Marc, What were Izzy's thoughts on Reckless Road?

[wfuckinga]

I'm not sure if it's been asked already, but I'm curious as to if he said anything about it or not.

[recklessroad]

When I called Izzy to tell him what I was doing, he was excited about the project. It was on a Sunday in spring on 2007. He told me that those were the best times, thats when the music was real. He was all set to come over that Tuesday to look what I had put together and interview for it. I sort of blew it, we were doing video interviews so that we would have them for the online part of the book. We had already done some at my house and 4 of them at Canter's. The guy doing the video said that we really shouldn't do any more with the same background because they were starting to all look the same and asked if we could do Izzy's at his house. I called Izzy on Monday to ask him if we could come to his house instead. Izzy didn't realize that we were doing video and started to shy away so I said no problem don't worry we don't have to do video. So he said ok I will come by at 2pm At the same time I made what turned out to be a big mistake, I told him that I had just found Desi his ex and she was coming over that day and also Pam Jackson who now goes by the name Manning was also going to be interviewed Tue. Thats when everything fell apart. What I didn't know was before GNR Izzy used to also date Pam. So I had 2 of his ex's coming the same day as him. The first thing he said was I don't want to see them. I told him no problem I will have them come at a different time than he said I have to go and hung up. 1 minute latter I got a text from him saying email me picks for comment with his email address. I guess he got very spooked and thought that they were going to talk about the drugs and dealing and it was the last thing he would want to happen. I emailed him a list of questions that only had to do with the music and the fact that he set the style and songwriting and all the great things that were important. He never replied. 2 months latter I bumped into him at The Black Sabbath Heaven and Hell tour and he said to me how did it all work out with the book? I said its coming along ok but all I could think of is it would be a lot better if you would interview. I didn't want to nag him so I waited a week and then emailed him again and got no response.

It turned out that Desi didn't come she was a no show and was still fucked up on Drugs. 3 days before the book went to print I found he again and she interviewed over the phone with Jason Porath who was my editor and Izzy was right she went off on what she was still interested in which was the drugs. I wanted her because she was in a lot of the photos and used to dance on stage for a song at most of the gigs, so I needed a voice to go with the photos. I didn't get a chance to really read what she had to say. Jason emailed me some of it and wasn't sure if they could make it fit since the book was already designed. I wasn't really in to going into too much about their drug use but Slash and Tom Zutaut talked about it a lot. So it was already there anyway.
In the end it was sad that I lost Izzy, If I hadn't called him back, you would have his story in the book. The other thing is Beta told me latter that Izzy was not happy with Slash telling all the Drug stories in Slash's book and that Izzy had called Axl to talk about my book while I was still trying to get he interview.

Also you should know that before I had called him, I hadn't heard from Izzy since 1991. I really feel that he let me down and the fans too. Its not like Axl where he just refuses to do anything that has to do with the old band. Izzy likes to old band. I was there when he needed my help in 1985. I know Izzy has some issues with doing interviews but I think he could have just answered some of the questions or at least looked at what I had put together, it would have made a big difference.

Edited August 24, 2013 by recklessroad

[Patience 4 Axl]

What a crazy chain of events! My impression of Izzy has always been that he's somewhat aloof and quirky. It's a shame he turned away and ignored your requests. I can't see the harm in answering some questions in an email, especially if it's in reference to his own music. Seriously, very strange.

And I wonder why Beta would care about Slash's drug stories. If anything it didn't paint him in the best light. As much as I've always been a huge Slash fan, the depth of his addiction was a bit disconcerting. I think anything that would make Slash look bad would be appreciated by Beta.

Edited August 24, 2013 by Patience 4 Axl

[T.wa.T]

Marc how bad was their drug addictions in your opinion? Were they getting heroin everyday and getting bombed or doing just enough so they werent sick? Drinking I coulld see them doing with relative ease. To support a drug habit one needs to have a steady income of money.

[DieselDaisy]

When I called Izzy to tell him what I was doing, he was excited about the project. It was on a Sunday in spring on 2007. He told me that those were the best times, thats when the music was real. He was all set to come over that Tuesday to look what I had put together and interview for it. I sort of blew it, we were doing video interviews so that we would have them for the online part of the book. We had already done some at my house and 4 of them at Canter's. The guy doing the video said that we really shouldn't do any more with the same background because they were starting to all look the same and asked if we could do Izzy's at his house. I called Izzy on Monday to ask him if we could come to his house instead. Izzy didn't realize that we were doing video and started to shy away so I said no problem don't worry we don't have to do video. So he said ok I will come by at 2pm At the same time I made what turned out to be a big mistake, I told him that I had just found Desi his ex and she was coming over that day and also Pam Jackson who now goes by the name Manning was also going to be interviewed Tue. Thats when everything fell apart. What I didn't know was before GNR Izzy used to also date Pam. So I had 2 of his ex's coming the same day as him. The first thing he said was I don't want to see them. I told him no problem I will have them come at a different time than he said I have to go and hung up. 1 minute latter I got a text from him saying email me picks for comment with his email address. I guess he got very spooked and thought that they were going to talk about the drugs and dealing and it was the last thing he would want to happen. I emailed him a list of questions that only had to do with the music and the fact that he set the style and songwriting and all the great things that were important. He never replied. 2 months latter I bumped into him at The Black Sabbath Heaven and Hell tour and he said to me how did it all work out with the book? I said its coming along ok but all I could think of is it would be a lot better if you would interview. I didn't want to nag him so I waited a week and then emailed him again and got no response.

It turned out that Desi didn't come she was a no show and was still fucked up on Drugs. 3 days before the book went to print I found he again and she interviewed over the phone with Jason Porath who was my editor and Izzy was right she went off on what she was still interested in which was the drugs. I wanted her because she was in a lot of the photos and used to dance on stage for a song at most of the gigs, so I needed a voice to go with the photos. I didn't get a chance to really read what she had to say. Jason emailed me some of it and wasn't sure if they could make it fit since the book was already designed. I wasn't really in to going into too much about their drug use but Slash and Tom Zutaut talked about it a lot. So it was already there anyway.

In the end it was sad that I lost Izzy, If I hadn't called him back, you would have his story in the book. The other thing is Beta told me latter that Izzy was not happy with Slash telling all the Drug stories in Slash's book and that Izzy had called Axl to talk about my book while I was still trying to get he interview.

Also you should know that before I had called him, I hadn't heard from Izzy since 1991. I really feel that he let me down and the fans too. Its not like Axl where he just refuses to do anything that has to do with the old band. Izzy likes to old band. I was there when he needed my help in 1985. I know Izzy has some issues with doing interviews but I think he could have just answered some of the questions or at least looked at what I had put together, it would have made a big difference.

What an interesting read.

My own interpretation of Izzy is this - see what you think.

Izzy saw how Aerosmith sobered up when GN'R played the Aerosmith tour. He saw how they had no contact with drugs or alcohol of any sort (and gnr were asked to only do their excesses in their rehearsal room and walk around with anonymous beer cups). I suppose you could call it the zero tolerance approach to sobriety. So when Izzy sobered up, this is why he drove his own van during the Illusion tour and basically kept to himself. He could not even be in the same room as Slash and Duff when they were boozing.

It is the same with your book Marc. Izzy and Desi used to sell persian heroin from their window. The first mention of 'Desi' and he was out of there. He may have heard something, a rumour, that she was still using drugs. Izzy mentally likes to seperate himself from that whole lifestyle due to, perhaps a nagging fear of a relapse or just a whole distate with the whole thing. That has been his way of life really since leaving gnr.

Edited August 24, 2013 by DieselDaisy

[Nobody]

It's really too bad. It would've been amazing to get Izzy's insight on those early formative years and his creative input into the band. I've always thought that he was such a huge important part of Guns n Roses as a songwriter and he never fully gets recognized. I think that's partly due to Axl and Slash being such huge personalities but also because Izzy never really chooses to express himself in anyway. I agree, that he could've atleast done some interviews off the camera for you Marc. While I sort've understand his reluctance to not speak about/promote his former "lifestyle", I think it's clear to any fans who know Izzy that he's been clean for many years now (since 1990?) and that's really not important to us. I'm only speaking for myself but I never thought Izzy,Slash etc. were cool because they were heroin addicts.

He has so much more to offer in terms of delving into the dynamics of his and Axl's relationship and the beginning years of the band. I think he sells himself short by thinking that everyone will just be interested in rehashing the heroin subject. To me, that's the least interesting thing about him, I'd love to hear more from him on pretty much any subject except that. The fact of the matter is the drug use is very well known and for better or worse was part of the bands legacy/infamy so Slash or anyone else speaking about it or denying it isn't going to change anything at this point. I think if he just spoke a little more he'd realize that people really don't care about the drugs at all, let's be honest, if he did interviews 90% of the questions would be about Axl/Guns and probably no one would really care about his addiction from 30 years ago.

The books still amazing though Marc!!!

[KinseyHolley]

I've been a fan since the very beginning but I have to admit that I'm an Izzy fan first and foremost. I'm one of those obnoxious bitches who will smile at you in pity and say, "No, baby - you're not going to see GnR, you're going to see Axl Rose and his back up band." (And also, "Would you just shut the fuck up about Slash already??? What about Izzy? IZ. ZY.")

It's just so sad about Desi, how all these long years later she's still fucked up. Now, at 49 and as a young girl's mother, I look back on that time and think what a waste, in some ways. If you're honest you have to admit they left a lot of human wreckage in their wakes. And I think Izzy knows it - after all, that's one of the reasons he quit the band. In his mostly stupid bio of the band, Stephen Davis wrote about how in the early days, they ate up women and threw the bones out the window, and I think that's kind of accurate (even tho much of the book isn't.) Back then it seemed dangerous and exciting, now I know that if my daughter were in Desi's situation (or Michelle's, or Adriana's, or any of the ones no one remembers), I'd probably be in jail because the bastard who did that to her would be dead, brilliant songwriter or no brilliant songwriter.

Maybe that's something you only think about when you get old.

Also, what Nobody said.

I'll go back to lurking now.

Edited August 24, 2013 by KinseyHolley

[T.wa.T]

Maybe Izzy just took the advice of his sponser, and took the people, places and things approach to being sober for the past 20 plus years.

If Desi is a trigger for his drug use, which she is, because they were using together, then he has to do what's best for Izzy.

This isn't a slight or jab at you Marc. You couldn't possibly know who or what Izzys triggers are. But Imo, I think Izzy was just looking out for Izzys best interests, as far as sobriety.Even the mention of her name could give him anxiety and make him want to use, that's just the way it is for addicts, I'm glad he's still clean, even if it means, not getting an interview with him.

Edited August 24, 2013 by T.wa.T

[T.wa.T]

I've been a fan since the very beginning but I have to admit that I'm an Izzy fan first and foremost. I'm one of those obnoxious bitches who will smile at you in pity and say, "No, baby - you're not going to see GnR, you're going to see Axl Rose and his back up band." (And also, "Would you just shut the fuck up about Slash already??? What about Izzy? IZ. ZY.")

It's just so sad about Desi, how all these long years later she's still fucked up. Now, at 49 and as a young girl's mother, I look back on that time and think what a waste, in some ways. If you're honest you have to admit they left a lot of human wreckage in their wakes. And I think Izzy knows it - after all, that's one of the reasons he quit the band. In his mostly stupid bio of the band, Stephen Davis wrote about how in the early days, they ate up women and threw the bones out the window, and I think that's kind of accurate (even tho much of the book isn't.) Back then it seemed dangerous and exciting, now I know that if my daughter were in Desi's situation (or Michelle's, or Adriana's, or any of the ones no one remembers), I'd probably be in jail because the bastard who did that to her would be dead, brilliant songwriter or no brilliant songwriter.

Maybe that's something you only think about when you get old.

Also, what Nobody said.

I'll go back to lurking now.

I don't beleive for one second that any of those girls became strippers because they wanted to. But when you have a music scene crossing paths with strippers they are going to use each other.

Saying Izzy and the others just used them is probably accurate, but they were also friends, and a few of the girls close to them probably hoped that one of the band members would be their ticket out of the gutters.

[DieselDaisy]

I've been a fan since the very beginning but I have to admit that I'm an Izzy fan first and foremost. I'm one of those obnoxious bitches who will smile at you in pity and say, "No, baby - you're not going to see GnR, you're going to see Axl Rose and his back up band." (And also, "Would you just shut the fuck up about Slash already??? What about Izzy? IZ. ZY.")

It's just so sad about Desi, how all these long years later she's still fucked up. Now, at 49 and as a young girl's mother, I look back on that time and think what a waste, in some ways. If you're honest you have to admit they left a lot of human wreckage in their wakes. And I think Izzy knows it - after all, that's one of the reasons he quit the band. In his mostly stupid bio of the band, Stephen Davis wrote about how in the early days, they ate up women and threw the bones out the window, and I think that's kind of accurate (even tho much of the book isn't.) Back then it seemed dangerous and exciting, now I know that if my daughter were in Desi's situation (or Michelle's, or Adriana's, or any of the ones no one remembers), I'd probably be in jail because the bastard who did that to her would be dead, brilliant songwriter or no brilliant songwriter.

Maybe that's something you only think about when you get old.

Also, what Nobody said.

I'll go back to lurking now.

The first thing you have to realise about GN'R is they were complete bastards. Seriously, these were not nice people. But then, they were young men at the time. Young men make mistakes. And they were sort of, being their heroes: The Stones and Aerosmith. They probably said to themselves, 'The Stones took lots of drugs and treated women like garbage, so we will.''.

[KinseyHolley]

Yep. The Gardner Street storage unit was a wretched hive of scum and villainy but in a certain light it looked sexy. Part of that was because in the late 80s treating women like shit wasn't yet completely socially frowned upon and partly it was because so long as there are rock stars there will be girls willing to throw themselves on the pyre.

But -- if Twitter and Youtube had been around back then, Axl would've found his ass Chris Brown-ed in a fucking heartbeat.

[T.wa.T]

He was.

Remember the cover of People Magazine? The one after Stephanie and Erin pressed charges?

That was right at the height of his career at the time, just after the Illusion tour.

[dalsh327]

When I called Izzy to tell him what I was doing, he was excited about the project. It was on a Sunday in spring on 2007. He told me that those were the best times, thats when the music was real. He was all set to come over that Tuesday to look what I had put together and interview for it. I sort of blew it, we were doing video interviews so that we would have them for the online part of the book. We had already done some at my house and 4 of them at Canter's. The guy doing the video said that we really shouldn't do any more with the same background because they were starting to all look the same and asked if we could do Izzy's at his house. I called Izzy on Monday to ask him if we could come to his house instead. Izzy didn't realize that we were doing video and started to shy away so I said no problem don't worry we don't have to do video. So he said ok I will come by at 2pm At the same time I made what turned out to be a big mistake, I told him that I had just found Desi his ex and she was coming over that day and also Pam Jackson who now goes by the name Manning was also going to be interviewed Tue. Thats when everything fell apart. What I didn't know was before GNR Izzy used to also date Pam. So I had 2 of his ex's coming the same day as him. The first thing he said was I don't want to see them. I told him no problem I will have them come at a different time than he said I have to go and hung up. 1 minute latter I got a text from him saying email me picks for comment with his email address. I guess he got very spooked and thought that they were going to talk about the drugs and dealing and it was the last thing he would want to happen. I emailed him a list of questions that only had to do with the music and the fact that he set the style and songwriting and all the great things that were important. He never replied. 2 months latter I bumped into him at The Black Sabbath Heaven and Hell tour and he said to me how did it all work out with the book? I said its coming along ok but all I could think of is it would be a lot better if you would interview. I didn't want to nag him so I waited a week and then emailed him again and got no response.

It turned out that Desi didn't come she was a no show and was still fucked up on Drugs. 3 days before the book went to print I found he again and she interviewed over the phone with Jason Porath who was my editor and Izzy was right she went off on what she was still interested in which was the drugs. I wanted her because she was in a lot of the photos and used to dance on stage for a song at most of the gigs, so I needed a voice to go with the photos. I didn't get a chance to really read what she had to say. Jason emailed me some of it and wasn't sure if they could make it fit since the book was already designed. I wasn't really in to going into too much about their drug use but Slash and Tom Zutaut talked about it a lot. So it was already there anyway.

In the end it was sad that I lost Izzy, If I hadn't called him back, you would have his story in the book. The other thing is Beta told me latter that Izzy was not happy with Slash telling all the Drug stories in Slash's book and that Izzy had called Axl to talk about my book while I was still trying to get he interview.

Also you should know that before I had called him, I hadn't heard from Izzy since 1991. I really feel that he let me down and the fans too. Its not like Axl where he just refuses to do anything that has to do with the old band. Izzy likes to old band. I was there when he needed my help in 1985. I know Izzy has some issues with doing interviews but I think he could have just answered some of the questions or at least looked at what I had put together, it would have made a big difference.

Do you think Axl changed his mind about helping you with the book because Izzy called him?

[KinseyHolley]

You're right. Hey - I'm old.

[recklessroad]

When I called Izzy to tell him what I was doing, he was excited about the project. It was on a Sunday in spring on 2007. He told me that those were the best times, thats when the music was real. He was all set to come over that Tuesday to look what I had put together and interview for it. I sort of blew it, we were doing video interviews so that we would have them for the online part of the book. We had already done some at my house and 4 of them at Canter's. The guy doing the video said that we really shouldn't do any more with the same background because they were starting to all look the same and asked if we could do Izzy's at his house. I called Izzy on Monday to ask him if we could come to his house instead. Izzy didn't realize that we were doing video and started to shy away so I said no problem don't worry we don't have to do video. So he said ok I will come by at 2pm At the same time I made what turned out to be a big mistake, I told him that I had just found Desi his ex and she was coming over that day and also Pam Jackson who now goes by the name Manning was also going to be interviewed Tue. Thats when everything fell apart. What I didn't know was before GNR Izzy used to also date Pam. So I had 2 of his ex's coming the same day as him. The first thing he said was I don't want to see them. I told him no problem I will have them come at a different time than he said I have to go and hung up. 1 minute latter I got a text from him saying email me picks for comment with his email address. I guess he got very spooked and thought that they were going to talk about the drugs and dealing and it was the last thing he would want to happen. I emailed him a list of questions that only had to do with the music and the fact that he set the style and songwriting and all the great things that were important. He never replied. 2 months latter I bumped into him at The Black Sabbath Heaven and Hell tour and he said to me how did it all work out with the book? I said its coming along ok but all I could think of is it would be a lot better if you would interview. I didn't want to nag him so I waited a week and then emailed him again and got no response.

It turned out that Desi didn't come she was a no show and was still fucked up on Drugs. 3 days before the book went to print I found he again and she interviewed over the phone with Jason Porath who was my editor and Izzy was right she went off on what she was still interested in which was the drugs. I wanted her because she was in a lot of the photos and used to dance on stage for a song at most of the gigs, so I needed a voice to go with the photos. I didn't get a chance to really read what she had to say. Jason emailed me some of it and wasn't sure if they could make it fit since the book was already designed. I wasn't really in to going into too much about their drug use but Slash and Tom Zutaut talked about it a lot. So it was already there anyway.

In the end it was sad that I lost Izzy, If I hadn't called him back, you would have his story in the book. The other thing is Beta told me latter that Izzy was not happy with Slash telling all the Drug stories in Slash's book and that Izzy had called Axl to talk about my book while I was still trying to get he interview.

Also you should know that before I had called him, I hadn't heard from Izzy since 1991. I really feel that he let me down and the fans too. Its not like Axl where he just refuses to do anything that has to do with the old band. Izzy likes to old band. I was there when he needed my help in 1985. I know Izzy has some issues with doing interviews but I think he could have just answered some of the questions or at least looked at what I had put together, it would have made a big difference.

Do you think Axl changed his mind about helping you with the book because Izzy called him?

There is a chance of that. I know I blew it with the ex girlfriends but why didn't he do the email questions which were all about the music? He did look sincere when he asked how did the book work out and the Sabbath gig. I should have asked him that night why he no longer wanted to see the first draft and why he won't take part in the questions that we had. The whole thing is just so weird to me that a book is coming out put together my the person they trust the most and it's a really special book about the best times of their life and yet they didn't want to help make it better. Very sad that it ended up without Izzy's input and without more input from Axl. I knew it would have been hard for Axl to focus on some of the events when he is so upset with some of the people that also have things to say about those same events. I can't imagine that it would have been a lot of fun for him to to that but I did still needed his help to make it a better project. Sometimes you have to do things that you don't really want to because someone is asking you that would have done the same for you if needed.

[T.wa.T]

You're right. Hey - I'm old.

Lol, that's why were all here to relive the old days. I'm old to.

Some really great insight Marc. Seems each member was a pretty complicated person to know and understand what made them tick.

Can you tell us about Duff and what he was like while the band was making their way through the clubs? Did he care about all the nonsense the others were involved in? Or just kind of blow it off?

[Lim666]

Marc, even though its coming down to money fitst (and you already gave some numbers), is there a chance to see an updated, error-free and maybe Izzy-, Axl-interviewed "Reckless Road 2.0" this lifetime? are you still working on this little by little? i mean, i would have liked to have at least all errors erased.

also, whats the state of the video compilation project?

Edited August 27, 2013 by Lim666

[trqster]

Izzy's one odd character I tell you that much! He & Axl actually seem to share a lot of the same weirdness towards other people (like need for isolation) - and that probably shows just how deep their long lasting friendship really is...

It's of course a real shame that you didn't get any input from either Izzy or Axl - but it was all worth it in the end of the day for all the real Gn'R fans out there. Thanks Marc!

[recklessroad]

Izzy's one odd character I tell you that much! He & Axl actually seem to share a lot of the same weirdness towards other people (like need for isolation) - and that probably shows just how deep their long lasting friendship really is...

It's of course a real shame that you didn't get any input from either Izzy or Axl - but it was all worth it in the end of the day for all the real Gn'R fans out there. Thanks Marc!

I did get some input from Axl back in 1994 when I first put the book together. As he looked at it he made some comments that I then added to the next draft but in 2007 when we decided to go a little deeper to get a better picture of the times and what was going on in their heads, he chose not to interview. Edited August 30, 2013 by recklessroad

[wfuckinga]

Izzy's one odd character I tell you that much! He & Axl actually seem to share a lot of the same weirdness towards other people (like need for isolation) - and that probably shows just how deep their long lasting friendship really is...

It's of course a real shame that you didn't get any input from either Izzy or Axl - but it was all worth it in the end of the day for all the real Gn'R fans out there. Thanks Marc!

I did get some input from Axl back in 1994 when I first put the book together. As he looked at it he made some comments that I then added to the next draft but in 2007 when we decided to go a little deeper to get a better picture of the times and what was going on in their heads, he chose not to interview.

Were any of those quotes from Axl from 1994?

[recklessroad]

You will know Axl's quotes when you read them They might say Axl recalls or something like that. I used my words to say what Axl said. Sometimes I just reported the news as if I said it. At that time I was just trying to get some more detail and while Axl was looking at the book he started telling some stories so I added them into the next draft. So he did help make it a better book but it still could have been much better if we had a real interview.