Jay Z Sticks It To Gallagher, Doubters

[Zint]

...and gigger conveniently quotes me as such

What whole thing??...proclaiming themselves better than the Beatles and the best band ever on the face of the planet?

It's absurd

oopsy...you left out the best part of that quote mate..

absurd (and a clever marketing scheme for those who care to take the blinders off and see it).

there...all fixed

The reason they didn't blow huge in the States is the same as The Kinks.

Few hits...

But hey, they still sold 10 million records State side. Not bad for a Beatles cover band.

But hey,Hannah Montanna has sold a gazillionly trillionly amount of records stateside.Not bad for a pretend Disney persona.

And just for the record...I'd go to an Oasis concert over a Jay-Z concert any day.

[Gigger]

But hey, they still sold 10 million records State side. Not bad for a Beatles cover band.

But hey,Hannah Montanna has sold a gazillionly trillionly amount of records stateside.Not bad for a pretend Disney persona.

And just for the record...I'd go to an Oasis concert over a Jay-Z concert any day.

If we are gonna be pedantic - Hannah Montana - 3 million albums in the US. Oasis 10 million. But we're talking different demographics, target markets, eras etc obviously. Unless the twentysomethings in North America have started listening to vastly different music to those this side of the pond.

Fact is in their pomp (95-97) they did crack America and they continue to sell out the big cities to this day. Deny it all you like but record and concert sales prove it. Globally they were the biggest band in the world at that time. And I have explained why they didn't maintain it in the US so if you haven't got it yet you never will.

Now globally they are probably more rock grandees than anything else but their footnote in music history is far longer than Hova's.

Edited July 3, 2008 by Gigger

[SolidSnake]

a perfect example of oasis taking the piss out of the US music industry, it's about 1 minute into the video.

it's funny how the ones in america who didnt get it got oh so offended, it's just rock n roll.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uLIAC6Qtjgc&feature=related

Edited July 3, 2008 by SolidSnake

[Zint]

If we are gonna be pedantic - Hannah Montana - 3 million albums in the US. Oasis 10 million.

You actually looked up the stats?

wow..

Looks like some irony gets lost on you as well.

Fact is in their pomp (95-97) they did crack America and they continue to sell out the big cities to this day. Deny it all you like but record and concert sales prove it.

Globally they were the biggest band in the world at that time.

I'm not denying anything...they had their moment in the sun.

And I have explained why they didn't maintain it in the US so if you haven't got it yet you never will.

By telling me the inferior Americans didn't mean shit to them and they were too lazy to properly promote themselves here??

nah..was it that??..or was it North America realized they weren't really all that and a packet of crisps and moved on.Hence the declining popularity.

They are all right man...but fuck,they haven't filled any big shoes.

[nunchuck]

people people, surely this is down to a matter of taste?!

but the fact that jay z came on and sang what is undeniably a fucking anthem, badly out of tune is hardly a two fingered response to gallagher. if anything it made him look rather foolish.

couple that with the fact that practically the entire glastonbury crowd were singing heartily along to a song he was trying to take the piss out of only illustrates my point further.

oh, and he was fucking shite as well!

[Gigger]

If we are gonna be pedantic - Hannah Montana - 3 million albums in the US. Oasis 10 million.

You actually looked up the stats?

wow..

Looks like some irony gets lost on you as well.

Guess we can both play the misquoting game. Pretty sure my next line showed that I was joking but well edited. Fair game I suppose.

And I have explained why they didn't maintain it in the US so if you haven't got it yet you never will.

By telling me the inferior Americans didn't mean shit to them and they were too lazy to properly promote themselves here??

nah..was it that??..or was it North America realized they weren't really all that and a packet of crisps and moved on.Hence the declining popularity.

As I've already explained it was the lack of effort in promotion. It happens. We never really got Nine Inch Nails or industrial music in this country because it was never promoted over here. It happens.

Is it really that hard to believe that a British band who sold 60 million albums globally genuinely didn't care about North America? They cracked the US briefly without even really trying. And they continue to sell out the big cities without even trying.

[Zint]

North America does not "LOVE" to make British bands huge.

...you're wrong

[SolidSnake]

why are you getting so wound up?

[nunchuck]

i think you should ask the sex pistols, they played north america and then broke up the next day!

[SolidSnake]

North America does not "LOVE" to make British bands huge.

...you're wrong

no im not, if that ridiculous statement was infact true, then you would have caught on to bands like the stone roses and the la's.

anyway, it hardly matters.

[Zint]

Is it really that hard to believe that a British band who sold 60 million albums globally genuinely didn't care about North America?

No..not at all.

Is it really that hard to believe that "outside of the big cities" as you call it...North America just thinks they are an "o.k." band?

They cracked the US briefly without even really trying. And they continue to sell out the big cities without even trying.

But...if they really had been the next Beatles...or the next Stones...or the next Zeppelin...or the next Cream (I'll stop there...because the list is extensively longer than you care to realize)...they WOULD hve been huge in Noth America.They would have been massive in every little hick town across the continent.

But they weren't,and they are not..

why??..it comes down the music...the songs

Twist that bit of information however you want...but THAT is fact.

I think they are ok...and maybe they ARE the best band to come out of the U.K. in like...decades.

But to me...that's not saying much.

[Zint]

why are you getting so wound up?

I'm not.

I just view this as a good conversation on music.

I love to talk music...pros and cons.

You ang Gigger seemed the ones tightly wound with all your stats and everything.

I'm fascinated with your zealous defence of how Oasis is perceived in North America.

It just works that way sometimes man...ever heard of Johnny Ray??

He barely scratched the surface of popularity in North America (he's from the U.S.) a looong time ago,but he was fucking massive in Britain...he was a really huge star there.

No one was around to post silly youtube quotes and shit about why he was more popular here than there...they just understood his music.They enjoyed what he had to offer.

Not every artist always catches on everywhere.

fact

[SolidSnake]

Is it really that hard to believe that a British band who sold 60 million albums globally genuinely didn't care about North America?

No..not at all.

Is it really that hard to believe that "outside of the big cities" as you call it...North America just thinks they are an "o.k." band?

They cracked the US briefly without even really trying. And they continue to sell out the big cities without even trying.

But...if they really had been the next Beatles...or the next Stones...or the next Zeppelin...or the next Cream (I'll stop there...because the list is extensively longer than you care to realize)...they WOULD hve been huge in Noth America.They would have been massive in every little hick town across the continent.

But they weren't,and they are not..

why??..it comes down the music...the songs

Twist that bit of information however you want...but THAT is fact.

I think they are ok...and maybe they ARE the best band to come out of the U.K. in like...decades.

But to me...that's not saying much.

what complete bullshit, Jimi Hendrix never made it in america, whats your point?

Oasis have long stamped their mark on the music radar, and are already mentioned in the same bracket as the stones and the beatles, they might not be as good, however taste in music is subjective.

Oasis have carried the tourch of british rock n roll for the last 15 years.

not one band has managed to take it from them, not U2, not radiohead, not coldplay, not anyone.

the strokes come from the US, are they known in every single hick town? FUCK NO, are they a terrific band FUCK YES.

Rock N Roll at the moment is hardly at the forefront of music, it hasnt been since the 90's.

why are you getting so wound up?

I'm not.

I just view this as a good conversation on music.

I love to talk music...pros and cons.

You ang Gigger seemed the ones tightly wound with all your stats and everything.

I'm fascinated with your zealous defence of how Oasis is perceived in North America.

It just works that way sometimes man...ever heard of Johnny Ray??

He barely scratched the surface of popularity in North America (he's from the U.S.) a looong time ago,but he was fucking massive in Britain...he was a really huge star there.

No one was around to post silly youtube quotes and shit about why he was more popular here than there...they just understood his music.They enjoyed what he had to offer.

Not every artist always catches on everywhere.

fact

well I pretty much agree with that.

[Gigger]

Firstly, no one is getting wound up and if they are they need to get some perspective.

Is it really that hard to believe that a British band who sold 60 million albums globally genuinely didn't care about North America?

No..not at all.

Is it really that hard to believe that "outside of the big cities" as you call it...North America just thinks they are an "o.k." band?

They cracked the US briefly without even really trying. And they continue to sell out the big cities without even trying.

But...if they really had been the next Beatles...or the next Stones...or the next Zeppelin...or the next Cream (I'll stop there...because the list is extensively longer than you care to realize)...they WOULD hve been huge in Noth America.They would have been massive in every little hick town across the continent.

But they weren't,and they are not..

why??..it comes down the music...the songs

Twist that bit of information however you want...but THAT is fact.

I think they are ok...and maybe they ARE the best band to come out of the U.K. in like...decades.

But to me...that's not saying much.

I don't think they are the next Beatles or Stones etc and I'm pretty sure I've never stated as much in this thread. And for the record neither do they. I do think however that culturally they were hugely important on our little island and globally they were hugely successful - album and concert sales prove this. And hell, musically they were pretty damn good too. Those first two albums are stellar no question about that.

I also think that the "Oasis never cracked the States" is a strange argument that people always make. Fact is they never tried to crack the States. It was never really on their radar. They weren't interested in the States. To work out why you'd have to examine the Gallagher brothers heads and that's too big a task for me but fact is they weren't interested. If they were they would have made more effort.

Of course they aren't know in every hick town across North America. How many bands really are? Not many. But I'd say a large percentage of people in North America would know about Wonderwall so they must have registered to some extent and I bet most bands British, American, Canadian or whatever would settle for a 4x platinum album in the US.

As for your slight on the UK music scene - well I'll leave that for another day but I bet if you examined the state of the US (I'm leaving Canada out of this one) and UK music industries you'd find that ours is much more fertile ground for new and original bands than the current wasteland that is the US music scene.

Edited July 3, 2008 by Gigger

[Zint]

what complete bullshit, Jimi Hendrix never made it in america

ooooooooo...you need to do your homework on that one

Oasis are already mentioned in the same bracket as the stones and the beatles,

Not in North America man...I can assure you.

Oasis have carried the tourch of british rock n roll for the last 15 years.

That's cool,I have no beef with that.

Can't argue with the home team pep rally.

not one band has managed to take it from them, not U2, not radiohead, not coldplay, not anyone.

Those bands are pretty fucking huge here in the land that doesn't love to make British bands huge.

Rock N Roll at the moment is hardly at the forefront of music, it hasnt been since the 90's.

Well it's a good thing that Oasis is carrying the torch then.

[Zint]

I do think however that culturally they were hugely important on our little island

Oh absolutely...that's recognized for sure.

globally they were hugely successful - album and concert sales prove this.

agreed

And hell, musically they were pretty damn good too. Those first two albums are stellar no question about that.

That's personal taste...but it's not why I got involved in the conversation.They're good...but not an all time fav for me.

but I bet if you examined the state of the US (I'm leaving Canada out of this one) and UK music industries you'd find that ours is much more fertile ground for new and original bands than the current wasteland that is the US music scene.

Oh without question...you'll get no argument from me there about the current wasteland.

It's cool to hear you have fertile ground over there...we really could use some.

Seriously....I'm not kidding.

The music scene is dire.

...bring it

[Zint]

North America does not "LOVE" to make British bands huge.

...you're wrong

no im not, if that ridiculous statement was infact true, then you would have caught on to bands like the stone roses and the la's.

anyway, it hardly matters.

When I went to England in '91 for the GnR Wembley gig.I spotted a mag that had the Stones Roses splashed across the front page.

"THE NEXT ROLLING STONES"

cool!!!!...I'm up for that!

I bought the mag...it came with a bonus disc of Stone Roses tunes.

I sat on the plane on the way home reading about them,always ready for something amazing to come along.

The Next Stones...wow!...can't wait to hear this.

Can't tell you how far they were from being the new Rolling Stones they were...for me.

Oh wait...I just realized...I had another British band take the piss out of me!!!

damn!!

you cheeky biggers!

Not gonna buy their records or go see the concerts just for that...

..oh wait

[SolidSnake]

what complete bullshit, Jimi Hendrix never made it in america

ooooooooo...you need to do your homework on that one

Oasis are already mentioned in the same bracket as the stones and the beatles,

Not in North America man...I can assure you.

hardly a relevant fact, the US music scene has been a joke for nearly two decades.

boy bands, nu-metal, limp bizkit, britney and rap music.

believe me when I say this, I can assure you, you're brilliant country is hardly relevant when it comes to the importance of an artist, their output, and their place in the history of music.

The Kinks and the Small Faces at their best were just as good as the beatles, this is a general consensus amongst people who know anything about music, yet there are only about 5 people in the US who have even heard of them. Oasis sound nothing like the beatles, and arent better than them, but they're definitely up there in terms of impact.

stop thinking the US plays some sort of role as a musical-consultant of the universe, musically the US is always going to be second best behind the UK. for many many reasons - FACT.

[Gigger]

North America does not "LOVE" to make British bands huge.

...you're wrong

no im not, if that ridiculous statement was infact true, then you would have caught on to bands like the stone roses and the la's.

anyway, it hardly matters.

When I went to England in '91 for the GnR Wembley gig.I spotted a mag that had the Stones Roses splashed across the front page.

"THE NEXT ROLLING STONES"

cool!!!!...I'm up for that!

I bought the mag...it came with a bonus disc of Stone Roses tunes.

I sat on the plane on the way home reading about them,always ready for something amazing to come along.

The Next Stones...wow!...can't wait to hear this.

Can't tell you how far they were from being the new Rolling Stones they were...for me.

Oh wait...I just realized...I had another British band take the piss out of me!!!

damn!!

you cheeky biggers!

Not gonna buy their records or go see the concerts just for that...

..oh wait

In 1991 they were calling the Stone Roses the next Rolling Stones? You sure of your chronology there? 89 or 90 I could understand but not 91. Not after their self titled released in 89 or the Spike Island gig in 90.

Great band the Stone Roses - the real precursor to Britpop. Their Spike Island gig was the Britpop equivalent of the 1976 Sex Pistols Manchester gig.

The La's - another great British 90s band. Add Oasis, Blur, the Verve, Radiohead, Massive Attack, Portishead and maybe Pulp, throw in some Manic Street Preachers as well and you've got a good yourself a good grounding in 90s British music. If you want one that is...

The thing about Britpop, much like grunge, is that once you get deeper into the scene you realise how many bands carried those other bands coat-tails. For every Oasis and Nirvana there was a lot of generic sound a like crap which bled the scene dry. Cast, Ocean Colour Scene, Shed Seven etc...

Edited July 3, 2008 by Gigger

[Zint]

a perfect example of oasis taking the piss out of the US music industry, it's about 1 minute into the video.

it's funny how the ones in america who didnt get it got oh so offended, it's just rock n roll.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uLIAC6Qtjgc&feature=related

What's funny to me is Oasis taking the piss out of the US music industry...when it was the US who spoonfed rock and roll to the rest of the world.

oh...the...irony

[SolidSnake]

no one ever thought the stone roses were the next rolling stones ffs. are you on crack???

The Stone Roses are one of the most unique sounding bands this country has ever produced.

[Zint]

what complete bullshit, Jimi Hendrix never made it in america

ooooooooo...you need to do your homework on that one

Oasis are already mentioned in the same bracket as the stones and the beatles,

Not in North America man...I can assure you.

hardly a relevant fact, the US music scene has been a joke for nearly two decades.

boy bands, nu-metal, limp bizkit, britney and rap music

sez the guy from the land of Robbie Williams

I watch your Brit Awards man...don't get too lofty here.

[Zint]

In 1991 they were calling the Stone Roses the next Rolling Stones? You sure of your chronology there? 89 or 90 I could understand but not 91. Not after their self titled released in 89 or the Spike Island gig in 90.

It could have been '90.

I was in England in the summer of '90 as well (went to Knebworth that year).

So yeah...I stand corrected if '91 doesn't fit a chronology.

But the mag was definitely hyping them as the next Rolling Stones.

there was a lot of generic sound a like crap which bled the scene dry.

...happens in every scene (unfortunately)

[SolidSnake]

a perfect example of oasis taking the piss out of the US music industry, it's about 1 minute into the video.

it's funny how the ones in america who didnt get it got oh so offended, it's just rock n roll.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uLIAC6Qtjgc&feature=related

What's funny to me is Oasis taking the piss out of the US music industry...when it was the US who spoonfed rock and roll to the rest of the world.

oh...the...irony

spoonfed us rock n roll? dont make me laugh :rofl-lol: :rofl-lol: :rofl-lol:

a couple of american artists may have layed the foundations of rock n roll

but the UK perfected rock n roll - FACT

and thus we "spoonfed" (what a word eh?!) you rock n roll with the beatles and the rolling stones, who are by far away the two best and most cutting edge rock n roll bands ever, of all time.

please run along now and stop making me laugh.

[Zint]

no one ever thought the stone roses were the next rolling stones ffs. are you on crack???

You are mistaken...somebody did.

Because I decided to check them out based on that very claim that was splashed across the music mag I bought.

I didn't hallucinate it man...

The Stone Roses are one of the most unique sounding bands this country has ever produced.

ok

But they definitely were not the next Rolling Stones....contrary to what I DID read about them.

a perfect example of oasis taking the piss out of the US music industry, it's about 1 minute into the video.

it's funny how the ones in america who didnt get it got oh so offended, it's just rock n roll.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uLIAC6Qtjgc&feature=related

What's funny to me is Oasis taking the piss out of the US music industry...when it was the US who spoonfed rock and roll to the rest of the world.

oh...the...irony

spoonfed us rock n roll? dont make me laugh :rofl-lol: :rofl-lol: :rofl-lol:

a couple of american artists may have layed the foundations of rock n roll

but the UK perfected rock n roll - FACT

and thus we "spoonfed" (what a word eh?!) you rock n roll with the beatles and the rolling stones, who are by far away the two best and most cutting edge rock n roll bands ever, of all time.

please run along now and stop making me laugh.

Your letting national pride obstruct your view of the facts..

You need to read some rock history.