Profanity banned in Middleborough, Mass.

[The Linguini Occurrence]

It'll be interesting trying to enforce this - bylaws cannot bypass the Amendments and swearing is protected under free speech.

That's like saying people should be allowed to carry guns anywhere because of their right to bear arms. The Amendments basically state what you can do on your own personal property, not what you can do in public.

And as much as I curse in private and on these boards, I never do it in a public setting where there's a bunch of young kids or elderly folks within earshot (actually I virtually never curse in public period). Just like they shouldn't be forced to inhale other people's secondhand smoke, they shouldn't be forced to hear other people's cursing. Child brains are like sponges, they pay attention to everything they hear and then constantly repeat it. I wouldn't want my young kid constantly using the F word everywhere because they heard some stranger saying it in public.

[DirtyDeeds]

And as much as I curse in private and on these boards, I never do it in a public setting where there's a bunch of young kids or elderly folks within earshot

I recognize you said you pretty much never do it in public at all, and I understand why you wouldn't say it around kids. But why are you extra careful not to say it around elderly? They've seen, heard, and done more things in their lives than most of us have, and I'm sure this has included some f-bombs.

[PappyTron]

It'll be interesting trying to enforce this - bylaws cannot bypass the Amendments and swearing is protected under free speech.

That's like saying people should be allowed to carry guns anywhere because of their right to bear arms. The Amendments basically state what you can do on your own personal property, not what you can do in public.

And as much as I curse in private and on these boards, I never do it in a public setting where there's a bunch of young kids or elderly folks within earshot (actually I virtually never curse in public period). Just like they shouldn't be forced to inhale other people's secondhand smoke, they shouldn't be forced to hear other people's cursing. Child brains are like sponges, they pay attention to everything they hear and then constantly repeat it. I wouldn't want my young kid constantly using the F word everywhere because they heard some stranger saying it in public.

No, the Amendments are not there just to cover your personal property. The right to free speech, as long as it is not inciting lawlessness, a threat or deemed to be "fighting words" is protected in public places and city bylaws do not have a right to over-rule that. For example, "I hate the fucking police because they are all corrupt pigs" is legal to say to a policeman, but "Hey, officer - go fuck yourself, you cunt" may well put you on shaky ground. Basically, throwing in swear words in a situation that is otherwise legal will not get you in trouble.

[Patience 4 Axl]

It'll be interesting trying to enforce this - bylaws cannot bypass the Amendments and swearing is protected under free speech.

That's like saying people should be allowed to carry guns anywhere because of their right to bear arms. The Amendments basically state what you can do on your own personal property, not what you can do in public.

And as much as I curse in private and on these boards, I never do it in a public setting where there's a bunch of young kids or elderly folks within earshot (actually I virtually never curse in public period). Just like they shouldn't be forced to inhale other people's secondhand smoke, they shouldn't be forced to hear other people's cursing. Child brains are like sponges, they pay attention to everything they hear and then constantly repeat it. I wouldn't want my young kid constantly using the F word everywhere because they heard some stranger saying it in public.

Just because your child hears certain words doesn't mean he will repeat them. If he does, you simply explain that they're not appropriate to say at their age. Keeping kids in a bubble isn't always the best solution. It's also naive to think they don't hear it from their friends in the schoolyard, while you're at home saying things like "Sugar" and "Baloney".

[Dazey]

Just because your child hears certain words doesn't mean he will repeat them. If he does, you simply explain that they're not appropriate to say at their age. Keeping kids in a bubble isn't always the best solution. It's also naive to think they don't hear it from their friends in the schoolyard, while you're at home saying things like "Sugar" and "Baloney".

I think it's more about setting an example about what's acceptable in certain situations. I never once heard my parents or grandparents swear in front of me until I was probably well into my teens and it's not that I didn't hear and use it every day at school but it gave me an appreciation of when and where it was and wasn't acceptable. I swear like a docker but I know when to give it a rest so I don't see the issue with this to be honest.

[PappyTron]

Just because your child hears certain words doesn't mean he will repeat them. If he does, you simply explain that they're not appropriate to say at their age. Keeping kids in a bubble isn't always the best solution. It's also naive to think they don't hear it from their friends in the schoolyard, while you're at home saying things like "Sugar" and "Baloney".

I think it's more about setting an example about what's acceptable in certain situations. I never once heard my parents or grandparents swear in front of me until I was probably well into my teens and it's not that I didn't hear and use it every day at school but it gave me an appreciation of when and where it was and wasn't acceptable. I swear like a docker but I know when to give it a rest so I don't see the issue with this to be honest.

It's true - you should see some of the things that come out of Dazey's mouth. Mainly cocks and cum, but he does swear a lot as well.

[The Linguini Occurrence]

And as much as I curse in private and on these boards, I never do it in a public setting where there's a bunch of young kids or elderly folks within earshot

I recognize you said you pretty much never do it in public at all, and I understand why you wouldn't say it around kids. But why are you extra careful not to say it around elderly? They've seen, heard, and done more things in their lives than most of us have, and I'm sure this has included some f-bombs.

I live in a rural town located in a conservative region where you just don't hear people swearing in public, except in the larger cities. The elderly folks here were raised in the 40's and 50's when cuss words were rarely heard, and they truly have been sheltered from swearing throughout their lives. They have only expanded basic cable (no premium channels = no swearing), they don't have satellite radio, they don't go to the movies, and they stay away from the big cities. I'm part of a large extended family (three generations, some as young as 22) and absolutely none of them has ever swore in the presence of the elders who are now in their 60's thru 80's ... not even the "s" word! It's mostly out of respect, and because of the way they were raised. Even if the elders have heard the "F" word at least once or twice in their life, it doesn't mean they are okay with hearing it again

[The Linguini Occurrence]

No, the Amendments are not there just to cover your personal property. The right to free speech, as long as it is not inciting lawlessness, a threat or deemed to be "fighting words" is protected in public places and city bylaws do not have a right to over-rule that. For example, "I hate the fucking police because they are all corrupt pigs" is legal to say to a policeman, but "Hey, officer - go fuck yourself, you cunt" may well put you on shaky ground. Basically, throwing in swear words in a situation that is otherwise legal will not get you in trouble.

Per the Supreme Court, government may prohibit some speech that may cause a breach of the peace.

Breach of the Peace is a form of Disorderly Conduct, examples include abusive or obscene language in a public place.

[Guest Len B'stard]

Bollocks! Fuck all that, no one should tell anyone how they can or can't talk. Language is our heritage, these words, awful and terrible as they may be so SOME (cunts), in fact, they're just a way of explaining things. That is all. The words, fuck, shit, cunt, bollocks, these are our heritage as much as any other word in the English language and NOBODY has the right to tell you a word is offensive, it's how you mean the word thats offensive you fuckin thick cunts.

How dare you say that the language i speak is profane, fuck you. If i am using the word fuck...or shit...or cunt...look at the fucking context i'm using it in before making judgements and also, if you want to know what i mean by using a certain word or a certain turn of phrase, ask meee, i'm the cunt that said it, ask me what i mean if you don't understand, don't tell me.

How can an actual word be offensive though, the word unto itself, to warrant banning, do you not see how ridiculous of a concept that is? Lets take the word cunt as a broad example. What is it, what does it mean, well it's basically a way of referring to female genetalia that also doubles up as an insult. But the word unto itself, cunt, what does it mean, female genitalia right? OK, so hows that offensive? Someone explain it to me, i'd like to know, how the fuck is that offensive to you, as a human being?

When you ban a word you don't just ban the word but you ban the ability to discuss the word or communicate that the word was used by someone in a certain situation or happenstance, you are basically handicapping yourself in your ability to make fucking sense in a simple and concise way. "they could always just say 'the C-word'"...fuck me, is that what it's come down to?!?!

This notion that the word is SOOOOO offensive and so bad and so evil and so wrong that if i was relaying a tale to someone and the word came up in the context of that discussion i'd have to go "and then after she flung her book at him, he called her a "C-word"...an effing C-word...an effing C-sucking, W-word! *gasp*"

And these are fuckin adults that i'm meant to fucking respect?

Words are a means to communication and why on earth would any species want to limit their ability to communicate, it's just so mind-blowingly ridiculous. A word is just a noise, sounds we make to communicate something, it is literally impossible, in any logical way, to find THE EXISTENCE of a word offensive. And thats basically what you're saying when you ban a word, that it shouldn't exist, that it is not necessary or proper or required for you to communicate THAT particular thing freely. You are being told what you can or can't say/do basically.

I love the English language, i think it's beautiful and no ones gonna fuckin tell me what i'm allowed to say. I understand that everywhere ain't the right place to swear but it's up to the individual to make those sorts of judgements and then stand by the consequences.

Banning words to me is in the ballpark of like, book burnings and thought policing. It's a load of fuckin shite.

Edited June 14, 2012 by sugaraylen

[username]

Swearing applies to things that you say.

I'd just wear this shirt all day every day:

http://www.tshirthell.com/funny-shirts/yes-my-tshirt-does-say-fuck-on-it-it-also-says-cunt-twat-and-machine-washable/

[ADPT]

I would have thought this could be dealt with under legislation that already existed, something like 'disturbing the peace'.

Recently I've found my tolerance for constant, loud, swearing in public wearing pretty thin so I actually have some sympathy for people who've become so fed up with it they've opted for this.

Edited June 14, 2012 by ADPT

[DirtyDeeds]

I would have thought this could be dealt with under legislation that already existed, something like 'disturbing the peace'.

Recently I've found my tolerance for constant, loud, swearing in public wearing pretty thin so I actually have some sympathy for people who've become so fed up with it they've opted for this.

Me too. I have the bad habit of having a sailor's mouth, but I can control it depending on my audience or lack thereof. It does grate on the nerves when others do not seem to possess the same ability to discern when and when not to use profanity, because usually (though not always) there is a certain attitude that goes along with it which is uglier than the language being used.

[Guest Len B'stard]

I would have thought this could be dealt with under legislation that already existed, something like 'disturbing the peace'.

Recently I've found my tolerance for constant, loud, swearing in public wearing pretty thin so I actually have some sympathy for people who've become so fed up with it they've opted for this.

Me too. I have the bad habit of having a sailor's mouth, but I can control it depending on my audience or lack thereof. It does grate on the nerves when others do not seem to possess the same ability to discern when and when not to use profanity, because usually (though not always) there is a certain attitude that goes along with it which is uglier than the language being used.

Perhaps they can/do discern only their estimation of when it is or isn't appropriate is different? Which is another reason why banning words is stupid, cuz with each different group of people there are different thresholds, we are not identi-kit beings.

Edited June 14, 2012 by sugaraylen

[DirtyDeeds]

True, but the appropriate time and place becomes defined by a society and consensus, and this ordinance suggests that if they were trying to discern the right place and time, that they discerned wrong.

[Guest Len B'stard]

Well not really because society is a group made up of lots of different little groups and each little group, whether differentiated on the basis of class or race or whatever, have different standards of propriety.

[PappyTron]

No, the Amendments are not there just to cover your personal property. The right to free speech, as long as it is not inciting lawlessness, a threat or deemed to be "fighting words" is protected in public places and city bylaws do not have a right to over-rule that. For example, "I hate the fucking police because they are all corrupt pigs" is legal to say to a policeman, but "Hey, officer - go fuck yourself, you cunt" may well put you on shaky ground. Basically, throwing in swear words in a situation that is otherwise legal will not get you in trouble.

Per the Supreme Court, government may prohibit some speech that may cause a breach of the peace.

Breach of the Peace is a form of Disorderly Conduct, examples include abusive or obscene language in a public place.

That is incorrect. As I said, it is not the words that you use that defines whether what you say is a breach of the peace or disorderly conduct, but rather the overall content of your intentions. You seem to be confusing the terms of "speech" and "conduct" which is why, as I said in my previous post, it is literally not what you say but rather the manner in which you say it that defines whether your speech is constitutionally protected.

[Chewbacca]

This is so berlooging...

[KBear]

Bollocks! Fuck all that, no one should tell anyone how they can or can't talk. Language is our heritage, these words, awful and terrible as they may be so SOME (cunts), in fact, they're just a way of explaining things. That is all. The words, fuck, shit, cunt, bollocks, these are our heritage as much as any other word in the English language and NOBODY has the right to tell you a word is offensive, it's how you mean the word thats offensive you fuckin thick cunts.

How dare you say that the language i speak is profane, fuck you. If i am using the word fuck...or shit...or cunt...look at the fucking context i'm using it in before making judgements and also, if you want to know what i mean by using a certain word or a certain turn of phrase, ask meee, i'm the cunt that said it, ask me what i mean if you don't understand, don't tell me.

How can an actual word be offensive though, the word unto itself, to warrant banning, do you not see how ridiculous of a concept that is? Lets take the word cunt as a broad example. What is it, what does it mean, well it's basically a way of referring to female genetalia that also doubles up as an insult. But the word unto itself, cunt, what does it mean, female genitalia right? OK, so hows that offensive? Someone explain it to me, i'd like to know, how the fuck is that offensive to you, as a human being?

When you ban a word you don't just ban the word but you ban the ability to discuss the word or communicate that the word was used by someone in a certain situation or happenstance, you are basically handicapping yourself in your ability to make fucking sense in a simple and concise way. "they could always just say 'the C-word'"...fuck me, is that what it's come down to?!?!

This notion that the word is SOOOOO offensive and so bad and so evil and so wrong that if i was relaying a tale to someone and the word came up in the context of that discussion i'd have to go "and then after she flung her book at him, he called her a "C-word"...an effing C-word...an effing C-sucking, W-word! *gasp*"

And these are fuckin adults that i'm meant to fucking respect?

Words are a means to communication and why on earth would any species want to limit their ability to communicate, it's just so mind-blowingly ridiculous. A word is just a noise, sounds we make to communicate something, it is literally impossible, in any logical way, to find THE EXISTENCE of a word offensive. And thats basically what you're saying when you ban a word, that it shouldn't exist, that it is not necessary or proper or required for you to communicate THAT particular thing freely. You are being told what you can or can't say/do basically.

I love the English language, i think it's beautiful and no ones gonna fuckin tell me what i'm allowed to say. I understand that everywhere ain't the right place to swear but it's up to the individual to make those sorts of judgements and then stand by the consequences.

Banning words to me is in the ballpark of like, book burnings and thought policing. It's a load of fuckin shite.

I don't know, I don't have a problem with it. I agree with your point overall, but they aren't banning words. They are banning them in certain situations and cops are told to use discretion. And I think we can all imagine the situation they have in mind. Some snot nosed 16 year old who feels all tough and is using "fuck" like he just discovered the word. Every third word is a cuss and he doesn't care who's around him that he's bothering.

When 30 people are quiet or respectful and one douchebag isn't, that's not down to difference in estimation of what's appropriate. It's someone who has no common courtesy.

Again, they aren't banning words. You can use "shit" and "fuck" in books and movies and a little more discretely. You shouldn't be yelling those words out when no one around you wants to hear you. In fact, you shouldn't be yelling out anything in that situation. It's like people on my train who have to have loud cellphone conversations while everyone else in the car is quiet (most are reading or listening to their iPods). There is almost always some a-hole who just doesn't give a damn who s/he bothers, and I'd love to take their stupid cellphone and smash it to a million pieces but I'd be the one that would pay for that. Some people need to realize that the world doesn't revolve around them, and these are the people that this law is for.

Granted, they should just use a law already on the books (disturbing the peace) and apply it to just that, rather than focus on if a cuss word is used.

Edited June 16, 2012 by KBear

[Sweersa]

I usually only struggle with profanity at night, when my tourettes gets bad as my body gets more tired. I am prone to say very impulsive things, which may include profanity/offensive/racist language in other context. Sometimes I'll be in a conversation and say something, or ask a totally unrelated question or statement too.

[Dazey]

I usually only struggle with profanity at night, when my tourettes gets bad as my body gets more tired. I am prone to say very impulsive things, which may include profanity/offensive/racist language in other context. Sometimes I'll be in a conversation and say something, or ask a totally unrelated question or statement too.

You have Tourette's don't you also have a small arsenal at home?

[The Linguini Occurrence]

It's like people on my train who have to have loud cellphone conversations while everyone else in the car is quiet (most are reading or listening to their iPods). There is almost always some a-hole who just doesn't give a damn who s/he bothers, and I'd love to take their stupid cellphone and smash it to a million pieces but I'd be the one that would pay for that. Some people need to realize that the world doesn't revolve around them, and these are the people that this law is for.

Granted, they should just use a law already on the books (disturbing the peace) and apply it to just that, rather than focus on if a cuss word is used.

I completely agree with you. That's also why most gyms don't allow cell phone calls. If I'm stuck on a treadmill for 30 minutes and the person next to me is talking on a cell phone (loudly, of course, so they can be heard above the noise from the equipment), there's no fucking way I'm going to be subjected to some bullshit phone conversation for that long. Rules and laws are made for a reason, usually because a minority of self-centered assholes have no consideration for anyone else.

[KBear]

It's like people on my train who have to have loud cellphone conversations while everyone else in the car is quiet (most are reading or listening to their iPods). There is almost always some a-hole who just doesn't give a damn who s/he bothers, and I'd love to take their stupid cellphone and smash it to a million pieces but I'd be the one that would pay for that. Some people need to realize that the world doesn't revolve around them, and these are the people that this law is for.

Granted, they should just use a law already on the books (disturbing the peace) and apply it to just that, rather than focus on if a cuss word is used.

I completely agree with you. That's also why most gyms don't allow cell phone calls. If I'm stuck on a treadmill for 30 minutes and the person next to me is talking on a cell phone (loudly, of course, so they can be heard above the noise from the equipment), there's no fucking way I'm going to be subjected to some bullshit phone conversation for that long. Rules and laws are made for a reason, usually because a minority of self-centered assholes have no consideration for anyone else.

Man, that would piss me off. It's kind of hard to believe they need to make rules like this. It should be common sense not to have a cellphone conversation while at the gym but as the saying goes, common sense isn't always common.

[Thelonious]

Swearing = bad

Killing your unborn baby = OK

Welcome to liberal logic.

Killing a grown adult = OK

Welcome to conservative logic.

Unborn babies don't murder people...

Neither does that benign tumor on my left arm, but because it is, too, a lump of cells should I be denied the right to have it removed? I am curious- where do the anti-choice people draw the line?... from my experience many of the same anti-choice "pro-lifers" are also some of the loudest proponents of capital punishment in the southern United States

[Guest Len B'stard]

I don't know, I don't have a problem with it. I agree with your point overall, but they aren't banning words. They are banning them in certain situations and cops are told to use discretion. And I think we can all imagine the situation they have in mind. Some snot nosed 16 year old who feels all tough and is using "fuck" like he just discovered the word. Every third word is a cuss and he doesn't care who's around him that he's bothering.

But see it's a move in that direction, when you begin to criminalise language, this is what happens.

Again, they aren't banning words. You can use "shit" and "fuck" in books and movies and a little more discretely.

See, as an adult, i find that quite patronising. That certain people would have legislation that dictates when where and how i can express myself.

You shouldn't be yelling those words out when no one around you wants to hear you. In fact, you shouldn't be yelling out anything in that situation. It's like people on my train who have to have loud cellphone conversations while everyone else in the car is quiet (most are reading or listening to their iPods). There is almost always some a-hole who just doesn't give a damn who s/he bothers, and I'd love to take their stupid cellphone and smash it to a million pieces but I'd be the one that would pay for that. Some people need to realize that the world doesn't revolve around them, and these are the people that this law is for.

Honestly, it doesn't bother me? I understand that thats not the point, the point is people in general but, honestly, i could give a second fuck if someones talking loudly on their phone on the train or texting in the cinema.

Granted, they should just use a law already on the books (disturbing the peace) and apply it to just that, rather than focus on if a cuss word is used.

Thats the interesting bit see cuz they ain't using legislation already in place for such things, they're making a new one, why? Cuz it serves or can be construed to serve another purpose and that purpose effectively is more to do with what i was talking about i.e. Word Nazi's.

[Forsaken]

Haha, Middleborough, I have to talk to their branch manager at work today.