Nevermind or Appetite

[Vincent Vega]

Axl wanted Guns to do MTV unplugged in the mid 90s. Slash put the kibosh to that idea.

[SunnyDRE]

Axl wanted Guns to do MTV unplugged in the mid 90s. Slash put the kibosh to that idea.

what's stopping him now?

[dalsh327]

Axl wanted Guns to do MTV unplugged in the mid 90s. Slash put the kibosh to that idea.

what's stopping him now?

I think MTV has lost interest in Axl. Maybe back in '02, but it wouldn't be a big draw now. There's just no interest in this band in the U.S.

It wouldn't be on MTV, it would be on VH1, VH1 Classic, or Fuse, but it would be cool if they did a one to two hour "soundstage" type show.

There's still an interest in GNR everywhere. If GNR has to cancel a tour due to lack of sales, then I'll agree there's no interest.

[Guest Sleeping Like An Angel]

Axl wanted Guns to do MTV unplugged in the mid 90s. Slash put the kibosh to that idea.

Didn't know that. How awesome would that have been? Shame.

[Vincent Vega]

Axl wanted Guns to do MTV unplugged in the mid 90s. Slash put the kibosh to that idea.

Didn't know that. How awesome would that have been? Shame.

"....I had the first multitrack studio I've ever had, so I was like a kid in a candy store, and I started playing and recorded all this stuff. At the same time, with Axl that whole trip that we'd just taken had really become a part of him, to the point where Axl is as much a rock star in his own mind as he is in the public eye. I didn't really understand all that.

"So when I started writing material that was more or less back to roots Guns N' Roses... I didn't really have the chance to do that with "Use Your Illusion", because with that we were going through so much of a mish-mash of all kinds personal changes and this, that and the other. The fact that we completed those albums is unbelievable. You might be able to go to a store and buy it and listen to it, but you'll never be able to understand the emotional turmoil that was going on from adjusting from being some piece-of-shit club band to all of a sudden being like, quote, "The biggest band in the world" and having that attention thrown at you, and having the pressures that go along with it and all this ridiculous stuff.

"Anyway, we accomplished that and then we took off on this world-wide fucking mega-rock star thing. So then we come home, and I'm writing material that's just the same as the kind of material I used to write in the old days, and Axl's whole trip was...

"Everybody used to go, "What's gonna happen when Guns is no longer.. when a new fad comes along?" or whatever. And I'd be, "I don't give a fuck". And I watched it happen, and it didn't matter to me. With Axl it mattered a hell of a lot. Next thing you know, he wants to be Pearl Jam, right? Why? I hate Pearl Jam anyway, so what's the point? And it's great to watch Pearl Jam going through what they're going through, cos I'm going, "See Axl?"

"We do what we do the best that anybody does. Let's just go out and do a club tour, a theatre tour, and fucking get back down to where we have some validity with an audience that we can relate to. But Axl was all fucking.. he wants to be on MTV, he wants to do Unplugged, he wants to be this, he wants to be that. So we didn't see eye to eye, and that's where a lot of that bullshit got started, and of course it was blown out of all proportion in the press.

"I played him the material that I was writing, and he was like, "I don't wanna do that kind of music." The stuff that he was into, I couldn't understand. So I took the material back - I was cool - and at the same time I started jamming with Matt (Sorum) at home. And Gilby was still my mate - I didn't have anything to do with him being fired from Guns - and we met up with Mike Inez, and all of a sudden I realised we had a band. I'm making a short story long here! And Eric (Dover) had this really innocent, natural, very "retro" kind of voice. And I was like "Cool!" y'know - play my ass off, the band's great, Eric sings the way he sings and so on - and we did an album in a short amount of time. And then I booked a tour, and at this point Axl turned around and wanted the material back. And that's where the big shit started, because I told him, "Dude, it's gone. If I remember correctly, it was turned down flat." And that's where we got threats of lawsuits and this, that and the other." --- Slash, November 1995.

Edited November 11, 2010 by Indigo Child

[Guest Sleeping Like An Angel]

. But Axl was all fucking.. he wants to be on MTV, he wants to do Unplugged, he wants to be this, he wants to be that. So we didn't see eye to eye, and that's where a lot of that bullshit got started, and of course it was blown out of all proportion in the press.

Wasn't it amazing how confident Axl was back then and how he was always striving to become bigger and better. It didn't come across to me as a fame or money thing but just trying to become muscially, the best he could be. I love that about him.

Do you think that his confidence is an issue now? I think it is. I read in another topic about how the record company came in and sort of bashed his ideas for Chinese Democracy and changed the direction. Stuff like Oh My God getting replaced with lighter stuff.

Thanks for posting that btw nice read.

[Vincent Vega]

. But Axl was all fucking.. he wants to be on MTV, he wants to do Unplugged, he wants to be this, he wants to be that. So we didn't see eye to eye, and that's where a lot of that bullshit got started, and of course it was blown out of all proportion in the press.

Wasn't it amazing how confident Axl was back then and how he was always striving to become bigger and better. It didn't come across to me as a fame or money thing but just trying to become muscially, the best he could be. I love that about him.

Do you think that his confidence is an issue now? I think it is. I read in another topic about how the record company came in and sort of bashed his ideas for Chinese Democracy and changed the direction. Stuff like Oh My God getting replaced with lighter stuff.

Thanks for posting that btw nice read.

Moby worked with Axl in early 1997 and said Axl acted like a "beaten dog"--that Axl was very cautious and reserved. Not really enthusiastic or energetic about stuff.

And when Zakk worked with Axl & Guns in early '95, Axl hadn't at that point written any lyrics and Zakk basically asked him why, and Axl said to the effect that he had (Stephanie's and Erin's) lawyers up his ass and if he wrote any songs they'd all be about his legal battles. According to Zakk, these legal troubles were really consuming all of Axl's mind and time--He apparently would be on the phone with Zakk discussing all sorts of complex legal strategies he was going to try, to the point that Zakk felt like Axl was playing "Axis & Allies."

Plus around the same time--in 1995--That stalker woman Karen entered his house, probably scaring Axl, and he was yet again in court getting a restraining order. She came to his house AGAIN in 1997, resulting in yet another restraining order.

At around this time--1995 to 1997--You had his relationship with Slash disintegrating, the band falling to the wayside of popularity in favor of grunge, his mother dying, his friend West Arkeen dying, Duff leaving the band, and battling Erin and Stephanie, two of his biggest loves, in a bitter court battle.

Edited November 11, 2010 by Indigo Child

[Guest Sleeping Like An Angel]

. But Axl was all fucking.. he wants to be on MTV, he wants to do Unplugged, he wants to be this, he wants to be that. So we didn't see eye to eye, and that's where a lot of that bullshit got started, and of course it was blown out of all proportion in the press.

Wasn't it amazing how confident Axl was back then and how he was always striving to become bigger and better. It didn't come across to me as a fame or money thing but just trying to become muscially, the best he could be. I love that about him.

Do you think that his confidence is an issue now? I think it is. I read in another topic about how the record company came in and sort of bashed his ideas for Chinese Democracy and changed the direction. Stuff like Oh My God getting replaced with lighter stuff.

Thanks for posting that btw nice read.

Moby worked with Axl in early 1997 and said Axl acted like a "beaten dog"--that Axl was very cautious and reserved. Not really enthusiastic or energetic about stuff.

And when Zakk worked with Axl & Guns in early '95, Axl hadn't at that point written any lyrics and Zakk basically asked him why, and Axl said to the effect that he had (Stephanie's and Erin's) lawyers up his ass and if he wrote any songs they'd all be about his legal battles.

Its sad because people (media etc) see Axl as this giant cocky a'hole but in reality he is this sensitive guy who worries about what people think. Even down to his appearance. Didn't he say in the 1990s he didn't even feel comfortable with his picture being taken? I know the 'gay card' was used in relation to the no photo policy at concerts but I think it might have been down to self esteem especially in relation to his looks. Just because he wore 'out there' stuff doesn't mean he was confident in how he looked. I'm going way off point but what I'm trying to say is Axl appears to be a very naive, sensitive and vulnerable guy and it translates into different aspects of his life. Hey we're all human even Axl. I think if he potential was pushed and he had 110% confidence throughout his music career he could have produced some wicked stuff. I truly believe he is a musical genius. Hes an intelligent guy away from music too in my opinion.

To hear him referred to as a beaten dog is terrible.

Was Karen the 'star' of those weird videos on youtube with millions of photos of her photoshopped with Axl?

Edited November 11, 2010 by Sleeping Like An Angel

[Vincent Vega]

. But Axl was all fucking.. he wants to be on MTV, he wants to do Unplugged, he wants to be this, he wants to be that. So we didn't see eye to eye, and that's where a lot of that bullshit got started, and of course it was blown out of all proportion in the press.

Wasn't it amazing how confident Axl was back then and how he was always striving to become bigger and better. It didn't come across to me as a fame or money thing but just trying to become muscially, the best he could be. I love that about him.

Do you think that his confidence is an issue now? I think it is. I read in another topic about how the record company came in and sort of bashed his ideas for Chinese Democracy and changed the direction. Stuff like Oh My God getting replaced with lighter stuff.

Thanks for posting that btw nice read.

Moby worked with Axl in early 1997 and said Axl acted like a "beaten dog"--that Axl was very cautious and reserved. Not really enthusiastic or energetic about stuff.

And when Zakk worked with Axl & Guns in early '95, Axl hadn't at that point written any lyrics and Zakk basically asked him why, and Axl said to the effect that he had (Stephanie's and Erin's) lawyers up his ass and if he wrote any songs they'd all be about his legal battles.

Its sad because people (media etc) see Axl as this giant cocky a'hole but in reality he is this sensitive guy who worries about what people think. Even down to his appearance. Didn't he say in the 1990s he didn't even feel comfortable with his picture being taken? I know the 'gay card' was used in relation to the no photo policy at concerts but I think it might have been down to self esteem especially in relation to his looks. Just because he wore 'out there' stuff doesn't mean he was confident in how he looked. I'm going way off point but what I'm trying to say is Axl appears to be a very naive, sensitive and vulnerable guy and it translates into different aspects of his life. Hey we're all human even Axl. I think if he potential was pushed and he had 110% confidence throughout his music career he could have produced some wicked stuff. I truly believe he is a musical genius. Hes an intelligent guy away from music too in my opinion.

To hear him referred to as a beaten dog is terrible.

Was Karen the 'star' of those weird videos on youtube with millions of photos of her photoshopped with Axl?

No--That was just some random girl, I have no idea who she is.

Karen was this big overweight woman. One morning in May 1995, Axl came into his kitchen to find her sitting at his kitchen table. He ran out, closed the door and immediately called the police and filed a restraining order.

"Rose first filed for a restraining order against McNeil in May 1995, his request was dismissed. He subsequently filed on two more occasions, June 1996 and May 2000, both times his request was granted."

That's her. She later stalked Justin Timberlake

Edited November 11, 2010 by Indigo Child

[Nintari]

Kurt Cobain destroyed the music I like. So yeah I guess Nevermind made the bigger impact.

Fixed all nice and neat like.

Not a coincidence that after he came along, all rock music was shitty.

So RHCP,Pearl Jam,Alice In Chains,Soundgarden,Tool are all "shitty" bands? I mean, I understand how opinions work and I'm down with that if that's what this is but come on.

A lot of people forget that Pearl Jam was the biggest band from the Seattle scene and the sales of Ten and Vs. trounced Nevermind and In Utero.

Nirvana made it possible for Pearl Jam to succeed in the way that they did. This is what people forget, or ignore when this comes up. There was no Pearl Jam when Smells Like Teen Spirit hits the airwaves. Seattle was just another city. I remember when Teen Spirit showed up on MTV's top 10. It was fighting Live And Let Die daily for #1. All the other bands on the top ten were Motley Crue, Ugly Kid Joe etc. Nirvana really were the forerunners in that they busted through it all and flipped the industry upside down. Without them, who the fuck knows how long the hair metal shit would have lasted. We could have been forced to endure another 5 years of fucking Poison....*shudders*.

[chevelle]

"What's gonna happen when Guns is no longer.. when a new fad comes along?" or whatever. And I'd be, "I don't give a fuck". And I watched it happen, and it didn't matter to me. With Axl it mattered a hell of a lot. Next thing you know, he wants to be Pearl Jam, right? Why? I hate Pearl Jam anyway, so what's the point? And it's great to watch Pearl Jam going through what they're going through, cos I'm going, "See Axl?"

"We do what we do the best that anybody does. Let's just go out and do a club tour, a theatre tour, and fucking get back down to where we have some validity with an audience that we can relate to. But Axl was all fucking.. he wants to be on MTV, he wants to do Unplugged, he wants to be this, he wants to be that. So we didn't see eye to eye, and that's where a lot of that bullshit got started, and of course it was blown out of all proportion in the press.

Whoa, whoa, whoa - what exactly happened to Pearl Jam in '95 that was so horrible? Them downsizing on their fame in order to keep going as a band, and standing up for what they believed in by fighting Ticketmaster? And making the music they wanted to make?

[bitstorm]

Every so often a list of the greatest albums ever made is compiled. Nevermind now charts in the top ten of most of these list. A fucking disgrace . The reason usually is that Nevermind killed off hair metal or some how changed the landscape drastically. It is my belief that GNR/Appetite killed off hair metal. Hair metal was dead for like two year by the time Nevermind came along. Am I the only person who believes that NEvermind is the most overated album of all time, at least over rated by journalist. I dont dislike Nirvana because Axl either i just cant stand how the bands influence is overated, therefore i cant stand them.

Nevermind was the start of something new, somewhat the next "Never Mind the Bollocks", if you will. It came along at a time where a lot of people were sick of "hair metal", they were "the alternative".

Appetite was more like the next classic "Back In Black" or "Rocks" type of album and sometimes I think it was the last of its kind... they were the next great group and were definitely more what a lot of rock bands at the time should have sounded like.

I liked Nevermind okay but it got as overplayed as the hair bands it put itself up against so I really can't listen to it anymore... good alternative album but I liked Siamese Dream better.

I can still listen to Appetite today. I honestly really enjoy the musical direction CD has taken, and it's just like how it was when I first discovered Appetite.. no joke, that's how it is for me.

[rockerman]

Every so often a list of the greatest albums ever made is compiled. Nevermind now charts in the top ten of most of these list. A fucking disgrace . The reason usually is that Nevermind killed off hair metal or some how changed the landscape drastically. It is my belief that GNR/Appetite killed off hair metal. Hair metal was dead for like two year by the time Nevermind came along. Am I the only person who believes that NEvermind is the most overated album of all time, at least over rated by journalist. I dont dislike Nirvana because Axl either i just cant stand how the bands influence is overated, therefore i cant stand them.

THe early Nineties was also a shift in American viewpoints. First Gulf War under Bush1-The mood in America darkened.

2) the eighties headbangers had grown up..most were college aged and had moved on from the good times...

What i hated by the grunge movement was

1) most of them sucked. Musically sounded like they had just started playing

2)The music was whiny and complainy...sniffles and boohoos

3) There was no show...lSaw Nirvana in 91..Standing around playing ..no crowd interaction...was boring to me... Here I thought oK this band is huge and its got a few good songs....ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzz

like Gene Simmons has said: You want to be entertained by the pizza delivery boy up there..in a flannel shirt?

[Bumble's Bridge Pickup]

It's safe to say Nirvana was the band that killed hair metal - but it would have been only a matter of time anyway, some band would have done it.

Edited November 11, 2010 by Jyrgen