Tadsy

17 hours ago, northernsoul said:

An album with Angus is an Angus album that Axl sings on.  It will probably take him a few weeks to record some vocals. It'll likely be dreadful simple lowest common denominator like Rock Or Bust, i can't imagine it'll be a particularly big undertaking. 

A GnR album on the other hand.. well we know that isn't going to be simple to get multiple parties to work on and come out with something that is mutually agreeable and they will be striving for something that is perfect (in their own minds at least) and involves a lot more input from Axl than going to a studio and doing the vocals for a few weeks.

I can see why he'd want to do the AC/DC stuff, he enjoys it, he isn't getting any younger and no doubt it is easy  fixed money for him to keep topping up the pension, which seems to have got more important for him these last few years.

Do you think axl sees an AC/DC album with his vocals on it a part of his own personal legacy that may mean more to him than another GNR album? And that's why it could be prioritised over GNR? Interesting thought??

23 hours ago, RussTCB said:

This took me a long time to learn personally. I spent the better part of a decade responding to seemingly every post I disagreed with and to be honest, it was quite exhausting.

I'd go around quoting every post that said "Axl & his solo band" and replying with something like "BUT IT *IS* GUNS N' ROSES!!!111!!11!!". Same thing with CD. CD is not only a GN'R album to me, it's my favorite of theirs. It took me years to understand that my opinion was just as foreign to others as theirs was to me. 

For whatever reason I (and a lot of CD fans) seemed to take it personally. I've said this before and I think it still rings true; I think a lot of it has to do with the harshness of all this being written in text where there's no tone or inflection. I've had knock down drag out "wars" with users on forums, then met them in person and got along with them famously. We're able to discuss our differences of opinion a lot better in person when we can hear the feeling behind the words being said.

Just thought I'd mention all of that as your post really hit home with me.

 

Great post Russ! 

I personally see both sides of the argument on this one. And although CD isn't my cup of tea, I respect it's history in relation to Axl, GNR and all that goes with it. I guess if Duff and Slash can accept playing it (for huge dollars no less) the least I can do as a fan is respect that one way or another, it's part of GNR history. 

you're 100% correct about tone and inflection, sometimes what I write seems harsh on here when read out loud but it's not my intention, it's not said with anger either, maybe it's blunt lol but I don't mean to be haha 

44 minutes ago, Towelie said:

Yeah, the whole Axl/DC thing makes me want to throw up a little bit in my mouth tbh. I have tried getting into them (before Axl joined) and watched some videos of the shows Axl did, but there music just does absolutely nothing for me. A whole album cycle and tour with AC/DC would be a colossal slap in the face to every single GNR fan and would do very little for me, based on their back catalogue.

What I just don't understand about Axl, is he seems to place AC/DC on a higher level of importance, it's strange to think that he's kept GNR going (in his mind) and fought so hard for it (his words) and now he's got the band close to where he wants it, that he would jeopardise that for a straight up rock album with a band that has very loyal fans that for the most part are indifferent to axl. Where as his own GNR fan base are screaming for an album. 

Obviously this post is going to look silly if they announce new music tomorrow, but I honestly see nothing to indicate new GNR music is on its way any time soon IF ever. 

Crazy stuff 

2 hours ago, Derick said:

Here I have more fun, buddy! Is MyGnRForum  exclusive to complainers & CIA? You tell me..

 

EDIT.: I tried be part of GNRTruth but I was bored.. That’s not what my ciberfan part is looking for...

Complain all you want, makes little difference to me. 

But you will need to accept that some people here don't accept CD as a legitimate GNR record for obvious reasons. Arguing that everyday will get tedious for you either way. 

The only reason I brought up GNR truth is because you sound EXACTLY like one of those sheep

23 minutes ago, killuridols said:

Why would anyone want to come out as a racist, homophobe and xenophobic just because?

Being like that is nothing to be proud of and voicing it to the world doesn't have anything to do with freedom of speech or a "fence".

Insulting people and hating on them ONLY based on their race, sexual interest or their ethnicity/nationality is plain dumb, in my opinion. There are assholes and bad people in all races, all countries, sexuality is not relevant when it comes to being good or bad.

I really hope that artists don't write songs like that not because they are scared of the reactions but because they are educated and have realized that denigrating others for things out of their control is bad, it is not cool to be this way

Where did I say it was cool? Or otherwise? 🤔

I also didn't say they should come out and be homophobic, racist or whatever "just because". 

I'm not really interested in turning this into an argument either as I can see where your coming from, for me though,  It's simply a 30 year old song, that the artist may or may not regret, and if he had bad experiences then he wrote about them, I can see where the offence is taken and rightly so. 

If you don't like the song, don't listen to it. 

I think it's rather obvious the reason he wrote the song, and yeah, it's got some seriously racism and homophobia in it and lyrics that are intended to offend. 

I'm hardly getting my knickers in a knot about it now, and as someone else said, the bigger issue for me wasn't what he wrote, but how he explained where he was coming from (or lack of) even though I think that's rather obvious. 

Not my favourite song either, but it is what it is. You won't see anyone putting their balls on the line writing anything anymore for fear of reaction these days which is a great shame, freedom of speech is a thing of the past regardless of what side of the fence you are on. 

I think Derrick might be a little more at home on another GNR site..

heres the link

www.gnrtruth.com 

😜

they will love you over there mate! 🤠👌

If Axl has plans locked in for an AC/DC Album in 2018, you can basically kiss whatever chance there is left of GNR releasing a new album with this line up goodbye.  

Time is definitely against him. I wouldn't say that, if he had a good history of releasing stuff but If AC/DC is the priority and they do an album then tour it, that takes any start date for GNR work out to 2020 imo. Then, with his history you couldn't see him banging an album out in 12 months?? 

As far as I'm concerned, with axl's age, work history, and other factors , it's pretty much now or never as far as an album is concerned. 

For the record, if axl does do an album with Angus, I won't be buying it! AC/DC just doesn't interest me with or without axl. 

Is this a real question? 😜

6 hours ago, thunderram said:

 

 Not to pick on you specifically, cause I've seen many others say something similar and also reference 'filler' tracks. But I just don't get how more material is ever a bad thing. Makes zero sense to me. Whatever tunes you don't care for, you simply don't listen to. It's that easy.  

But chances are, the tunes some don't like or don't get just might resonate with other fans. I think there's overwhelming proof of that in that each song on the album has detractors and also those that love them. 

When the album first came out, I probably only consistently listened to 4-5 off each album. Then a few more resonated with me over the next couple years. After a while longer, I began to explore tracks I had previous ignored because they didn't excite me like the others did. However some of those eventually became my favorites, such as Perfect Crime, Breakdown, Locomotive, Garden of Eden, and Coma.

In the end, I grew to like every song on the albums except for My World and Back Off Bitch. And I'm quite glad they released them all and they became part of their catalogue. I still wish they would have released true studio versions of Shadow of your Love, Ain't Goin' Down, Jumpin' Jack Flash, Heartbreak Hotel, Crash Diet and some of the other lost illusions. 

More songs to listen to is never a bad thing. Whatever you don't like you just ignore. But I tend to discover that songs I didn't care for originally grow on me over time, usually because my tastes and life experiences change. 

Totally agree on the point about discovering other songs in the catalogue that aren't the well known ones growing on you. 

I also agree on more material the better especially in regards to guns because they have a small catalogue. 

My comments in regards to my world and alt version of don't cry were merely to state that I really don't think they are necessary and from a personal taste pov I don't like them on the albums. That's not to say that everyone feels this way, it's just my personal opinion, that I would have liked to have seen them left off or put somewhere else down the line, overall I'm not one to knock either album overall because I literally listen to them both in my car every day, but when my world comes on, I am literally like "wtf were you think axl" lol 

just a personal opinion mate 👍😜

Reading quotes from Mike Patton over the years gives me headaches. 

In fact that goes for the whole band   FNM. 

They have always come across as butthurt cry babies who were happy to use the GNR vehicle for their own purposes and yet everytime someone stuck a tape recorder in their face they'd whinge. I find that highly hypocritical and I see through the whole trying to be cool thing by knocking a lead singer who did more for you than you've done for them so like Patton should probably just be greatful, their music was fucking tedious for the most part and has been long forgotten compared to GNR. 

Right- moving on to the next point 😜

I think trying to apply a little sensibility into how the media viewed them around 93-94 you could lap up all the shitty extreme views that were aired or you could look at it for what it is then and even now, I think regardless of whether the media is writing that band x is the greatest thing since the Beatles or getting slagged off, the truth is always somewhere in between. 

I distinctly remember that period and whilst there was cool be bands hitting the airwaves like STP, and Live, Tool ect that were getting lots more attention, I think it's fair to say that guns were not actually hated or forgotten, but more on ice, people still listened to it, but within that age group (and even now) kids think being cool is staying on the edge of what's new is great, even if it isn't so. I look at new music today and kids are like, this is so fucking awesome and I'm trying to identify with it and yes my age might make that difficult (38) but even back then I couldn't get my head around a the trends that my age thought were good just because it was new. (If that makes sense). 

People go on and about axl and the trilogy of videos being such a negative at the time, but in a way, I look at those videos now and think that they really did cement GNRs place in music TV history, and without them, they'd perhaps be just another band lost in time. 

The renaisance they are enjoying now, wouldn't be possible without those videos, the images of slash, axl the golden years wouldn't be in the memory, so they were helpful in the long run. 

The major problem always goes back to this. 

The lead singer was a megalomaniac, the rest of the band were alcoholic junkies and the thing fell apart, that's on all of them! There's a million reasons why that shit went to well... shit! 

Not sure I agree with everything he says but that's how the world works. 

He makes obvious points, like alt version don't cry, my world ect weren't really needed. I'd have preferred to have a track of slash just jamming the god father at the end of UY2 than my world but that's just me? 

I think he's barking up the wrong tree with LALD, and KOHD though, I have no issue with either over being on the records and they were separated anyway so I've no issue with them. 

I like the fact that the records have so much material and it seems mish mashed, it keeps me listening to them. 

Obviously if you wanted to be not picky, you could pull the best of 1 & 2 apart and have a record that could justifiably be in the conversation as a match for AFD, but what's the point? 

May the find I was wrapped we got a double album and I wouldn't change too much, especially seeing we haven't exactly been bombarded with new material so I'm happy with everything we have on these albums. 

I want to believe, I really do. But being honest, there's just as many reasons that nothing new will ever see the light of day as there is of us hearing even one brand new song. 

This conversation has been revolving forever under all sorts of circumstances for years, admittedly some of the factors in the argument look more promising than ever before, but I keep coming back to one factor, and for me personally it tilts the chances of new music to the negative. 

Axls age! He's 55, and not a young 55 in terms of his physical appearance and regardless of how much I love the dude, love the music, loved the gig I went too on this tour, his voice has deteriorated! With his history of time keeping and work output, I just can't see it happening. 

Before I get shot down, I do believe he could do it, and deliver  an album worthy of guns, but to get in and get it done in timely fashion? I have massive reservations about that! 

Would love to be proven wrong but I honestly believe time has beaten all of them on this finally. I just don't see it happening when they can continue doing this or variations of it till they retire. 

57 minutes ago, RONIN said:

@Modano09, we mostly agree on Adler but you're not able to be objective about the guy mate. He's got his faults and they are many, but your take on events is pretty one-sided. There was a lot more going on to effect his ouster if you look at the situation with an unbiased lens.

In light of some of the recent posts from Blackstar and others, my take is simply this:

*The guy was too deep into drugs to clean up for the new records. Even if they had waited another year it's anyone's guess whether Steven would have cleaned up in time. It seems to me, he was too far gone.

*Steven was too immature to see the gravity of the situation towards the end when most people in his place would have gotten their shit together. He just didn't take the gig seriously enough and this is something he continues to not take responsibility for. Even his NITL interviews continue the "woe is me" schtick. He put the band in a bad situation and it was unfair to them and he paid a heavy price. 

*He couldn't play the material. An even more significant part of the story than simply drugs. Adler could not adapt to the new direction of the band and Axl's vision. Axl's vision would eventually alienate Slash later on when he drifted towards other styles of music in the mid 90's. But it starts here with writing material that Steven could not adapt to. I'm not a drummer so I have no idea whether Illusion material is beyond Adler's abilities (he sounds great on YCBM) but his playing ability is questioned by Niven and Slash. Niven's tight with Duff, Izzy, and Slash - so it's hard to say whether he's being objective or covering for Sluff.

*The lawsuit situation has me leaning towards the band's side even though I want to give Steven the benefit of the doubt given the scumbaggery of the others. 

All that being said, I don't think Steven would have gotten kicked out of the band if..and this is a big if....he was on better terms with the others. I think there would have been more effort to work it out with him - the guy was just unceremoniously tossed out. We don't even know if they even considered having him sit out Illusions and returning for a future album or maybe sharing drum duties with Sorum on the tour. Seems like none of that was on the table given past interviews. He was literally erased from the band. And the lawsuit just sealed the deal as far as ending that relationship completely. It does seem weird for a band of brothers to toss one of their own out in the cold without even a chance for reinstatement.  

Axl delayed Illusions for several years and this is confirmed plenty of times by Izzy who had submitted some of his tapes two years in advance. The same Izzy who said Axl screamed at him and told him "There is no schedule!" when he asked about the recording delays for UYI. Axl also missed most of the Chicago sessions and only showed up right at the end. Let's not pretend Steven, as messed up as he was, delayed the album anywhere near as much as Axl. The truth is, the band was working on Axl's schedule and when Axl was ready to go, Steven wasn't and so the axe fell on Steven's neck. Simple as that. History would repeat itself when Duff would quit in '97 over the same reason - Axl not showing up and constant delays with the new record because of Axl being unwilling to stick to a schedule. If we're going to point out Steven's bad behavior, then it's only fair we do the same with Axl. 

Steven's problem was that he was completely alienated from the band by '89 and 90. He's said in interviews before how Duff and Slash stopped hanging out with him or would ditch him at parties towards the last few years of his time in GNR. There's actually a great article about the Chicago sessions that I posted last year which mentions how Duff/Slash would ditch Steven at the local chicago bars to party together. And then there's Axl - a person who did not get along with Steven from the start. Someone who had a very real dislike for him by the end due to the Erin Everly speedball incident. 

I don't think the guy had friends in the band towards the end (weren't they all ignoring him those last few months?) and I don't think any of them fought hard enough to keep him - I think they basically gave up and washed their hands after a certain point as Duff basically admits. The only guy who may have stuck up for him (Izzy) was deep in detox and barely around. So couple the bad behavior of Steven with the general apathy of the rest of the band and it's no surprise to me how things ended up. 

But can anyone imagine the same scenario with Slash and Axl's bestie Duff being a wasted mess who can barely play getting kicked out the way Steven was? Perhaps it might have happened the same way but it does make you wonder. I don't think Duff would have been treated this way but that's just conjecture on my part...

As I said in a previous post, when it comes to Steven....things just don't add up with the version of events we're given by the band. I don't doubt that Steven was a mess and that it was perhaps bad enough to get fired. I'm just skeptical of the band politics that led to his ouster.

Ronin, I think you nailed the theory behind how this actually went down.

Joining the dots, i dont think theres a great "mystery" to steven's sacking. There is countless quotes out there stating that Axl found Steven irritating because he has no filter. Put the clash of personalities together with a major drug addiction, a lot of water under the bridge, the erin incident, and finally steven being unable to record, its not a major mystery that the band moved on without him, regardless of them looking like major hypocrites which Duff and Slash have both acknowledged in their books.

I think you make a key point and a lot of people may have missed this... Axl kept the band waiting on his time longer than anyone else in the band. That cannot be questioned. But.. and this is the big point... Axl had more control of the band than steven. When Axl was ready to go... Steven wasnt.. and that was the problem. Im not saying it makes Axl right, or more right than steven... but Axl had the power then, as he does now.. and steven (in Axl's eyes) was expendable and the show had to go on.

Interesting thought re: would duff or slash have been cast aside if they were at the same point as Adler? Well... in a way.. we got that anyway.. just a fair few years later.. Axl was taking GNR in HIS direction... regardless of what the others wanted, it was a simple case of, youre either on the bus.. or your off... in the end, as we know slash and then duff got off.. and sorum got fired.

as for this argument between daisey and soul, i think Diesel makes some very relevant points regarding Axl's behaviour, and Adlers influence on appetite is not in question, he IS the sound of that album, BUT.... If anyone is seen as expendable in a band, it certainly isnt the lead singer or lead guitarist, and certainly not such iconic figures as Axl or Slash. Steven was never going to win that battle with Axl regardless of how good his chops were on AFD. In fact.... id even go as far to say that if adler didnt have a drug issue AT ALL...and wanted adler out.. hed have eventually got his way anyway.. one way or the other. For what its worth.. there is a distinct difference in the sound of the drumming on AFD from UYI even to a very untrained person like me, steven and sorum are polar opposites in style and sound... both have excellent skill sets, i do think steven IS GNR.. but Matt was a very capable replacement and like Gilby, those 2 are pretty much the only members outside of the AFD 5 that i consider remotely "GNR" worthy.... (thats another argument for another day)...

In regards to this tour and the mystery of things not stacking up, my theory is this... Axl, slash and duff probably debated till the cows came home whether to include steven as the number 1 drummer and for the sake of live nation and the advantages of selling this as best they can (more so to hardcore fans) that steven was IN. But.... i reckon they had massive reservations about it (obvious reasons), then steven hurt his back and it solved their reservations for them. I dont think theres much more too it, i just think they said yes with massive reservations and then when he hurt himself, it was.. well that problem fixed itself... 

thats about all i have to add at this point.

Oh fuck, here we go again, the band acting like a bunch of fuckin pussies. 

oh better not say anything, might upset axl! Better not say anything.. Might upset slash! Fuck me...

heres how it works in the real world, people from time to time say things, in any group of blokes, whether it be a basketball team, a football team, or just a regular bunch of mates at a local pub, things get said and there's a blow up and it's fixed either right there or within a day or 2! It's called being a man and not a fuckin pussy. 

Somehow we (as a fan base) have come to justify these blokes acting like fucking bitches like its normal behaviour! Oh but they are rock stars I hear you say! Who gives a fuck! Be a man (duff wrote a book on it apparently) 

Just do some fucking interviews for your fan base that's made you multi bazillionaires you jackasses and don't worry so much whether someone says something you don't like! It's called being a man! FFS 😉

I went to a show in 2013 in my hometown of Newcastle (Australia) and there was 12 thousand people there. (Those numbers could be inflated). 

i enjoyed the show for what it was. It was my first time seeing Axl so I was buzzing. But I wasn't deluded enough to think that line up was GNR! I have been to a show on this tour, and it super seeded that 2013 show many times over thanks to slash and duff. 

The only thing that would top the reunion show for me now would be AFD 5 doing something (won't happen). 

Back on topic though, if the band from 2014 continued on, they would have been playing clubs, not arenas. Even casual fans i know were asking me, when is slash coming back? And id answer, don't hold your breath! Their reply, I'm not that into it! 

That line up was done! Axl had one play left, and releasing CD2 wasn't it! Neither was releasing anything under the GNR name that didn't have at least slash on it! I'm not even sure guns n aliens is the right move at this point! Frank is bang average! Fortus is competent! And as for the Emo??? WTF... I'm still shaking my head she's still in the band but whatevs 

all I know is, if 2014 band was still in operation, Axl's career and guns would be on life support. He should be thanking slash for being back on top of the world and his reputation being restored as good as it is! 

I think it would very short sighted to suggest AFD 5 wouldn't have been bigger & better on every level. 

The marketing opportunities and media opportunities would have been multiplied a million times over (if Axl gave a damn about it) and if professionals were running the show in that regard. 

This tour is top 10 all time but that doesn't mean AFD 5 couldn't have topped it. This tour has been wildly successful, and I enjoyed the show I went too. But they missed a major opportunity in the eyes of a lot of fans. Not that they care, their bank balances have a lot more zeroes than they did 18 months ago. 

So there we have it! Nothing to see here people! Move along now! 😉👌

You all realise we will be severely let down this time tomorrow 😉

Axl at sound check is surprising I must say! He wouldn't be there just because he had nothing else to do, so something different is coming. 

What level of different? Who knows. 

he could be dusting off sonething from CD? 60% chance

something from illusions? 35% chance 

Slither? 3% chance 

A new song altogether? 2% chance! 

Personally I would love a new song, but I don't see it happening, I reckon it's a CD cut

5 hours ago, Modano09 said:

If Axl were honest in that interview, his answer would be something like "Steven's unreliable and can be obnoxious if you have to see him every day, so we felt it was best to limit him to guest appearances and Izzy wanted to make equal money to us despite being bought out and washing his hands of the band's business 25 years ago, which he didn't think was fair." 

 

And my respect for that answer would be so high. 

We, as fans might argue over the answers merits, but at least we'd get Axl's real answer.

12 minutes ago, ludurigan said:

exactly

about the brazilian interview, it looks like there are 2 most-likely possibilities for axl's answer about izzy

1 - he knew everything that was going on and LIED

2 - he had no idea of what is/was going on around him -- he became a sort of ozzy-like person/zombie -- and has been LIED TO

i dont see any other possibility

 

Honestly, if you watch the vid back, you see Duff and Axl constantly looking at each other, in a way that lends me to think they were both figuring out what the correct response should be! Duff is uncomfortable to watch regarding that izzy issue almost like he's too unsure what to say in case it's not to Axl's liking. 

Thats just my interpretation and it may be wrong. I dunno. 

I can't remember the timeline of events, but was Izzys tweet about the loot AFTER this interview? I'm sure it was???

i would love to hear Axl answer the questions on izzy regarding the "loot" issue 😉

as I said before on Adler, Izz, and re integrating them, there was NOTHING stopping the other 3 saying, hey, let's do a 5 or 6 gun run around the 30th anniversary for just the five of us! Play AFD cover to cover, 7 or 8 of the illusions and let izzy and Adler make a mil a show too! Pick one City, do a residency for 2 weeks, believe me, they'd have sold it out 5 times for the AFD line up, the other 2 make bank and can get a share of it! 

There is a million of those types of ideas that would have been feasible. 

I'm not going to pretend I know the exact reasons for Adlers inclusion then expulsion for what they agreed on this tour. 

But I'll say this, there is question marks on Axl, Slash & Duff at the very minimum, regarding the Izzy and Adler situations. 

Axl and Duff looked very strange in the Brazilian interview when it came to the Izzy issue, almost like it was a badly rehearsed response. And there in lies the problem with the fans again. The lack of information, and what little info we do get isn't straight forward or answered properly. 

For what it's worth, I don't think we will see Adler or Izz back, these guys have been getting 3 mil a show between them, and how many shows have they done since getting back together? That's a lot of loot! You can't tell me that they couldn't have included these guys and integrated them to make everyone happy if they wanted too? 

It looks from the outside that this was purely a business decision, and coin ruled over everything else. That's fine, I get it, but it does leave you open up interpretation that you're an asshole. 

One last point, everyone keeps going on about how Adler said this, and said that, who fucking cares? They are grown men, not 12 year pre-pubescent girls, (that's how they act) and how axl has acted for the last 20 years. All this shit could have been avoided if ALL of them just acted like fucking adults and not spoilt little bitches. 

Not really sure that you can compare them fairly. The music, the styles, them as people, they were completely different in every aspect. 

Both of them were fantastic in their prime however and it comes down to what you prefer. 

In a funny way they will be linked forever though, I honestly think Axl's rendition of KOHD at the Freddie tribute concert was Axl at his absolute rockstar best. I love watching that clip, the whole band was at the top of the tree and Axl as a front man, show man, rock star, he had it man! I would literally give my left nut to have been Axl at that moment! That Wembley crowd, he had them in the palm of his hand. 

I would honestly prefer not to choose who was better because it doesn't prove anything. I will say this, in my life time, there are certain performers who are a level above. Axl quite rightly belongs in that group along with the other obvious names. 

Anything different in the set list?