Nice Boy

13 hours ago, EvanG said:

Cobain didn't write about society really, he wrote mainly about himself.

yeah exactly, but a lot of the fans took it as spokesman for a generation etc

thanks for these vids man, they're excellently researched.

One thing I want to reiterate is the value of 'Civil War' in terms of what it showed GnR to be capable of. Basically when grunge and Nirvana were in ascendency, a lot of their fans would say "yeah GnR don't have integrity, they just write misogynistic crap about 'bitches' or do soppy overblown ballads. Nirvana, well there's a band who write clever, nuanced lyrics that talk about the state of society, and young people relate to Kurt's intelligence, blah bla bla"

GnR had no integrity? Really? So could Nirvana have produced a song like 'Civil War', which was a more incisive commentary on warfare, militarism and politics (with a small p) than Nirvana could ever have hoped to write, amongst their deluge of bedroom teenage angst songs? Hardly profound material. (And I do say that as a Nirvana fan; I just hated the sanctimonious grunge crew who claimed GnR had 'nothing to say' whereas Kurt was some enlightened genius philosopher. Bollox. Civil War alone proves what GnR were capable of when it comes to serious social commentary.)   

On 8/12/2017 at 8:14 PM, EvanG said:

I like more surrealistic and poetic lyrics, and that's hard to find in any GnR song

 

Umm really?? Have you listened to e.g. Coma, or The Garden?

I think what some people forget is that AFD only showed a certain side of them, and actually their musical influences were/are far more diverse. So songs like Bad Apples simply demonstrate their interest in blusey, funky Rolling Stones type jams.

Well, here's my basic appraisal of the whole lot of UYI songs:

Right Next Door To Hell  - A fairly good straight up aggressive hard rock song. 

Dust N' Bones - Typical Izzy style, less rock/punk, more blues.

Live And Let Die - Pointless shit cover. Axl thought it was "the next WTTJ"???!!!

Don't Cry - Decent emotional powerful song.

Perfect Crime - A fairly good straight up aggressive hard rock song.

You Ain't The First - Just a throwaway acoustic jam, has its place though I guess.

Bad Obsession - GnR showing the Rolling Stones influence.

Back Off Bitch - Good guitar work, lyrics are a bit much. 

Double Talkin' Jive - Awesome live - Slash shines; but this studio version is a bit sterile.

November Rain - Axl doing his epic Elton John thang. Not for me really, always skip.

The Garden - Very underrated psychadellic deep cut. Great song.

Garden Of Eden - Nice guitar instrumental, GnR doing "punk" but lyrics too rushed.

Don't Damn Me - Again, Nice guitar instrumental but lyrics a bit 'angry teenager'

Bad Apples - GnR showing the Rolling Stones influence.

Dead Horse - Good hard rocker with Southern influence.

Coma - Absolutely fucking amazing epic masterpiece.

Civil War - Great song with very thoughtful lyrics. GnR had no 'integrity'? Listen to this!

14 Years - Izzy doing his Izzy thing, not heavy rock but bluesy style

Yesterdays - The Southern Rock influence.

Knockin' On Heaven's Door - A bit long but defo has its place. Preferred 80s live style.

Get In The Ring - GnR do what they imagine punk to be but go well over the top.

Shotgun Blues - Another throwaway 'punk' song, comes across as juvenile.

Breakdown - The Southern Rock influence.

Pretty Tied Up - Pretty good balance of Rolling Stones and hard rock influence.

Locomotive - Amazing work from Slash and Axl. A grooving hard rocker and amazing end.

So Fine - Uh.... In the words of Izzy, "No."

Estranged - Axl epic, well better than NR and awesome Slash work too.

You Could Be Mine - Killer riff, good meaty drum track, lyrics a bit dark and spiteful. 

Don't Cry - was another version necessary?

My World - The real hidden underrated gem of the album.

(Only joking, it's a total embarrasment.) 

I first came across AFD on cassette in the UK in 89/90, my older brother had a copy. It was issued by a company called 'Thompson Original', who at the time were publishing what seemed to be unauthorised / unlicensed copies of popular albums (I saw a New Kids on the Block one too.)

The artwork was totally different, so neither the cross or Robert Williams painting. It was just a glam-era picture of the band with the name superimposed. I always wondered how this 'Thompson Original' company got away with it and where they were actually sold.

Another curiosity for me was how GnR managed to be so big in 89 that they even had a big presence in rural areas of the UK like where I lived, considering they hadn't really done that many shows in this country. Their merchandise was everywhere, and I latched onto them despite being only 9 years old, living in rural UK far from a city or any rock scene, never having seen them in a video etc.. I guess the music just really was that good. - To be fair I reckon Alan Niven must have done an especially good job of promoting them here as he knew how the press worked here, being a former native Brit.  

really like Wish you were here, get it in my head all the time..

Which song/s do you think gives the band members that 'not this again' feeling?

(inb4 all of them, lol.)

We all know that Slash used to hate playing SCOM in the old days, but I think he has come around to it now. At a guess I'd say he is least unenthusiastic about maybe the title track off CD, and some of the others from the same album. On the other hand Axl has said in the Kimmel interview he likes doing the new stuff the most.. and I reckon he hates doing SCOM now, given that a.) he's done it a million times b.) it's fairly demanding c.) Who really wants to sing a love song you wrote about a sweetheart you separated from almost 30 years ago?

I guess that's an occupational hazard.

I reckon they still like doing PC, certainly Slash buzzes off it and Axl probably likes it because it means the show is over, ha.

What are your thoughts ? 

26 minutes ago, cooker said:

I find he's a bit more snake like when he's on a smaller stage. 

Good point. The smaller stages meant he was obliged to move energetically in a confined space, but on the huge UYI stage he was more running about etc

I think his interest in hip-hop style influenced the post-1990 attire: leathers out, baseball hats and simple t-shirt in. Also I think he had a kilt a while before it emerged on stage, can't remember where i read that..

p.s. where's the yellow rain coat poll option? lol 

Incidentally, there's an interesting theory that Axl picked the dance up from... Davy Jones of the Monkees!

yeah it's a bit more slow shuffley these days though, nothing like the proper thing in the leather trouser era of peak snake

Just a light hearted thread while we wait for some actual news.

A couple of questions for you.

1.) What is the ultimate, best snake-dance clip from all the LIVE footage we have of GnR era 85-93? - Personally I think we reached 'peak snake' around 87-89, when Axl was wearing those tight leather trousers all the time, lol. In the biker shorts UYI era he seemed to tone down the snaking a bit, maybe he became self conscious that it had become a trademark/gimmick? - Anyway there are lots of great snakey clips to choose from, I would put his guest spot with Jagger and the Stones 89 up there, the VMAs and Ritz 88 of course, but at the moment this little gem is my favourite... what's yours?

https://youtu.be/hkmiXmM4I1s?t=218

2.) Is the snake alive and well on the current NITL tour? I've seen him do a few shuffled side-to-sides, but can you post any proper good examples from 2016-2017, or the best we've had?

Peace and snakes for all x

On 3/10/2017 at 5:53 AM, Riad99 said:

 If you look up RIR 91 you get a good idea of what the song would sound like with just Izzy on vocals when Axl's mic goes out and he carrys the song for a bit. 

Yes! I have always thought this too.. you can definitely imagine how the song would have started as an Izzy penned basic structure here, with him on vocals and less heavy / distorted guitar.. it's interesting..

This video is awesome - reminds me of my reaction when I first pressed play on my older brother's cassette player... WOW, WHAT IS THIS?!  

And so began the education - hearing these heavy, punchy, yet melodic guitar driven tales of sleaze, drugs, and urban decay really opened my eyes and ears - we grew up with this as the background soundtrack to our lives - how did you react?  

Ok so I found this Axl quote, apparently from an 'unapproved CD booklet': -

"Riad is the name my one time momentary brother-in-law of Erin Everly went by when I knew him. Of part Lebanese descent and a former student of Pepperdine University he claims to be an international arms dealer, billionaire with ambitions of being “King of the World”. He claims to fund several medical organizations and underground Nazi organizations around the world who says his heroes are Napoleon and Adolph Hitler. He claims his most prized asset is his anonymity. He also claims to be an expert in military strategy and was the inspiration for the Guns song Civil War which was written per his request for a song how “people were stupid and he could and he could sell them anything because people love to kill each other.” He also claims to be an expert in global finance and money laundering living tax free in Belair last I was aware and claiming to launder monies for wealthy individuals in several countries predominantly Saudi Arabia and the Middle East, with ties to the Bush/Reagan administrations and wherever there’s a war in the world at any given moment." 

Ok thanks, so I didn't imagine it ha. - Does anyone know any specifics such as who the relative was and what his dealings involved? 

I have previously read somewhere on this forum that part of the inspiration for 'Civil War' was derived from an interaction between Axl and a friend or relative of Erin Everly (I seem to recall) who was involved in the arms trade which was fuelling a war somewhere in the world at the time. Can anyone shed any light on this please? Sounds very interesting.

I am all for her inclusion in the band. GnR have a long history of women on stage anyway, musicians or otherwise (for example think of the Illusions era backing singers Tracy and Roberta, plus the horns section Lisa Anne etc, or even the strippers that were all over the stage back in the Sunset Strip days!)

Granted she is not a 'core' member by any means but she certainly provides important functions. Actually my theory is that one reason Axl is keen for her inclusion is that her harmonies on the opening of Paradise City serve to mask the fact that at that point in the concert his tired voice is severely at risk of sounding totally shit on the iconic intro choruses of what is one of the most focused on songs, likely to be televised etc.. seriously, listen to how it sounds on this tour with her supporting him and then imagine how it would be without her - much weaker. Hence her inclusion is vital for this reason alone. Happy Birthday Melissa! 

Funny you should mention this, because I was thinking today about a percussion sound on "Anything Goes" that I've always wondered about - during the opening riff you can hear a sort of scraping sound, which I am guessing is a 'Guiro'?

It's a great addition I think, gives the song's intro that extra slidey scrapey sleazy sound!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Güiro

As per the title, what's the quickest way to do this please?

Was just listening to this and thought of this thread.. here's It's So Easy with Duff on vocals from an 88 show.

On 10/1/2016 at 9:59 PM, Fitha_whiskey said:

 

Probably the fastest paced song they ever did. 

No way is it the fastest song they ever did. 

It clocks in at about 212 bpm; compare that to some of the speedy punk stuff they were doing in mid 80s: the rare version of Nice Boys on the Family Tree album is almost 260 bpm. Shadow of Your Love is even faster, about 265 bpm.

Say what you will about Adler, he could drum fuckin fast. 

I was just listening to this performance of Rocket Queen in Houston. There's a bit during the extended solo section where Slash does the classic dreamy sex bit from the album (with a delay effect or something) and to my ears it sounds like the band almost loses it for a few seconds. It definitely sounds off - Frank seems to hit his snare really lightly and then not at all for a few beats, just keeping the kick going, and Slash appears to hit a note on an offbeat and for a dangerous moment it's like the whole thing is about to fall apart. BUT - within seconds they find the groove again and go into the final refrain of the song.

For the record I'm not 'having a go' at any of them here of course, I'm not bothered if there is the odd sloppy moment, it's Rock n Roll. I'm just interested from a musicianship point of view what you think of happens during the section I'm talking about. If the notes of the Slash solo on the album are imprinted on your brain as they are on mine you'll know what I'm on about - listen carefully from 6.10 mins in the video below, tap your foot to where the steady kick drum should be and then listen to the guitar solo - does it seem to drift off course?

Let us know your thoughts...

yeah

Riff Raff is my fave