ludurigan

14 hours ago, Wagszilla said:

Damn homie was in deep

have you ever listened to "bleedin"?

izzy wrote this song "bleedin'" right around the time that "homie was in deep" as you mentioned

(its from the 117 album released in march 1998)

if i remember correctly some of us in forums were speculating that this song could very well be about homie "dying" for the stephanie lady

now if you ask me id say that there are a few lines on the song that look like dead giveaways for "homie"...

She'd always be out late a-drinkin'
You'd always let it go down
Now she's gone, why you bleedin'...let it go

You gotta know better now you're older
This ain't the end of the world
So get off your ass and get over her
Let it go
Let it go

Whatcha dyin' about, ya gotta let it go
No need to be crying for her man, come on now
You should know

Now time has passed, you're an old man
Way up there high on the hill
Back on the streets it ain't changed much
Yeah I know
Let it go

Whatcha dyin' about, ya gotta let it go
No need to be cryin' for her man, come on now
You should know

1 hour ago, EvanG said:

Yeah, could be, I wouldn't know. But Izzy did send in a lot of songs on tape at the time. So Slash and Duff probably worked on a lot of Izzy songs in Chicago, writing guitar solos over it, adding bass lines, etc. Bands often say ''we wrote that song'', meaning everyone added their own instrumental parts to the song, while in reality only one person wrote the original composition. I don't think that for a lot of Izzy songs, especially at the time of UYI when they weren't really communicating like before, Izzy would tell Duff how to play the bass lines and Slash how to play the guitar solo.

yeah it is possible but i suppose izzy sending tapes was later in the process? like on the actual sessions in LA and stuff? not sure

oh sure

i don't think izzy ever told slash or duff how to play

i don't think slash ever told izzy or duff how to play

i don't think duff ever told slash or izzy how to play

by all accounts, izzy and slash had a "unspoken chemistry", both have said that several times in various interviews as you are probably aware of

slash would come up with something and izzy would write "around it" to "complement it" or to "push it forward" etc

same when izzy came up with something... slash would then add stuff "around it" or "over it"

apparently they didn't need much spoken communication to achieve that

10 hours ago, Sydney Fan said:

Gee he was really starting a dowhill slide health wise at this stage. 

yes

during his solo tour it gets pretty scary

43 minutes ago, Ratam said:

would be good hear the original song , maybe some.outtakes, I be curious if the original song exist.

yeah that would be fantastic

i truly hope it exists

and i truly hope it surfaces some day!

1 hour ago, soon said:

Its interesting that Duff contributed to the iconic drum intro for YCBM. Because the lyrics are referenced in the AFD booklet. And then Adler didnt make it to the recording of YCBM. Its like the band was always eating away at itself.

I mean, its cool and normal that various members in a band apply their creativity in many ways. A bassist can write a drum riff, I get that. But its just like the writing was always on the wall for this bands disintegration. And the vying for power: Play this drum, turn Izzy down, hire Dizzy, write with Paul, etc.

 

all these quotes from the last sentence except "play this drum" apply to one man

and i don't think duff forced matt to play it like he wanted

by all accounts there is just one guy in GNR who used to push stuff down people's throats

1 hour ago, EvanG said:

It's funny about the West Arkeen quote, because in Duff's book he mentioned that the only reason West got a song credit is because he showed Duff alternate tunings on the guitar that Duff didn't know about, and if it wasn't for that, the song wouldn't have been written.

Duff apparently says some non-true stuff in his book (probably not on purpose), for example he said that he and slash wrote Pretty Tied Up in Chicago, which is probably not true, since by all accounts it was Izzy who wrote it and apparently izzy didnt hang around long enough in Chicago to write with them

1 hour ago, Ratam said:

But for i interpret they switch  Easy as is now,  i guess they make better , for my is a perfect song with great punch , i can't imagine Easy acustic song .I noticed that Axl was very sincere about West Arkeen ,because he recognized Arkeen work , Axl would ignored Arkeen work.Good for Axl.

yes it has great punch i also agree that they probably made it better

58 minutes ago, soon said:

Its hilarious to me that Axl believed that the song would be a hippie song if on acoustic in a different arrangement. Like, the lyrics are still the same! How on Earth is "See me hit you, you fall down" a hippie thing? 

For no reason at all, here is my hippie lyric rewrite for first verse and chorus of ISE:

I see your sister in a tie dye dress/ she's eats no meat/ her names Celeste/ makes zucchini cake/ its dry/ helps endangered apes mate

Its so Etsy, Etsy/ when everybody's omming to free me, baby/ yeah its so Etsy, Etsy/ when the Tarot Cards are all seeing 

 I'll see myself out

the lyrics were probably not complete by then or they have been changed a bit

check this Axl quote:

- 'It's So Easy' was written by Duff and West Arkeen (a friend and co-conspirator of the band), then I wrote the obscene verse because the original sounded too much like 'Night Train' [Screamer, August 1988].

SOURCE: http://www.a-4-d.com/t73-it-s-so-easy

2 hours ago, Ratam said:

I love much " Is't so easy " , is a very important song to GNR history , you mean they " stolen " this song West Arkeen❓❓ first time i heard it.

its a famous story about how the song was written by west and duff and once the band got its hands on it they turned it into something else

Axl quote:

"'It's So Easy'...was originally a hippie ya-ya song. And Duff and West wrote this song like on acoustic, and it literally went like: [singing country-like] "I see your sister in a sunday dress..." Oh absolutely, and we were rehearsing in L.A and Slash basically just starts raping the song and I ran up and started like, doing like the evil Iggy Pop over it, while West is standing there and his face is like drooping, like: "My song " [Eddie Trunk Interview, 2006]

SOURCE: http://www.a-4-d.com/t73-it-s-so-easy

2 hours ago, sidman69 said:

Last friday we chatted with Dave Dominguez about his time working on Chinese Democracy in 1998. He shared some stories about also working with Slash on the Curdled Movie soundtrack a few weeks before he quit GNR. He also recorded with Duff and Izzy as well. He also chatted about visiting Axl's house and what those early recording sessions with Mike clink were like in the late 90's! Discussion starts around 10-12 minutes into the interview. Enjoy! We've got another big interview coming next week with someone who worked with GNR back in the day!

 

pretty great info on izzy/slash/duff/taz sessions!

1 minute ago, Ratam said:

And Duff wrote " is't so easy " too .

yep, duff and west arkeen

then it was "raped" by the band and it became the what it became

9 minutes ago, EvanG said:

No. But wasn't Izzy also a drummer in a band before GnR? So he probably came in with a broader perspective than let's say Slash or Steven in those early days. I'm sure nowadays it's a different story because all of them are veterans, but it seemed that at the beginning Duff had the most experience.

yeah surely Duff had been in more bands than anyone at that point, i am not sure if he had written full good songs at that point. izzy had written a lot of great songs with axl and chris webber. yes, izzy played drums and bass also in some other band (London if i am not mistaken)

this is the Duff's quote about Izzy right after they recorded stuff for Duff's EP

"I had a really good time just creating… I've played on a bunch of Izzy records over the last fifteen years, and it was just really nice to be in the studio with him for a couple of days. I really trust whatever he does. If he says, 'I've got a bridge. I've got a part,' I know he's got a part. It's not, like, 'Oh, let me hear it.' It's, like, 'Okay, he's got the part. Good. That's taken care of.' And, yeah, I'd like to do more music with him — always; for the rest of my life."

source: http://www.blabbermouth.net/news/duff-mckagan-would-like-to-keep-making-music-with-izzy-stradlin-for-rest-of-his-life/

9 minutes ago, EvanG said:

Maybe he was too, who knows? I just know that Duff talked about this a lot, being a drummer, guitarist, and bassplayer, therefore being able to put everything sorta together when they were working on songs.

He talks about it in this clip too.

 

 

yeah i agree

about a few months before the reunion fakunion duff mentioned how izzy was good at structuring a song

did you catch that?

On 09/01/2019 at 4:15 AM, zombux said:

good. so that means Izzy and Duff were in 1995 writing both for GNR and Izzy solo album, correct?

probably yes

@sidman69 brand new podcast has some great info about izzy jamming on studio with slash and duff and taz

this guy dave dominguez was around when they (izzy and slash) jammed with taz, apparently for izzy's album but he seems to be very confused on dates

starts on the 9-10 minutes mark

http://www.mygnrforum.com/topic/221904-our-interview-with-dave-dominguez-chinese-democracy-afd-re-recording-live-era-engineer/

10 minutes ago, EvanG said:

I meant the first twenty seconds. I know it doesn't seem too important, and that's why he didn't get a songwriting credit for it. 

But it's the same with Sweet Child... it's mainly Izzy, Slash and Axl's song, but Duff wrote that bass melody in the intro, which isn't insignificant either. I think in many songs Duff was probably the glue who put a lot of things together and added small things that might have not been enough to give him a songwriting credit if you want to go all technical, but he did add something to the song. I read an interview with Duff where he said that he wrote a lot more for the UYI's than he got credit for. Like the bass melody in the intro of Pretty Tied Up... I can imagine Duff coming up with that and not getting a songwriting credit for it because it's played over Izzy's composition.

funny that these are my exact thoughts about izzy

i always saw him as the glue who put things together

5 minutes ago, EvanG said:

I'm sure Izzy wrote more than Duff, I agree with that. I can imagine Duff writing the drum and bass part until those licks come in (bending of the strings). From then on it's probably Izzy's and Axl's song. But I wasn't there, so it's all speculation.

Because Duff was the guy with most band experience, I can picture him having been the one who put a lot of ideas together and what not. There's always someone like that in a band, even if they're not the main songwriter. That's why I think Duff was probably more important than he got credit for.

yeah i see, its possible

3 minutes ago, EvanG said:

It's on youtube somewhere. Interview with Matt. They asked him if he came up with the drum part at the beginning, but he said it was Duff.

I think that was Duff's role in that band. He talked about this in his book as well. He was basically the conductor in that band because he had the most musical experience out of all guys.

oh you mean the drum intro

yeah thats a great drum intro

i dont think duff wrote the "full" proper intro -- the crescendo stuff, the dramatic and so flowy arrangements

and if you ask me i would say that duff probably didnt have much to do with building that drama (and flow) in the songs, and even being a sort of "conductor" as you point

i respect your opinion, i am speculating here, but all that i have read about GNR and all that i can listen on everyone (axl, izzy, slash and duffs) solo albums leads me to believe that izzy had way more to do with that kind of stuff than duff

or it was a band effort

maybe clink helped?

1 hour ago, Rovim said:

I used to be harsh on Gilby for not contributing on the original material but Axl didn't want to it seems and Gilby had ideas, he had Pawnshop Guitars which could have been used for parts on the next Guns record. (can't believe I just said that)

Izzy will always be the greatest but Gilby did exactly what he should and could have done and he did it with grace.

no matter where you go, whenever you start to try and understand why things didn't work (or,why did they go so wrong) the name that always pops up -- and usually closes the conversation -- is axl rose

2 minutes ago, EvanG said:

But I think in other aspects Duff was rather important. For example, it was Duff who wrote the intro to You Could Be Mine.

that is important

do you have source for this info?

also that doesn't make him irreplaceable

2 hours ago, soon said:

Its all hilarious and Spinal Tap. Why wouldnt they be able to make available isolated Izzy tracks? Why did Slash wanna bury Izzys parts with his own on the album but apparently want the reverse live? And I imagine that the parts Slash wanted to change would be from AFD and Lies tunes where Izzys parts matter more. Those parts he wanted Slash-ified. And the UYI stuff he wanted Izzy-fied. Its bonkers!

exactly

pretty pathetic hysterical spinal tap stuff

1 minute ago, EvanG said:

Gilby definitely could have added something to the creative process. Pawnshop Guitars is a decent record and Monkey Chow is one of the best songs on the Snakepit record.

agree

Cure or Kill me is fantastic

that riff alone has more heart & spirit than the entire axl rose solo discography

Black is pretty good too

the Col Parker album has some truly good songs

the list goes on

1 hour ago, Rovim said:

yea cause he's not Izzy. I don't think anyone would sound "right" except the guitar playin' of the man who was a part of the original recipe. It sounded different, but for me, in the style of Gn'R. It wasn't too different that it stuck out like a butthurt penis

i respect your opinion

yeah "butthurt penis" seems to be a more accurate description for the past and current axl aliens

yeah probably no one would sound right other than izzy

same goes for axl and slash

irreplaceable

and even steven in a sense

but GNR sounded good with matt on drums in 1991

duff seems to me to be the only replaceable member of guns n roses

On 14/01/2019 at 1:46 AM, lame ass security said:

Does anyone think Axl "seemed medicated" during his testimony?  It's been a long time since I watched it but I didn't get that impression.

axl doesnt look like his proper self onstage since the end of 1991 

9 hours ago, Rovim said:

now now... Gilby is a good guitar player with a good tone and a... he's not Izzy, but he contributed to the machine and it had it's value. I like his classic bluesy hard rock vibe. He kept it movin' along

I agree that Gilby is a good guitar player with a good tone that contributed to the machine, had its value and kept it moving along

that doesn't change the fact that he didn't sound right on a lot of songs, and his little tale about picking wrong guitar parts may explain why Gilby didn't sound right on a lot of songs

9 hours ago, TeeJay410 said:

Why in the world did you highlight this part and not his comments on the reunion?

maybe because i have been listening to that band 92-93 live recordings for 25 years now and I always thought that "this doesn't sound right"?

and now I may have found (additional) information that may explain why said band never sounded right to my ears?

something I have always suspected -- Gilby wasn't playing the songs properly?

this "Gilby picks guitar parts wrong" information adds to a much more famous Gilby tale (also via his own mouth) that when he was learning the songs Slash told him something like "Hey, you are playing my parts"... (additional evidence that Gilby can't pick parts that good)... and then Slash told him something like "no one really knew what Izzy played"

You put A plus B and it gets pretty obvious why it never sounded right

10 hours ago, GNR 1991 said:

Literally who cares lol

yeah, exactly, why on earth would someone care about having their favourite songs played right?!

This is a bit from a Gilby Clarke interview on Rock Talk With Mitch Lafon

He talks about playing with Wayne Kramer on a tribute to the MC5...

"When I first sat down with him to learn the songs, you know, I'm pretty good at picking out guitar parts on records, and when I sat down with him - man did I have them wrong. When he showed me what the parts really were, I'm not kidding, it blew my mind."

source: https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/general_music_news/ex-gnr_guitarist_gilby_clarke_i_was_beyond_stunned_to_see_axl__slash_reunite.html

SO Gilby considers himself "pretty good at picking out guitar parts on records"

BUT he picked the guitar parts of an album all wrong at least once -- by his own admission

YEAH I would go even further and say that it happened at least twice

YES i am talking about the izzy's parts that gilby "picked" on GNR songs

i think if gilby sat down with izzy and izzy were to show him what the parts really are, then gilby's mind would blow even harder