2002 vs 2011

[Voodoochild]

^ True, This I Love really should be Robin's moment to shine. Ashba's take is really bad IMO. Bumblefoot played the very begining of this solo in one of the streamings he did and it sounded 100 times better than Ashba's version.

In all fairness, I don't think there's many alterations/different solos to old songs that Robin did that were received favorably.

I never meant to imply that Finck/Buckethead had ZERO chemistry, I just prefer the overall sound of the current line-up. To each their own.

I like Finck’s addition to Sweet Child; and I’m one of the few that appreciated his unorthodox approach to old GN’R tracks.

The present GN’R replicates. I don’t think near perfect replication is worth more than originality.

That's your thoughts/opinion though. Your original comment about Bucket's solo being received favorably was general, which is true - I've rarely seen anybody criticize that solo. It's the opposite with Robin though, where I've seen TONS of criticisms of his takes on solos. Robin has a cool style though, and I do have to say that DJ doesn't quite capture Robin's solos as well as he does Slash's because Robin had a very unique feel for bends/vibratos and just his overall approach. Very unorthodox player, as you said, but for me personally I don't want to hear unorthodox approaches to the old Guns material (although that's probably my own bias being a huge Slash fan).

I'm all for originality, but sometimes straying too far from the source can totally change the sound of the song, for better or for worse. A good example of what I like is Bumblefoot's second solo in Estranged. He plays it close to the original but adds in that little bit of shred at the end which is characteristic of himself as a player. Same with his take on Sweet Child, most of that solo he stays true to the song but adds bits of shred and some little sweeps to put his stamp on it. By doing that he keeps the solos sounding accurate enough for the casual fan to recognize (which is important to the shows) but still puts his own style into it. Fortus is the same way. He plays the November Rain solo faithfully but changes up the bends a little bit and adds that little fast passage at the end. I like stuff like that, very tastefully used in my opinion. DJ is a bit more of a direct copier, but even so, he does it differently. His Don't Cry solo, for example, he simplifies the one part right before the high bends.

I'm talking more the main solos though. I don't mind when they do extended outros/different solos to songs like Nightrain and Paradise City because those are ideal for jam space. Change is always fun in those spaces, which is perhaps another reason why Buckethead's solo is so well received. It's melodically awesome, has some cool shred, and works in that jam space. Even Slash never played the same outro to Paradise City twice back in the day.

From all those years of criticism, yours was one of the most well written and not-biased (as much as possible, of course). I disagree with you in my taste, but I understand you.

But, I don't really think Robin went too far on changing Slash's work. Far from it, as SCOM was always a highlight before, but not that much now (well, at least from the public reaction I saw on some videos and when I saw them live).

And what you said about DJ's solo in Don't Cry is exactly one of the worst things he does. He's always doing shortcuts, sounds like amateur.

[DaneisKing1389]

Also: Bucket is really talented and has a soulful, distinct personality - I love Bucket - but I think BBF is a more advanced player. Bucket always picks up from a very distinct and catchy chord progression - something Slash did/does - and does not branch far from it. He's afraid of getting lost. Even in some great Nightrain solos I hear Bucket do something amazing - then its obvious he's lost. He's not really an improviser. He can play many styles but each time he switches to one, he does something I've heard him do before. Meanwhile, Ron I think is more progressive, technically skilled, and creative. Watch some of his older stuff pre-Gnr. It's not as catchy to a rock n roll fans ears as Bucket's stuff, because BBF comes from more of a jazz/prog kinda place so often he's speaking a language nobody understands.

Never had I had such a torn opinion. Part of me wants to agree with that and part of me wants to hate you for life. I don't think I'd consider Thal more progressive and surely not more creative, but I think he's a better fit for GN'R. It felt like Buckethead never really had his heart into the old tracks, which is why I see Ron a better fit for the old tracks. I wish we could've seen Buckethead play some of the tracks he was a part of creating. He'd feel more comfortable. He could've owned Sorry.

And lots of Buckethead's solo stuff comes straight from improvising over a track. I think he's a master of that. You can watch a million versions of the same Buckethead track and he'll never play it the same. He has comfortable licks that he goes to, but every artist does. I feel like his role in GN'R was very limited and he wasn't given as much freedom as Ron, so that might be a reason why you think of him in the band the way that you do. I agree with him occasionally being lost in the GN'R tracks, but look at the way GN'R was set up in 2001/2002. Even Axl was lost. It was kind of a mess. I know plenty of people that would agree with Buckethead owning a few songs in his day.

I like Finck’s addition to Sweet Child; and I’m one of the few that appreciated his unorthodox approach to old GN’R tracks.

The present GN’R replicates. I don’t think near perfect replication is worth more than originality.

That's my opinion 100%. I've posted it in a few threads before. They play it nearly identical, but without the feeling that the old band had. I really liked Finck's additions to songs. He played them with his own style and feel. I'd choose his versions of Better, Street of Dreams, Sweet Child, etc. any day over Ashba's versions. The problem comes from the fact that Axl didn't seem to appreciate or trust Finck as much as he does Ashba. Ashba is far better for Axl now, but I think Finck was better on a lot of the tracks.

Edited November 19, 2011 by DaneisKing1389

[Stro]

I think the 2002 band could have been pretty big if Axl had sounded like he did at any other point in the past 10 years. It was such a weird and unique group of characters. I don't think they would have been 1991 huge, but I think they would have had a pretty significant resurgence had Axl sounded better. I'm a big fan of all versions of the new band, but 2002 had the most potential to be its own thing and a totally separate entity from the original group. I enjoy quite a bit of the 2002 shows and don't think Axl sounded nearly as bad as gets talked about, but the shows of this year totally blow 2002 away. Go download the audio from the Chicago show and compare that to the 2002 Chicago show. Axl is killing it right now and the band is much more of a band. But still, 2002 feels like a lot more wasted potential than even 2006.

[DaneisKing1389]

I think the 2002 band could have been pretty big if Axl had sounded like he did at any other point in the past 10 years. It was such a weird and unique group of characters. I don't think they would have been 1991 huge, but I think they would have had a pretty significant resurgence had Axl sounded better. I'm a big fan of all versions of the new band, but 2002 had the most potential to be its own thing and a totally separate entity from the original group. I enjoy quite a bit of the 2002 shows and don't think Axl sounded nearly as bad as gets talked about, but the shows of this year totally blow 2002 away. Go download the audio from the Chicago show and compare that to the 2002 Chicago show. Axl is killing it right now and the band is much more of a band. But still, 2002 feels like a lot more wasted potential than even 2006.

I agree with that. The 2002 band brought us nearly everything on Chinese Democracy, so it proves that they had the chops and writing skills to be huge. To me, It felt like they really limited what everybody could do in the band and that affected a lot of it. It feels like the band functions like more of a band nowadays, which is great. I love the fact that everybody knows their parts and they really gel. I'm very curious to hear things that this version has written.

But I'm still greatly disappointed we'll never get to hear Finck play "This I Love" or Buckethead play Buckethead's solos. The "This I Love" solo is one of my favorites in all of GN'R, old or new.

Edited November 19, 2011 by DaneisKing1389

[The Catcher in the Rye]

2002 line up, with Izzy and Axl of 2006 .. UUUUUUhhh Mama Mia!!! :thumbsup:

[Yesterdays-Civil-War]

If Axl had his 2006 or 2010 vocals in 2002... I'm a BIG fan of the 2002 line up, love Buckethead, Brian and Robin and sad they are gone. However this current incarnation play the material to perfection and are more rock n' roll. The 2002 line up had little chemistry and looked like a goth/industrial/punk juxtaposition.

Thank you.

[ITW 2012]

The 2002 band was it's own unique thing. The 2011 lineup does a great job at playing old GNR material, but I'm not exactly sure what their sound is; I really don't know what a new album written and recorded by the 2011 lineup would sound like. Would it be a knock off of the old GNR sound, or an evolution of CD? I just wish Axl would put out the heavy electronica music he talked about back in the late 90's.

Edited November 19, 2011 by ITW 2012