like GnR have no creativity left.  I find it hard to believe that we are going on almost four years since they reunited and all they can do is rehash songs that were not good enough to release 16 years ago.  I would have thought some new tunes would have been written and released by now.  I hate to say it but it is getting time to retire.   

Bruv....I know people lost a few years there with the pandemic, so some of us are still maybe a little discombobulated, but, they've been reunited for what will be eight years next year.

2 minutes ago, ToonGuns said:

I’m a big fan of Steven Wilson / Porcupine Tree and his production is always excellent (regardless of what you think of the songs), so it just annoys me that Guns could have such poor QC and / or standards on that front. 

Me too...big fan... And he works in a home studio...A REALLY nice one, but, still...It's not the thousands a day facilities Guns were accustomed to in their prime, and certainly nowhere near what Axl was afforded for the CD sessions.

As an aside, Steven mixed the Illusions records in Dolby Atmos for the recent set, but, the final mixes were apparently rejected and not signed off on by the band, according to a few folks on the Quadrophonic forums who have direct access to Steven.

Anyway, the new Peter Gabriel is a phenomenally produced album, as well.  Low dynamic range, but REALLY well recorded.  

46 minutes ago, Cosmo said:

Better than Riad and Scraped, for sure, better than a few cuts off UYI and better than Anything Goes, IMO.

Don't know why Scraped gets so much heat...Far from a great song, but, the bridge is among the most OG Guns sounding bits on the whole record.

38 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

And it's not even months since it leaked (it's only 6 weeks). I'm sure that by the time Monsters is released it will be slammed as being "shit", too.

I think I understand the point you're making, but, I don't know...Monsters is a whole different kettle of fish altogether.  I think we'll see much more uniform positive opinions on that one.

19 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

They knew, or at least Fernando knew judging from his "The General is a monster" joke. That's why I think the registration as "The General and Monsters" was not accidental.

I'm still with you here.  I know there will be some who come on and say things like "Bro, come on.. November Rain was on a single in 1992...blah blah" and, yeah, sure, that's true, it was, but, I also feel like there wasn't the same scrutiny on things as there is now. 

I genuinely believe that the single was delayed because it was supposed to contain both tracks at one point, but, you can't cheat science; Roughly 7 minutes, tops, on a 45 rpm 7" before sonic degradation kicks in, and, I think they heard the result and balked.

Why else would we magically happen to have them leak together?  They were both meant to come out at the same time.

1 minute ago, SoulMonster said:

It is unfair to the band to base the standard to which you judge them purely on their best material. GN'R has also release ABSOLUTE SHIT music, in my opinion. So shouldn't the standard by an average? Is it fair of us to expect more than the average of their previous output? And I happen to think The General is definitely better than the average. You might disagree. Some might think it is top 5. It is all good and we are all correct.

That's fair...I appreciate your level-headedness.  I think I'm just fired up today because it feels like the end of an era, in a way- the dark days, the forum threads, the waits, the quotes, the teases...It feels as though it's all sort of winding down now, as the songs we waited decades for get released, and, the future, if there is one, seems a bit unclear.

18 minutes ago, El Guapo said:

You know, this makes me kinda angry. Because I love(ed) GnR. They are pissing on their legacy and their fans with this. I hate because I care.

Exactly!. Hate because you care.

The Appetite album cover was on my birthday cake when I was 10...I dragged my crippled ass into Manhattan to see all four Hammerstein nights...I love this band!  They were my Led Zeppelin & Stones growing up...they're in my blood.

I'm not naive enough to think a bunch of 60 yr olds will ever reclaim the throne, but, damn it, come on...I want to hear what they sound like on record NOW, in 2023.

What music could they conjure up?  What is Axl thinking about today?  What's on his mind?  What would he sing about in the present??  Forget 23 years ago.  What do you have to offer today?

12 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Huh? Of course people who think it is incredible and amazing should say so. Who are you to dismiss their opinions? Just because you happen to disagree doesn't make you the opinion police. Music is subjective. There is lots of music I really don't like, like This I Love, but I accept -- and appreciate -- that others do. Maybe you could try that, too, instead of trying to dictate or rather cancel others opinions?

Gosh...take a piece out of a three paragraph post and that's what you get out of it...I'm not judging you, or anyone for liking it..There's just no nuance in argument anymore, is there?  

Knee-jerk, social media quick thought tribalism.  Me, you, like it, hate it, screw you, screw you, done.

Whatever I write is my opinion, that's it...No policing, no dictation...Like what you like.  All I'm saying is that, in my opinion, standards for GN'R and their fanbase, given the history of the band, should be higher.

I also made it clear that my frustrations are with the band, not the fanbase.

13 minutes ago, Rovim said:

it's not a big deal, I just thought it was ridiculous of you to suggest something must have been lacking in the listener's musical experience and they were ignorant in case they thought The General is an amazing track. Surely you can see the problem with this way of thinking.

The initial comment was said in an off-handed, glib way...meant to be kind of intentionally a little confrontational in a playful way...it didn't land. 

I do sincerely apologize.

I took my misplaced disappointment in the band and directed it towards fellow fans.  I'm sorry.

All in all, I do like the track, believe it or not, I just...man....The leaks were the leaks, and, as someone else said, at least they were of their time and place, ya know?

The idea of the leaked versions still held the mystery of promise & possibility; the idea that these songs could have been worked on in the intervening years, improved exponentially, potentially in new and exciting ways.

Now that they're being put out?  This is it.  Here they are!

We obviously didn't have "The General", but, a few of them are really not very much different than they were as they existed in 2001.  I think, that, for me, is the most disappointing part.

I feel, barring any boxed set or new releases, it's at least pretty evident to me that CD was largely, with a few exceptions,  the greatest hits mixtape of this era and that, for me, is a bit of a let down, at the moment.

58 minutes ago, Rovim said:

"if you actually think this song is amazing, then you're not listening to music correctly and should work on expanding your musical knowledge" 

give me a fuckin' break.

That's not what I said, AT ALL.  Instead of being defensive, let's have a conversation.

Let's stay within the GN'R bubble, then, OK? 

I'm sorry, but, the bar should be much god damn higher for Guns N' Roses!  It might be unfair, but, that's on them for being so awesome out of the gate, alright? LOL

Dead Horse, Locomotive, Bad Apples, Back off Bitch, Bad Obsession...These were the level of "just" album tracks!  Not the standout material, but, they fleshed out the record, gave it some color or attitude... Whatever the record as a whole needed.

The B material for the Chinese era is nowhere near the standard of even the best of the CD tracks.  It's not about wanting Appetite redux or not growing out of a mullet, it's about quality releases and having standards...taking pride in your work, and that's reflected in the effort you put out. 

These are demos Axl Rose either wouldn't, or couldn't finish, and, they sound that way.  Amateurish productions, lazily slapped together, spit-shined with a fresh coat of paint, released under the guise of new material. 

It's insulting to the people who get up on that stage every night, and, it's an insult to their fan base, who has stuck with them, yes, "through all the fucking shit" and who supports them, year after year, tour after tour, regardless of anything else.

If you like the song, that's great, but, please, can we save words like "incredible" and "amazing" for songs that actually deserve it, and , maybe for bands who actually put the work in?

Far be it from me to begrudge someone their subjective opinion, but, I suspect that the folks who think this is an amazing track might want to consider diversifying their music listening.

1 minute ago, GNRRHCP98 said:

“Atlas” has the potential to be a damn good track, it needs some tweaking for sure, but I can’t imagine them not giving it attention cause it’s practically a finished product.

I honestly thought “Monsters” as a hidden track for TG would’ve been fantastic… there’s a duality there that just uplifts both of them musically and thematically… oh well, ‘tis just a dream now. 

With that being said, they shouldn’t wait too terribly long, the interest will most definitely wane… January/February would be prime time to do so… Green Day’s got an album coming, plus there’s rumblings of more Stones stuff, Paul McCartney dropping another album, and Springsteen releasing vol. 2 of his covers album. 

I appreciate your optimism, but, I think that release schedule might be a bit too ambitious for this band.

I'll say late Spring/early Summer, May-June...just my uneducated guess.

25 minutes ago, Chris 55 said:

why do they keep releasing their flac files at 48hz when the appetite flacs were 192?

Appetite was recorded on analog tape, so, they likely captured it and stored it at 24-192 for archival purposes.

These recent songs are all a product of the digital age, done in pro-tools, probably had the session captured at that rate. 

Not an audiophile forum, but, honestly, nothing we really need to worry about too much.  It's more for the folks making the music.

5 minutes ago, GNRRHCP98 said:

I seriously want to know their intentions for “Monsters.”

They obviously know it leaked along with “TG” and it’s apparent that what we heard then (back in October) would be the final (official) version of “Monsters.”

Just doesn’t make sense for them not to release it at some point in the very near future… strike while the iron is hot, do it sooner rather than later.

I have no connections and no insight, but, I'm pretty confident that we'll see Atlas & Monsters next year, at some point.  After that?  Unclear, the future is.

9 minutes ago, Route66 said:

Get better headphones sweetheart

then you answered your own doubts, Congrats

I'll tell you what: Talk to me about the mix, give me details, elaborate on your argument..a few time codes, maybe?  Points of reference where you've noted changes so that I can see where you're coming from.

1 minute ago, WhazUp said:

I have learned the hard way, so many people who are not musicians throw out the terms "mix", "master" and "production" as if they are all the same thing - respect to everyone but it really needs to be said because so often I just think we need to realize how many people are not experts on audio

Can't tell you how many times I've seen people ask if an upcoming remaster is going to be a full re-mix...Well, you can make a few EQ moves remastering, and maybe ADC tech has improved since the original release, but, by and large....no...you need a lot more than that for a full remix!

13 minutes ago, Route66 said:

the mix is different like I said 

I really don't believe that it is...

Clearer?  Yes

Higher quality?  Yes

A different mix would mean instrumental parts re-inserted which weren't present or audible before, possibly extended pieces or different takes selected, a different balance between where each instrument sits within the frequency spectrum...all tell-tale signs of a re-mix, a la Rush's Vapor Trails or Pearl Jam's Ten from 2009.

This is really just the same thing we had, in shaper focus.

The level of peak limiting on the drums is bad enough.  To make matters worse, it sounds like instead of making everything skull crushingly loud, as is what usually happens in these cases, they may have shaved all of the peaks off of the audio and then lowered the overall volume.  That "shaving" actually distorts the source file and creates that audible clicking sound, while the lowered output volume just makes everything lack dynamics and sound dull.

As for something positive...the mix is cleaner, and the guitars & bass sound pretty good, but, again, the whole drum track sounds like they've had sample hits replace everything (I'm not talking about the drum machine used in the verses).   The shift from verse to chorus should open up like Bonham and drive the song, but, it all sounds so processed and artificial, smearing everything into the same grey murk.

All in all, a pretty disappointing presentation, in my opinion.

If the Brazilians thought death threats in an e-mail was an appropriate reaction to a botched Slash solo by Bumble, DJ Assclown should have been strung upside down by his balls from the Christ the Redeemer statue.

1 hour ago, Slugworth said:

 

GNR's first official video since Moses wore short pants should have similar numbers. Instead they can't even get their own subscribers to watch.

I'm glad someone put together a few recent musical references to put this in proper context.  FFS, there are pimple popping videos on Youtube released a month or two ago with 26 million views!

These songs are hardly even a blackhead on the ass cheek of the music world, never mind the world at large.

55 minutes ago, Rovim said:

I believe there are still finished and unfinished material with vocals that Axl might still want to release, who knows? it's possible that Slash and Duff could rerecord more Chinese era tracks, but no one knows what the plan is when it comes to what Axl wants to do (that is if they're planning to release more tunes from that era or that it ends with what we have now, which I don't think will be the case)

 

I can't believe in a world where Slash & Duff didn't record on Oklahoma.  If they haven't already done so, they need to. 

Devious Bastard is also right up their alley.