Chinese Democracy sales-DETAILED

[blake-a-mania]

please also note that the 2008 leak of CD alone reportedly cost the album between 500-850,000 sales, and amount that would have pushed it close to Contraband. Never mind the impact of the earlier leaks in 06 etc

Where did this number come from? To be honest, I think only hardcore/people that post on this forum cared or even knew about the leaks. I think the majority of fans only cared when the album was announced to finally be released.

c'mon man, do you really believe that only hardcore fans cared about the leaks?

people were dying of curiosity to hear CD, to see why the hell Axl was taking so long to release the album.

Nah only the hardcore fanbase cared about them

i dont know, it made national news in the UK a few times, in the tabloid press as well as the music press, so people knew about them, and i dont think you can jusdge how many downloaded the leaks but by looking at torrents you could see it was a huge amount then

[Kill Devil Hill]

It certainly didn't in America.

[Georgy Zhukov]

Everytime someone posts one of these threads, someone complains about not finding the CD anywhere or how little it sold in the US.

[James Bond]

I really think the fact that they put the whole album up for a listen on MySpace just a day or two before it came out really hurt sales, even more than the leaks. Anybody (I'm talking just the casual fan or general public) who had any curiosity about this weird new Guns N' Roses album without Slash that's been delayed for many years was able to satisfy that curiosity just by going to MySpace and listening to full tracks. Sure, I doubt it would have sold that much better, but I'm willing to bet it had quite the impact. Between that, the leaks, and the live performances from 2001-2007, over half the album was heard long before it even came out. Then you've got the lack of promotion and so on. A lot of factors, surprisingly.

Even my buddy's dad who has a massive CD collection and still always buys either actual CDs or off iTunes just listened to it on MySpace. He thought it was a good album but he was never a huge Guns fan anyways so he passed on buying it. Without the MySpace thing, he probably would have actually picked up a copy to listen to it.

I'm just happy I was able to change the minds of a few people who were skeptical about it.

[Georgy Zhukov]

Wait.

Are you guys telling me Slash is not on Chinese Democracy?

[sailaway]

so contraband sold almost 2x as much as CD?

That average ass record or "Contraband" as you call it came out at the peak of 80s nostalgia during an era where record companies still had considerable control of the artist's material, prior to cable internet hitting the mainstream and thus prior to illegal downloading reaching critical mass - not to mention sites like YouTube and MySpace becoming widespread. This severely limits one's access to music and favors corporate interests forcing regular consumers to either buy material based on word-of-mouth or ignore it altogether, inflating numbers by today's standards. And when you consider that "Contraband" was widely talked about, promoted, and marketed - it sold poorly given it's advantageous context.

"Chinese Democracy", contrarily had virtually no marketing budget or promotion whatsoever, was leaked early multiple times, and still sold 4+ million in the digital era of rampant piracy and free listens. Very respectable.

Nice try at a cupcake you ignorant fuck weasel, now go sit at the kids table while the adults discuss big people problems.

This BoBo kid can't think logically,or how the economy has plunged. He also plays e-manager,e-music producer- you know the ilk.

He couldn't go to a Florida gig,because his g/f had to work.

I'm still of the opinion that his mommy wouldn't buy his ticket and give him transport.

And this skidmarks has never been to any GNRs gigs. He got his experience off of Utube.

All in all he inhabits the world of insignificunts.

[Kill Devil Hill]

Does waiting two hours at every concert build hype, too?

[Georgy Zhukov]

The biggest problem with Chinese Democracy that it came out in 2008. When the record company has won the creativity war. Its all about the money baby.

Edited December 11, 2011 by BirdCatcher

[The Archer]

so contraband sold almost 2x as much as CD?

That average ass record or "Contraband" as you call it came out at the peak of 80s nostalgia during an era where record companies still had considerable control of the artist's material, prior to cable internet hitting the mainstream and thus prior to illegal downloading reaching critical mass - not to mention sites like YouTube and MySpace becoming widespread. This severely limits one's access to music and favors corporate interests forcing regular consumers to either buy material based on word-of-mouth or ignore it altogether, inflating numbers by today's standards. And when you consider that "Contraband" was widely talked about, promoted, and marketed - it sold poorly given it's advantageous context.

"Chinese Democracy", contrarily had virtually no marketing budget or promotion whatsoever, was leaked early multiple times, and still sold 4+ million in the digital era of rampant piracy and free listens. Very respectable.

Nice try at a cupcake you ignorant fuck weasel, now go sit at the kids table while the adults discuss big people problems.

Thanks Brodie - I really needed to read a response like that to that stupid post.

Edited December 11, 2011 by The Archer

[Georgy Zhukov]

so contraband sold almost 2x as much as CD?

That average ass record or "Contraband" as you call it came out at the peak of 80s nostalgia during an era where record companies still had considerable control of the artist's material, prior to cable internet hitting the mainstream and thus prior to illegal downloading reaching critical mass - not to mention sites like YouTube and MySpace becoming widespread. This severely limits one's access to music and favors corporate interests forcing regular consumers to either buy material based on word-of-mouth or ignore it altogether, inflating numbers by today's standards. And when you consider that "Contraband" was widely talked about, promoted, and marketed - it sold poorly given it's advantageous context.

"Chinese Democracy", contrarily had virtually no marketing budget or promotion whatsoever, was leaked early multiple times, and still sold 4+ million in the digital era of rampant piracy and free listens. Very respectable.

Nice try at a cupcake you ignorant fuck weasel, now go sit at the kids table while the adults discuss big people problems.

Thanks Brodie - I really needed to read a response like that to that stupid post.

Not bad for an asshole.

[Chris 55]

So much for 5 million. I knew that was way too far fetched.

What fool said it sold 5 million?

[Georgy Zhukov]

Wikipedia apparently.

[axlrod]

Are Digital and Vinyl sales included?

1. Tops iTunes all over the world for a week.

(1st day reported 25k downloads at iTunes)

2. Top 8 US Vinyl sales.

[axlrod]

I really think the fact that they put the whole album up for a listen on MySpace just a day or two before it came out really hurt sales, even more than the leaks. Anybody (I'm talking just the casual fan or general public) who had any curiosity about this weird new Guns N' Roses album without Slash that's been delayed for many years was able to satisfy that curiosity just by going to MySpace and listening to full tracks. Sure, I doubt it would have sold that much better, but I'm willing to bet it had quite the impact. Between that, the leaks, and the live performances from 2001-2007, over half the album was heard long before it even came out. Then you've got the lack of promotion and so on. A lot of factors, surprisingly.

Even my buddy's dad who has a massive CD collection and still always buys either actual CDs or off iTunes just listened to it on MySpace. He thought it was a good album but he was never a huge Guns fan anyways so he passed on buying it. Without the MySpace thing, he probably would have actually picked up a copy to listen to it.

I'm just happy I was able to change the minds of a few people who were skeptical about it.

Breaks MySpace record.

http://www.nme.com/news/guns-n-roses/41217

http://www.roadrunnerrecords.com/blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=109384

[sailaway]

so contraband sold almost 2x as much as CD?

That average ass record or "Contraband" as you call it came out at the peak of 80s nostalgia during an era where record companies still had considerable control of the artist's material, prior to cable internet hitting the mainstream and thus prior to illegal downloading reaching critical mass - not to mention sites like YouTube and MySpace becoming widespread. This severely limits one's access to music and favors corporate interests forcing regular consumers to either buy material based on word-of-mouth or ignore it altogether, inflating numbers by today's standards. And when you consider that "Contraband" was widely talked about, promoted, and marketed - it sold poorly given it's advantageous context.

"Chinese Democracy", contrarily had virtually no marketing budget or promotion whatsoever, was leaked early multiple times, and still sold 4+ million in the digital era of rampant piracy and free listens. Very respectable.

Nice try at a cupcake you ignorant fuck weasel, now go sit at the kids table while the adults discuss big people problems.

This BoBo kid can't think logically,or how the economy has plunged. He also plays e-manager,e-music producer- you know the ilk.

He couldn't go to a Florida gig,because his g/f had to work.

I'm still of the opinion that his mommy wouldn't buy his ticket and give him transport.

And this skidmarks has never been to any GNRs gigs. He got his experience off of Utube.

All in all he inhabits the world of insignificunts.

Uhh. What? He wasn't even talking to me. LOL. But I'll add my opinion anyways. CD had promotion. Maybe very little from Axl himself, but it was promoted pretty well from various media outlets such as magazines, internet articles, Dr. Pepper, TV spots, Entertainment television, late night talk shows, what more could've been done on their part? People still buy albums. Death Magnetic and Black Ice were released at the same time CD was and sold just as much as Contraband. Their albums leaked prior too. I'll give you that Black Ice had a SHIT TON of promotion from Wal Mart, but it also got rave reviews from fans AND critics. Contraband had two hit singles come off it that are still frequently played on rock radio. CD had none. CD was also a very drastic departure from previous GNR records, that most fans just didn't realy dig. CD (the song) had plenty of radio airplay the first week, but then people stopped caring after they got a taste of it. If people dig the music, they'll still buy it to some extent.

As for your comments, your youtube comments are again invalid, and would only be valid if I criticized Axl's voice or the band on a performance perspective, which I've never done. My girlfriend did have work, nothing I can do about that. She originally told me she could for sure get off, and then her manager said no due to two of her other employees having already asked off for that week, months beforehand. One buddy said he was interested in going, and then told me he didn't want to spend the money. I didn't feel like dishing out money to go to a concert by myself. Maybe if the concert had been within reasonable driving distance to me, that'd be a different story. But to fly out, just to go by myself, didn't seem like it was worth it.The idea to me seemed stupid. Don't know many people who do that.

As usual, you failed at your attempt to berate me. Kindly fuck off.

Nobody has a burning urge to make you look ridiculous,you do fine by yourself.

Chinese Democracy hardly had adequate promotion,a cardboard stand in the middle of Best Buy does not constitute effective promotion,and don't forget the Kevin coghill leaking incident.

The three covers never emerged,and the UNapproved version of the booklet was released. You seem to forget Azoff's agenda to pocket an immesurable amount of cash,if he could force a reunion.

Axl isnt likely to prostitute himself on late night purgatory talk shows,like others do.

And you seem dammned determined to quote figures,and act like a wanna-be critic,or a pretend label mogul.

I have gone to a great many concerts on my own,and I don't buy your excuse for not attending.

Especially when you spew out your vile bile over a band you have never seen live.

Your Utube expertise on all things GNR is ludicrous,uninformed and laughable.

You certainly live up to your s/n BoBo,I'll give you that one.

[Georgy Zhukov]

so contraband sold almost 2x as much as CD?

That average ass record or "Contraband" as you call it came out at the peak of 80s nostalgia during an era where record companies still had considerable control of the artist's material, prior to cable internet hitting the mainstream and thus prior to illegal downloading reaching critical mass - not to mention sites like YouTube and MySpace becoming widespread. This severely limits one's access to music and favors corporate interests forcing regular consumers to either buy material based on word-of-mouth or ignore it altogether, inflating numbers by today's standards. And when you consider that "Contraband" was widely talked about, promoted, and marketed - it sold poorly given it's advantageous context.

"Chinese Democracy", contrarily had virtually no marketing budget or promotion whatsoever, was leaked early multiple times, and still sold 4+ million in the digital era of rampant piracy and free listens. Very respectable.

Nice try at a cupcake you ignorant fuck weasel, now go sit at the kids table while the adults discuss big people problems.

This BoBo kid can't think logically,or how the economy has plunged. He also plays e-manager,e-music producer- you know the ilk.

He couldn't go to a Florida gig,because his g/f had to work.

I'm still of the opinion that his mommy wouldn't buy his ticket and give him transport.

And this skidmarks has never been to any GNRs gigs. He got his experience off of Utube.

All in all he inhabits the world of insignificunts.

Uhh. What? He wasn't even talking to me. LOL. But I'll add my opinion anyways. CD had promotion. Maybe very little from Axl himself, but it was promoted pretty well from various media outlets such as magazines, internet articles, Dr. Pepper, TV spots, Entertainment television, late night talk shows, what more could've been done on their part? People still buy albums. Death Magnetic and Black Ice were released at the same time CD was and sold just as much as Contraband. Their albums leaked prior too. I'll give you that Black Ice had a SHIT TON of promotion from Wal Mart, but it also got rave reviews from fans AND critics. Contraband had two hit singles come off it that are still frequently played on rock radio. CD had none. CD was also a very drastic departure from previous GNR records, that most fans just didn't realy dig. CD (the song) had plenty of radio airplay the first week, but then people stopped caring after they got a taste of it. If people dig the music, they'll still buy it to some extent.

As for your comments, your youtube comments are again invalid, and would only be valid if I criticized Axl's voice or the band on a performance perspective, which I've never done. My girlfriend did have work, nothing I can do about that. She originally told me she could for sure get off, and then her manager said no due to two of her other employees having already asked off for that week, months beforehand. One buddy said he was interested in going, and then told me he didn't want to spend the money. I didn't feel like dishing out money to go to a concert by myself. Maybe if the concert had been within reasonable driving distance to me, that'd be a different story. But to fly out, just to go by myself, didn't seem like it was worth it.The idea to me seemed stupid. Don't know many people who do that.

As usual, you failed at your attempt to berate me. Kindly fuck off.

Nobody has a burning urge to make you look ridiculous,you do fine by yourself.

Chinese Democracy hardly had adequate promotion,a cardboard stand in the middle of Best Buy does not constitute effective promotion,and don't forget the Kevin coghill leaking incident.

The three covers never emerged,and the UNapproved version of the booklet was released. You seem to forget Azoff's agenda to pocket an immesurable amount of cash,if he could force a reunion.

Axl isnt likely to prostitute himself on late night purgatory talk shows,like others do.

And you seem dammned determined to quote figures,and act like a wanna-be critic,or a pretend label mogul.

I have gone to a great many concerts on my own,and I don't buy your excuse for not attending.

Especially when you spew out your vile bile over a band you have never seen live.

Your Utube expertise on all things GNR is ludicrous,uninformed and laughable.

You certainly live up to your s/n BoBo,I'll give you that one.

Bobbo claims he is going to the HOF show this april as if hoping for a reunion.

[Kill Devil Hill]

Nonsense! Bobbo's going because, though he can be critical, he's still a GN'R fan.

[Georgy Zhukov]

Nonsense! Bobbo's going because, though he can be critical, he's still a GN'R fan.

My pimp hand is tremblin'.

[Use Your Delusion 1]

Are Digital and Vinyl sales included?

1. Tops iTunes all over the world for a week.

(1st day reported 25k downloads at iTunes)

2. Top 8 US Vinyl sales.

in most cases digital sales are included, although some countries have these seperatly, I havn't included Vinyl, if anyone could quote numbers I would be happy to change the list, but I inflated the US numbers slightly to accomidate for this sort of thing.

[oktayyaxl]

in usa bestbuy bought 1.6 million copies so ıt has sold 1.6 million copies in usa technically.

in europe ıt has sold more than 1 million copies and ıt has reached platinium status all through europe.(ıt won ıfp europe platinium awards) also in italy more than 120K HAS SOLD.

US : 1.6 MILLION

EUROPE : 1.3 MILLION

CANADA : 250K

JAPAN : 200K

SOUTH AMERICA : 250K

AUSTRALİA : 120K

NEW ZEALAND : 30K

MEXİCO : 50K

REST OF THE WORLD (ASİA,SOUTH AFRİCA etc.) : 150 K

SO CHİNESE DEMOCRACY HAS SOLD NEARLY 4 MILLION COPIES WORLDWIDE.

[Spirit]

Norway; 40,000+ shipped (X4 PLATINUM), 40-50,000 sales.......thanks spirt 83

Just a little correction, Platinum is "30,000 units sold" in Norway.

[sailaway]

so contraband sold almost 2x as much as CD?

That average ass record or "Contraband" as you call it came out at the peak of 80s nostalgia during an era where record companies still had considerable control of the artist's material, prior to cable internet hitting the mainstream and thus prior to illegal downloading reaching critical mass - not to mention sites like YouTube and MySpace becoming widespread. This severely limits one's access to music and favors corporate interests forcing regular consumers to either buy material based on word-of-mouth or ignore it altogether, inflating numbers by today's standards. And when you consider that "Contraband" was widely talked about, promoted, and marketed - it sold poorly given it's advantageous context.

"Chinese Democracy", contrarily had virtually no marketing budget or promotion whatsoever, was leaked early multiple times, and still sold 4+ million in the digital era of rampant piracy and free listens. Very respectable.

Nice try at a cupcake you ignorant fuck weasel, now go sit at the kids table while the adults discuss big people problems.

This BoBo kid can't think logically,or how the economy has plunged. He also plays e-manager,e-music producer- you know the ilk.

He couldn't go to a Florida gig,because his g/f had to work.

I'm still of the opinion that his mommy wouldn't buy his ticket and give him transport.

And this skidmarks has never been to any GNRs gigs. He got his experience off of Utube.

All in all he inhabits the world of insignificunts.

Uhh. What? He wasn't even talking to me. LOL. But I'll add my opinion anyways. CD had promotion. Maybe very little from Axl himself, but it was promoted pretty well from various media outlets such as magazines, internet articles, Dr. Pepper, TV spots, Entertainment television, late night talk shows, what more could've been done on their part? People still buy albums. Death Magnetic and Black Ice were released at the same time CD was and sold just as much as Contraband. Their albums leaked prior too. I'll give you that Black Ice had a SHIT TON of promotion from Wal Mart, but it also got rave reviews from fans AND critics. Contraband had two hit singles come off it that are still frequently played on rock radio. CD had none. CD was also a very drastic departure from previous GNR records, that most fans just didn't realy dig. CD (the song) had plenty of radio airplay the first week, but then people stopped caring after they got a taste of it. If people dig the music, they'll still buy it to some extent.

As for your comments, your youtube comments are again invalid, and would only be valid if I criticized Axl's voice or the band on a performance perspective, which I've never done. My girlfriend did have work, nothing I can do about that. She originally told me she could for sure get off, and then her manager said no due to two of her other employees having already asked off for that week, months beforehand. One buddy said he was interested in going, and then told me he didn't want to spend the money. I didn't feel like dishing out money to go to a concert by myself. Maybe if the concert had been within reasonable driving distance to me, that'd be a different story. But to fly out, just to go by myself, didn't seem like it was worth it.The idea to me seemed stupid. Don't know many people who do that.

As usual, you failed at your attempt to berate me. Kindly fuck off.

Nobody has a burning urge to make you look ridiculous,you do fine by yourself.

Chinese Democracy hardly had adequate promotion,a cardboard stand in the middle of Best Buy does not constitute effective promotion,and don't forget the Kevin coghill leaking incident.

The three covers never emerged,and the UNapproved version of the booklet was released. You seem to forget Azoff's agenda to pocket an immesurable amount of cash,if he could force a reunion.

Axl isnt likely to prostitute himself on late night purgatory talk shows,like others do.

And you seem dammned determined to quote figures,and act like a wanna-be critic,or a pretend label mogul.

I have gone to a great many concerts on my own,and I don't buy your excuse for not attending.

Especially when you spew out your vile bile over a band you have never seen live.

Your Utube expertise on all things GNR is ludicrous,uninformed and laughable.

You certainly live up to your s/n BoBo,I'll give you that one.

Huh? Never said that Axl was on late night tv, I said it was talked about on late night tv. As for the booklet? Who gives a shit? I doubt that would've been a real game changer in the grand scheme of things. As for Azoff, we don't know the full details on that. When it became official that CD was released, it was everywhere. The Dr. Pepper promotion got things going, I saw it mentioned on Chelsea Lately of all places with my ex, magazines, tv spots, internet articles and everything I mentioned previously. What more did you want Best Buy to do on their end? Have a blow up doll of Axl for you to french? They had signs all over my local Best Buy promoting it. Other than that they can't do much, because for whatever reason, Axl wouldn't cooperate. But the whole "it wasn't promoted" thing is such crap in my opinion. People were shocked it was actually seeing the light of day. People might not have followed every leak and every tentative release date and every little detail, but every general fan knew Axl was taking a lonnnnnggggg time on this album. And many thought it would never get released. Call me a cynical prick all you want, but that's just my perception of things. I've been through this a hundred times in much more detail on this site, so I'm done explaining my opinion on it again.

You don't buy my excuse for not attending? I find it very rare for people to fly to a concert solo. To me, it's like going to the movie theater by yourself. The idea felt awkward to me. Each to their own.

I don't base ANY of my opinions on my "youtube" experience. Shove that accusation right back where it came from (your ass). Going to a show, or not going to a show, it doesn't change history, or what's happened internally within the band the past 20 years. My ONLY beef with the shows is that they rely too heavily on hits they had no part in contributing. Which is fact, not opinion. That wouldn't change whether I attended the shows or not. So what does that have to do with anything? Had I said "Wow Dj Ca$hba fucking sucks live, what a poser" or something among those lines, then you'd have a point. But I haven't.

Let's cut the shit here. The ONLY reason you have a problem with me, is because I'm not a "yes man" to anything and everything Axl does. We have differing views, so you find petty ways to insult a 21 year old stranger that you don't even know over the internet. That's the true definition of pathetic.

For the second time now, kindly fuck booboo

Dont have a earthshaking opening,so its time to break-of profanaties litle excuses for dishing out negativiy?

I didnt insinuate that "Axl" was on a late night purgatory,did mention that he in all probability wont pimp himself out.

And actually you ARE a "yes man" for the cupcake patrol.

What is hilarious is when you debase yourself like a bobble headed mascot, when there is one of the Hater Brigade amongst us. :lol

Your poofy,pompous,wannabe attitude is laughable.I have flown overseas to do the holiday festivities and have travelled to Germany,Scotland,midwest shitholes,Kansas and st.Louis to see concerts. Flying isnt scary,.and I dont mind the downtime at all.

And,hate to burst your bobble bit the opposite to love isnt hate its indifference.

Ask anyone whether actually attendiing a gig vastly surpasses watching a show on Utube

Okay your turn,be sure to throw in a few profanities to boost your e-peen fantasies.

Edited December 11, 2011 by sailaway

[Laparka]

so contraband sold almost 2x as much as CD?

But will they make CD II suck 2X more than Libertad?

Sounds like a difficult challenge...

[Use Your Delusion 1]

I don't see any links for anyones numbers and the fact that the OP is willing to change his numbers based off some random guy saying "it sold 400 000 in Peru" or something automatically invalidates the whole list.

No one elses numbers were sourced either.

The sales to best buy don't count as "album sales" and if they do, what's even the point? The point of figuring these things out is to figure out how many individuals went out and bought it to listen to it themselves... So Best Buy buying however many million to sit in a warehouse and hopefully sell later does not count as record sales. I'd think this would be obvious but.... mygnr.

This is by no means a correct list, these things never are, the estimation for GN'R's albums sales for example that if frequently touted is not 100 million, it could be 90 it could be 110 or inbetween but 100 million is in the ballpark hence why we stick with it. These figures are also in the ballpark, I will collect sources if you wish, they are readily available for the certification;

"Chinese Democracy debuted at number three on the US Billboard 200 chart, selling 261,000 copies in its first week, well below expectations.The album secured an IFPI European Platinum Award, having sold more than one million copies in Europe, and has sold 2.6 million units worldwide as of February 2009, according to Universal Music.

The album also reached triple platinum certification in Canada, as well as platinum certifications in many other countries, including Finland, the Czech Republic, Germany, Ireland, Italy, Norway, Poland, Romania, Switzerland, the United Kingdom, Argentina, Australia, New Zealand, and South Africa.

It was certified gold in Austria, Belgium, Denmark, France, Greece, Hungary, the Netherlands, Sweden, Indonesia, Japan, Malaysia, Singapore, Taiwan, Thailand, Brazil, and Colombia"

Source Blabbermouth, Ultimate Guitar, IFPI, BPI.com,

http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/general_music_news/guns_n_roses_chinese_democracy_re-enters_us_charts.html

http://www.ifpi.org/content/section_news/plat_month_20090129.html

http://www.roadrunnerrecords.com/blabbermouth.Net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=131043

However the estimate for actual sales is just that, an estimate. However I have confidence that these figures are roughly correct and seem reasonable. 2.9 million sold fits will the record companies claim of 2.6 million sales in February of 2009. I will source directly at a later date

[Georgy Zhukov]

Chinese Democracy sold six copies in The Vatican.