Chinese Misery

[wasted]

Without being too negative because just cos a record is not that much fun doesn't mean it's not great art etc. but I have a feeling that CD might not be as fun as AFD or UYI.

AFD was great fun because it was both dangerous and controversial. Although at some stages the subject matter was dark there was a swagger and for every My Michelle sleazeathon there was an Anything Goes party tune.

By the time Illusions came along the band was splitting up so you had Axl's ballads which were not that much fun, but then you had Izzy's tunes which were lighthearted and offbeat and then Slash was always bringing some of that party rock he does so well. So there was a balance. GNR were still a rock n roll band and for every introspective song there was something to keep the party going.

Now it's Chinese Democracy...and I'm not sure I've heard anything with any swagger or any truly rock n roll songs from the new band. That's not to say the songs aren't good. But just about every song seems to deal with pain or angst on some level. With the prominence of Axl's ballads and the rockers being more like grunge meets industrial theres no real chance of their being any songs on the album which you can burn down the highway listening to.

Part of the appeal of GNR to most fans was the escapism of songs like It's So Easy, Bad Obsession, Live and Let Die and You Could Be Mine - a certain carefree attitude or sense of relief you get when you are listening to those songs - a "fuck it" attitude which gives you an adrenaline rush.

I'm just worried that somehow this album is a gonna be a triple album of miserable songs with nothing to really make you happy to be alive. I hope Izzy donates a couple of songs or Axl finds some of that Hanoi rocks boogie behind the wall of modern rock he is making right now.

[Ions]

Without being too negative because just cos a record is not that much fun doesn't mean it's not great art etc. but I have a feeling that CD might not be as fun as AFD or UYI.

AFD was great fun because it was both dangerous and controversial. Although at some stages the subject matter was dark there was a swagger and for every My Michelle sleazeathon there was an Anything Goes party tune.

By the time Illusions came along the band was splitting up so you had Axl's ballads which were not that much fun, but then you had Izzy's tunes which were lighthearted and offbeat and then Slash was always bringing some of that party rock he does so well. So there was a balance. GNR were still a rock n roll band and for every introspective song there was something to keep the party going.

Now it's Chinese Democracy...and I'm not sure I've heard anything with any swagger or any truly rock n roll songs from the new band. That's not to say the songs aren't good. But just about every song seems to deal with pain or angst on some level. With the prominence of Axl's ballads and the rockers being more like grunge meets industrial theres no real chance of their being any songs on the album which you can burn down the highway listening to.

Part of the appeal of GNR to most fans was the escapism of songs like It's So Easy, Bad Obsession, Live and Let Die and You Could Be Mine - a certain carefree attitude or sense of relief you get when you are listening to those songs - a "fuck it" attitude which gives you an adrenaline rush.

I'm just worried that somehow this album is a gonna be a triple album of miserable songs with nothing to really make you happy to be alive. I hope Izzy donates a couple of songs or Axl finds some of that Hanoi rocks boogie behind the wall of modern rock he is making right now.

While I hear what you're saying, I personally like the direction they seem to be going at this point. I'm not worried about it. -

Edited September 27, 2006 by Ions

[wasted]

No, I'm pretty worried in a selfish sort of way. I'm sure Axl's ballads will sell the album but I'm worried that the variety of tracks won't keep me coming back for more. Like with UYI theres different songs for all states of mind like You Ain't the First can be funny when you feel up tight. But so far all the CD tracks seem to be about isolation and being misunderstood. It could be heavy going if you ask me. Imagine slogging through The Blues, Madagascar and TWAT on one side of an LP with the only breaks being IRS and Chinese Democracy. I'm exhausted just thinking about it.

[EccoTides]

I wouldn't exactly call the UYI albums "fun" listening - They were both pretty dreary aside from the brighter spots like Yesterdays and Izzy's tunes.

But I see what you're getting at, and I agree - But as long as CD has musically "lighter" and poppier tunes like The Blues, CITR, and others in a similar vein, I think it'll be a balanced listening experience.

An album full of stuff like Madagascar and TWAT would be tough to slog through though - It'd remind me of NIN's The Fragile.

[wasted]

That's true about Catcher in the Rye and even the The Blues are like fresh oxygen. The Illusions still had Izzy's influence and even Slash's songs upped the tempo and the two covers did help both albums to be a bit more accessible and fun.

With the absence of Slash as that cartoon type of character and Izzy's songwriting I'm worried it's gonna be Axl in "all business" mode - ballads and art rockers all the way to the end. A good album is much harder to pull off than a good song.

Axl has so much to work through on these albums that maybe the average fan is going to find it heavy going? I don't know, like I said it could still be a great album but not much fun for the listener.

[UltraMav]

EccoTides:

The Fragile is my favorite NIN album and one of my all time favorite albums. So if it turns out anything like that I will be amazingly impressed.

[wasted]

I really liked the way The Fragile moved from one song to another without any really break in the songs, a bit like Chili Peppers Blood Sugar Sex Magik. I think GNR still makes these songs which stand alone but there was a hint of The Fragile style on Better, that bit where this whole new industrial sound comes in, almost like another song. This could make the album more interesting to listen too if there are these instrumental breaks with Buckethead and Finck and Bumble filling out the album, more like a musical landscape, that really would be something if Axl has the balls to put that out as an album. I think it would be commercial suicide as I think for GNR to be as big as they have been then they need to hold on to certain classic rock traditions. But maybe these types of risks could be what makes this album live up to all the hype. The more I think about it the more I feel like I might be disappointed if there isnt some sort of experimentation going on somewhere on this album.

[Ions]

I think for GNR to be as big as they have been then they need to hold on to certain classic rock traditions

I disagree. I think they need to move in another direction in order to do that. Good points though.

[wasted]

I just think if the album is too weird for your average rock fan to listen to it will effect sales - but really this thing would have to suck dick not to sell now. I'm talking about serious alterations like weird jam sessions between songs, or space rock interludes ad nauseum. I'm so far the songs are not classic rock but they still fit a format or song structure that is acceptable to most. VerseChorusVerseChorus. It's even gone as far into leftfield as Radiohead for example or The Fragile. There are elemnts here and there but the GNR template still pulls everything back into alignment. Maybe certain traditions like stand alone songs will still stand even if they have brought in different kinds of music to the Classic Rock of AFD. I don't know if Axl will make CD a sonic tapestry - for the simple reason that he wouldn't want people using such gay terminology around the name GNR.

[Ions]

I just think if the album is too weird for your average rock fan to listen to it will effect sales - but really this thing would have to suck dick not to sell now. I'm talking about serious alterations like weird jam sessions between songs, or space rock interludes ad nauseum. I'm so far the songs are not classic rock but they still fit a format or song structure that is acceptable to most. VerseChorusVerseChorus. It's even gone as far into leftfield as Radiohead for example or The Fragile. There are elemnts here and there but the GNR template still pulls everything back into alignment. Maybe certain traditions like stand alone songs will still stand even if they have brought in different kinds of music to the Classic Rock of AFD. I don't know if Axl will make CD a sonic tapestry - for the simple reason that he wouldn't want people using such gay terminology around the name GNR.

Why are you so concerned about the album's commercial success? I'm just curious.

GNR template

This term sucks. -

Edited September 27, 2006 by Ions

[wasted]

I'm not that bothered myself if it bombs commercially. But it is a factor which comes into play. Without commercial success this incarnation of GNR will be short lived and I persoanlly like GNR to be around for my entertainment. It does have an effect on the band. GNR has been about sucess, it's not really been about ironic failure, people want to see Axl fight across the world, grandstanding at every show and pulling off. See Axl get fucked commercially by the record comapny or by a record that bombs wouldn't be that much fun to read about in the press or see live. I don't Axl to have a single not chart and he has to introduce the new single as "You didn't buy it but we like so here's..." That would be awful.

But in another way if the album really is a good then it's no biggie really. It could be on a level with NIN albums which do alright. That would be fine I guess. But how great can a record be, theres way more to it than a quality record. GNR is a show, a circus, theatre.

[Vogstar90_G'N'R]

you failed to mention duff's emotional music it was good, Civil War being the best.

[wasted]

Yup and Duff with his songs was another entertainment. Get in the Ring, So Fine - that Sid Thunders thing he had going. All these elements came together. But maybe the new lineup has Finck songs Better and Axl ballads still and Dizzy weighing with Silkworms (lol). It's much harder to pin down for sure. To me it's got very professional in GNR these days. Probably helps Axl get through the day.

Weirdly though Axl has looked chipper on stage in these shows and actually looks to be enjoying everything whereas back in the day on the illusion tour he stalked the stage as if he had glass in his ass. He wasnt a happy camper. The new band and direstion must have something to do with it. Not that I care how he feels but yeah paradoxicaicallically fucked up!

Happy record, miserable Axl.

Miserable record, Happy Axl.

He's probably just happy to get the fuck out of the studio n' wrestlin' with his inner demons for a bit of a tango in the limelight with Mr "Laughing Boy" Bach. It makes me laugh how Axl has spent almost a whole career pushing to be a serious artist but Bach treats all his songs on the most basic Motely Crue level. to have that metal muppet head banging to My Michelle to makes me laugh so much.

[wasted]

But GNR did have a lot of songs similiar. Breakdown, Civil War, Paradise City very simliar. DTJM, PCrime, GOE, ISE - very similiar.

IRS is a basic rewrite of Civil War if you ask me. Sometimes CD sounds like an arty Nightrain.

CITR = Estranged/Nov Rain/Yesterdays

Better to me is really original for GNR.

[ssiscool]

as far as i'm concerened i can't judge until we have heard the entire album

[wasted]

I think we can safely say that there won't be an Welcome to the Jungles or Dust N Bones on this album.

[ssiscool]

I think we can safely say that there won't be a Dust N Bones on this album.

thank-god

[Chris Axl]

wttj can be beaten by anyone ever. Its the best hardrock song ever

but dust n' bones?

All "new" GN'R songs ive heard is 1000 times better.

And by the way; NO, i just KNOW that I wont be disapointed when im lissening to Chi Dem for the first time

Edited September 27, 2006 by Chris Axl

[f**k_your_enemy]

I think we can safely say that there won't be an Welcome to the Jungles or Dust N Bones on this album.

Dust N' Bones is how I feel about the situation we are in now... and i'm cool with that

[ssiscool]

All "new" GN'R songs ive heard is 1000 times better.

too right i hate DNB

[worldwideboss]

Blood On The Tracks is a depressive record and is one of the best albums ever.

And Dust N' Bones is fuckin' great. Izzy shines on that song.

[sweetness]

I thaught about this too, I really hope it doesnt turn out that way.

[Allen8R]

But GNR did have a lot of songs similiar. Breakdown, Civil War, Paradise City very simliar. DTJM, PCrime, GOE, ISE - very similiar.

IRS is a basic rewrite of Civil War if you ask me. Sometimes CD sounds like an arty Nightrain.

CITR = Estranged/Nov Rain/Yesterdays

Better to me is really original for GNR.

WTF???

are you drunk?

None of those songs are alike at all man. GN'R has always been known for having unique sounds to each song and album. Allthough estranged and NR are a bit alike.

Edited September 27, 2006 by allen8r

[Ions]

Btw Ions, isn't it "sowin' all your porno"?

Sewin' porno, doesn't make much sense eh

Tell that to Axl. LOL! I think it was the Rock AM Ring show, that's what he sang. Funny shit. I guess I spelled it incorrectly. My bad. Neither spelling makes sense anyway. -

Edited September 27, 2006 by Ions

[nollsiesays]

No, I'm pretty worried in a selfish sort of way. I'm sure Axl's ballads will sell the album but I'm worried that the variety of tracks won't keep me coming back for more. Like with UYI theres different songs for all states of mind like You Ain't the First can be funny when you feel up tight. But so far all the CD tracks seem to be about isolation and being misunderstood. It could be heavy going if you ask me. Imagine slogging through The Blues, Madagascar and TWAT on one side of an LP with the only breaks being IRS and Chinese Democracy. I'm exhausted just thinking about it.

With all due respect, we've only heard perhaps half of the new album. Who knows what else they are bringing to the table, so to speak. We don't even know if all of the songs we've heard lately are even going to be included on Chinese Democracy!!!! No matter what, they are going to be Top 10 singles on the album. The GNR name is so big and the rock landscape so barren right now that, i think they would actually have to TRY to not have atleast one hit on the album.