BangoSkank

Just chiming in to say I love both, but especially "Monsters" - it's heavy, crazy, industrial, and exactly what I want to hear from those days of Axl recording. 

This reminds me so much of the Village leaks. It's something the band had forever, Axl was probably insecure over, and we all just fucking eat it up because it rules. 

I may be going against the grain but I do not want Slash & Duff on these or any similar material - just release them as is. 

EDIT: Read back some pages. Has it been confirmed that Slash & Duff are on these or Finck?

Monsters FUCKING rules - uuuughh this would have likely been the second album. I love when Axl gets into heavy industrial sounds. 

Goddamnit.

Reading through all of this and part of me wants to say, "aren't you all figuring that this song can't possibly live up to the hype and isn't it likely big chunks of the hardcore fanbase won't like the production on it?" but I won't.

16 hours ago, rumandraisin said:

Sadly I can guess the answers to these already. 

Regrettably I can too - if he can answer them at all.

I went to a Tommy solo show a few years ago and he was at the bar afterwards and pretty hammered. To this day, I regret not going up to him and saying, "Tommy, I'll pay for your drinks all night if you answer questions about Chinese Democracy and your time in Guns N' Roses for me."

We were talking to one of his friends and she said he does not love talking about GNR because apparently people always ask him about it (or something).

We need to stop debating this and figure out 2/3 good questions about his time in GNR that the person who paid could maybe, hopefully, pleeeeease ask.

Ideas:

1. How did he hear Axl wasn't coming to Philly and what do you think he was doing?
2. What, to him, is the key reason the album took so long to do?
3. What's his favorite unreleased song?
4. Did he have any apprehension being in "Guns N' Roses" vs. being in something labeled as Axl's solo project?

Obviously the person who paid can do what they want - I just think this is a great opportunity. I'd even chip in to get some of these asked. 

I'd chip in $20 to ask him a list of Chinese era questions that we come up with. I would want assurance that he's no longer bound by an NDA though.

15 hours ago, Georgina Arriaga said:

I like your article very much, the way It was written AND the perspective, I'm in the second group, I cannot accept GNR without Slash, just can't...if Chinese Democracy was market as solo effort It would be more palatable. I accepted VR because It was not GNR and I understood that right away

I really, really like to hear what Axl has to say from that period. Is a shame that he simply doesn't talk

Thanks so much and completely agreed on the last part. He has spoken about it but sparsely and I had to really dig for those quotes. I think he assumed that he would get a mountain of shit for speaking out and now things have healed over, so why pick at the wound?

But it's this era of the band that make me really want an Axl autobiography. He's said he started and got many pages in, but it got depressing and it ended up sounding like he was calling everyone a liar, so he's unsure how to go forward. Just a shame. 

16 hours ago, Blackstar said:

Very good article, thanks for sharing. I agree with a lot of it, even though I'm not as big a fan of CD. That would have been the best of both worlds.

Really appreciate it and agreed, everyone could have been happy. 

I had tickets to the ill-fated Philly '02 show (both of them, actually). I was so excited because it was the band that I was just starting to love (I was 15) and now they looked cool, crazy, and really interesting. When the shows got cancelled I was crushed and I couldn't believe that I was in a GNR riot. That's a kind of cool thing to say now, but was devastating to me then. 

I still look back on that era of the band and love what it could have been. I actually recently wrote an essay on this where I just can't help but wonder what cool industrial metal songs we may have heard if he just went solo. Who knows? We could have had a version of NuGNR that is active between GNR tour legs. A lot has been written about the name, but I just can't help but think how different it all may have been if he dropped it. 

https://medium.com/@tomrankin026/if-axl-went-solo-688f166ea662

Great thread, one of my favorite eras of the band. Fills me with a sense of "What might have been" every time I think about it. Kills me that I never saw Bucket play with them.

2 hours ago, Rovim said:

all interesting questions that I would like to know the answers to as well. I think there was a lot of talent in old Guns and a lot of talent in new Guns with Bucket.

my guess is that Bucket was never going to stay in Gn'R anyway. The way I look at it is that for me, as a Gn'R and a Bucket fan, I'm just glad he joined Axl's band and some of his work was released. I also think Slash belongs in Gn'R.

some of it is really the question of "what if Axl was less like himself and more like other people?" or more in control maybe. I don't think the music would have been possible anyway if Axl was a well adjusted human being back then. The chaotic nature of this band seems to have fueled a lot of the greatness and that includes all classic band members imo.

Never considered that Bucket was always destined to leave, but it does make sense. Even if GNR had been more productive it's hard to see them doing it to the degree that it would satisfy him. 

And it's definitely a question of control, because I still want him to be himself, but the highest and best possible version. Tough to see it spiral out in '02, '11, and elsewhere. I have to wonder if maybe the music would have been better? The chaos may have helped, but only for a bit before hurting things.

And those spirals I mentioned above are why I'd find a blu ray release a bit frustrating because (as others have pointed out on this board) GNR has a knack for somehow really blowing it for majorly when the general public is watching: RiR '11, Bridge School, Golden Gods awards, Glastonbury (to a degree), and a blu ray with him sounding like this would kind of be another example of this.

I don't know, you are right in that it's me caring more about other's opinions of him, and I do want them to release stuff regardless.

It would just be a bit underwhelming, I guess?  

1 hour ago, Rovim said:

I get what you're saying here, but my guess is that Axl can take care of himself, I don't know him, and we don't have enough officially released pro shot footage of live Gn'R shows.

you're basically saying here that you'd rather sarifice a product you want from a band you are a hardcore fan of just so that the image/reputation of the singer of the band won't be damaged by negative opinions of people you also don't know. Not judging btw, just that I believe the priority should be what are we getting from Gn'R as fans if the only downside is that some people could mock Axl's singing ability/style.

Yeah, I see what you're saying and you are right. Ultimately I'd rather have something from one of my favorite bands than nothing. And I'd rather them be producing material than not.

I think I just have a lot of "what might have been feelings" about GNR and this would be another. 

What if Bucket just stayed? 

What if Axl just called NuGNR something different? 

What if Axl actually rehearsed with the band?

What if he could still sing with vicious rasp? People would see how great he still is.

[Shrug]

14 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said:

 

The only one I ever bought was the blu ray & CD release of Appetite For Democracy, and I never even opened it

I'm sure there's a niche market for concert blu rays, like there's a niche market for cassettes, but any live release I've wanted to watch has been available for free online so obviously I'll go with that option. That said, I'm definitely not the target audience for this type of release, I have a PS3 that plays blu rays, but I honestly can't remember the last time I even used my TV, nevermind watched a blu ray on it...

Exactly - some people for sure buy them but I have to think the market for this kind of thing has seriously diminished compared to what it was even 10 years ago. Admittedly, I haven't looked at the numbers so I could be wrong, but I just know I'd for sure be the target market for this and I'd have minimal interest in getting it if it's available to stream somewhere. 

Also, and this is the cold truth, but I do not want an official release from them if Axl has anything resembling the Mickey voice. I personally don't mind it, but the general public is always savage towards him and I'd just rather not see one of my favorite musicians go through that yet again. 

5 hours ago, Spoon87 said:

Yes.

Ok.

40 minutes ago, janrichmond said:

yes

ok

Serious question: Do people still buy concert blu-rays? 

41 minutes ago, History2010 said:

They took it down! Would have really liked to hear it!

Damnit! Same!

15 hours ago, Sausagebrain said:

Thanks to this lame ass illness, I'm goin' home!

Damn, came here to make this joke. Nice work.

4 hours ago, Martin Riggs said:

In demand shows don’t have highly reduced ticket prices or tickets basically given away. The prices would actually be considerably higher than face value. Not saying these shows haven’t ended up with decent attendance, but a lot of money was left on the table to get there.

For sure, my overall point is just that it's not the doom-and-gloom scenario people are often speculating it is. There's a lot more strategy to it than we may realize.

The sales really aren't that bad (or bad at all). They look empty for a few weeks but that's the new way of selling tickets. For promoters, it's no longer about attaining an immediate sell out, it's about getting as much money as possible up top from the die hards (us) and then filling it in as it goes by lowering prices on certain sections, little marketing pushes, hell, I've even seen Groupons offered for shows. Through all this, plus everything else fans get gouged on, people make their money and tickets get sold. 

I don't fully get the details of how it works yet but I know that's the new model. See: dynamic pricing.

Most of the last stadium shows I went to looked half empty on TicketMaster in the weeks leading up to it and then at showtime they're at 90% capacity. 

Fucking INCREDIBLE. 

A SURPRISE GENERAL RELEASE. CALL AN AMBULANCE, I'M DEAD OF A HEART ATTACK. 

32 minutes ago, jacdaniel said:

So since the reunion, Slash has released 2 albums with a third on the way as well as guesting on a few other projects. 

Part of me almost wants him to leave and focus full time on some of these more productive projects 

I agree, and bring back Bucket!

"Set Me Free" could be sick too. 

It'd be cool, but I'd be worried about:

1. The cost

2. The venue - U2 will be the first thing there, I believe, and there were crazy stories of rushed construction, etc. on this place, so I'm kind of expecting some big flaws in this run.

Real talk: I've been wondering what Slash and Duff (and the rest of the band, for that matter) think about the setlist never really changing.