GUNS N'ROSES WORLDWIDE ALBUM SALES

[Damn_Smooth]

Are we talking in terms of success and recognition? We don't even know what Libertad sold worldwide. Or even the US for that matter. It sold 222,000 JUST in the US as of October 2007, that's all we know, and that's not even that far behind what CD sold in the US. It wasn't a commercial success, but it didn't flop THAT hard. I want actual up to date numbers. And at least VR accomplished more with Contraband than Axl did with CD. That's a fact.

And I'm not even a "blind Slashite" either, but now you're just instigating.

I'm talking everything. And despite your sincerest attempts at severe obfuscation, the point remains: you and I both know that CD II very much has the potential to outmatch Libertad. It's within range, and I can't believe you're actually trying to bullshit me here and spin it any other way. Why don't you take your own advice about "actual numbers" and post Contraband's sales data in comparison to Libertad's. I'll accept your written apology now. That was a joke, don't freak out, I really am having fun here, although I mean what I say. Let's not get too serious. Well actually, I'm very serious- I'm rootin for Axl, what can I say? It will give me pleasure to see CD II perform better than its predecessor whilst also outperforming contraband's successor.

And furthermore, I never fuckin called you a "blind slashite" in quotes. I said Slashhole. There's a difference. And if you read my post, I also said I'll be happy to be you and your ilk's antithesis: the Axlhole to your Slashole. Now carry on. But you know CD II has good odds. Haha. >=)

"Slashite" "slashole", etc. All soap opera internet bullshit. Whatever floats your boat man.

Contraband sold 4 million worldiwde, we don't know what Libertad sold. We have US numbers from 4 years ago, that's it. But even if if CD II (or whatever) "outdoes" (or whatever game you got going) libertad, it'd be more of a tie than a victory.

There's no denying that Contraband had more of an impact than CD did. Media dug it, fans dug it, signs point that it sold more, and it had two hits that are still played on rock radio nearly eight years later.

My opinion of what COULD go down with the next record is mixed. I personally think if it's more of the same, with just DJ's and Bumble's contributions puzzle pieced in, I think it will flop. That's my personal opinion. There's no "mystery" or "wonder" this time around, and I personally think that's a big reason why CD even went as far as it did.

If it's fresh studio takes, with a somewhat...different...direction, I think it has a better chance.

I really don't understand how you think that "mystery" had anything to do with anything. Damn near the whole album had leaked way before release and they streamed it on Myspace. The only sales that CD achieved were from people that liked what they had already heard.

And the people who weren't aware of all the leaks and such. I do think most GNR fans knew about the old band falling apart, Axl was still performing under the name, and recording an album that many were curious about, and had doubts it would see the light of day. Doesn't mean they were spending every waking moment on message boards waiting for leaks.

I wasn't spending time on message boards back then. I found out about the leaks from a friend that isn't even really in to GN'R. That was the beginning of my involvement with GN'R on the internet and outside of a couple of posts at a forum here and there, last year was the year I really got involved with forums. And that's just this forum. If I found out from someone that doesn't really even care about the band, I'm sure that many other people did too.

Not to mention that the leaks were covered in newspapers and magazines, you pretty much had to be living under a rock to not know that they existed. Anybody who had any interest in the band whatsoever had already made up their mind by the time CD launched.

I disagree. I'm not saying that every general fan were unaware of the leaks, but I think much more of the general fan base weren't paying attention to the leaks in comparison to those that were. I think most people mainly cared when it was finally confirmed the album would see the light of day. I firmly believe that the album was always going to sell a certain amount of copies based on the history leading up to it, and the certain "mystique" behind it, no matter what.

I guess we are going to have to agree to disagree on this. I think that even if someone would have skipped the leaks to wait for release, they would have at least checked out the free streaming on Myspace. I don't think there was any reason for anybody to buy CD out of curiosity.

Well at that point, it was already so close to the album being released. I actually think it probably would've sold more had it not been streamed. A lot more. But I do believe people bought it out of curiosity of what took 14 years to accomplish, perhaps blindly. I know a couple cases of that personally.

I only know 5 other people with the album and they like it, but 5 isn't a high enough number to form any sort of statistic off of. I do know that I don't really care about sales because they don't effect my opinion of the album at all.

[saber_]

"Slashite" "slashole", etc. All soap opera internet bullshit. Whatever floats your boat man.

First of all- you put blind slashite in quotes, therefore explicitly implying I called you that. There is a semantic distinction, which I thought was kind of obvious. But just so you know ut's the same as lying, and reveals what type of person I'm debating with here. Also it proves you are a Slashole. Stop acting like your entire existence on this board isn't spent mostly arguing about nonsense with other people. I can read your posting history. Slashole. lol

Contraband sold 4 million worldiwde, we don't know what Libertad sold. We have US numbers from 4 years ago, that's it. But even if if CD II (or whatever) "outdoes" (or whatever game you got going) libertad, it'd be more of a tie than a victory.

I am getting sick and fuckin tired of you repeatedly acting like you know what the hell you're talking about when it comes to sales data. You fucking act like you're some sort of master statistical analyst or renowned reputable industry professional. I got news for you buddy: you're a neophyte when it comes to your googling research skills. Now post your sources plz, because you know what? I don't agree with all your numbers. So quit saying "we have" or "we don't know" when it comes to sales stats. It's just preposterous that you think you get to post numbers without sources. Unfuckingbelievable. But then again, it illustrates who I'm debating with here.

There's no denying that Contraband had more of an impact than CD did. Media dug it, fans dug it, signs point that it sold more, and it had two hits that are still played on rock radio nearly eight years later.

You really are unbelievable. I mean you're like Slash's personal messageboard sleazy PR guy. I mean, truly- you are a master wannabe semanticist.

Contraband had more of an impact in the United States. Y'know: since you seem intent on making distinctions between the United States and the rest of the world. Well by golly, let's be consistent here! I acknowledge Contraband is the more popular album in the United States. But I don't concede that for every other country. I mean, it's sort of annoying that you're so ethno-centric about the U.S. Let's go country by country, shall we? Ok that was a joke, well not really, but kinda. Remember though- there's a world outside the U.S. And if I may borrow a phrase from you, "we know" what the concert numbers were from South America. I'll accept your second written apology now. lol

My opinion of what COULD go down with the next record is mixed. I personally think if it's more of the same, with just DJ's and Bumble's contributions puzzle pieced in, I think it will flop. That's my personal opinion. There's no "mystery" or "wonder" this time around, and I personally think that's a big reason why CD even went as far as it did.

If it's fresh studio takes, with a somewhat...different...direction, I think it has a better chance.

Let me ask you something, since you supposedly purport to be a Guns n Roses fan. When has Axl ever given us "more of the same"? (see there, I actually quoted you when putting something in quotes, what a concept). The answer is: NEVER! Axl's never recycled the same sound from the last record verbatim. Godamn, I thought you were a GnR fan. Do I really have to list all the GnR albums, and then say "herp derp" to you? For christ sakes.

I don't know why you're in such denial, or are so hellbent at deluding everyone else into thinking that Libertad was some epic album. But hey, like you said, whatever floats your boat. The bottom line is this: CD's followup has great odds in outperforming Libertad. Now, if you'd like to cut the bullshit, we can place a fucking wager right here and now. Of course we're going to have to agree on sources, since I'm not willing to trust some guy on internet messageboard (no offense or anything, you just clearly haven't taken a statistics class).

[Use Your Delusion 1]

its interesting how Cd sold more overseas but Contraband more in the USA

Edit: lol, Greatest Hits only sold 20,000 copies less than Chinese Democracy in 2008

Edited January 7, 2012 by Use Your Delusion 1

[gnrkoncerti]

its interesting how Cd sold more overseas but Contraband more in the USA

Edit: lol, Greatest Hits only sold 20,000 copies less than Chinese Democracy in 2008

Yeah...People in Europe.Sa ,Australia believe in what they see or hear with their eyes or ears - So they were bouying Chinese democracy

People in US and England believe in what their tv,internet,newspapers say-So they weren't buying Chinese democracy

For example in Europe every fuckin show had 12000+ people

In US 7000+ (Except Chicago 10000,and La 16000)

But I think this US tour will change stuff.Reviews were excelennt and everything were fine.

[Use Your Delusion 1]

its interesting how Cd sold more overseas but Contraband more in the USA

Edit: lol, Greatest Hits only sold 20,000 copies less than Chinese Democracy in 2008

Yeah...People in Europe.Sa ,Australia believe in what they see or hear with their eyes or ears - So they were bouying Chinese democracy

People in US and England believe in what their tv,internet,newspapers say-So they weren't buying Chinese democracy

For example in Europe every fuckin show had 12000+ people

In US 7000+ (Except Chicago 10000,and La 16000)

But I think this US tour will change stuff.Reviews were excelennt and everything were fine.

hay! Chinese Democracy went platinum in the UK (over 300,000 sales) and on their recent tour they played to over 170,000 people over here

[gnrkoncerti]

Ok,sory for England...

[Georgy Zhukov]

Album sales don't mean anything in age of download.

[Kill Devil Hill]

The thing is that with Van Halen, people still respected EVH, and he didn't wait 15+ years to release an original album. The situations really aren't the same. Time plays more of a key role.

Waiting doesn't build hype. Just look at the people who complain about Axl coming on stage late.

Well I kind of agree.

But at the same time, had people really taken to the music, it wouldn't have mattered. I don't buy that it was more than a minority of people that were purely prejudice against the album, even if it were truly mindblowing.

Not that I want to sound too much like a "basher", as I do enjoy a few songs off CD.

See, I would agree, but people can't take to the music if they haven't heard it. Just go on any web site outside MyGNRForum. You'll find many people bashing ChD who haven't heard it. On one of the sites I go on, they were gonna have a GN'R survivor game, and only one guy had heard ChD (he said it was beautiful), and everybody else said it couldn't be good because it wasn't a real GN'R album. Axl didn't start scoring high on vocalist web sites until one guy who'd heard and loved ChD came in and turned everything upside down. Just a couple examples I've seen, not counting real life experiences or the morons of YouTube.

Do you know a lot of people who have heard ChD?

But this is all theoretic I guess.

[GnRDuff1]

All that matters to me is that Chinese Democracy's followup blows Libertad out of the water. Eat it all you trolling Slasholes.

You are a fool!

Yeah well I really don't give a fuck if that bothers you or if you are offended. The bottom line is it's personal. You can kid yourself and say "oh well time heals everything" but that's a crock of shit. Slash ran his mouth for years, smearing Axl. Now, did Axl bring some of it upon himself? Damn right he did. But for too many years, I have had to endure people incessantly, constantly, annoyingly, perpetually cupcake Axl relentlessly and post in almost every thread. And I've had to take it. Well no more. Axl and Slash may be somewhat cool with eachother as of late, but there is still one more unspoken score to be settled. And I have faith in Axl that he will be motivated to beat Slash where it counts the most: THE MUSIC. That, more than anything else, means something to me. Why? Because I'm rooting for Axl, that's why. You wanna label me an Axhole to your Slashole, hey that's fine. But in the end, in the end- what matters is that CD II destroys Libertad, musically and thus commercially.

You can call me a fool, you can miss the humor behind the yes-i-admit-sincerity in my post, but in actuality- you and I both know that CD's followup is a very, very important record for a myriad of reasons. And one of those reasons, like it or not, is competitiveness with a nemesis. Haha, now flame away- but you know I'm right- CD II will be more satisfying than Libertad. Checkmate.

;)

No offense, but my morning bowel movements are slightly more satisfying than Libertad.

[batman007]

its interesting how Cd sold more overseas but Contraband more in the USA

Edit: lol, Greatest Hits only sold 20,000 copies less than Chinese Democracy in 2008

Yeah...People in Europe.Sa ,Australia believe in what they see or hear with their eyes or ears - So they were bouying Chinese democracy

People in US and England believe in what their tv,internet,newspapers say-So they weren't buying Chinese democracy

For example in Europe every fuckin show had 12000+ people

In US 7000+ (Except Chicago 10000,and La 16000)

But I think this US tour will change stuff.Reviews were excelennt and everything were fine.

WRONG! The Texas shows I went to were well over 10,000.

[Apollo]

It has always been fascinating to me that fans love and adore Eddie VH, when he is a bigger egotistical prick than Axl is. Look at the singer turnover in van halen. Look at the lack of activity the last decade. The guy has basically ruined two incarnations of VH that were hall of fame worthy bands. But he gets 1% of the negative press that Axl does.

[Thatwhy83]

I think I found where some of the ' missing' copies of CD landed. I am into vinyl LPs so I wi

ll check out thrift stores for used vinyl. The last store had a whole rack of best buy chin dem CDs. I wonder if the inventory was simply donated?

[KiraMPD]

My god, when did this turn into a Velvet Revolver v.s Guns n' Roses thread? Is it because of the Slash v.s Axl thing that fans seem to have going? If that's the case then shouldn't we include Slash's solo album in this argument too?

Seriously, grow up. It doesn't matter how much a new album by Guns sells in comparison to Libertad as long as its good music...

[moreblack]

My god, when did this turn into a Velvet Revolver v.s Guns n' Roses thread? Is it because of the Slash v.s Axl thing that fans seem to have going? If that's the case then shouldn't we include Slash's solo album in this argument too?

Seriously, grow up. It doesn't matter how much a new album by Guns sells in comparison to Libertad as long as its good music...

It all started because for the longest time Axl fans just assumed that CD was gonna sell more than VR, "blow them out of the water" I recall someone saying...

Now that the dust has settled, we can all see that didn't exactly happen. The revelation is more than some can bear.

[droezle]

All that matters to me is that Chinese Democracy's followup blows Libertad out of the water. Eat it all you trolling Slasholes.

Obvious is obvious

My god, when did this turn into a Velvet Revolver v.s Guns n' Roses thread? Is it because of the Slash v.s Axl thing that fans seem to have going? If that's the case then shouldn't we include Slash's solo album in this argument too?

Seriously, grow up. It doesn't matter how much a new album by Guns sells in comparison to Libertad as long as its good music...

It all started because for the longest time Axl fans just assumed that CD was gonna sell more than VR, "blow them out of the water" I recall someone saying...

Now that the dust has settled, we can all see that didn't exactly happen. The revelation is more than some can bear.

Ok so are we talking about sales or talent?

Fact: Contraband sold more

Fact 2: CD is a much better album for many many reason. Any monkey with hearing knows this

With your logic Justin Beiber is better than both VR and GNR

Opinions are like assholes, everybody has one.

[Apollo]

My god, when did this turn into a Velvet Revolver v.s Guns n' Roses thread? Is it because of the Slash v.s Axl thing that fans seem to have going? If that's the case then shouldn't we include Slash's solo album in this argument too?

Seriously, grow up. It doesn't matter how much a new album by Guns sells in comparison to Libertad as long as its good music...

It all started because for the longest time Axl fans just assumed that CD was gonna sell more than VR, "blow them out of the water" I recall someone saying...

Now that the dust has settled, we can all see that didn't exactly happen. The revelation is more than some can bear.

Not really. Most of us don't judge the quality of an album by the amount of copies sold.

The first two albums were pretty similar across the board in terms of sales and song chart positions and in terms of concert sales.

The haters will blow that off, as they twist every argument both ways. They will say the sales were dissapointing for GnR......but then will say all GnR's success is solely based on the name GnR and people not knowing that Slash/Duff/Izzy aren't in the band anymore.

So let's move on to album number two.

Moreblack.

Is there ANY DOUBT in your mind that GnR's next album will "blow them out of the water" in terms of matching it up against VR's second album? Or against Slash's solo album?

Whatever forumula you want to use.

The next GnR record.

VR's second album.

Slash's solo album.

The next GnR album will dominate in every category. Sales, chart places, concert sales, etc.

[droezle]

The next GnR album will dominate in every category. Sales, chart places, concert sales, etc.

The same has been said about the highly anticipated album Chinese Democracy.

[Use Your Delusion 1]

The next GnR album will dominate in every category. Sales, chart places, concert sales, etc.

The same has been said about the highly anticipated album Chinese Democracy.

If CD2 does worse than Liberturd then NuGuns may as well give up and go home.

[KiraMPD]

The next GnR album will dominate in every category. Sales, chart places, concert sales, etc.

My question is this; does it really matter if it does/doesn't? If we just go by the fan-base alone then another GnR album would sell about the same (probably a little less) than CD and that's because loyal fans will go out and buy it no matter what. Its what you and I would do correct? (I certainly did that with CD)

As far as chart places, critiques and all that is concerned, its all pretty subjective. Any new songs they may release may or may not be what people are wanting to hear at that time. As far as I see it, chart placements are usually about 'right place, right time'. Would I be disappointed if they came out with a kick-ass song but got ignored on the charts or bashed by critiques? Yes, but it wouldn't take away from the music for me.

All that matters if you individually like a song or not. Other than that I see no point in expecting too much on a global scale or turning this into some sort of a pissing contest between "Slash and Axl".

All I'm expecting are a couple more songs from Axl before the world ends.

------------

Back to the OP; Aww... so close to 100M yet so far away. Unofficially it probably is 100M+ since I know GnR albums are sold and bought second-hand quite a lot...

[moreblack]

The next GnR album will dominate in every category. Sales, chart places, concert sales, etc.

The same has been said about the highly anticipated album Chinese Democracy.

true,

Groghan, to answer you directly, I'd say there is doubt.